Decrease enfield damage.

[vjese 20]

Too much damage for a weapon that drops everywhere.

Let's also not get into a arma simulator/realism debate. the gun does to much damage. if it was a rare as a good sniper then sure. but doing 4000 more damage then a sniper rifle with a 400 meter effective range, and a drop rate of once every 4-5 houses/barns. I'd say something needs to be scaled down.

In no form or way this is a whine/qq thread. I just think it requires balancement, and that's what this thread is for.

[malphos101 71]

Alpha is for adding and testing features, Beta is for fixing bugs and balancing gameplay. Move along.

[outlawxxable 10]

I think it's fine how it is. this games "realistic" so I guess the gun should one shot most of the time

[vjese 20]

Alpha is for adding and testing features, Beta is for fixing bugs and balancing gameplay. Move along.

Suggestion and bug reports are asked for by the devs. Alpha is also used for balancing and fixin g bugs. smartassery however is not. move along. I heard the barrens chat is missing yet another clown.

[vjese 20]

I think it's fine how it is. this games "realistic" so I guess the gun should one shot most of the time

Aah the realisitic comment, was waiting for it.

If a bullet kills a person, then why does a m16 require 8 bullets, an enfield 1 a revolver and a m1911 3. a makarov 7. and does a a50 with the same bullet size and less velocity do 6 times the damage a m107 does.

Yet these guns have low droprate. oneshot guns should not be the most common gun in the game. not if ur gonna throw rare guns out there, who cant reach an enfield, cant outdamage an enfield, and are rare so why even search for them

any gun within theyre effective range will penetrate into a vital area thus killing the person. U want realistic?

a foot shot by any gun can lead to a flesh wound not a one shot. if this is treated one can survive. yet the enfield kills the person realistic? not really.

a shot by the enfield in the finger kills you, but a revolver sho in the heart just does damage, not even throw u on the floor/unconscious.. realistic? not really.

Edited July 19, 2012 by vjese

[Zeromentor 169]

I know if I was hit by that size of a round I'd wake up on the ground... If I woke up at all.

Anyhow, it does seem pretty potent, especially if you compare the damage to 7.62 rifles. But you have to remember that ingame, those rifles tend to kill their targets if they hit, as the first round knocks the target out and they quickly bleed to death. If they survive, they get away with a small fraction of their total health, and might just die to a second round, or even a random zombie.

Nah, I like the Lee Enfield, so my opinion is biast, but I love knowing I can counter "Pro Snipa" on random hills with a common rifle and make them rage when I collect their gear and disappear into the woods, using their equipment to survive without even needing to loot a town for it myself. But a slight decrease in damage (still more than 8000 blood, say 10k-11k) would be fine, but the end result would still be an effective 1-hit weapon of DOOM.

I like the Lee Enfield.

[Zeromentor 169]

Aah the realisitic comment, was waiting for it.

If a bullet kills a person, then why does a m16 require 8 bullets, an enfield 1 a revolver and a m1911 3. a makarov 7. and does a a50 with the same bullet size and equal velocity do 6 times the damage a m107 does.

Yet these guns have low droprate. oneshot guns should not be the most common gun in the game. not if ur gonna throw rare guns out there, who cant reach an enfield, cant outdamage an enfield, and are rare so why even search for them

any gun within theyre effective range will penetrate into a vital area thus killing the person. U want realistic?

a foot shot by any gun can lead to a flesh wound not a one shot. if this is treated one will survive.

5.56 rounds are actually not much more dangerous than .22 (note: .223 government rounds replace 5.56 as common civilian rounds in USA). Infact, outside of sucking chest wounds, hitting a major organ or the head, the 5.56 is not a good round for killing people. 9mm is about the same. A .45 will drop a person quickly, and a .50 caliber will do some massive damage to anything it hits.

Realism changes from person to person and what is hit on them, but usually it takes more than 1 round from an M16 to drop a target. Sure, they don't do flat damage in real life, but I haven't seen realistic organ damage in this game, so I'll just assume the engine doesn't support it. Also, ALPHA MOD.

EDIT: Note, I didn't mean in cartridge size, as the amount of gunpowder and shape of the lead is very different. Velocity matters as well as weight and distance.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Zeromentor

[Tatakt 50]

i think most of the guns in this game does "realistic" damage, if you get shot irl by an enfield in the chest or head you most likely die to one shot, i dont think any guns need tweaking since its a realistic element of the game.

