Is rocket satisfied with us?

[Felix (DayZ) 21]

I mean how many more engines are there out there that can solve the basic requirements of huge maps' date=' thousands of AI and 50 or more players? I consider myself a hobby level game designer ;) but wonder if an Arma2/3 mod or paid DLC isn't the best choice with today's selections of engines at any price?

[/quote']

Unity is actually a solid engine. It has its issues, but overall it features great stuff and solid functionality. It defaults to the 32 network limit, but devs have tossed in different networking to develop MMOs. Various AI systems have cropped in recent years allowing for thousands.

Would be a lot more work than integrating into ARMA 2, and the familiarity with the engine makes Arma 2 a great platform for Rocket.

[Suicide Mouse 50]

Eurgh' date=' money. Reading this thread the concept of money comes up a lot and I really could just put on my political commie hat.

It is a shame to see money come into the mod's future because with free-content and mods it always goes down the wrong route for me in the sense of items that give you advantages and so forth. Donations I guess are fine but the wording here is that you require money from us :/

[/quote']

Don't be like this, doode. The world is not black and white, neither are the economic systems. Money can be used for good.

Have faith!

[demine0 43]

When the time comes' date=' I'll be asking the community to support this, with their wallets. But that time isn't now, its not the right time for that. I just honestly don't believe a massive cash injection would suddenly make everything better.

Am I satisfied? Of course I am! You guys pushed an obscure, old, game into the top sellers for an entire month on team. You made the gaming media wake up and take notice... and of what? A mod? A mod in Alpha? One that's pretty broken, difficult, complex, cruel, frustrating?

I didn't buy all those copies, you guys did. What a cool message to send to the publishers and studios out there. You can have a million good reviews, and a million people playing your game... but unless it is affecting a studios bottom line it probably won't get taken very seriously. The success is still very small, relatively speaking - but its the speed and the strength of the message you guys have sent that has made people stand up and take notice.

My responsibility is to stay true to what this is, and to keep saying what we have all been saying for a long time... because now the gaming media is listening, and the gaming publishers are scratching their heads and beginning to wonder if [i']just maybe their customers aren't actually retarded and just maybe this social media thing is more than just a marketing gimmick. Just maybe new ideas that are not shit can travel extremely fast, even if their delivery is a bit shit. Just maybe people want something exciting, and they're not actually that concerned with the packaging and the sexy bits.

My carebears comments and such, my build notes. I'm just trying to have some fun, maybe force a bit of introspection and get people to ditch the traditional shackles of modern video gaming boundaries. I think it's important to have some fun and not take yourself too seriously. I'm just a guy, a normal guy who loves this style of game. I was in the right place, at the right time, with the right thing. That's just how it rolls. My only regret is that I have to choose my words very carefully now, making jokes is fraught with difficulties. But that's just all part of it I guess.

My favorite aspect about DayZ is how accessible the development team is. For once I don't feel like I'm on the other side of the glass when you guys are making announcements and replying to forum topics. I think that's why I haven't touched Diablo III since the release day. I also get to see this game from a standpoint that many of the players don't get to see it, as a DayZ Gameserver host. I have a heavy background in IT, so I can truely appreiciate the technical conversations that I have with members of the development team on IRC.

[rocket 16567]

I've always suspected that even if you had the money (and the desire) to make some sort of stand-alone game out of this concept that it probably wouldn't end up much different than it is now.

Well yeah, that's what I don't understand from some people's questions.

There is only one fundamental difference between DayZ as a mod or DayZ as a product.

Access to source.

Kickstarter is for pussies!

[robollama 1]

You could simply throw up a poll for some preliminary data. Ask if people would rather DayZ transform into a standalone game or continue to be only a mod.

[rangerpl 1]

One downside I could see to having this as a commercial product would be the fact that it would give a lot of people a sense of entitlement such as "I PAID MONEY FOR THIS, YOU BETTER MAKE IT THE WAY I WANT".

But it's all pretty much up to rocket.

[Kigrax 0]

Dude please standalone and polish this game I would pay out the ass for it

[MR DELICIOUS 297]

Y'all really need to join me on chill hill, sit back and kill some zombies.

Everything is going pretty well. The community is new, a lot of the game mechanics are new. Everything is being tested. The suggestions forum likes being filled with suggestions, but please bear in mind that the more darts you throw doesn't mean you'll hit the board. Take a look at some of the new features being implemented, and then come up with ideas along those lines. There are ideas that Rocket obviously wants to try, and things that are not going to change.

The only tedious thing is when the same problem is incessantly presented by people with no understanding of sentence structure, use of punctuation, and especially when said problem really stems from an attraction to the most deadly areas in the game.

