Are Choppers needed in DayZ?

[Zombie Jesus 723]

Please explain how I was "a huge dick" and back up your explantion with valid points and then perhaps were can move on to more civil conversations?

Need an example, every fucking post in this thread.

Man, someone has a very sandy vagina the past two days, calm down it is a game.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Zombie Jesus

[jossy 1]

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

[HowardTheDuck 27]

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

That's the point of them in DayZ, currently being only one and seeing it is (or should be, at least) very rare. If you're going to compare it with real life then they've got it as close as you can get.

[Zombie Jesus 723]

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

Yea because every video game should be limited to what you can do in real life. Nothing is needed in Dayz, question is are they fun without a huge amount of drawbacks, I would say yes they are. It is not like I have choppers all the time but one of my greatest Dayz moments was getting into a battle with another helicopter and taking it and the crew down.

[Jex =TE= (DayZ) 218]

Then you didn't read the posts. (Doesn't surprise me) Nice ad hominem attack as well, I'm 30 and gainfully employed. Keep trying though. You can't swing and miss forever.

Try non sequitur

[Jex =TE= (DayZ) 218]

That's the point of them in DayZ, currently being only one and seeing it is (or should be, at least) very rare. If you're going to compare it with real life then they've got it as close as you can get.

I don't think we need to compare to rl - out of 40 people (on a server) who knows how to actually fly one and how to maintain one and really, how many choppers would be flying anyway? The point is an unfair advantage over others. Not everyone can have one and with the current canopy issue it's too easy to find bases and rape chopper crash sites meaning the team with the chopper can gear up at a massively increased rate to everyone else. Fly by the area - any zombies spawned? No ok let's land then, etc etc

[rallye 89]

I don't think we need to compare to rl - out of 40 people (on a server) who knows how to actually fly one and how to maintain one and really, how many choppers would be flying anyway? The point is an unfair advantage over others. Not everyone can have one and with the current canopy issue it's too easy to find bases and rape chopper crash sites meaning the team with the chopper can gear up at a massively increased rate to everyone else. Fly by the area - any zombies spawned? No ok let's land then, etc etc

Not everyone can have a UAZ REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a PBX REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a URAL REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a MOTORCYCLE REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

That's what you are saying. DayZ is not balanced to be fair, it's not balanced at all. You want balance, there are plenty of other games to play.

As I have said, Life isn't fair and neither is DayZ. Nor should it be.

Deal with it. It's whiners like you that are the biggest danger to the standalone being a steaming pile of shit.

[Zombie Jesus 723]

I don't think we need to compare to rl - out of 40 people (on a server) who knows how to actually fly one and how to maintain one and really, how many choppers would be flying anyway? The point is an unfair advantage over others. Not everyone can have one and with the current canopy issue it's too easy to find bases and rape chopper crash sites meaning the team with the chopper can gear up at a massively increased rate to everyone else. Fly by the area - any zombies spawned? No ok let's land then, etc etc

See Jex is it so hard to discuss a point without an insult?

Who cares about realism, we can just assume that our characters have a military background since they seem to have basic weapon and survival skills since if we get into this whole realism argument our characters would be extremely limited in what they can do. If we go with a strict realism argument you might as well get rid of medical system, shooting, fixing cars, running for prolonged periods, and other skills that not everyone has.

As far as advantages I will say it again, this game is not about balance. If it was we would have starting loadouts because the guy with an AKM shooting at the guy with a double barrel shotgun is unfair as well. Why should someone who is good at the game or has put in the massive amount of work that goes with finding and repairing a helicopter be punished because they now have a legitimate advantage over other players. The advantage was not easily obtained and the helicopters are very rare and stay destroyed for up to 7 days so they are not a common occurrence on regular servers, not really seeing why this is some huge problem that can not be solved with a few minor tweaks. Helicopters are rather easy to take down and almost every player will attempt to shoot at the players in a helicopter and the helicopter itself so it does come with significant drawbacks. Your argument about ease of travel applies to vehicles and I have used an offroad truck to effectively search for campsites and hidden vehicles in the past, so many of your points transfer over to items, weapons, and vehicles that you seem to be perfectly fine with (this is why people assume you are butthurt about a particular incident, maybe you are not but you can at least see why some would think that).

We will most likely disagree on this topic no matter what either of us says, just try not to get so worked up over this shit it really is not worth it and the reason you get harsh responses is completely on you. When the majority of people respond negatively to the way you are acting it is not an indication that everyone else is stupid.