[vjese 20]

5.56 rounds are actually not much bigger than .22 (note: .223 government rounds replace 5.56 as common civilian rounds in USA). Infact, outside of sucking chest wounds, hitting a major organ or the head, the 5.56 is not a good round for killing people. 9mm is about the same. A .45 will drop a person quickly, and a .50 caliber will do some massive damage to anything it hits.

Realism changes from person to person and what is hit on them, but usually it takes more than 1 round from an M16 to drop a target. Sure, they don't do flat damage in real life, but I haven't seen realistic organ damage in this game, so I'll just assume the engine doesn't support it. Also, ALPHA MOD.

I got all this, doesnt change the fact that "I" believe the damage is to high in a "GAME" that throws these weapons at you like theres no tomorrow.

therefor i post in the "Suggestion forums" a suggestion to decrease the damage of a weapon that "I" find does to much damage.

stop being a frigging forumdweller and take every single post on this forum as your duty to reply to with whatever u seem to believe is the truth.

It's my opinion.

[kovalhuk 19]

I agree, there is no significant, ballistic difference, between .308 and .303brit. They should do almost same damage.

[Cypherdiaz 28]

Uhmm its actually more powerful than the M14,DMR, M24, CZ 550...

M24/DMR/M14 fire the 7.62x51mm NATO round.

The Lee Enfield fires a 7.7x54mm R round.

The difference between 54mm and 51mm is some major power when it comes to firearms. Heck, the .30-06 is 7.62x63mm.

The issue with the enfield, that balances it...is the lack of anything beyond iron sights which make long range accuracy difficult...oh and the NOISE.

Not only does it have the 2nd highest damage in the game...(M107/AS50 have higher) but it also has the 2nd highest sound range (234m).

Its fine how it is.

[seriousman 9]

Alpha is for adding and testing features, Beta is for fixing bugs and balancing gameplay. Move along.

You're so full of it. Let me just c/p straight out of the 1.7.2.3 hotfix patch notes:

Changelog:

* [FIXED] Ghillie and skin removal on login ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36666 )

* [FIXED] Arma X stuck on loading screen ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36647 )

* [FIXED] AKS_74_kobra classname incorrectly named ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36680 )

* [NEW] Server side performance tweaks and improvments

* [FIXED] Infected detect players from too far away (reduced by about 20%)

* [FIXED] Disconnect updates not being correctly applied (caused inventory issues)

* [FIXED] Bear traps not appearing for spawn (low spawn)

Now stop being a douche.

[vjese 20]

i think most of the guns in this game does "realistic" damage, if you get shot irl by an enfield in the chest or head you most likely die to one shot, i dont think any guns need tweaking since its a realistic element of the game.

really pal? all guns do kill in oneshot if shot in the head. So gtfo.

enfield in chest = dead. regardless wether a flesh wound, or shot in the organ. realistic? no.

revolver shot in the chest, from 2 meters away 4500 blood lost. clearly if a bullet to the chest kills someone so should the revolver. realistic? no.

but accoring to you any chest wound is deadly. according to me it isnt. see my point? lower damage value of enfield for realism and equality to other guns. as they all give somewhat of the same effect since there is NO organ damage. or velocity damage, or puncture damage or any other damage then flat damage. therefor enfield OP.

Now stop being dumb

[Zeromentor 169]

I got all this, doesnt change the fact that "I" believe the damage is to high in a "GAME" that throws these weapons at you like theres no tomorrow.

therefor i post in the "Suggestion forums" a suggestion to decrease the damage of a weapon that "I" find does to much damage.

stop being a frigging forumdweller and take every single post on this forum as your duty to reply to with whatever u seem to believe is the truth.

It's my opinion.

I'm very tired and editted my original post when I reread what I had typed. But anyhow, this might be a game but the fact that it is mod based off a military simulator and the guns need to hit pretty hard. We aren't wearing vests designed to stop lead, they are just pouch holders. And I'm not a 'forumdweller', I come here in my spare time, which is like 30 minutes out of the day. That's 23 whole hours of doing other stuff, and I come here when I can't play the game, nice attempt at an insult, though.

I find there isn't enough Mechs ingame. Doesn't mean they will be added. I also like AH-64D Apache Longbows, but you don't see me starting petitions to get them added. Have you ever hit something with a .30-06?

