3rd person view and other aid’s? discussion .

[Murphy (DayZ) 1]

In real life I have a spatial sense so I can tell if I'm going to fit into this doorway/hole/whatever but Arma handles this in such a horrible way I often get stuck because of first person. I agree 3rd person with crosshairs is very cheap and easily exploitable but I really prefer knowing when to turn in a doorway instead of having to readjust a few times until I get it right.

Without 3rd person I simply have horrible orientation when moving around because my character is often bumping into things and having an awkward time navigating even the simplest of obstacles (staircases can mean death very easily). So I do believe 3rd person should stay but remove the ability to aim out of first person thus keeping any action strictly first person while allowing the player to remain spatially aware.

The only real issue I have is being able to peek over and around objects with third person.

[jordnz 102]

I like third person for roaming and looting and general game play, but always go first person when I need to use my firearm. I don't like crosshairs however, and being able to see player names. I'm not sure if it's server side, but I remember when the OZ one was up, crosshairs was disabled, meaning you couldn't scan the horizon waiting for names to pop up. Made it a little harder to communicate (was fine when Direct Comms was working) but it was much more realistic. It also meant rookie PvP'ers had to go into first person to aim, thus not giving anyone an advantage.

[tpenn 9]

No 3rd person, no crosshairs, no infinite range radar. This is a simulation. If we want to have these things in, then let's bring in hitscan weapons because "I have a hard time telling where my bullets drop"

[TheOnlylars 0]

I only play firstperson servers, i hate 3rd person.

[sheppydog 0]

I only play on 3rd person servers, I understand why some people would like first person for pvp. but frankly arma in first person is more immersion breaking to me then 3rd person. the first person view has very awkward movement and possibly the worst reloading animations I've ever seen.

I'd be happy if arma 3 has improved reload animations and more realistic fluid movement. but if it doesn't I'm sticking with 3rd person

[Vincitti 0]

No 3rd person' date=' no crosshairs, no infinite range radar. This is a simulation. If we want to have these things in, then let's bring in hitscan weapons because "I have a hard time telling where my bullets drop"

[/quote']

Or we could just admit that the first person experience is anything but smooth and third person gives you another option.

Zombies - strict military simulation - WUT?

[tpenn 9]

No 3rd person' date=' no crosshairs, no infinite range radar. This is a simulation. If we want to have these things in, then let's bring in hitscan weapons because "I have a hard time telling where my bullets drop"

[/quote']

Or we could just admit that the first person experience is anything but smooth and third person gives you another option.

Zombies - strict military simulation - WUT?

If you admit that the zombie movement is anything but smooth so we should be able to have the option to disable zombies amirite?

Personally I don't find the first person experience disruptive, I enjoy it as much as I enjoy realistic ballistics and damage, and I think anyone who doesn't could just as well be served by turning view bob off (which is probably the single most reason for not liking it). Beyond that, they probably just want easy mode on, in which case:

Apocalypse simulation. simulation. simulate. WUT

[Vincitti 0]

No 3rd person' date=' no crosshairs, no infinite range radar. This is a simulation. If we want to have these things in, then let's bring in hitscan weapons because "I have a hard time telling where my bullets drop"

[/quote']

Or we could just admit that the first person experience is anything but smooth and third person gives you another option.

Zombies - strict military simulation - WUT?

If you admit that the zombie movement is anything but smooth so we should be able to have the option to disable zombies amirite?

Personally I don't find the first person experience disruptive, I enjoy it as much as I enjoy realistic ballistics and damage, and I think anyone who doesn't could just as well be served by turning view bob off (which is probably the single most reason for not liking it). Beyond that, they probably just want easy mode on, in which case:

Apocalypse simulation. simulation. simulate. WUT

I don't think you have been out of the ArmA universe in a long time if you don't realize just how bad the first person play is but I see that there is no point in arguing.

For me it's more to due to the first person being frustrating and downright annoying than difficult, FPS games I played in the 90's were more fluid.

My whole point is to let people choose and don't throw the entire mod into a forced first person, leave it be.

I can't find anywhere this mod has been advertised as a simulation by the dev's if you can find it please link me.

[puppetmasterjjk 3]

I only play on 3rd person servers' date=' I understand why some people would like first person for pvp. but frankly arma in first person is more immersion breaking to me then 3rd person. the first person view has very awkward movement and possibly the worst reloading animations I've ever seen.

I'd be happy if arma 3 has improved reload animations and more realistic fluid movement. but if it doesn't I'm sticking with 3rd person

[/quote']

Fair enough that you feel that 3rd person is more immersion breaking for you, but realize that you're seeing the same exact animations and moving just the same in third person, just from a different camera position. Also, how could you tolerate the awkward looking reload animations (most are actually quite good, considering it's an actual model animation) in third-person but not in first?

If people want a more classic first person experience, then just turn the head-bobbing and free-aim all the way down and that's that.