[patrick_insanity@hotmail.com 111]

Well well.. as far concerning the whole rage inbetween.. I'll ignore all of that.

I'll be honest that I haven't flown a chopper in Chernarus at all yet. I play solo most of the time and fixing one on my own is probably close to impossible (for me that is.)

I've flewn in a Huey as a gunner in Takistan. which is more of a vehicle fun map or.. die out in the ass of the map.. but yeah I only then noticed (might also be due to the lack of fog in the map) that you can scout out the map with little to no effort. Now speaking for myself, I was enjoying it but at the same time I noticed how much of advantage it gives you (and your team) not to mention that as a team you already are more of a threat to others. but in Chernarus, I've rarelly encountered Heli's up in the air. though when I hear one comming it does give you that kind of excitement of danger as they might be out there to kill you or they're just flying about picking their friends from the coast. I can imagine how bandits would love to take out a chopper or try and hijack it even. so in some aspects I think it has it's home in DayZ but it can greatly surpress other players who have no proper gear to fight against them. Also considering a heli crew can have a team on the ground to smoke out the people they've spotted from the heli.

So yeah back to the whole OP's statement. perhaps there could be a way to reduce the visibility of interactive objects (players and vehicles etc.) when you're gaining altitude. it's probably absurd but it might be something. other than that. they could replace the huey with a more civil kind of helo. with minor visibility to the ground. being able to fly across the map in moments is advantage enough I'd say. so I guess it would become more of a transportation helo rather than an all around heli with multiple advantages. though I can only imagine the frustration of losing a heli to a sniper with an M107. but in this case when the heli would be replaced with something that would only serve as transportation. I'm sure you'd try to avoid crowded areas anyhow.

[daze23 549]

Despite being a mighty airborne weapon, helis can be taken down with just a few shots by a skilled sniper with a duped/hacked-in AS50 or M107

*fixed*

i think the obvious thing is you shouldn't be able to hide them off map

how would you guys feel if there was more than one per server?

[daze23 549]

anyone that doesn't think

DayZ is not balanced to be fair, it's not balanced at all.

so why do people care about hackers?

edit: obviously Rocket was worrying about "balance" when he was picking and choosing what weapons and vehicles would be in the game, tweeking zombie behavior, etc

the game is meant to be "difficult", and achieving that is a form of "balance"

like i said, if you don't care about things being "fair" and "balanced", you should have no problem with hackers running around with god-mode, aim-bot, etc

Edited October 10, 2012 by daze23

[rallye 89]

anyone that doesn't think

so why do people care about hackers?

edit: obviously Rocket was worrying about "balance" when he was picking and choosing what weapons and vehicles would be in the game, tweeking zombie behavior, etc

the game is meant to be "difficult", and achieving that is a form of "balance"

like i said, if you don't care about things being "fair" and "balanced", you should have no problem with hackers running around with god-mode, aim-bot, etc

Your whole post falls apart in one sentence. People hate hackers because they illegitimately gain an advantage.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Lobo

[hawc 63]

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

You can't respawn in RL so let's make permanent death as in you get banned and can never buy the game again.

[daze23 549]

Your whole post falls apart in one sentence. People hate hackers because they illegitimately gain an advantage.

only carebears worry about what's legitimate

the idea that DayZ isn't "balanced" or meant to be "balanced" is just ridiculous. in another thread I said "no one wants to play a game where you have no chance in hell", and of course some cool guy was like "I do". no you don't. you want a game that is a challenge, not a game that is literally impossible (and no I'm not saying DayZ is impossible. it's just a devil's advocate argument against this idea that "balance" doesn't matter)

[Zombie Jesus 723]

only carebears worry about what's legitimate

the idea that DayZ isn't "balanced" or meant to be "balanced" is just ridiculous. in another thread I said "no one wants to play a game where you have no chance in hell", and of course some cool guy was like "I do". no you don't. you want a game that is a challenge, not a game that is literally impossible (and no I'm not saying DayZ is impossible. it's just a devil's advocate argument against this idea that "balance" doesn't matter)

Maybe your view is not coming across well but how the hell does playing a game legitimate without cheating make one a care bear? I could care less when I die and often I just laugh (even when it is a hacker, had a guy spawn behind me and then he said do not cross this line while shooting the ground and I promptly crossed that line and died, still laughed), but cheating is cheating and that is why I care. Killing anyone while being a cheating little girl should not be accepted by any player who also has even a shred of dignity, not saying you should rage out about it but hating dirty skiddies is not even close to being a carebear.

