Perks to reduce PVP

[ScienceMan 9]

This may have been done before, but I searched a bit and I couldn't find exactly what I am suggesting.

I think that we can easily reduce the amount of PVP by just adding some perks to hero and bandit skins. Here is what I suggest...

Hero Skin: -20% damage taken from everyone, -10% damage done to civilians

Bandits: +20% damage taken from everyone, -20% damage done to civilians

Now this helps only with close contact fighting, I know it doesn't address sniping. I did read on one forum a very good idea that I didn't think got enough attention. I don't know who you are so I can't cite you but you did well with this one. Lets say bandits have schizophrenia or some mental disorder like that. They will have to go to hospitals to get medication. Much like the way your water and food bars turn red, as a bandit your medication bar turns red. When it turns red like you would starve or dehydrate it will have a different effect. You wont die, but your screen will fade in and out between your current health level and as dark and gray as it will go. Also you will hear random gunshots, zombie moans, and vehicle sounds in the distance if your medication is low. As I am writing this I think it might be better for the "medication" bar to be similar to health so you have a sliding scale of symptoms....

I also think that humanity gain should be done differently. Right now I think it is every five minutes playing you gain 150... I think it should be reduced to 50. However, if you are within 50m of a hero you humanity gain should be 150. And if you are within 50m of a bandit you humanity should drop by 50 every 5 minutes.

Anyways this is the best way I can think of reducing PVP in the game... What do you guys think?

[Sgt.Asshat 607]

Why reduce PVP? thats a main aspect of the mod lol

[twitch13 49]

bad idea is bad. need a reduction in PvP? find another game.

[The_Weapon1 33]

Seems to me that you just want to reduce banditry. Probably because you always get shot.

[aoikazega 9]

Some people just don't like pvp, and I can somewhat relate. I think it should be a gamemode option; ie. PVPE, Horde (5x zombie spawns). In other words, a co-op. But this website will be dead very soon, rocket is dropping the mod and picking up the standalone. The new website will most likely be linked with bohemia website.

[T.G. 48]

While I do not understand why you think pvp is a bad thing you are entitled to your opinion. I hope you realize that a damage bonus or reduction to a player based on their in game actions in no way falls in line with the "authentic" experience that the mod design is attempting to achieve. Beyond this in many cases it would be a pointless mathematical addition to a scenario that would ultimately end the same. Would you feel better that it took roughly ten shots to be killed instead of six? How do you imagine your twenty percent humanity tax (or forty percent for bandit vs hero) on damage would slow down an encounter with an anti-material weapon?

While I can appreciate that many players might not like the outcome of many of their pvp encounters, I would suggest that these players (and this often includes myself) work on becoming twenty percent more aware of their surroundings and the potential threats they harbor. This mod is not like other games. The stand alone looks to follow in that vein. Please stop suggesting that it should be anything other than what it is. If the experience is not to your liking then try another game that is more appropriate.

[arma2eraseditself 22]

I think that we can easily reduce the amount of PVP by just adding some perks to hero and bandit skins. Here is what I suggest...

Bandits: +20% damage taken from everyone, -20% damage done to civilians

This is honestly one of the worst ideads I have heard. LOTS of people like pvp and I understand if you dont. However alienating / penalizing one side of the community for playing that way is a poorly thought out plan. This game is a "sandbox world" where you can do what you will. YOU can go survive. (albeit with alot of trouble by yourself) its much easier in a group i suggest you find a clan. If not play low pop servers and learn the game mechanics. (IE how many zombies spawn in the NW Airfield vs Pusta etc to learn where people may or may not be w xx/xx zombies on map and 3 people) Understand that zombies spawn in from 200M and despawn @ 500?M.

This will help you recognize where players are and to stay away from them. THIS is just like real life. There would be looters (bandits) in real life and YOU (a normal person) would have to stay away from them.

[miket 92]

No. Simply no. Anything which artificially penalises players for PvP in a game is a horrible idea.

Giving people reason to work together on ther other hand is a good idea.

Things like a skill tree which is impossible for one character to master, or end-game goals which are impossible to achieve alone or would take a ridiculous amount of time.

[ScienceMan 9]

From most of my reading, Rocket is trying to reduce PvP. He has said that he wants the game to be more PvE. This is why I made this thread. I bandit with the best of them, I just thought I would submit my idea to reduce the thing that Rocket has himself said not the main focus of the game. The bandit skin was originally designed to designate the players who should be shot on sight. It was meant to be a deterrent, not an achievement. But this is what I have read and been told from players wiser than myself. If I am wrong then by all means keep it the same.