[cutzero 5]

When the time comes' date=' I'll be asking the community to support this, with their wallets. But that time isn't now, its not the right time for that. I just honestly don't believe a massive cash injection would suddenly make everything better.

Am I satisfied? Of course I am! You guys pushed an obscure, old, game into the top sellers for an entire month on team. You made the gaming media wake up and take notice... and of what? A mod? A mod in Alpha? One that's pretty broken, difficult, complex, cruel, frustrating?

I didn't buy all those copies, you guys did. What a cool message to send to the publishers and studios out there. You can have a million good reviews, and a million people playing your game... but unless it is affecting a studios bottom line it probably won't get taken very seriously. The success is still very small, relatively speaking - but its the speed and the strength of the message you guys have sent that has made people stand up and take notice.

My responsibility is to stay true to what this is, and to keep saying what we have all been saying for a long time... because now the gaming media is listening, and the gaming publishers are scratching their heads and beginning to wonder if [i']just maybe their customers aren't actually retarded and just maybe this social media thing is more than just a marketing gimmick. Just maybe new ideas that are not shit can travel extremely fast, even if their delivery is a bit shit. Just maybe people want something exciting, and they're not actually that concerned with the packaging and the sexy bits.

My carebears comments and such, my build notes. I'm just trying to have some fun, maybe force a bit of introspection and get people to ditch the traditional shackles of modern video gaming boundaries. I think it's important to have some fun and not take yourself too seriously. I'm just a guy, a normal guy who loves this style of game. I was in the right place, at the right time, with the right thing. That's just how it rolls. My only regret is that I have to choose my words very carefully now, making jokes is fraught with difficulties. But that's just all part of it I guess.

Well... I guess... thank you for replying to my thread :-) I just got scared that you don't enjoy making the mod because of the community. I'm really excited now that you want to get the mod into a game release as fast as possible. You delivered in average 1 patch in 3 dayZ (<- pun, you see it?) which is really really impressive and that "pay what you want" model would be great! People pay much for a good product. Hopefully your ideas on improving the gakme, adding new features and your way to think will never find an end.

-Cutzero

PS: Hopefully you still get enough tears from the community to feed yourself ;-)

[Bandage. 3]

Well this thread is full of awesome.

Rocket. If you really care about the community here that much, I'm sure I will never get out of here, ever. Gee, only seeing you posting here tells me that this mod's developer kicks ass, and I want to support him even further. We've got something that we all have been waiting for: the great concept of a game, with great ears towards the community itself!

(Even though we're still new and fresh, there's a lot to discuss while polishing the community type)

Lately, we've been treated like some witty excited kids who whine to get some more all the time. See how DICE and EA's combo did that to us, it's just so bad. The Battlefield forum (or should I say, Mordor) is loaded up with threads complaining and reasoning about DICE & EA and their decisions, because their focus is obviously on the money for now. The community is still pretty intact, but they aren't listened to at all. It's a horrifying sight to look at, really. That series is eventually going to get dumped down into the oblivion as like Call of Duty does, which is quite sad since I pretty much liked playing Battlefield 2 back then. It's just plain obvious in sight.

I happy to see I finally found a community and the developer team (should I call it as a team?) which actually listens to the community itself. I've not seen anything like that for years, so I'll be sure my support will be adequately greater than usually.

Keep up with the awesomeness, rocket. You'll see it's all worth it, even after the community has built up large. Just go and try to read us as a whole, we always have something important to say, and I'm sure about it!

[DaPessimist 1]

He doesn't like us. I don't like us.

Hopefully he has the will to stick to his vision. Most developers end up caving to the pressure.

[masacrualex 6]

Don't worry, most suggestions seem to be in the "benefit only me" gender and some are just something that the game will obviously have by its release and at one time or another is intended to be added. Now the bad ideas and so on are obviously overlooked, Rocket knows better.

[cod3r 1]

Torque 3D could handle this shiz. Plus the server will run on linux. Plus you get source and pay no royalties. Hard part is gonna be the gfx. check it out at garagegames.com

[Aquazi 0]

If this project takes too long' date=' then I am doing something wrong. I fully intend to have progressed to a full release (as what, mod/game I dont know) pretty quickly. There is no reason why that can't be achieved.

Lets do a bit of analysis:

MOD.

Pro: Free

Con: No cool content, some things can't be changed (no source)

GAME.

Pro: New content, customized engine, optimized, easy to install

Con: Costs money

I can't do anything without your guys support, so at the end of the day, you guys will decide where this goes.