As far as an impossible game to win Dayz is just that, so is the zombie mode on CoD. Both of these are fairly popular despite not having an end game objective besides survive as long as possible. Balance is impossible in Dayz, there will always be inequities in this game as long as one can find better gear. Unless you are advocating for fixed loadouts on spawn there will never even be the semblence of balance in this game. There will always be the guy shooting you when you have nothing or next to nothing.

I have now heard everything on this forum, being against cheating is now the same as being a carebear. Thanks for the laugh man.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Zombie Jesus

[daze23 549]

Maybe your view is not coming across well but how the hell does playing a game legitimate without cheating make one a care bear? I could care less when I die and often I just laugh (even when it is a hacker, had a guy spawn behind me and then he said do not cross this line while shooting the ground and I promptly crossed that line and died, still laughed), but cheating is cheating and that is why I care. Killing anyone while being a cheating little girl should not be accepted by any player who also has even a shred of dignity, not saying you should rage out about it but hating dirty skiddies is not even close to being a carebear.

As far as an impossible game to win Dayz is just that, so is the zombie mode on CoD. Both of these are fairly popular despite not having an end game objective besides survive as long as possible. Balance is impossible in Dayz, there will always be inequities in this game as long as one can find better gear. Unless you are advocating for fixed loadouts on spawn there will never even be the semblence of balance in this game. There will always be the guy shooting you when you have nothing or next to nothing.

I have now heard everything on this forum, being against cheating is now the same as being a carebear. Thanks for the laugh man.

I was being sarcastic with that "carebear" thing. it seems to be the goto insult when someone wants to change something in the game, so I took it to ridiculous levels. I considered using some kind of notation to indicate sarcasm, but yeah...

I think it's equally ridiculous when someone suggests a change, people jump all over them like "the game wasn't meant to be balanced"

and i wasn't talking about a game being "impossible to win". I'm talking about a game being "impossible" to do anything. just imagine you spawn, the zeds see you from any distance, run faster than you, kill you with one hit, and you have no weapon. again, I am not saying this is what DayZ is like. it's just an example of why "balance" matters, and how having an impossible game wouldn't be fun

Superman 64 and ET for the 2600 come to mind...

Edited October 10, 2012 by daze23

[NickM (DayZ) 57]

And what does that have to do with choppers?

I have yet to join a server where the zombies are flying choppers-the closest they come to that is spawning on the crashed ones.

If you are saying having the choppers in game makes it impossible for anyone that does not have a chopper, I'm just going to have to disagree with you.

Edited October 10, 2012 by NickM

[Zombie Jesus 723]

Daze, no problem man sometimes sarcasm is hard to read online, happens to us all. Great example of a game that is just impossible, I actually remember raging out on that one as a child and swearing to never play it again (I think I followed through too).

As far as balanced, maybe it is just one of those loaded terms on this forum that I read too much into (like realism). We all have different preferences so I should learn to not attack someone for stating what their preference is, but in all fairness the OP started this thread out in terrible fashion and the tone reflects that fact. Starts with a simple response that was not at all insulting and the OP turns around and calls the poster an asshole, really was uncalled for and then the OP just continued down that path.

[NavyCuda 39]

Agreed, If you ever had to scavenge 50 jerry cans by your self it is a task in itself.

I've found that the UH-1H can be moved from any of its spawn points to a relatively safe fuelling point with a minimum of 3 Jerry cans and a maximum of 5. Now, fuelling the UH-1H by yourself takes a long time and I've never felt more exposed than going back and forth between a fuel tank and the Huey for close to 10 minutes.

Getting a chopper to full repaired the legit way can be a lot of work. It is a pretty easy target unless it's moving fast or high up and doesn't get too much ammo. I think it is pretty reasonable.

Getting the UH-1H operational on an empty server with no vehicles has taken my wife and I over 6 man hours(2 persons times 3 hours each).

If I hear gunfire while I'm flying, especially if I hear the crack of the super-sonic projectile passing by I'm retreating to a safe distance until I can get some of my people on the ground then I distract with the UH-1H while my ground forces advance.