[ScienceMan 9]

Also, this would just make being a bandit more difficult. And normally the game I find most difficult are the games I enjoy and play the most. Darksouls for example....

[miket 92]

From most of my reading, Rocket is trying to reduce PvP. He has said that he wants the game to be more PvE. This is why I made this thread. I bandit with the best of them, I just thought I would submit my idea to reduce the thing that Rocket has himself said not the main focus of the game. The bandit skin was originally designed to designate the players who should be shot on sight. It was meant to be a deterrent, not an achievement. But this is what I have read and been told from players wiser than myself. If I am wrong then by all means keep it the same.

If all 50 players on a server worked together, the game would be too easy. Everyone would get bored of the mod after a week and go back to playing something else.

[malau (DayZ) 36]

While I do not understand why you think pvp is a bad thing you are entitled to your opinion. I hope you realize that a damage bonus or reduction to a player based on their in game actions in no way falls in line with the "authentic" experience that the mod design is attempting to achieve.........

Here's just some of the more obvious realism issues with DayZ if we're going to be nitpicky.

* You can't drink from a lake unless you have a bottle, you would sooner die of thirst than drink without a bottle ? That's not realistic.

* You can carry a couple of car tyres, a tank trap, a tent, a roll of barbed wire and 3 guns - and run (never mind even move). That's not realistic.

* You can drink and eat as many cans of food/drink as you can carry in a row and then sprint without puking ? That's not realistic.

* You can't eat raw meat - you would sooner die of hunger than eat raw meat. That's not realistic.

* There's no virus (nor will there ever be) that makes people both physically disintegrate AND yet super humanly strong. That's not realistic.

* I can't remove barbed wire with a bandage wrapped round my hand ? Why not ? That's not realistic.

[kinemator 4]

Anyways this is the best way I can think of reducing PVP in the game... What do you guys think?

It`s also good way to make this game more boring. I don`t think that PvP is a problem. The problem is that for single player this game is quite boring(when you are alive) and frustrating(when you die). If there would be some simple mechanism to create/join team you wouldn`t thnik about reducing PvP. With other people even dying should be fun:)

When joining server you should be able create team, join existing or play alone. Team could have some description: private/opened, interested in banditry/looting/hunting snipers/mic requierd etc. There are some problems with this proposition. It allows to join team and then betrayed them, first spawn after joining server should be near team not on coast.

[T.G. 48]

Here's just some of the more obvious realism issues with DayZ if we're going to be nitpicky.

* You can't drink from a lake unless you have a bottle, you would sooner die of thirst than drink without a bottle ? That's not realistic.

* You can carry a couple of car tyres, a tank trap, a tent, a roll of barbed wire and 3 guns - and run (never mind even move). That's not realistic.

* You can drink and eat as many cans of food/drink as you can carry in a row and then sprint without puking ? That's not realistic.

* You can't eat raw meat - you would sooner die of hunger than eat raw meat. That's not realistic.

* There's no virus (nor will there ever be) that makes people both physically disintegrate AND yet super humanly strong. That's not realistic.

* I can't remove barbed wire with a bandage wrapped round my hand ? Why not ? That's not realistic.

Hence the word "authentic" as opposed to realistic both taken in the context described by rocket in relation to the mod he designed. The mod is not at all realistic in comparison to reality as you have noted with several very good examples. In comparison to other games however this mod is brutally realistic. It is not perfect and doubtful ever will be. I agree with the problems you bring up and could list others as well, this does not justify the inclusion of further flawed game mechanics.

My intent was not to be nitpicky. My intent was to illustrate that the described mechanic would have little actual effect at discouraging pvp and question why redesigning the game mechanics to reshape open world interactions in a sandbox game would be a positive idea in the first place.

[ScienceMan 9]

If all 50 players on a server worked together, the game would be too easy. Everyone would get bored of the mod after a week and go back to playing something else.

I agree with you completely. The problem is right now, 99% of the people you meet are hostile. I cannot be sure, but I think rocket is going for more of a 50-75% hostile interaction area. Judging from what I have read on their interviews I think they want to have spontaneous factions form and small groups working together.

[BelMarduk 169]

While I do not understand why you think pvp is a bad thing you are entitled to your opinion. I hope you realize that a damage bonus or reduction to a player based on their in game actions in no way falls in line with the "authentic" experience that the mod design is attempting to achieve. Beyond this in many cases it would be a pointless mathematical addition to a scenario that would ultimately end the same. Would you feel better that it took roughly ten shots to be killed instead of six? How do you imagine your twenty percent humanity tax (or forty percent for bandit vs hero) on damage would slow down an encounter with an anti-material weapon?