Edit: That said, let people use third person, but disable HUD elements like crosshairs and such. It doesn't matter that much when it comes to shootouts with other players, as the fights aren't about the quick draw and such like other games, but rather tactical positioning.

[sheppydog 0]

I only play on 3rd person servers' date=' I understand why some people would like first person for pvp. but frankly arma in first person is more immersion breaking to me then 3rd person. the first person view has very awkward movement and possibly the worst reloading animations I've ever seen.

I'd be happy if arma 3 has improved reload animations and more realistic fluid movement. but if it doesn't I'm sticking with 3rd person

[/quote']

Fair enough that you feel that 3rd person is more immersion breaking for you, but realize that you're seeing the same exact animations and moving just the same in third person, just from a different camera position. Also, how could you tolerate the awkward looking reload animations (most are actually quite good, considering it's an actual model animation) in third-person but not in first?

If people want a more classic first person experience, then just turn the head-bobbing and free-aim all the way down and that's that.

Edit: That said, let people use third person, but disable HUD elements like cross hairs and such. It doesn't matter that much when it comes to shootouts with other players, as the fights aren't about the quick draw and such like other games, but rather tactical positioning.

I'll try to cover why I dont like first person a little better

Reloading: instead of removing the magazine, grabbing another, inserting it, and pulling the charging handle (there are no wet/dry reloads). the first person view just moves the hand to the mag, magazine disappears, gun is brought out of view and shakes a bit and POOF fully loaded weapon. in third person you dont have to watch this process as much and in my case lets me assume it is done correctly. its purely aesthetic. Resident evil 5 had very well done 3rd person model reloading

Movement: In arma 2 you move very...oddly. its very passable and isnt game breaking, but its not as fluid as other games (or real life). if you are in 3rd person it will seem less sticky. hard to explain sorry :'c

weapons: none of the weapons in arma are held all that well in first person. most of them clip through your hands. things like fore grips and GL grips are not used entirely in some cases. you don't see this in 3rd person as much

overall the only reason I use 3rd person is for aesthetic reasons. and while I appreciate that reload/weapon modeling is the same as the world model its just simply not as smooth as using other games methods. Red orchestra and BF have very good first person reloading animations. and passable world views. I frankly don't care to see my enemy reloading with complex animations if it costs me the fact that weapon modeling in first person is worse

I apologize for the poor grammar :(

[cuel 2]

I enjoy 3rd person in coop plays etc but the way it ruins PvP makes it not worth having it on.

[dunnobe 3]

I agree with Cuel.

[rikardgladt (DayZ) 0]

All of these complaints are simply how arma is supposed to be. you can't shoot on the move' date=' you have to stop, take aim and kill the target. Keep practicing and you'll get better at it. But dont plan on dumbing it down for beginner players.

[/quote']

So you're saying arma is supposed to be bad and clunky?

I think he just says that it's not like CoD where you basicly fly around. Arma is made like a simulator and i think they are trying to portrait the you actually do need to stop to shoot accurate, and while carrying heavy gear you are just that, clunky.

[magnumx70@gmail.com 2]

The situation:

I'm injured (it doesen't matter how),I have no pain killers left.....

then your screen start shacking non stop!!!

you try to figure out what next....in the middle of the night with your

chemlight stuck on your rifle lilke it has been glued to it.....

now try to immagine.....your freakking screen shacking constantly

and you got a rifle and a chemilight stuck in the middle of the screen...

IT IS UNPLAYABLE!!!!.....I'm getting so much headache!!!

I could undesrtand if your screen shakes once in a while but not all

the time please!!!!

UNLESS you switch to 3d person view....and that gives you a chance

to move on....

STOP the bullshit about 3d person distrupt pvp...because you probably

sux at it big time anyway!!!.......you are going to

DIE soon or later!!! no matter what it's just a matter of time!!!

[rikardgladt (DayZ) 0]

The situation:

I'm injured (it doesen't matter how)' date='I have no pain killers left.....

then your screen start shacking non stop!!!

you try to figure out what next....in the middle of the night with your

chemlight stuck on your rifle lilke it has been glued to it.....

now try to immagine.....your freakking screen shacking constantly

and you got a rifle and a chemilight stuck in the middle of the screen...

IT IS UNPLAYABLE!!!!.....I'm getting so much headache!!!

I could undesrtand if your screen shakes once in a while but not all

the time please!!!!

UNLESS you switch to 3d person view....and that gives you a chance

to move on....

STOP the bullshit about 3d person distrupt pvp...because you probably

sux at it big time anyway!!!.......you are going to

DIE soon or later!!! no matter what it's just a matter of time!!!

[/quote']

Seems like you're the one who's really bad at this game:) I've been down to 2k blood several times with blur all over, no color and alot of shaking. I've actually never died from that, so maybe you are the one that should adapt right?

[tajin 17]

All of these complaints are simply how arma is supposed to be. you can't shoot on the move' date=' you have to stop, take aim and kill the target. Keep practicing and you'll get better at it. But dont plan on dumbing it down for beginner players.