If u had a brain u could read, though I already answered this above however the ;) would normally indicate I'm joking around with what I said but since u require baby food because ur not on solids yet, I feel the need to point this out to you ;)

As a rule of thumb, people will take you more seriously when you at least make an effort to correctly use the English language. "U" and "Ur" are not real words, please for the sake of the human race and out of respect for the language we speak, make an effort to be grammatically correct. I hate to have to be the person to say this, because I have horrible spelling and did poorly in English in school. I happen to be replying to you, but I'm generalizing to everyone who posts online.

Not a fan of choppers at all. Never knew how easy you could spot everything until I was in one. We could basically look over the whole map within an hour and get all camp locations. Nothing is safe when there's a chopper on the loose.

The only way I can see myself hiding a tent is glitching it inside a building or placing it under water.

Would not mind at all if they were taken out.

I respect your opinion, but I would mind if the UH-1H was removed. I'm actually very glad that it is the UH-1H, perhaps the most iconic helicopter of all time.

...

Do helicopters belong in DayZ? No, not at all.

They take away much more than they add

At this time, to the best of my knowledge public hive servers only have one UH-1H.

I have seen more than one on private hive servers though.

Many other military helicopters many not belong in DayZ, but if any helicopter does, it's the Huey. Having control of the Huey represents an enormous time investment, never mind trying to keep it longer than one session. I have only once managed to keep the Huey more than one gaming session, but I still lost it within 24 hours from getting it operational. My previous home server, the admins parked the Huey off map and wouldn't restart the server until the Huey was moved somewhere safe and then the server would get restarted. I only had the Huey once on that server.

I'm starting to believe that the people who do not support having the Huey in game are the people who do not have the real life time to allocate to DayZ to make the Huey a viable option for them, so their solution is to try and find ways to prevent other people from having it.

[NavyCuda 39]

"it's not what you put into a game that makes it great, it's what you leave out of it"

Of course we could add jetpacksand lazorguns and all that shit to dayZ, but that wont make it a better game, dayz in fact is way too easy it is right now, and balance is important in EVERY game, even if rocket calls it an anti-game

without balance, everyone will run around with the best shit

...

lets just make it the servers choice if they want to have a huey or not, and be good with it

Not one person in my group thinks of DayZ as a game, even though we do label it a game. DayZ is the premier shit hit the fan simulator. Balance does not belong in something that is simulating a hypothetical apocalypse.

Private hive servers do have the option to select if they want to have the Huey or multiple of them. In fact private hive servers offer the opportunity for the handout crowd to play the game however they want and I completely support that. What I don't support is that same mentality being applied to the public hive.

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

I would argue that a good portion of the people who play DayZ have never handled a firearm, let alone fired or maintained one, therefore why should they be able to use a firearm in DayZ?

I don't think we need to compare to rl - out of 40 people (on a server) who knows how to actually fly one and how to maintain one and really, how many choppers would be flying anyway? The point is an unfair advantage over others. Not everyone can have one and with the current canopy issue it's too easy to find bases and rape chopper crash sites meaning the team with the chopper can gear up at a massively increased rate to everyone else. Fly by the area - any zombies spawned? No ok let's land then, etc etc

The helicopter is an advantage, but it is not remotely unfair. The only unfair advantage that exists in DayZ is when people script in gear and vehicles.

anyone that doesn't think

so why do people care about hackers?

edit: obviously Rocket was worrying about "balance" when he was picking and choosing what weapons and vehicles would be in the game, tweeking zombie behavior, etc

the game is meant to be "difficult", and achieving that is a form of "balance"

like i said, if you don't care about things being "fair" and "balanced", you should have no problem with hackers running around with god-mode, aim-bot, etc

I don't have the link handy, or remember where to find it, but I do remember something that the list of items that could become available is huge. Most games when in alpha and beta stages rarely ever have the full compliment of items that will be available in the final version. You don't need 200 different firearms to be able to test that firearms work correctly in game, a small sample pool from each class is sufficient to validate the functionality. DayZ mod is still in alpha, so there is no reason for the entire inventory selection to be available.

only carebears worry about what's legitimate

the idea that DayZ isn't "balanced" or meant to be "balanced" is just ridiculous. in another thread I said "no one wants to play a game where you have no chance in hell", and of course some cool guy was like "I do". no you don't. you want a game that is a challenge, not a game that is literally impossible (and no I'm not saying DayZ is impossible. it's just a devil's advocate argument against this idea that "balance" doesn't matter)

DayZ as it stands is no where near impossible for those willing to work for it. If DayZ is literally impossible, it would not have the following that it does. Some people may find DayZ more challenging than others. There are some real world skills can be applied to DayZ and if you have those skills it means that it will be less challenging, but certainly not less fun.