While I can appreciate that many players might not like the outcome of many of their pvp encounters, I would suggest that these players (and this often includes myself) work on becoming twenty percent more aware of their surroundings and the potential threats they harbor. This mod is not like other games. The stand alone looks to follow in that vein. Please stop suggesting that it should be anything other than what it is. If the experience is not to your liking then try another game that is more appropriate.

What he is getting at (I think) is a concept that you find in table top roll playing games such as DND. Your player chooses an alignment, and the DM needs to ensure that the player plays to his alignment. A Paladin can not randomly kill innocents without there being serious repercussions, such as loosing his paladin bonuses and powers, where acting true to his alignment gains him his bonuses. Playing outside of a chosen alignment causes various issues (left to the discretion of the DM generally). Someone that just kills and kills fellow survivors would indeed have psychopathic issues that can manifest in different ways. This being a game takes out the "personal" (IRL feelings), so the CoD kiddies can just kill with impunity. Realism would dictate manifestations of paranoia and delusional effects, like hearing noises etc.

[Gordon Axeman 191]

Maybe just instakill players if they become bandits automatically? Lol.

[apache25 133]

sgt.asshat the main goal of the game is to survive not kill other players

[00dlez 22]

This may have been done before, but I searched a bit and I couldn't find exactly what I am suggesting.

I think that we can easily reduce the amount of PVP by just adding some perks to hero and bandit skins. Here is what I suggest...

Hero Skin: -20% damage taken from everyone, -10% damage done to civilians

Bandits: +20% damage taken from everyone, -20% damage done to civilians

Now this helps only with close contact fighting, I know it doesn't address sniping. I did read on one forum a very good idea that I didn't think got enough attention. I don't know who you are so I can't cite you but you did well with this one. Lets say bandits have schizophrenia or some mental disorder like that. They will have to go to hospitals to get medication. Much like the way your water and food bars turn red, as a bandit your medication bar turns red. When it turns red like you would starve or dehydrate it will have a different effect. You wont die, but your screen will fade in and out between your current health level and as dark and gray as it will go. Also you will hear random gunshots, zombie moans, and vehicle sounds in the distance if your medication is low. As I am writing this I think it might be better for the "medication" bar to be similar to health so you have a sliding scale of symptoms....

I also think that humanity gain should be done differently. Right now I think it is every five minutes playing you gain 150... I think it should be reduced to 50. However, if you are within 50m of a hero you humanity gain should be 150. And if you are within 50m of a bandit you humanity should drop by 50 every 5 minutes.

Anyways this is the best way I can think of reducing PVP in the game... What do you guys think?

No.

No visual ques indicating a player's playstyle.

Any "illness penalty" should apply to all players, not just bandits. There is discussion to be had whether or not a high hummanity score would make it affect a character less or not... But it should affect everyone on some level.

The goal is not to overtly reduce PvP, IMHO, it is to create additional factors to consider before pulling the trigger. Right now, Killing on Sight is the easiest and best way to approach all other survivors. There are no drawbacks or outside considerations other than "If I shoot first, I win, so I'll shoot". Bandits who want to be mass murderers should be able to do so without direct penalty or visual indication, but there should be long term implications to that style of play that balance it out with the risk of not shooting first.

[T.G. 48]

Someone that just kills and kills fellow survivors would indeed have psychopathic issues that can manifest in different ways. This being a game takes out the "personal" (IRL feelings), so the CoD kiddies can just kill with impunity. Realism would dictate manifestations of paranoia and delusional effects, like hearing noises etc.

I used to play d&d myself so I won't make fun of you for that, but I have to disagree with the alignment parallel. I do not think they should be included in this or any game to force players to act according to a set of preconceived guidelines. These alignments make decent short descriptions of world views and exceedingly poor indicators of how individuals react in specific situations. True neutral for example is bullshit unless you refuse to make a choice the majority of the time. I would also hesitate to drop all the CoD kiddies into the kill with impunity dictates manifestations of paranoia, delusional effects, visual and auditory hallucinations, etc. alignment whatever that might be. Chaotic evil? Human psychology is slightly more complex than this system makes it out to be. How many serial killers are described in this manner by their former neighbors and coworkers. I can recall a few more typical, quiet guy next door types than acid freaks with a taste for jerky. Certainly this is the direction that some minds would eventually follow, but there are plenty of other directions as well. You have already described these players as having no feelings and killing with impunity. This delusion and detachment could very well be the extent of their psychosis. How else would you describe someone sitting on a hillside waiting deliberately for something to pass through the crosshairs, indifferent to thirst, hunger, or the elements? I would like to describe these types as a Chigurh from No Country For Old Men or maybe Hannibal Lector (if cannibalism was allowed in game). I would but these types of players are not nearly this interesting, but their play style does not deserve penalty for being uninteresting or borderline psychotic.