Ignoring that, the 303 is a 7.7x56 if I am correct, which compared to the 7.62x51mm Nato is a bigger round. That means bigger punch. As the 7.62 does 8k per hit, doing just slightly more at 12k is not a huge jump, seeing the .50 does well over that amount. If it is changed, it will still kill a player before they can bandage their wound, much less get off the ground from the knockout they suffer from the round hitting them. So they'd still die in one hit, it would just take a few seconds more for them to bleed out.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Zeromentor

[Jgut90 71]

Enfield is pretty "balanced", yes it does 1 shot kills but you have to use iron sights and the sound it makes is just so loud. I love the accuracy though.

[vjese 20]

I'm very tired and editted my original post when I reread what I had typed. But anyhow, this might be a game but the fact that it is mod based off a military simulator and the guns need to hit pretty hard. We aren't wearing vests designed to stop lead, they are just pouch holders. And I'm not a 'forumdweller', I come here in my spare time, which is like 30 minutes out of the day. That's 23 whole hours of doing other stuff, and I come here when I can't play the game, nice attempt at an insult, though.

I find there isn't enough Mechs ingame. Doesn't mean they will be added. I also like AH-64D Apache Longbows, but you don't see me starting petitions to get them added. Have you ever hit something with a .308?

Ignoring that, the 303 is a 7.7x56 if I am correct, which compared to the 7.62x51mm Nato is a bigger round. That means bigger punch. As the 7.62 does 8k per hit, doing just slightly more at 12k is not a huge jump, seeing the .50 does well over that amount. If it is changed, it will still kill a player before they can bandage their wound, much less get off the ground from the knockout they suffer from the round hitting them. So they'd still die in one hit, it would just take a few seconds more for them to bleed out.

I never fired a gun IRL in my country we believe guns are illigal.

and eventhough it's based of a mil sim, it isnt a mil sim, it's a mod. a survival MOD that is not ment as a mil sim.

[yorkie065 78]

I got all this, doesnt change the fact that "I" believe the damage is to high in a "GAME" that throws these weapons at you like theres no tomorrow.

therefor i post in the "Suggestion forums" a suggestion to decrease the damage of a weapon that "I" find does to much damage.

stop being a frigging forumdweller and take every single post on this forum as your duty to reply to with whatever u seem to believe is the truth.

It's my opinion.

I don't think dropping it's damage would be the right way to go, but decreasing it's spawn amount would help resolve the issue. Infact I think there are a few guns (double barrelled as well) that too frequently spawn. It's a little too easy if you know where to look, but then there is a slight bit of luck put into the equation as loot spawns are based on percentage.

You're so full of it. Let me just c/p straight out of the 1.7.2.3 hotfix patch notes:

Changelog:

* [FIXED] Ghillie and skin removal on login ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36666 )

* [FIXED] Arma X stuck on loading screen ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36647 )

* [FIXED] AKS_74_kobra classname incorrectly named ( https://dev-heaven.net/issues/36680 )

* [NEW] Server side performance tweaks and improvments

* [FIXED] Infected detect players from too far away (reduced by about 20%)

* [FIXED] Disconnect updates not being correctly applied (caused inventory issues)

* [FIXED] Bear traps not appearing for spawn (low spawn)

Now stop being a douche.

You should stop being a douche. Alpha's in general are made for implementing gameplay elements. Bugs don't usually get fixed until beta. Just where this is a free, open alpha that is open to the public 24/7, they're having to adapt the development process slightly to fix any major game braking bugs, and any smaller ones they can fix to keep them busy as they're designing new elements and trying to get stuff implemented into a game. Not everyone on a game dev team can do everything, so people will be doing general bug fixing until theres something that they can do.

[seriousman 9]

This gun is mostly the first gun I find. There's ammo all over the place and it one hits everything. OP? No, no.

[nobudy 0]

bro did u ever notice what u are wearing ? u wear a protection west so a shot with some guns is not able to kill u oneshot to the body but needs 2shots because much of the impact is absorbed by the protection. The Lee however does completely penetrate that protection, why u get killed in one shot.

Btw getting shot in arms or legs does not kill u oneshot. Additionally hitting a target in 400 meters is nearly impossible due to the bad iron sights and if the target is moviing u will never hit from more than 200 meters so the weapon is not much stronger than any other assault rifle because its rate of fire is extremely low.

[Zeromentor 169]

I never fired a gun IRL in my country we believe guns are illigal.

and eventhough it's based of a mil sim, it isnt a mil sim, it's a mod. a survival MOD that is not ment as a mil sim.