...

As far as an impossible game to win Dayz is just that, so is the zombie mode on CoD.

...

Black Ops zombies is a perfect example of an impossible to win scenario, yet is still very entertaining. I've only ever made it to 37 legitimately on Kino (52 with inf.ammo before that cheat was disabled). Excellent example, thank you for posting that.

Edited October 11, 2012 by NavyCuda

[Bakst 98]

As far as balanced, maybe it is just one of those loaded terms on this forum that I read too much into (like realism). We all have different preferences so I should learn to not attack someone for stating what their preference is, but in all fairness the OP started this thread out in terrible fashion and the tone reflects that fact. Starts with a simple response that was not at all insulting and the OP turns around and calls the poster an asshole, really was uncalled for and then the OP just continued down that path.

"Realism" is definitely a loaded term, and Rocket prefers to call it authenticity, that's what the devs are aiming for: authentic experiences that accurately reflect real life situations without the need to model every last detail. Quoting the man himself here:

I'm steering well clear of the term "realistic" because it's a loaded term, we will be aiming for "authenticity". I.e. The experience should model the thought processes, feelings, and emotions associated with a similar situation - but it need not follow the exact "how it happens". This means we will model the tensions required to make the player make decisions thatsomewhat resemble those they might face in a real situation. It's really an extension of what was done already with DayZ, but with a proper team and genius engine programmers instead of, well, me.

In that sense, being able to fly a chopper is plausible enough -- assuming the guy has some kind of military background, which would explain why he can handle almost any type of gun and read maps, not to mention being fit as hell (running crouched like that all the time would DESTROY a normal man's back in no time -- believe me, I tried during my last paintball session!)

[Bakst 98]

*fixed*

Is it still that bad? Seems to me like Battleye has been clamping down on the duping in a major way. I haven't been hit by a script kiddie in weeks, but I constantly see "script restriction" messages from BE. I know there are still many duped/scripted weapons in circulation, but it's only a matter of time before things normalize.

i think the obvious thing is you shouldn't be able to hide them off map

I thought off-map vehicles get wiped and reset during server restart (i.e. they don't save off the map)?

how would you guys feel if there was more than one per server?

Two helis per server would be cool. Any more and it turns into a heli DM :)

[Osaka (DayZ) 32]

No, choppers are not needed in DayZ, over half you morons don't even know how to fly one in real life why should you in DayZ?

I indeed cannot fly a real one because I never tried, I need to learn first.

But I however do not break my legs by jumping off a table, and I know that morphine does not heal broken bones.

I also know that zombies don't exist, and that you can't simply fix any helicopter by attaching a random rotery engine to it without even the slightest amount of tools and knowledge on how to do this.

I also do not need windshield glass to make a car drivable, and ammunication doesn't magically spawn in random buildings.

Hatchets work fine without reloading their mags, and at night I cannot magically see better by upping the gamma correction of my eyes.

I can drink from a waterpump without the use of a bottle.

A shot to the chest cannot be repaired with a mere bandage and my bloodloss is not replenished simply by eating a truckload of baked beans back to back.

And..so....on

[Bakst 98]

(...) and at night I cannot magically see better by upping the gamma correction of my eyes.

lol excellent!

authenticity, not realism; a game, not RL. And yet, it will be forever discussed on the forums.

[Jex =TE= (DayZ) 218]

Not everyone can have a UAZ REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a PBX REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a URAL REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

Not everyone can have a MOTORCYCLE REMOVE PLZ ITS UNFAIR

That's what you are saying. DayZ is not balanced to be fair, it's not balanced at all. You want balance, there are plenty of other games to play.

As I have said, Life isn't fair and neither is DayZ. Nor should it be.

Deal with it. It's whiners like you that are the biggest danger to the standalone being a steaming pile of shit.

Your comparing something that spawns 3 of in game against 30+ other somethings - how is this even close to being a comparison? Not only that, can you fly any of these vehicles you listed? Can they travel across the map in a straight line at twice the speed of most vehicles?

So you have no issues with choppers being these super powered machines that never need any maintenance and can see through forests with ease - nobody here has a problem with this right? You all are perfectly happy to get ur camps raided and find nothing but crap at chopper crash sites and then get ur asses sniped by an AS50 - everyone here is totally ok with that and doesn't think any of this needs addressing one bit.