What should be considered "Geared Out" in DayZ Game?

[m.w. vindicator 880]

In DayZ Mod the community generally considered someone "geared" if they have most of the following:

Items marked with and "*" are extra important.

• Long range Primary (scoped weapon)
  
• -with 2-4 magazines of ammunition
  
• 
  
• *Mid/Close range primary
  
• -2-4 magazines of ammunition
  
• 
  
• *Secondary Pistol
  
• -approx. 4 magazines of ammunition
  
• 
  
• *1-2 water bottles
  
• 
  
• *2-4 peices of food
  
• 
  
• *1-4 morphines auto-injectors
  
• 
  
• *1-3 Blood Bags
  
• 
  
• Epinephrine
  
• 
  
• Compass
  
• 
  
• *Map
  
• 
  
• *Hatchet
  
• 
  
• Big Backpack
  
• 
  
• *Hunting Tools (matches and knife)
  
• 
  
• Painkillers
  
• 
  
• *A lot of bandages
  
• 
  
• Camo or Ghillie
  
• 
  
• Binoculars
  
• 
  
• *NVGs
  
• 
  
• Tent
  
• 
  
• Toolbox
  

As you can see the standard for a "geared" player is pretty high for the Mod. A person with this gear could survive indefinitely if they just camped in the woods.

I think that this is too high of a standard. In DayZ Game loot should be harder to come by. People should generally be not as well equipped. The high end gear should exist, just in smaller proportions.

I am going to make a list of what I think a normal "geared" player should look like in Stand Alone. I am factoring in all the gear and items that the community is fully on board with and wants in Stand Alone. For example almost everyone expects pen and paper to be in Stand Alone along with clothing.

Same rule applies with the *

Average Player with general bad luck

• *Pistol (A makarov most likely. I really hope it has realistic damage)
  
• - 2-5 magazines of average grade ammunition
  
• 
  
• *Can of Soda or water bottle
  
• 
  
• *Can of Food
  
• 
  
• Civilian winter coat (often a brightly colored one)
  
• 
  
• Decently Good Shoes
  
• 
  
• A hat, hood, or helmet
  
• 
  
• *A few bandages
  
• 
  
• Compass or Map
  
• 
  
• *Knife
  
• 
  
• Matches
  
• 
  
• Larger melee weapon such as a hatchet or a crowbar
  
• 
  
• Binoculars
  
• 
  
• Some advanced medicine (Small amounts of the following: antibiotics, morphine, and painkillers)
  
• 
  
• Pen and Paper
  

As you can see the average player in Stand Alone has far less gear. There is still a lot of suspense in survival and the player is living by the minute. Any mistake could spell doom for the survivor. That doom could come slowly by means of infection or quickly through a Zed wound. The average player is armed but only lightly. This is different from the mod where most players are equipped similar to army regulars.

Now obviously this is all speculations and individual players would vary based around their luck. As I mentioned earlier, high end gear would exist, it would simply be harder to find. Some players might be lucky and find a military camouflage jacket instead of a brightly colored civilian one. Some people might not have a pistol but a primary weapon instead. Others might have only a large melee weapon.

Many of the ideas in this topic are up for debate. I am sure that I forgot some piece of gear/ item that the community has suggested.

Edited November 27, 2012 by Vindicator

[Bludy 324]

i like your analisys, probably we have all a lot of stuff because it's just a mod of a military sim..but a part for weapons, all the rest are pretty common objects..we'd have canned food and bottles of water for years..and if the average life will drop as they say, you'll never need new shoes

[MarksmanKing 17]

Honestly I somewhat agree with this. Although, when one player does get very lucky and find that 50 cal sniper and ghillie suit, he will simply mow everyone the fuck down and nobody will stand a chance. Would you rather a bunch of players that are somewhat equally well geared, and a few people with lesser gear, or one person with good gear, and tons with next to none. Imo the way it is now is fine and keeps the game somewhat fair.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

i like your analisys, probably we have all a lot of stuff because it's just a mod of a military sim..but a part for weapons, all the rest are pretty common objects..we'd have canned food and bottles of water for years..and if the average life will drop as they say, you'll never need new shoes