That sucks for you, but it doesn't change that such rounds in history (303, 30-06, etc) tend to kill unprotected people from 550 meters in one round. The amount of force hitting a target with that kind of round is very powerful, and comparing it to rounds with much less powder sending them off at a much lower velocity (less force) is showing ignorance of firearms and their ammunition. Trying to say because this is a Mod for survival shows you are ignoring that it is based off a military sim game and shows the results of that. Balance comes WITH realism, not fighting against it.

In any case, I'd suggest visiting a country with a firing range. More life experiences with all tools are better for people. You expand your knowledge and can make decisions with all the information, not just what you think without any real information. Also, wikipedia doesn't count.

So... I'd rather not insult you, as I think your own words do you disservice enough.

[smithy0815 6]

JFK got killed with such a gun, its a good rifle and its realistic as it is.

Dont nerv it it would make this gun arcade, maybe reduce spawn rate a bit...

In my opinion all shotguns should be avaiable in civ areas, there is no sense to spawn them as military loot only because you can buy as much as you want as civillian in europe. Only real military weapons should spawn in military areas (full auto and sniper guns)

Edited July 19, 2012 by Smithy

[smithy0815 6]

I never fired a gun IRL in my country we believe guns are illigal.

and eventhough it's based of a mil sim, it isnt a mil sim, it's a mod. a survival MOD that is not ment as a mil sim.

Which country?

[vjese 20]

I don't see why firing a gun would enhance my life.

anyway i understand all the bigger caliber more damage stuff.

but the game doesnt take this is account it just does flat damage. and with the high droprate imo the gun should either be lowered in damage or droprate.

[seriousman 9]

You should stop being a douche. Alpha's in general are made for implementing gameplay elements. Bugs don't usually get fixed until beta. Just where this is a free, open alpha that is open to the public 24/7, they're having to adapt the development process slightly to fix any major game braking bugs, and any smaller ones they can fix to keep them busy as they're designing new elements and trying to get stuff implemented into a game. Not everyone on a game dev team can do everything, so people will be doing general bug fixing until theres something that they can do.

Have you ever done any Real programming? You fix bugs all the time. And no, they're not only fixing "game breaking bugs" they're fixing little things as well.... all the time and yes, a shit load of it doesn't make it onto the patch notes. I have no idea where you guys are getting this from, but the development process is never set in stone as Alpha = Impliment or Beta = Fix. Very few developers will continue to beta if their alpha is completely* buggy and unbalanced. And only the most retarded developers would say "Lol, are you crazy? we can't add this.. we should've done that in alpha".

*missed that one ;)

Edited July 19, 2012 by seriousman

[Zeromentor 169]

I don't see why firing a gun would enhance my life.

anyway i understand all the bigger caliber more damage stuff.

but the game doesnt take this is account it just does flat damage. and with the high droprate imo the gun should either be lowered in damage or droprate.

Ingame, the Lee Enfield is a cheap and plentiful alternative to scoped rifles using smaller rounds. Those rifles offer more visual range for less damage per round. But it is easier to hit and kill the target at those ranges due to the scopes. The Lee Enfield lacks a scope, and the iron sights are good until 300-400 meters. After that, it takes skill to nail a moving target, much less a stationary one.

I can easily hit a target in the head (a very small target) with something like the CZ550. I've done this multiple times in a row as ranges as far as 600 meters and over. A Lee Enfield user would be hard pressed to do this, and I bet most rounds might be only a chest or lower body shot. Also, in real life, this would easily obliterate ribs, lungs, internal organs in other areas and the blood loss and trauma from the impact would put you on your back. So in real life, you'd be dead very soon unless you were LUCKY.

On the other hand, a .45 round from a pistol has much less force behind it due to the lack of gunpowder. The .45 ACP could easily put you on your back at 45 meters, but at 500 I doubt you could even hit a target with a handgun. Also, a round that size with such low velocity would do much less damage to the human body.

Just because you're close-minded and dislike the Lee Enfield doesn't mean it should be nerfed. What is your problem with it anyhow? Any change that still keeps it stronger than a 7.62 would still result in a one hit kill at ranges of 300-400 meters, so nothing really changed. You don't seem to want ALL damage to be toned down, so I can only conclude that you have a dislike of the Lee Enfield because you were recently killed with it.