White Flag? Ceasefire? (Stop KoS)

[CLewis 31]

If you have to take a sarcastic statement and try to turn it into a non-sarcastic statement as some sort of "victory", then you're a very special person :) You take that "victory", little guy, I'll buy you some ice cream later okay?

If you have to take a sarcastic quote, of a sacastic statement and try to turn it into a non-sarcastic statement as some sort of "victory", then you're a very special person. You take that "victory", big guy, I'll buy you some coffee later m'kay?

(Yeah I removed the smiley, I'm to old for that shit).

[gizm0 96]

Lets add grouping so you can click "join raid team" and then you can all go kill that boss together in cherno right? You can all roll and see who gets the Lee enfield.

No I'm talking like how vanilla arma 2 doesn't groups, and units and team leaders. Since this kind of stuff would actually be done by some survivors and is done now, however due to the shitty skin system sometimes you can't tell frienldy from hostile due to both having the same skin. But I would also like each player having a unique skin that noone else has because unless your rolling with a uniformed group, none of us would look identical.

Edited July 31, 2012 by Orthus

[harken (DayZ) 57]

I am against ideas like this because they take way from the excitement and danger of the Mod. That feeling of complete randomness when you spot another player from 500m away through your scope of Binocs, only to realize he is scoping you out as well. Adding any kind of hi5/flag system would detract from this.

I am unsure how to solve the issue and perhaps that is because the Mod is so perfectly designed to mimic the real world situation of total freedom of choice and consequence, there is no way to limit that without being ridiculous.

[Inception. 9443]

One could merely send them a "white flag" offer, but then kill them when they choose.

[gizm0 96]

I am against ideas like this because they take way from the excitement and danger of the Mod. That feeling of complete randomness when you spot another player from 500m away through your scope of Binocs, only to realize he is scoping you out as well. Adding any kind of hi5/flag system would detract from this.

I am unsure how to solve the issue and perhaps that is because the Mod is so perfectly designed to mimic the real world situation of total freedom of choice and consequence, there is no way to limit that without being ridiculous.

However the issue is that it doesn't provide any way to show body language or even allow use to holster both weapons and do things like high5,shake hands, etc.(cause I would shake or even hug the first survivor I met).

I mean dayz just hands us tools to kill each other, set up camps, and loot. however the tools to communicate are either superseded by 3rdparty voip, and are our only way to show non-hostile intentions.

Edited July 31, 2012 by Orthus

[federik21 42]

wha-wha-what?

Cmon... If you show white flag, i will ejoy more killing you.

Since this game is NOT going to involve psycologic aspects, everyone can kill anyone to be safer.

That's the only logic solution.

[gizm0 96]

wha-wha-what?

Cmon... If you show white flag, i will ejoy more killing you.

Since this game is NOT going to involve psycologic aspects, everyone can kill anyone to be safer.

That's the only logic solution.

well than call me crazy for not doing the only logical solution.

[SwitchBlayd 32]

wha-wha-what?

Cmon... If you show white flag, i will ejoy more killing you.

Since this game is NOT going to involve psycologic aspects, everyone can kill anyone to be safer.

That's the only logic solution.

You know something in the game is broken when "killing everyone" is the only solution. Why would people actually do that? If there were a zombie apocalypse, groups would form, people wouldn't b lonewolfing "killing newbs". Seriously groups would form and they would be protective of each other. And the whole "play with your friends" aspect is irrelevant, as groups could often be complete strangers. Which is more exciting I think. I don't want to hold anyone's hand, it's not "arcadey". The majority of this game is arcadey. We all look identical, really like 2 character models with diff colour shirts? We can carry half a damn helicopter in our backpacks.