I understand what your saying. Look to Namalsk for food rarity. On Namalsk food is much rarer than Stand Alone. That is they way I think it should be. I agree that some of the items are common. In Stand Alone the loot system will be different. I don't know how it will be exactly but I would bet that highly populated areas will be picked clean and gear will not respawn as quickly.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

Honestly I somewhat agree with this. Although, when one player does get very lucky and find that 50 cal sniper and ghillie suit, he will simply mow everyone the fuck down and nobody will stand a chance. Would you rather a bunch of players that are somewhat equally well geared, and a few people with lesser gear, or one person with good gear, and tons with next to none. Imo the way it is now is fine and keeps the game somewhat fair.

I see where your coming from.

[carpediembr 10]

I think binoculars are a must have. Specially to find if there are people in a city.

[Sutinen 635]

If that is what is considered a geared up player in the STANDALONE, I will pissed off. What really pisses me off, is that people are carrying two heavy rifles around and there's no way in hell any of you would be able to find a fucking sniper rifle before dying in a real-life apocalypse. Same goes for me.

So:

Any player that carries a military rifle should be considered a high-end player.

A geared up player should be one with basic equipment, supplies and a civilian rifle.

A starter should be considered a player with some necessary supplies and only a melee weapon.

Edited November 27, 2012 by Sutinen

[starwarsfan@gmx.de 450]

Making food and drink more rare is only going to promote the whole kill on sight mentality and everyone's already bitching about that. :huh:

Also, yes I would prefer fewer people with heavy load out and more with bad equipment, I think that might make people work together more. Might be some low end players would team up to take down those high end players. That'd be the best case scenario though, which is unlikely to happen. <_<

[Inception. 9443]

One is not properly geared out unless they have a big backpack.

[Dabaroony 86]

One is not properly geared out unless they have a big backpack.

Truth.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

If that is what is considered a geared up player in the STANDALONE, I will pissed off. What really pisses me off, is that people are carrying two heavy rifles around and there's no way in hell any of you would be able to find a fucking sniper rifle before dying in a real-life apocalypse. Same goes for me.

So:

Any player that carries a military rifle should be considered a high-end player.

A geared up player should be one with basic equipment, supplies and a civilian rifle.

A starter should be considered a player with some necessary supplies and only a melee weapon.

I imagine that a person with the gear I listed has played for 1-4 hours. There are hundreds of factors that determine how long it takes a person to find gear. Primary weapons shouldn't be impossible to find.

I agree with you that you shouldn't be able to carry multiple sniper rifles around. What I am saying is that currently people have too much stuff.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

One is not properly geared out unless they have a big backpack.

I suppose,but a person could survive without one.

[dallas 5195]

As soon as I've traded out my beach backpack, I'm as good as it gets. The rest is just extra weight.

[carpediembr 10]

If that is what is considered a geared up player in the STANDALONE, I will pissed off. What really pisses me off, is that people are carrying two heavy rifles around and there's no way in hell any of you would be able to find a fucking sniper rifle before dying in a real-life apocalypse. Same goes for me.

So:

Any player that carries a military rifle should be considered a high-end player.

A geared up player should be one with basic equipment, supplies and a civilian rifle.

A starter should be considered a player with some necessary supplies and only a melee weapon.

Nonetheless (?) this is a fps game (well 3rdperson shooter nowadays), and was made for shooting people. If you want to play survive go play The Sims.

If I can put a rifle in my bag and carry another one on my hand I will do that.

Now talking about rarity to find stuff, Yes, some stuff should be only on heli crash sites.

[Dabaroony 86]

Nonetheless (?) this is a fps game (well 3rdperson shooter nowadays), and was made for shooting people. If you want to play survive go play The Sims.

If I can put a rifle in my bag and carry another one on my hand I will do that.

Now talking about rarity to find stuff, Yes, some stuff should be only on heli crash sites.

