... worried about standalone :(

[glasscasket 33]

Weapon degradation? VIRULENT DISEASES?

this is a pretty general suggestion, and i know it's 'their' game and all...

... but honestly this has me worried for standalone, and i'll more than likely be playing mods of the standalone, or just mods for arma 3 :\

I think the DayZ Dev team should take a look at youtube and see what makes DayZ so special and popular.

OH THE DAYS WHEN ROCKET WOULD TALK OF COOLER BASE BUILDING, AND BEEFING UP THE VEHICLES.

Diseases? I mean honestly, that's a big focus? We're talking about a zombie apocalypse here. Now I have to worry or not whether I can cook my food with adequate heat? Well, I guess I should definitely consider cutting back on all the Coke/Pepsi I drink in game, because that obviously isn't going to hydrate me... surely if I keep this sugar diet up I'll be too fat to run from the zombies.

Weapon degradation goes down a bit easier than a plethora of disease. I mean, it makes sense... but it'd be pretty cool if there was a bit more modular system with the weapons. I could see this if they were all, "K GUYS, THESE ARE THE GUNS IN DAYZ. DEAL." I love the guns in DayZ. It's a good balance. You can do damage with anything. My homie DP pops people outta choppas with a mak. It's all in how you use it ;D

Hard to say without it getting to be too much of a headache, but would repairing guns be like, 5% health akm + 10% health akm = 15% akm? Still, finding nothing but tin cans is pretty depressing. Finding broken guns? D: I think having to find ammo is bad enough. I would actually be down for weapon degradation if the melee system was sorted better, without having to learn it's nuances(ie stand two perfect ft. away from target to hit it).

JUST A COUPLE OF MY THOUGHTS.

YOU KNOW.

[indominator 95]

dude, go play something, being worried about anything is not going to be the end of the world, they are professional game developers, trust them and wait for the time being, and you can relax because it will be one of the best games next year

[DrunkPunk 159]

I get the desire for realism in the game, I totally do. There are reasons, however, why there aren't any games out there that are life simulations. Mainly because realism lacks balance. But also because life is full enough of tedious, boring BS. Games are typically supposed to be fun, though, and too much realism can suck the fun out of anything. I'm slightly worried about standalone, and sure it's not here yet so I can't really say anything. But weapons degrading, I'm not a fan of. At all. This disease system? I think it already sounds stupid as hell. Ultimately, we'll see, as time is the only thing that will tell.

Also, to the guy above me, it's hard to say "Trust them, they're professional game developers." Isn't rocket new to the game development thing? And in any case, if he's not, tons of "professional" developers manage to fuck up perfectly good formulas all the time. Not saying these guys will, but it's not enough to put my mind at ease.

[Rage VG 4033]

Your concerns are going on the basis that they are focusing on Diseases and Weapon degrading in place of improved vehicles and base building, which is untrue. Think of it as they are working on Diseases and Weapon degrading in addition to improved vehicles and base building.

I would assume that you either can't repair weapons and have to find a replacement, or you would have to find weapon parts to fix your weapon, otherwise you simply can't repair a primary without a good backpack to carry them in, because of how much space they take.

[Michaelvoodoo25 3120]

There's a thread for the disease idea, don't worry about it, there will be more to the SA than what you mention.

Concentrating on one aspect is silly. Think of the bigger picture, you will enjoy it more

[Sutinen 635]

You really think this game would be so unrealistic, that you would have to combine two half broken weapons to fix one? I think we are talking about cleaning and replacing the broken parts, not losing the entire weapon.

[psylnz 34]

Im with Glass Casket and Drunk Punk on this one. Anybody reading this should read the disease thread. I'm thinking about sticking with the mod now. What Rocket's considering is too much in my opinion. Catching a deadly disease just cause you looted a corpse, or took water from a pond or well that you didn't know was infected? And then searching across the land for the holy grail of the right medicine for the right disease (they are talking about several, each with its own specific medicine). Defecation in game? What's the point of teaming up and building a remote survival camp if one griefer decides to infect himself with cholera and run through your camp infecting everything, or shit in the nearby pond you gather water from. It could just be mildly annoying, if the medicines are as easy to find as pain killers, or it could be a major pain in the ass, if the medicines are as rare as 50 cal sniper rifles. But either way, it will be less fun and challenge and more simple annoyance. It won't lead to grouping either, it will lead to more KOS.