[CLewis 31]

It might be an idea to, instead of the no friendly fire agreement, you had the option to identify yourself. If both agree to this, a small form of icon/name or something would show when you look at that person. The distance of id'ing each other could be between 50 to 100 meters or so. Once both had agreed the icon would show for "x" time. This would meen that you could recognize someone you know or have met before. How far away you should be able to recognize someone would be maybe a bit longer then the first meeting. This would benefit groups/clans as much as the loners. It would also meen that you would know if someone has dobblecrossed you before. Considering that in real life you are able to recognize people you know/ have met this isn't really a "gamey" solution, and I think it could work without to much QQ'ing from too many. (The distances should be balanced through trial and error, by devs and us alpha-testers).

Just an idea. Don't know if it's even original, or if it has been suggested before. Commence the flaming...

Edited July 31, 2012 by CLewis

[SwitchBlayd 32]

It might be an idea to, instead of the no friendly fire agreement, you had the option to identify yourself. If both agree to this, a small form of icon/name or something would show when you look at that person. The distance of id'ing each other could be between 50 to 100 meters or so. Once both had agreed the icon would show for "x" time. This would meen that you could recognize someone you know or have met before. How far away you should be able to recognize someone would be maybe a bit longer then the first meeting. This would benefit groups/clans as much as the loners. It would also meen that you would know if someone has dobblecrossed you before. Considering that in real life you are able to recognize people you know/ have met this isn't really a "gamey" solution, and I think it could work without to much QQ'ing from too many. (The distances should be balanced through trial and error, by devs and us alpha-testers).

Just an idea. Don't know if it's even original, or if it has been suggested before. Commence the flaming...

Yeah I made this point a while back, some aesthetic way of recognising friendlies/enemies. As we all know rocket removed the skins, citing introduction of customisable skins to replace it. But tbh they haven't even introduced the feature yet. Which is kind of ridiculous.

"Oh hey nice bike, ill just take that off you, don't worry I'll give you a customisable bike".

"So, where's my customisable bike then?".

"Dunno lol"

[TheMachine 803]

If this system is ever put into the game I'm going to gather up survivors then lure them to my friends who won't have a fake 'block' on shooting them, BAM BAM BAM, all dead.

Oh, or perhaps you numbskulls want pvp safe zones now too?

[SwitchBlayd 32]

It might be an idea to, instead of the no friendly fire agreement, you had the option to identify yourself. If both agree to this, a small form of icon/name or something would show when you look at that person. The distance of id'ing each other could be between 50 to 100 meters or so. Once both had agreed the icon would show for "x" time. This would meen that you could recognize someone you know or have met before. How far away you should be able to recognize someone would be maybe a bit longer then the first meeting. This would benefit groups/clans as much as the loners. It would also meen that you would know if someone has dobblecrossed you before. Considering that in real life you are able to recognize people you know/ have met this isn't really a "gamey" solution, and I think it could work without to much QQ'ing from too many. (The distances should be balanced through trial and error, by devs and us alpha-testers).

Just an idea. Don't know if it's even original, or if it has been suggested before. Commence the flaming...

Yeah I made this point a while back, some aesthetic way of recognising friendlies/enemies. As we all know rocket removed the skins, citing introduction of customisable skins to replace it. But tbh they haven't even introduced the feature yet. Which is kind of ridiculous.

"Oh hey nice bike, ill just take that off you, don't worry I'll give you a customisable bike".

"So, where's my customisable bike then?".

"Dunno lol"

[LT_COUCH 3]

I like this idea a lot but they would have to buff it out a lot to try and prevent abuse of this system.

Edited July 31, 2012 by LT_COUCH

[SwitchBlayd 32]

If this system is ever put into the game I'm going to gather up survivors then lure them to my friends who won't have a fake 'block' on shooting them, BAM BAM BAM, all dead.

Oh, or perhaps you numbskulls want pvp safe zones now too?

I already answered this a few pages back. So stop being such an "Internet badass" and read. I said that it was a clever idea, but there are 2 flaws, the first the most major. And that is if you intent to kill this "victim" your luring, why go through the arduous process of according their friend request, and then walking them all the way to your friend? Why not just kill them there and then like a bandit, no need to enter into an alliance with them. The second issue is bringing these "victims" to your friend is putting him in danger, he could kill your friend.