Actually, this is intended to be a survival game.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

I tend to lean on the side of less loot for everyone. The guy who gets really lucky and finds the high powered assault rifle will rule the day.

I don't think everyone should have big guns. Some say that this "balances" things. I say fuck balance. This is DayZ and it is is supposed to be unreasonably cruel.

If a bandit finds a good weapon and kills a bunch of other survivors, that is fine and except able. Good for him. If a hero finds a big gun and kills the bandit, even better. If a bunch of noobs with Makarovs team up to kill the bandit, even better! If the noobs all die of disease due to being next to each other, and a dead body, that's good too.

Unreasonably Cruel.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

I like to think that low-mid tier players will still be relying heavily on melee weapons in SA.

The rarity of ammunition should be far more of an issue than it is currently. EVERY bullet should be valuable.

The lucky bandit with the 50 cal shouldn't be mowing anyone down, because he has 5, maybe 10 rounds to his name. And that rifle is now his pride and joy.

Having played Namalsk, I can only imagine if people could eat military hardware, nobody would go hungry.

I don't think it's a good example TBH. I can see why people like it, but it's not my cup of tea.

We need to wait and see whether the new loot-spawn system has any tricks up it's sleeve.

Will the map still be coated in a thin layer of empty tin cans?

[m.w. vindicator 880]

I like to think that low-mid tier players will still be relying heavily on melee weapons in SA.

The rarity of ammunition should be far more of an issue than it is currently. EVERY bullet should be valuable.

The lucky bandit with the 50 cal shouldn't be mowing anyone down, because he has 5, maybe 10 rounds to his name. And that rifle is now his pride and joy.

Having played Namalsk, I can only imagine if people could eat military hardware, nobody would go hungry.

I don't think it's a good example TBH. I can see why people like it, but it's not my cup of tea.

We need to wait and see whether the new loot-spawn system has any tricks up it's sleeve.

Will the map still be coated in a thin layer of empty tin cans?

Tin can rain would kill us all after being hit in the head 8-10 times....

[camycamera 36]

i want the loot system to be changed so people will work together more often. right now DayZ is basically one big deathmatch with zombies, food and weapons in it. having heavy weapons equals lots of innocent dead guys (most times), and there needs to be drastic changes so that players NEED to work together to survive, because realistically to survive, you need to work together, and if the loot system is changed so that teamwork is needed, and that the zs become more deadly, there will be more teamwork.

[Bludy 324]

it's cool to have a big weapon, but there are not anough choices to take:

you can carry two or three rifles without fearing to starve

you can have tons of food and drinks and a weapon

you can enter a random building and find a weapon a backack and food and drinks, sometimes i respawn and i'm running north in 15 minutes!

if you put a AR/sniper in your backpack, you should have 1-2 free slots

the deteriorating gear system would balance the number of military weapons(this would be implemented so your precious dmr won't last forever)

for how the game works a player will consider himself geared only when he will heve the stuff he has nowadays, so maybe it will take more time but i think no one will fix a vehicle until he has a gun

pistols MUST become a threat for players as before that bohemia patch

[m.w. vindicator 880]

it's cool to have a big weapon, but there are not anough choices to take:

you can carry two or three rifles without fearing to starve

you can have tons of food and drinks and a weapon

you can enter a random building and find a weapon a backack and food and drinks, sometimes i respawn and i'm running north in 15 minutes!

if you put a AR/sniper in your backpack, you should have 1-2 free slots

the deteriorating gear system would balance the number of military weapons(this would be implemented so your precious dmr won't last forever)

for how the game works a player will consider himself geared only when he will heve the stuff he has nowadays, so maybe it will take more time but i think no one will fix a vehicle until he has a gun

pistols MUST become a threat for players as before that bohemia patch

I agree with you that it should be possible to get as much gear as people have now (with a few exceptions like the sniper rifle in you backpack). It should just take longer and be more dangerous along the way. It should be necessary to team up with someone if you hope to survive and get the best gear.