[mzltv 2281]

I have to say, glasscasket; fair shout.

I'm a little concerned myself. The concept of disease and stuff is quite cool, and I'm fully onboard with what I've heard so far, but I do wonder how the Standalone's going to play once you've implemented so many of these fundamental survival systems.. I just think it could be a bit too much, but like I said; so far I'm onboard, and I'll see how the Standalone actually plays before I choose which side of the fence I'm on.

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

My personal opinion is that it's a tad early to start getting worried about a concept (disease) that is at a very early stage in the thought process. The key to getting anything right in DayZ will be balance.

OP - It sounds like you think these ideas are are going to be introduced at the expense of others.

Quote: "OH THE DAYS WHEN ROCKET WOULD TALK ABOUT COOLER BASE BUILDING AND BEEFING UP VEHICLES" - He was discussing the amount of work they've been doing with vehicle customization very recently on these forum's and base building is possibly one of his most discussed subjects and one of the main things he intends to spend a lot of time on.

We'll only know how it's all going to pan out once we get to play it but nothing I've read about the development process so far makes me worried at all.

Edited November 23, 2012 by Fraggle

[glasscasket 33]

My personal opinion is that it's a tad early to start getting worried about a concept (disease) that is at a very early stage in the thought process. The key to getting anything right in DayZ will be balance.

OP - It sounds like you think these ideas are are going to be introduced at the expense of others.

Quote: "OH THE DAYS WHEN ROCKET WOULD TALK ABOUT COOLER BASE BUILDING AND BEEFING UP VEHICLES" - He was discussing the amount of work they've been doing with vehicle customization very recently on these forum's and base building is possibly one of his most discussed subjects and one of the main things he intends to spend a lot of time on.

We'll only know how it's all going to pan out once we get to play it but nothing I've read about the development process so far makes me worried at all.

GOOD STUFF.

Really, the key is balance... and DayZ has that down pretty good now. It is a bit early to get all flustered, yes. Saturation? That is not the key.

EDIT: Also, in regards to your comment on my OPness: Yes, I guess you could say I am. Big things like that in the gears of it all definitely carries major 'weight' from developmental and gameplay perspectives. I am not being all, "OH NO MY DREAMS/HOPES/SEXUAL FANTASIES ARE SHATTERED BECAUSE HE'S DOING THIS INSTEAD OF THAT"

... but I unno man. I JUST GET THIS VIBE. Rocket did this whole interview with Canada.com, and I guess Zombies weren't even really apart of the whole jam anyways(which i guess it's true, they aren't) and that it was intended to have more of a survival focus.

Then again most of this is just my own personal blathering and I am sure rocket and co aren't dumb.

Edited November 23, 2012 by glasscasket

[rocket 16567]

Then again most of this is just my own personal blathering and I am sure rocket and co aren't dumb.

I don't think we're dumb, but unless we actively seek to push the boundaries and make mistakes, we're not going to break new territory and move from being an interesting concept to a great game. This means we need to be prepared to make mistakes.

Will diseases work well? Will the new inventory system be better? Will weapon/clothing degradation be a worthwhile feature or just annoying? I don't know, and I don't think anyone does. That's why we do them, because they're interesting concepts. We try them, we see what works.

Construction + Vehicles require huge amounts of programmer time. Diseases - the required functionality is entirely already in game therefore it simply requires some designer time. Things are done in order mainly because of the workload they represent. Construction + Vehicle changes represent entirely new mechanics that aren't core the experience. Inventory + weapon customization/degradation + clothing + item spawning are all core mechanics that have been entirely reworked from the ground up ... they are CORE mechanics - so that is where we start.

DayZ development will continue till at least this time next year. As I said in the tumblr post, this is merely the end of the beginning.

[Michaelvoodoo25 3120]

So, when are you releasing it Mr Sir rocket?

