Thoughts on the M107 / AS50

[-Gews- 7443]

The current game mechanics make using any weapon so incomprehensibly simple, it pretty much negates ANY skill requirement on the part of the player.

Well without some kind of virtual reality high-fidelity 3D motion sensor you're not going to be able to replicate all the difficulties of real life.

[RooBurger 285]

If you suck, learn, if you can't learn, then enjoy your level of skill. If you can't enjoy it, games are probably not your type of hobby you should be spending time on.

Well, there has been a trend in gaming for a long time where developers make games which adjust to the player's skill level, and they bend over backwards to remove any elements which might cause frustration and disappointment. So that even if you suck, the game will come down to your level and reward you for it.

People have come to expect this so-called "balance" and "fairness" in every game, and get upset when it isn't there. It's why Rocket called DayZ an anti-game. There is no mollycoddling in DayZ.

[RooBurger 285]

The current game mechanics make using any weapon so incomprehensibly simple, it pretty much negates ANY skill requirement on the part of the player.

The number of people defending the current functionality is the truly retarded thing.

Making everything more complicated is the only way to go if the devs want YOUR skill to be more important than that of your game character. FACT

I think people are focusing too much on the typical FPS mechanics which are important in games like Counter Strike - twitch reflexes and mouse accuracy. In DayZ this is far less important.

The real skills you need to develop are situational awareness, positioning and small squad tactics. Getting into the right position, choosing the right moment is paramount.

I've performed a flank which took an hour to execute. That's fucking awesome to me.

Also the human interaction, social stuff, deciding if someone is lying and what to do with new people. Admittedly many players turn to KoS after playing for a while as it's just safer.

[wooly-back-jack 294]

I collect them but don't really use them lol

actually tell a lie I have used AS50 once, but I prefer the zoom of M107

[B00tsy (DayZ) 19]

blablabla ...

Finding a sniper rifle or throwing gas in a helicopter gunship has nothing to do with skills. almost nothing anyway. You are not a better player when you have an uber weapon, you are just a player with uber weapon. The best players according to you would then be hackers using artillery and flatten a whole town. If we both have an unscoped weapon crawling around Cherno and you sneak up to me to put a bullet in my head then you were better.

[RooBurger 285]

Finding a sniper rifle or throwing gas in a helicopter gunship has nothing to do with skills. almost nothing anyway. You are not a better player when you have an uber weapon, you are just a player with uber weapon. The best players according to you would then be hackers using artillery and flatten a whole town. If we both have an unscoped weapon crawling around Cherno and you sneak up to me to put a bullet in my head then you were better.

It takes a lot of time and effort to get decent weapons and repair vehicles. You need to apply every skill to gear up and fly a chopper in the first place. When there aren't scripters, that is.

[B00tsy (DayZ) 19]

Well I have pretty nice gear with NVG, grenades, a AKM with plenty of ammo, soldier outfit and a tent filled with supplies. It was easy to get. Just let others get the good loot and then kill the dude and take his stuff. I was in a house watching through the window looking for players with nice gear passing by, when I saw one I sneaked up on him and killed him with a pistol (and not an uber weapon). And because I have NVG now I only play at night time cos the advantage I have is huge, un less I run into an other player that also has NVG. I didn't use much skills to get the gear, was a matter of patience and a few headshots from close range. For the vehicles, I should have used more nuance with my comments cos it indeed takes some effort to get it in working condition.

[RooBurger 285]

In my book that makes you a skilful bandit. You got the kills, you get the gear. How often do you end up in that situation though? Every time you play, or would you say you got lucky this time?

Really, to go from zero to AS50, NVGs and then repair a chopper doesn't happen every time you play. the gunfights, navigation, dealing with zombies, accidentally breaking your leg and crawling to a hospital... all of this is going to happen while you're trying to find that rotor assembly. Then once you get it flying, everyone will do their best to shoot you down.

[B00tsy (DayZ) 19]

Yeah I was a bit lucky I guess because the dude was not paying attention, I think he had his gear menu open when I approached him. I am only low on blood now and playing lonewolf, matter of time till I am dead. Hope I will find my old gear back when it happens :)

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

I still don't think the time/effort you put into tracking down gear should have any bearing on your ability to use it properly.

If the length of time you spend searching is the only thing that matters, it just turns into "farming for higher levels".

It's not impossible to find an AS50 straight after spawning. It's just luck of the draw.

If you manage to steal it from someone, THAT likely involved skill, but it still shouldn't mean you automatically know how to handle it.

EDIT:

If, for example, you walk through the desert for months, and find an accordion. It doesn't mean you can play the accordion.

But now that you've found it, you have the opportunity to learn how.