[m.w. vindicator 880]

The responses have wandered away from the OP a bit. The real idea of this post is about how difficult should the game be. Rocket and team and most of the community want the game to be more difficult than the mod. One of the factors in how hard it is to survive is how much useful survival gear the player has (obviously). That is the general topic of this thread. There are many factors that contribute to difficulty but gear is the main factor in my opinion. With amazing gear most threats become null and void.

Like the OP says, long arms should be a lot less common in standalone in my opinion. I believe that Pistols and melee weapons should be the primary form of defense for many players. I think that it adds to the suspense. That being said I think pistols should be more dangerous in the game.

At the current moment pistols are only good at plinking zeds with head shots. Pistols are under powered against Zeds with body shots and grossly under powered against human beings that feel pain. The fact that with the current system, a player can survive 6+ shots to the chest with 9x18 and 9x19 is absurd.

Lets say that 9x18 Makarov bullets kill in 2-3 shots in standalone. What will this affect? First off, Zeds would be able to be killed while moving without head shots. Zeds don't feel pain so they should be more resistant to damage in the body, but they are only infected humans so they would eventually succumb to wounds to the body.

I think that, if pistols are the primary form of defense for a many players, it will add suspense that players will enjoy. I personally love the suspense involved with gathering gear. It has been acknowledged that one of the major sources of useless PvP is the lack of end game. Once you gather your gear, there is nothing left to do but kill others. If people had things to do, PvP would naturally go down.

Look at Minecraft for example. PvP is an option on many Minecraft servers. But players rarely go around killing others because there is always something to do, like building something. Now obviously Minecraft isn't the perfect example but it does have similarities to DayZ Mod.

What I would like to see is:

• The rarity of loot is increased so that it takes longer to get "geared"
  
• Once some one is "geared" there should be late game things to do
  

- Rocket has mentioned building as a late game goal for players. Diseases will also add late game things to do. If your character is infected with a long term illness, it will take awhile to cure, giving you something to do other than kill. Diseases will give players reasons to communicate, IMO. It will be for everyone's benefit to know that certain water supplies aren't safe to drink from. Medic style players will be much more important. Experienced medics who know symptoms of diseases well will be critical assets in diagnosing ailments. Rocket mentioned that the game will not tell you what disease you have. You will only know the symptoms you're feeling. In order to receive the correct treatment, it will be necessary to know your illness. Less people will not want to be mindless killers because if they get sick, no one will want to help them (some people will always kill mindlessly, but that is classic DayZ).

DayZ will not have an endgame per say but there should definitely be difficult challenges for players to achieve once they have acquired gear.

That is my image of DayZ and there are about 1,300,000+ other views of the game.

Sorry for the wall of text/rant.

TL;DR loot should be rarer combined with more late game (optional) goals so that people have fun on characters that have live 15+ hours.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Vindicator

[m.w. vindicator 880]

my first and last bump. If the thread dies after this...well darn.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Vindicator

[logan23 118]

The biggest hurdle with balancing the loot/gear for players and the DayZ world is -Server Hopping

Server Hopping makes it almost impossible to balance the loot in the game.

Solutions would need to be either to not allow players to server hop (this means you can be playing on 3 servers with friends but each of those servers will have a different player character that is locked to that server)

Another solution is to have it where you must wait X minutes (15-60) with that character to hop to another server. You would still be able to create multiple characters on different servers but that one that was playing can just hop server to server searching for gear.

Once this issue is resolved or managed then you can find it more easily to study data from the servers on their own loot spawns and player gearing up and see what can be tweaked as well as see where there are more clans or lone wolfs- how players seem to be geared up to what level---This will allow the developers to decide what can be done to help keep the players in a constant striggle to survive and not become over geared and just go all Rambo on other players.

Good thread-OP

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

@logan,

Very good point. Would the server be able to check a players' gear to change spawns accordingly? Or is that sci-fi?

With base-building and all the other fancy crap we're hearing about, it sounds like we're going to be encouraged to make ourselves a "home server".

This might be a way to lessen server hopping, but it won't stop it outright.

It would certainly give "old" characters something to work towards, nonetheless.