[rocket 16567]

So, when are you releasing it Mr Sir rocket?

When it's ready, and not a day before. Anything less would be less than what anyone (including myself) deserves.

Just ask David Braeben if he would have rather delayed Frontier First Encounters before it was released. It was a great game, but a disaster on release because it wasn't ready.

[glasscasket 33]

I don't think we're dumb, but unless we actively seek to push the boundaries and make mistakes, we're not going to break new territory and move from being an interesting concept to a great game. This means we need to be prepared to make mistakes.

Will diseases work well? Will the new inventory system be better? Will weapon/clothing degradation be a worthwhile feature or just annoying? I don't know, and I don't think anyone does. That's why we do them, because they're interesting concepts. We try them, we see what works.

Construction + Vehicles require huge amounts of programmer time. Diseases - the required functionality is entirely already in game therefore it simply requires some designer time. Things are done in order mainly because of the workload they represent. Construction + Vehicle changes represent entirely new mechanics that aren't core the experience. Inventory + weapon customization/degradation + clothing + item spawning are all core mechanics that have been entirely reworked from the ground up ... they are CORE mechanics - so that is where we start.

DayZ development will continue till at least this time next year. As I said in the tumblr post, this is merely the end of the beginning.

:D:D:D Well, considering you're pretty much the end all to DayZ... I, glasscasket, deem this satisfactory in my books.

Either way, so long as it's still a moddable experience you're pretty much guaranteed success :D

Thanks for taking the time to respond, homie.

PS BE MY FRIEND

[DrunkPunk 159]

I don't think we're dumb, but unless we actively seek to push the boundaries and make mistakes, we're not going to break new territory and move from being an interesting concept to a great game. This means we need to be prepared to make mistakes.

Will diseases work well? Will the new inventory system be better? Will weapon/clothing degradation be a worthwhile feature or just annoying? I don't know, and I don't think anyone does. That's why we do them, because they're interesting concepts. We try them, we see what works.

Construction + Vehicles require huge amounts of programmer time. Diseases - the required functionality is entirely already in game therefore it simply requires some designer time. Things are done in order mainly because of the workload they represent. Construction + Vehicle changes represent entirely new mechanics that aren't core the experience. Inventory + weapon customization/degradation + clothing + item spawning are all core mechanics that have been entirely reworked from the ground up ... they are CORE mechanics - so that is where we start.

DayZ development will continue till at least this time next year. As I said in the tumblr post, this is merely the end of the beginning.

I think you could argue that stuff like the vehicles and construction, especially, is pretty core to the experience, given how drastically it will change the experience. Especially the construction aspect. I'd wager, at least, that it's more of a core mechanic than diseases, or say, dogs. You are correct, though, about making mistakes. I'm not here to say play it safe the whole time, because if you did that, DayZ wouldn't exist. However, there is a lot of room to look at mistakes developers have made in the past, with other games. Hell, you can even look at the issues people have with DayZ to see this. Particularly, what people really, truly dislike is overly complicated systems that maintain too many variables. The disease system you have suggested, at least in my eyes, falls under that category. Weapons degrading, okay, that might be more my own issue with a system than something I think won't work, because I'm sure you can implement it in a way that not only makes sense but isn't too cumbersome throughout gameplay.

I get it is all something that we all can't know how it will work until it is implemented. Just keep in mind, that while the game is about survival, adding in too many elements regarding survival will effectively create more annoyance than drive, and will potentially alienate the majority of the player base. In any case, I'll be buying your game and providing all the feedback I can for it, because I want it to succeed probably more than you do :P

quick edit. of course, the absolute best possible compromise is to give us quite a bit of control over our servers (private hive, of course) to provide the playstyle we would prefer. say, remove diseases and weapons degrading, if that's not our thing. i'm not too sure on your plans for allowing us to customize our private servers, but the more power you provide us, the better we can tailor our experiences in the game, and the more we can get out of it in the long run.

Edited November 23, 2012 by DrunkPunk

[DaGolem 95]

When it's ready, and not a day before.

hrhr...."a variation of "it´s is done, when it is done!" :D

I hope of december but if not it is not bad.