[evulclown@gmail.com 191]

If this system is ever put into the game I'm going to gather up survivors then lure them to my friends who won't have a fake 'block' on shooting them, BAM BAM BAM, all dead.

Oh, or perhaps you numbskulls want pvp safe zones now too?

Exactly.

I'll join a group, sure I'm friendly guys.... Then:

• I'll steal your vehicles...
  
• I'll look in your backpacks and take what I want...
  
• I'll throw flares around and let everyone know where you are...
  
• I'll tell another team where you are or lure you into an ambush...
  
• I'll stand in front of you when you try to kill players or zombies so you hit me instead...
  
• I'll lure you all into a shed and then stand blocking the door so you can't get out...
  
• I'll play absurdly loud music over direct chat...
  
• I'll throw smoke grenades at you luring zombies and impairing your vision...
  
• I'll throw actual grenades at you...
  
• I'll drive you into the sea in the sedan we just spent an hour fixing...
  
• I'll ask to try out your gun or request an item off of you and then not return it...
  
• I'll keep running into you in buildings until one of us breaks a leg...
  
• When we're looting together, I will grab the best stuff first and tell you "you snooze, you loose"...
  
• I'll walk you into a building and then barbed wire the front door...
  
• I'll lure 100+ zombies and run in circles around you...
  

What you going to do? Nothing -- I'm "friendly" according to your system, aren't I?

Going to add a kick function for the group leader? Cool, now it's ME who will form the group and then I will kick you and shoot you in the back. Going to add a timer on the kick function? Cool I will accidentally "lure" 100 zombies and have us all take refuge in a building then do the kick while everyone is concentrating on the chaos. Or, failing that, barb wire the doorways so no one can escape the ensuing massacre.

I already answered this a few pages back. So stop being such an "Internet badass" and read. I said that it was a clever idea, but there are 2 flaws, the first the most major. And that is if you intent to kill this "victim" your luring, why go through the arduous process of according their friend request, and then walking them all the way to your friend? Why not just kill them there and then like a bandit, no need to enter into an alliance with them. The second issue is bringing these "victims" to your friend is putting him in danger, he could kill your friend.

To troll them, retard. To lure them into the perfect ambush. To lull them into a false sense of security. To make sure EVERYONE dies, not just one or two. If the "lurer" happens to die, he can come straight back to the bodies -- His friends will be guarding the site and there will be more than enough loot. If he really wanted to be a pussy, he could even log out just before they open fire or lay down and tactical roll to the side so they know who not to hit.

The naivety in this thread is only trumped by the stubbern stupidity.

Edited July 31, 2012 by itputsthelotion

[hawc 63]

So the main issue prevalent on these forums is the whole KoS issue. And how that cant be avoided for players who may want to team up with strangers (people like these exist). Now personally im a KoS person as i've been on the receiving end of KoS strangers numerous times and it was the only way to play and survive successfully. So heres an idea. A white flag, or ceasefire, so say two players meet, lets call them player A and B.

Neither player wants to KoS but wants to team up, but of course neither player trust the other player and truly believes eaches intentions. They are both behind cover and are wary the other player may want to kill them (that old "friendly" thing in dc chat is often a lie). So player A can somehow click the other players name or type /friendly or /whiteflag or something into dc. This will send an offer from Player A to Player B. If Player B accepts Payer A's offer, neither can attack each other, and if they decline, both players know that they are hostile. Thus a teaming up aspect is introduced, whilst keeping banditry if one player so wishes to. Similar to how people in real life (like in the walking dead tv show for example) can just lay down there weapons and put there hands up to show they are not hostile.

Just an idea, i'm sure it will have some flaws but just looking to get an idea of what you guys think.

Are you unable to say/write "friendly" this in direct chat? How is this different than saying friendly? please don't say a magical force prevents you to shoot. Why waste valuable time in implementing same shit different packaging?