[/quote']

Hey Rocket, I just registered to give you my opinion.

Sincerely this should not be your problem, but BIS's one.

BIS should do with you the same what Valve did with Gooseman and Cliffe. Pay and hire you for the rights on Dayz, and you should simply get some people to work with you and work on this project and fit it in Arma.

Then BIS should decide the business model around Dayz, wich honestly should be the same of Valve with Counter Strike. They made probably more money by Dayz then they did with their own game, they cannot ask community for money once again. I already gave 25 euro to bis for this game, jesus, it's 5 hours of work in my country, and I will unlikely spend again for this game. You deserve to be paid for your success, but it is BIS's work to pay you for what you did, and I told you how..

I don't wanna think what Counter-Strike could be if Valve instead of hiring Goose and Cliffe and paying for rights just made it a DLC..I don't think it would be the most played online fps ever.

So yes this game must stay a mod, there are too many reasons why you cannot make it a game (starting from engine, ending on a commercial flop) or even a dlc.

You have a cool idea in your hands, but sorry, it is not angry birds, it is not a portable easy game, it is still a sandbox elite frustrating mmo.

[rocket 16567]

I don't wanna think what Counter-Strike could be if Valve instead of hiring Goose and Cliffe and paying for rights just made it a DLC..I don't think it would be the most played online fps ever.

Uh' date=' you realize that counter-strike was sold as a product by valve shortly after it was acquired?

They made a cool 9 million out of it.

I can't keep paying for everything myself. It's not your typical mod. I also can't keep devoting all my time to it. This mod will die if it doesn't recover some costs.

[Danger Boy 1]

I don't wanna think what Counter-Strike could be if Valve instead of hiring Goose and Cliffe and paying for rights just made it a DLC..I don't think it would be the most played online fps ever.

Uh' date=' you realize that counter-strike was sold as a product by valve shortly after it was acquired?

They made a cool 9 million out of it.

I can't keep paying for everything myself. It's not your typical mod. I also can't keep devoting all my time to it. This mod will die if it doesn't recover some costs.

Agreed.

Yes, it sucks if it was made a full game, or a commercial mod that had to be paid for, but here's the deal:

a) you already paid for ArmAII because you liked it, and thus got the mod for free, so who cares if you have to buy the game because you are only buying it "once" anyway, or

b) you are like me, and heard about DayZ and bought ArmaII: CO because you wanted to play DayZ, and DayZ alone. In this case, I knew before I purchased it, that if this game became big enough, I might have to buy it again, or pay for more content, or whatever. But (and maybe it's just me, being in the game-industry), I'm OK with that.

Supporting projects like this is integral to making sure fresh, new ideas stay alive, otherwise we risk EA/Blizzard/Etc. filling the world with "safe" games that are 100% sure to make money.

[IronCore 0]

I'm pretty new to this mod. I started playing a few days ago. I am one of those that bought ARMA2 just to play this mod. It's amazing. I love open world games to begin with so the size of this map and the freedom to do what you want pushes all the right buttons for me. I've tried my hand at simple survival, banditry, carebearing, and simply watching the activity in Cherno and Elektro with a pair of binoculars. It's all great.

I am looking forward to the future of this mod. When the time comes that Rocket feels the product is worth charging for I'll gladly be handing over some of my cash. Work like this deserves support. It is so much better than the majority of swill the major publishers are churning out.

[StrayWolf 1]

I don't wanna think what Counter-Strike could be if Valve instead of hiring Goose and Cliffe and paying for rights just made it a DLC..I don't think it would be the most played online fps ever.

Uh' date=' you realize that counter-strike was sold as a product by valve shortly after it was acquired?

They made a cool 9 million out of it.

I can't keep paying for everything myself. It's not your typical mod. I also can't keep devoting all my time to it. This mod will die if it doesn't recover some costs.

Dude...then you have to throw the mod on Kickstarter and get your necessary financing that way, unless BI wants to pony up for your expenses - or hire you full-time, which ever you prefer.

Kickstarter would be a good idea since 1) the player base is large already, 2) we know that Day Z is not a scam and 3) you might get plenty of dough to really get this thing in full gear and move beyond an 'experiment'.

I think each of us would pitch in 50 clams for the game - easy.

[Stealth Pyro 3]

Rocket, do you have any sort of donation system in place yet? I'd suggest something like "donate $20 and we'll mail you an autographed DayZ poster" or something like that, maybe give us some exclusive access to early patch testing. Very reasonable donation with a good incentive to encourage people to donate. I'm sure plenty of people will donate more than $20 to support the cause, and even if only a handful of people donate every month, that is still a few hundred dollars to at least REDUCE your costs. I'd start sooner rather than later, when the cost and labor requirements begin to increase. Just look at how quickly the mod has taken off and become popular; you're certain to get donations right away and you have nothing to lose by trying to ask for some. Eventually, when you know whether the mod is headed towards a standalone release for sale, you can say "Pre-order for $40 and get access to the final closed beta before release along with X autographed item or special game item."