There are many good new Maps like Taviana,Namalsk,Thirk...so the Mod is not getting boring.

Better it takes a longer time then a terrible release!

btw. Maybe someone from Team can make a Section "CustumsMaps"

It is sad to see that the maps getting not enough attention and getting lost in the "privatehive discussion"

[Fitzkrieg 129]

I get the desire for realism in the game, I totally do. There are reasons, however, why there aren't any games out there that are life simulations. Mainly because realism lacks balance. But also because life is full enough of tedious, boring BS. Games are typically supposed to be fun, though, and too much realism can suck the fun out of anything. I'm slightly worried about standalone, and sure it's not here yet so I can't really say anything. But weapons degrading, I'm not a fan of. At all. This disease system? I think it already sounds stupid as hell. Ultimately, we'll see, as time is the only thing that will tell.

Also, to the guy above me, it's hard to say "Trust them, they're professional game developers." Isn't rocket new to the game development thing? And in any case, if he's not, tons of "professional" developers manage to fuck up perfectly good formulas all the time. Not saying these guys will, but it's not enough to put my mind at ease.

Rocket said in a post that he isn't looking for balance. If you want balance go somewhere else, if you want something challenging and harsh, feel free to stick around.

[mzltv 2281]

...unless we actively seek to push the boundaries and make mistakes, we're not going to break new territory and move from being an interesting concept to a great game.

Can't say he doesn't have a point.

[rocket 16567]

I think you could argue that stuff like the vehicles and construction, especially, is pretty core to the experience, given how drastically it will change the experience.

Core to the experience, but it is additional to the engine. We are fixing the core engine to better match the DayZ we all want. That means a completely new method for dealing with weapons, inventory, items, etc... Not just the look at feel, but every aspect of it. How the servers work is completely changed. These are core engine changes. Construction would be an entirely new section added to the engine - we don't want to add this kind of new functionality until we have the base engine functioning as we want it for DayZ.

Game development is not about figuring out just what is the most important, but also figuring out the order in which you can actually do things. Sometimes, you can't do the really important stuff till later because you need the foundation stuff done first. And while that is being done by a few people, everyone else is working on other parts that may be somewhat less important. Game development isn't about devoting everyone to a single task, it is concurrent activity. That is why often seemingly unimportant stuff gets done and released in patches when big problems remain... big problems take time - but often only a few people. In the meantime, people work on other stuff.

[glasscasket 33]

Ahhh yes, the big change in client/server. I FORGOT ABOUT THIS, and how exciting this is, too. I think with the whole base construction thing I was thinking how Arma 2 does it and all, "OH THAT'D BE EASY WHY NOT GUYS" but yeah, that's not how you keep things interesting... and I can also see why that functionality was limited to tents/wirefence/sandbags. lol.

But like you said Rocket, just layin' dat foundation.

Regardless,

I AM PSYCHED.

[DrunkPunk 159]

Core to the experience, but it is additional to the engine. We are fixing the core engine to better match the DayZ we all want. That means a completely new method for dealing with weapons, inventory, items, etc... Not just the look at feel, but every aspect of it. How the servers work is completely changed. These are core engine changes. Construction would be an entirely new section added to the engine - we don't want to add this kind of new functionality until we have the base engine functioning as we want it for DayZ.

Game development is not about figuring out just what is the most important, but also figuring out the order in which you can actually do things. Sometimes, you can't do the really important stuff till later because you need the foundation stuff done first. And while that is being done by a few people, everyone else is working on other parts that may be somewhat less important. Game development isn't about devoting everyone to a single task, it is concurrent activity. That is why often seemingly unimportant stuff gets done and released in patches when big problems remain... big problems take time - but often only a few people. In the meantime, people work on other stuff.

Oh, I'm no stranger to game development :) And I do get what you're saying, and you're right. I guess I forget sometimes just how different this engine is turning out than the Arma 2 engine, and how much work is likely still to be done on it. I do think, however, that construction would be a task better performed as part of the initial groundwork for the engine, to prevent a much more challenging time implementing it at a later stage, but of course I know you have a better grasp of the engine than I do. I appreciate your responses, and openness to discussion for this kind of stuff (especially for those of us who don't reddit :P). I do hold a lot of faith in what you're doing, and what you're giving back to the hardcore gamers. And my concerns for the final product are really just a reflection of that.