If you are wondering why I am so strongly against discouraging pvp through penalties, I can only offer full disclosure for the style of play I would like to see. I play with a large group of players some friends, some friends of friends, and some just met along the way. The group is too large to coordinate easily most of the time. I have proposed that we divide into two (or more) smaller groups and compete with each other. Each group would still be well rounded enough to do everything the larger single group could with out the logistical drawbacks. There would be room for treachery, infighting, and power struggles all without any artificial game mechanics dictating these conditions. Once you start setting up obstacles to play within this sandbox to foster the type of game you want to see, please consider the other playstyles you would be doing away with. If the CoD douches are really your main concern, I do not see them sticking around that long. This is not the game for them and we should not be asking to alter its mechanics to attempt to change their playstyles or affect their fragile states of mind.

[Ajvkorn 72]

Go play arma 2 if u dont want to pvp. You said it yourself, the main point of this game is to survive. That means killing other players and taking their gear helps you survive better. If there is no pvp, what do you have to survive against? Zombies are NOT a challenge. They pose no real threat to you unless you go into a city and start shooting and attract them, which then just lets people know where you are. Rocket wants people to do what they want to do. HE wants us to be in charge and play how we want to play. I am not saying that this game should solely be based on pvp, but to try and penalize people for wanting to play how they want to play is ridiculous. How is getting vehicles, avoiding zombies, and hunting animals fun? It takes no skill. If this was real life, it would be different. No it wouldn't be fun, but not everybody would go around killing others without a second thought. So tired of these post.

[pondroid 10]

This was a crappy idea. It's a game based on survival and human nature.... perks shouldent be anyway near this game. If you like perks, go play cod.

[ScienceMan 9]

Right now I am really regretting using the word "perks" simply because people instantly link it to CoD. I see and understand most of your points. But as someone mentioned earlier the game as it stands right now is shoot first = win. The only time I have seen people cooperate has been between irl friends and unarmed spawns. These suggestions I think only apply because there is so much resources available. I was reading other posts and one by a guy named Mr. Two or something had a very good idea that I think would move this game in a more positive direction. He said there should be limited items based on a global hive scale. The thing is, there is so much pvp not because people want gear, but because they are fully decked out and have nothing to do so they get bored and snipe Cherno. With no wants for gear the game just turns into a free for all.

The other day I was playing and I was fully geared out. We went to town just because we had nothing else to do. I got sniped through a window and my friend was in the next door building. It took me 20 minutes to get back to my body and they guy didn't even try to loot it. I was FULLY decked out with nvg, gps, m16 w/ launcher, coyote backpack and the guy didn't even bother to come check out my gear.... He sniped and walked off. This kind of thing would not happen in real life. This is the situation I am suggesting to prevent and I realize now that my ideas address this a little bit but the best overall option would be to severely limit weapons and supplies so the game actually requires survival. I am sorry but there is not an infinite number of AS-50s in a soviet town.....

Edited August 31, 2012 by ScienceMan

[ScienceMan 9]

I tried to edit above but it wouldn't let me... But I was going to point out, that with unlimited gear the game turns into a free for all deathmatch and that is exactly what CoD is... And CoD is like this because of unlimited gear. By capping gear spawns you will essentially reduce pointless killing and increase killing for gear. And I am all for killing to get gear....

[00dlez 22]

I was FULLY decked out with nvg, gps, m16 w/ launcher, coyote backpack and the guy didn't even bother to come check out my gear.... He sniped and walked off. This kind of thing would not happen in real life. This is the situation I am suggesting to prevent and I realize now that my ideas address this a little bit but the best overall option would be to severely limit weapons and supplies so the game actually requires survival. I am sorry but there is not an infinite number of AS-50s in a soviet town.....

To be fair, none of this would "happen in real life". First, we are assuming there is a zombie apocolypse... for starters.

Next, half the players have probably never seen a real gun of any kind before, let alone are able to use military grade weapons and hit targets 800m away. Or be able to fly helicopters. Or even sprint for 10 minutes straight.

Your point about limiting supplies is decent and one many have agreed with, myself included - however, with so many servers all spawning loot and the ability for players to go from server to server... how limited would it really be?