[rocket 16567]

Which do you want:

Kickstarter:

> You give me money and hope for the best

Mod:

> You donate knowing it can never change the game

Game:

> You buy something with new content, new features, polished, expanded

I mean fuck guys. By commercializing... I don't mean I'm going to become EA or anything. I just mean I think its best you BUY something rather than GIVE me shit and hope for the best. If this was a game, I would expect you to be buying something that has more content, more features, more optimized.

Personally, I like what Radiohead did with a pricing experiment. We set a minimum price and then you can choose to pay more if you think its worth it. Most people won't but I think that's better than blind donation. Pay what you think it is worth. If you want to fuck me over with it, then fine, and then that pricing model dies.

[deadbolt (DayZ) 10]

Which do you want:

Kickstarter:

> You give me money and hope for the best

Mod:

> You donate knowing it can never change the game

Game:

> You buy something with new content' date=' new features, polished, expanded

I mean fuck guys. By commercializing... I don't mean I'm going to become EA or anything. I just mean I think its best you BUY something rather than GIVE me shit and hope for the best. If this was a game, I would expect you to be buying something that has more content, more features, more optimized.

Personally, I like what Radiohead did with a pricing experiment. We set a minimum price and then you can choose to pay more if you think its worth it. Most people won't but I think that's better than blind donation. Pay what you think it is worth. If you want to fuck me over with it, then fine, and then that pricing model dies.

[/quote']

i would be fine paying 50-60 if it was a full game by itself and not a mod, if you sold in game skins you could probably make decent money off that too

[Aquazi 0]

I don't wanna think what Counter-Strike could be if Valve instead of hiring Goose and Cliffe and paying for rights just made it a DLC..I don't think it would be the most played online fps ever.

Uh' date=' you realize that counter-strike was sold as a product by valve shortly after it was acquired?

They made a cool 9 million out of it.

I can't keep paying for everything myself. It's not your typical mod. I also can't keep devoting all my time to it. This mod will die if it doesn't recover some costs.

The way you act seems you are begging the community to scream: "yeah plz make it a game".

I understand (or tbh I can try to understand, I never released a successful mod) your feelings.

But you are not the first person who makes a popular mod and you won't be the last.

If you ask the community if they will pay for dayz as a dlc well, it differs person by person, I tell you I won't. Many other mods for Arma or other games involved far bigger work then yours and never went even near to be commercial (aside of IF).

Bohemia actually have to hire/pay you for the work you did, implement the mod in Arma and put a lot of effort in. Then the business model around Dayz will be their problem, like Valve had this "problem" with his popular mods.

But, if you ask me if I would pay for a MMO-FPS based around surviving in a world full of zeds, then hell yes, shut up and take my money, but, it should be something far bigger then the mod is now. I think every of us playing dayz thinks the same "how cool if it was a biggest world, with more people but the same mechanics, and if it was not limited by this engine". Yes I would pay for a 4 times bigger chernarus, with more people in it, and dunno server based characters (it will make sense to make an encampment or many other things, I think you understand me) and some other stuff, something that just will make the actual dayz obsolete.

Then yes, bring your idea, find a publisher, the correct engine and ask us for money for the definitive survival-fps-sandbox-mmo (had to condensate it!), but no, I won't pay for the actual dayz, even if it will improve.

The destiny of this mod can change something in gaming industry, and prolly in your life, try to ride the wave as best as you can, don't let it die to fast for excessive greediness. Kisses <3

[BigMorgan (DayZ) 3]

Anyone else catch the subtle, meta-level irony that Arma 2 (public) multiplayer was basically dead and this zombie mod brought it back to life... in a horrifying form that barely resembles its past life and consumes all who come near it? :P

[Shag 90]

Personally I would like DayZ to be another DLC mission on Arma, and you both (BI and DayZ) having fair reward for all your efforts. With more cash comes a more polished product, and with BI sharing the rewards, perhaps comes access to the source code and some dev support from them.

It seems an obvious path to the best most polished gaming experience for the player base, and you get some cash too. BI happy with greater sales and DLC revenue to cover costs.

[dead3ye 21]

Oh man if BI made this an actual DLC and put more resources into it would be amazing. But i guess they're too busy with Arma 3.