[Dancing.Russian.Man 1631]

Weapon degradation? VIRULENT DISEASES?

this is a pretty general suggestion, and i know it's 'their' game and all...

... but honestly this has me worried for standalone, and i'll more than likely be playing mods of the standalone, or just mods for arma 3 :\

I think the DayZ Dev team should take a look at youtube and see what makes DayZ so special and popular.

OH THE DAYS WHEN ROCKET WOULD TALK OF COOLER BASE BUILDING, AND BEEFING UP THE VEHICLES.

Diseases? I mean honestly, that's a big focus? We're talking about a zombie apocalypse here. Now I have to worry or not whether I can cook my food with adequate heat. Well, realistically speaking you can't just shoot down a dog and munch on the raw flesh you sliced off his leg. And even in a ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE, you can die of other, REAL diseases. It's not like your immunity system is going to be disease-proof now. Quite the opposite -- Due to all the stress, it would most likely become weaker. And due to how rampant all diseases would roam, and the lack of medicine, you're in a real threat of catching several diseases. Well, I guess I should definitely consider cutting back on all the Coke/Pepsi I drink in game, because that obviously isn't going to hydrate me... surely if I keep this sugar diet up I'll be too fat to run from the zombies. If you look at unedited DayZ gameplay videos, the players are on the move 90% of the time. Yeah, it's not really possible to run across a small continent with one can of Mountain Dew and then come back, but if it WAS, all that sugar would be spent ten-fold. So you had no chance of becoming fat with all that running.

Weapon degradation goes down a bit easier than a plethora of disease. I mean, it makes sense... but it'd be pretty cool if there was a bit more modular system with the weapons. I could see this if they were all, "K GUYS, THESE ARE THE GUNS IN DAYZ. DEAL." I love the guns in DayZ. It's a good balance. You can do damage with anything. My homie DP pops people outta choppas with a mak. It's all in how you use it ;D And yet you have to shoot someone in the chest 6 times with a .45 caliber revolver to knock them out. Not sure how that goes for balance, but it sure isn't fun.

Hard to say without it getting to be too much of a headache, but would repairing guns be like, 5% health akm + 10% health akm = 15% akm? Still, finding nothing but tin cans is pretty depressing. Finding broken guns? D: I think having to find ammo is bad enough. I would actually be down for weapon degradation if the melee system was sorted better, without having to learn it's nuances(ie stand two perfect ft. away from target to hit it). I have a lot of faith in Rocket putting in an actual melee system. Because there is NO MELEE OF ANY KIND in ARMA 2 or DayZ. Literally. None. The "axe" you find is a short-range, no-sound pistol with a slight change in animation.(swing) Have you ever noticed the little puff of smoke when you swing it? That smoke should be coming from a muzzle of a pistol.

JUST A COUPLE OF MY THOUGHTS.

YOU KNOW. We know.

[glasscasket 33]

why would you shoot someone in the chest and not the face?

[Guest]

lol this is kind of reminding me of far cry 2..

Weapon degradation?

Disease?

At any case, personally, I will just wait and see.

[SpittyTheDude 18]

I just wanna post my opinion on diseases. I honestly think it's one of the best features. I play on Namalsk lately, and I gotta admit, the way it implements the temperature system is very good. On Namalsk I have learned that weapons aren't the most important thing in DayZ.

I was all geared up, m4 CCO SD(12 extra clips), G17 etc. but I was shaking cold, coughing and couldn't find any food. My blood indicator went red and I took my last chance to write on the side chat and ask for help. And a guy responded, he had antibiotics and a helicopter. I told him my position, marked the spot with a green smoke grenade, 5 minutes later he landed. I layed down all my weapons to show my respect, and he gave me cure.

My first friendly experience after playing DayZ since early Juli :). The point I'm making is: when people have to rely on each other, in order to survive, then this game can be more than about bandit killing and avoiding people.