You know something in the game is broken when "killing everyone" is the only solution. Why would people actually do that? If there were a zombie apocalypse, groups would form, people wouldn't b lonewolfing "killing newbs". Seriously groups would form and they would be protective of each other. And the whole "play with your friends" aspect is irrelevant, as groups could often be complete strangers. Which is more exciting I think. I don't want to hold anyone's hand, it's not "arcadey". The majority of this game is arcadey. We all look identical, really like 2 character models with diff colour shirts? We can carry half a damn helicopter in our backpacks.

Stop comparing a game to real life. Seriously, every time people start with the stupid "in real zombie apocalypse bla bla" argument.

[Trajado 22]

Will not work, and wont benefit the game experience Rocket is after.

We all know realism is impossible to achieve in a game, but fact is, we can recreate some of the realism. The permenant threat another person can be should always be present, you either trust and turn your back on them, or you dont.

Like the bandit skins! It was a crapy mechanic, simply because you wouldnt be able to define a person by its cloths in real life, but to add more, it was also crap cuz your humanity would lower when killing someone in self defense.

The only suggestion so far i've seen to boost co-op, that makes any sense and can bring the game closer to realism is the "Background mechanic", where each person would chose a profession for their character, and diferent skills would be needed for diferent actions in game.

This is the only thing that would fit the game experience this Mod provides, boosting co-op without breaking the immersion and the feel of autenticity, and without penalties for lone-wolfs and bandits.

[CLewis 31]

Are you unable to say/write "friendly" this in direct chat? How is this different than saying friendly? please don't say a magical force prevents you to shoot. Why waste valuable time in implementing same shit different packaging?

Stop comparing a game to real life. Seriously, every time people start with the stupid "in real zombie apocalypse bla bla" argument.

I agree about the useing reality as an argument is a bit tricky. You kinda did it yourself with "magical force". I do think it's ok to use when you want something in the game made more realistic though.

It is however used by alot by the "stop QQ'ing" people, to shut down every single suggestion being posted. Wich usually makes the "QQ'ers" use it as a counter argument. Both sides use realism, or the lack there off, to back their argument. And just for the record, I'm very pro realism. The more real, the better. (I do like more than one life, so not that real).

[gizm0 96]

Snip.

Cool the system doesn't stop you from backstabbing. However when I read your posts, don't see much on the constructive criticism and more just saying its a bad idea and that anyone who is a friendly and would like a more fleshed out system for being friendly are fuck tards, who should just stop playing. If i'm getting the wrong impression please correct me. Why not tell us how we could make it better, instead of just calling it moronic? I really don't see why some people have to be dicks on the forums.

[qubolo@gmail.com 1]

You know something in the game is broken when "killing everyone" is the only solution. Why would people actually do that? If there were a zombie apocalypse, groups would form, people wouldn't b lonewolfing "killing newbs". Seriously groups would form and they would be protective of each other. And the whole "play with your friends" aspect is irrelevant, as groups could often be complete strangers. Which is more exciting I think. I don't want to hold anyone's hand, it's not "arcadey". The majority of this game is arcadey. We all look identical, really like 2 character models with diff colour shirts? We can carry half a damn helicopter in our backpacks.

Yes that makes the problem. But it is only like that,because zombies don't pose any real threat to you. seriously you can just stand and shoot them all day if you have ammo. Zombies have to become more powerful to the point when people would have to join in groups in order to survive. that is one of the options i think.

[haviv[3rdid] 57]

If you want to make a friendly gesture, you're going to have to be more creative, be in a position of control. Accept the fact that you are taking a big risk by being friendly when you don't know what you are doing (such as trying to be friends with the wrong people)

The game shouldn't do this work for you.

Edited August 1, 2012 by Benjamin

[TheLonelyFrog 4]

Yes that makes the problem. But it is only like that,because zombies don't pose any real threat to you. seriously you can just stand and shoot them all day if you have ammo. Zombies have to become more powerful to the point when people would have to join in groups in order to survive. that is one of the options i think.