Edited February 3, 2013 by Chabowski

[RooBurger 285]

It's not impossible to find an AS50 straight after spawning. It's just luck of the draw.

Possible, but very unlikely. I was playing for weeks before I found a legit one.

shouldn't mean you automatically know how to handle it.

EDIT:

If, for example, you walk through the desert for months, and find an accordion. It doesn't mean you can play the accordion.

But now that you've found it, you have the opportunity to learn how.

It's not so hard to figure out how to fire a gun. Firearm maintenance is another story.

However, it took me some time to become proficient with the sniper rifles in DayZ. I've even written up a mildot calculation chart for reference.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

Mildots and estimation is a good example of what I mean.

Everyone will be able to pick up a gun and fire it at someone, but it takes practice before you can understand why some of your shots aren't on target, and you learn to compensate.

When I first found a camo Dragunov, it took a little bit of trial and error to get the best out of the PSO scope. As it should. Everyone accepts this.

I just don't understand why it's OK to have a learning curve for these weapons, but it certain people are so entirely against making players learn how to range any other rifle.

Optics don't click straight to 200/400/600 metres.

Sometimes it makes more sense to guess a bit and aim high rather than range-up, to save time/hassle.

I think, as well as a knowledge requirement, it could add another element of tension, along with more choice in how to handle certain situations.

Honestly, I just feel like the mechanics are too simple to be considered anything along the lines of simulation. (which is what DayZ looks to be aiming toward in most cases)

Weapon maintenance is a discussion for another day. In any case, I look forward to seeing how (if) it's implemented in SA.

[dystopeon 46]

been reading the thread again. I'll have to say - yeah keep all the weps, I don't really care.

What I care about is the EASE of which you can make even >1000M shots.

It's PATHETICALLY EASY.

Add WIND or REMOVE all sniper/scope. Currently it's fucking dumb.

[not_today_son. 14]

been reading the thread again. I'll have to say - yeah keep all the weps, I don't really care.

What I care about is the EASE of which you can make even >1000M shots.

It's PATHETICALLY EASY.

Add WIND or REMOVE all sniper/scope. Currently it's fucking dumb.

and without a proper scope it's impossible to see ANYTHING beyond 1000m. currently it's already rarely the case you can see further than 1km, the fog will limit ur view range to mostly around 700-800m (in case of bad weather 400-500m)

if u get hit by a sniper rifle, you either ran over the open field or ran straight towards him OR just met a good shooter. 2 out of 3 you can prevent, and if you are smart you can also mostly prevent no.3 - because a good shooter will wait for a clean shot.

[hairylemon 4]

Right, but a normal civilian (if you want to relate it to RL) wont be able to hit anything more then 100 meters away, To fire a sniper rifle from long distance (especially 50 cal) you heed to have had military sniper training for it or a ton of practice on the range.

We are discussing in this topic sniper rifle's alone, but for me it goes for any scoped weapon. Enforcer mentioned the wind factor, that would definitely improve things and level the odds a bit. If that would be a fact for every gun and rifle then it would make things more interesting as you need to have skills then to fire accurately. As long as you don't have any helpers like a wind direction and wind speed pop-up on your screen. If a bullet would have a falloff to the left or right depending on the wind then I am for that.

I have a rather large arsenal irl I'm just a civilian but I have 2 .50s and can and have put shots out to over 1km, cold bore. There all ready very very rare any way and to me in dayz Arm and ace it doesn't matter if I have a .50 or a m16 acog I can still one shot you the only difference is the range at witch it's the most effective

If you use a .50 at under at least 800 or 900 meters your not using it for its intended purpose witch is long range accuracy or anti material applications

[plexico 386]

I have a rather large arsenal irl I'm just a civilian but I have 2 .50s and can and have put shots out to over 1km, cold bore. There all ready very very rare any way and to me in dayz Arm and ace it doesn't matter if I have a .50 or a m16 acog I can still one shot you the only difference is the range at witch it's the most effective

If you use a .50 at under at least 800 or 900 meters your not using it for its intended purpose witch is long range accuracy or anti material applications

What's with people necro posting lately?

Check the date on this thread.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Plexico

[Mos1ey 6301]

I have a rather large arsenal irl I'm just a civilian but I have 2 .50s and can and have put shots out to over 1km, cold bore. There all ready very very rare any way and to me in dayz Arm and ace it doesn't matter if I have a .50 or a m16 acog I can still one shot you the only difference is the range at witch it's the most effective

If you use a .50 at under at least 800 or 900 meters your not using it for its intended purpose witch is long range accuracy or anti material applications

 

Rare? The .50s have been removed, lol.

 

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