Now that you mention it, that does seem to be the biggest problem. Teamwork is never required to overcome the threat of zombies. The only real threat is other players, which is why everyone is so hesitant to trust others.

Hardly ever does it become necessary to pick off other zombies that are chasing a friend because they will never catch up when the player is running and they can be easily lost with a few twists and turns around fences and walls. The only time teamwork is necessary is for blood transfusions.

So the question is, how does this get solved without making the zombies chase you over half the continent.

[SwitchBlayd 32]

Exactly.

I'll join a group, sure I'm friendly guys.... Then:

• I'll steal your vehicles...
  
• I'll look in your backpacks and take what I want...
  
• I'll throw flares around and let everyone know where you are...
  
• I'll tell another team where you are or lure you into an ambush...
  
• I'll stand in front of you when you try to kill players or zombies so you hit me instead...
  
• I'll lure you all into a shed and then stand blocking the door so you can't get out...
  
• I'll play absurdly loud music over direct chat...
  
• I'll throw smoke grenades at you luring zombies and impairing your vision...
  
• I'll throw actual grenades at you...
  
• I'll drive you into the sea in the sedan we just spent an hour fixing...
  
• I'll ask to try out your gun or request an item off of you and then not return it...
  
• I'll keep running into you in buildings until one of us breaks a leg...
  
• When we're looting together, I will grab the best stuff first and tell you "you snooze, you loose"...
  
• I'll walk you into a building and then barbed wire the front door...
  
• I'll lure 100+ zombies and run in circles around you...
  

What you going to do? Nothing -- I'm "friendly" according to your system, aren't I?

Going to add a kick function for the group leader? Cool, now it's ME who will form the group and then I will kick you and shoot you in the back. Going to add a timer on the kick function? Cool I will accidentally "lure" 100 zombies and have us all take refuge in a building then do the kick while everyone is concentrating on the chaos. Or, failing that, barb wire the doorways so no one can escape the ensuing massacre.

To troll them, retard. To lure them into the perfect ambush. To lull them into a false sense of security. To make sure EVERYONE dies, not just one or two. If the "lurer" happens to die, he can come straight back to the bodies -- His friends will be guarding the site and there will be more than enough loot. If he really wanted to be a pussy, he could even log out just before they open fire or lay down and tactical roll to the side so they know who not to hit.

The naivety in this thread is only trumped by the stubbern stupidity.

My idea is not to prevent any of those suggestions at all, as it only benefits those players with good intentions, whereas your intention is to be an asshole, something I sure you have a great affinity with. Furthermore I would like to point out that yes, you could waste your day pestering your partner, or you could just kill them before you accepted their ceasefire, thus you would not need to waste your whole day "luring" them to your friend.

[orion 54]

The is already the surrender option. To put one's hands in the air.

"Anyone who runs is a Bandit, anyone who stands still is a well-disciplined Bandit."

[SwitchBlayd 32]

Yes that makes the problem. But it is only like that,because zombies don't pose any real threat to you. seriously you can just stand and shoot them all day if you have ammo. Zombies have to become more powerful to the point when people would have to join in groups in order to survive. that is one of the options i think.

I wholeheartedly agree with you. My aspiration with this game is simple. Make it as realistic as possible in every aspect, as long as it does not detract from the gameplay. For example having to find a tin can opener to open your tin cans would be very realistic, it would also negatively affect the gameplay so I am against it. As an example, improving zombie AI and numbers would make it more realistic for me, seriously I can't think of any zombie movie or situation that involves like 5 zombies in a town, lol. I know the analogy with movies is stupid, but I would like hordes, of slower moving zombies who can attack while moving, and who dont teleport around me. This would promote teamwork I think. As yeah get would be easier to kill, but people would be less trigger happy about wasting all their gun magazines just to thin the herd. I understand the whole "it's only alpha" blah blah blah, I don't expect to have this implemented during alpha or anything, just if there was one change from alpha to going gold, this would be what I want.