[/quote']

I completely agree, except for one thing. You can very well shoot on the move in arma. However the best way to do it is when you're looking over your ironsights, which makes you walk at a normal and steady speed. That is how I do it in ACE all the time. Slow and steady, with the weapon ready but slightly lowered, so you see more of your surroundings. You can also doubletap arrowdown to zoom out slightly, giving you a wider field of fiew, useful for close quarters.

First person in ArmA works very very well, it just takes a bit of time to get used to. But dont blame the game for the fact that most of the newer players here (dont take this as an insult) are spoilt by games like BF3, CoD or CS where you move like on rails and always keep a steady aim.

Take some time to actually learn how to use first person in ArmA properly before you start raging about how removing thirdperson would destroy everything.

ArmA is not a game that is meant to be dumbed down (hell most mods out there even make it more complex than it already is, think about that for once).

[Bandit (DayZ) 3]

All of these complaints are simply how arma is supposed to be. you can't shoot on the move' date=' you have to stop, take aim and kill the target. Keep practicing and you'll get better at it. But dont plan on dumbing it down for beginner players.

[/quote']

I completely agree, except for one thing. You can very well shoot on the move in arma. However the best way to do it is when you're looking over your ironsights, which makes you walk at a normal and steady speed. That is how I do it in ACE all the time. Slow and steady, with the weapon ready but slightly lowered, so you see more of your surroundings. You can also doubletap arrowdown to zoom out slightly, giving you a wider field of fiew, useful for close quarters.

First person in ArmA works very very well, it just takes a bit of time to get used to. But dont blame the game for the fact that most of the newer players here (dont take this as an insult) are spoilt by games like BF3, CoD or CS where you move like on rails and always keep a steady aim.

Take some time to actually learn how to use first person in ArmA properly before you start raging about how removing thirdperson would destroy everything.

ArmA is not a game that is meant to be dumbed down (hell most mods out there even make it more complex than it already is, think about that for once).

Exactly, speaking of it would be great to have the smk animations working with this mod. I had forgotten about getting stuck in stairwells with your weapon raised...

[tajin 17]

Exactly' date=' speaking of it would be great to have the smk animations working with this mod. I had forgotten about getting stuck in stairwells with your weapon raised...

[/quote']

Lenth of your gun is a factor. Better use handguns in confined spaces to avoid this in the first place. But yeah would be better if the weapon was lowered instead of just getting stuck ^^.

[maxim.kapinus@gmail.com 0]

In my opinion, that things broke all gameplay. Any ambush or escaping is useless because a simple review of the horizon in search of a illuminating nickname and distance to player. It breaks the whole concept of Arma.

[mastrovara 0]

Player Names: NO; People have the right to tell you their names or not. Be killed by a random guy so you can't take revenge on him: Realistic.

Crosshair: NO; Not realistic, shooting gun isn't easy, and the character has yet an iron hand that never misses the spot. Give him a crossair and it becomes Robocop.

3d Person: DEBATABLE

Pros:

-Humans have spatial awarness ( you can see without looking on your left and right and even a bit behind you; this can be achieved with 3 monitors, that are not so common in every player's house)

-It's extremely useful to move in the Arma universe (stairs, buildings, tight places)

-It can save your eyes if you are carrying a flare that will make you blind as soon as you get into the 1st person, because the character holds it stupidly in front of his head

-Makes hip-firing usable

Cons:

-Ruins immersion

-Destroy realisticity and realistic approch to PvP

-Can be used to tweak "pain shaking" and other effects.

[B4N3 0]

I think being able to see player names is entirely CHEAP and you can go 3rd person to avoid tons of the realistic shooting negatives in the game. With those things being said I enjoy 'hardcore' mode, I'm not a big fan of crosshairs either, just makes it easier to shoot from the hip cod style.

[Atkins (DayZ) 4]

3d Person: DEBATABLE

Pros:

-It's extremely useful to move in the Arma universe (stairs' date=' buildings, tight places)

-Makes hip-firing usable

[/quote']

These 2 are as doable in the 1st person as they are in 3rd. It just takes practice. I have had my fare share of problems going thru a door in 3rd person as well.

I do agree about the other stuff u mentioned.

[bodycount 83]

Third person does lend a HUGE advantage to being on a rooftop. You can pick out potential targets without having to put yourself into a position to be shot at and exposed to fire. Then when they have their back to you pop up out of cover and drop them. It is also easy to peer over and around walls.

I got to admit the game is far more difficult when facing humans in first person as well as being more scary and difficult fighting zombies in first person.

If this is an election then I vote for removing third person as well as crosshairs. (Although I wouldn't mind a name recognition for when you are very close to someone).

[abysmal 2]

I think 3rd person and crosshairs are at best debatable, and at worst unnecessary, but we NEED a system of identifying other players. There is nothing more immersion destroying than not being able to tell my group members apart from each other, or recognize another player.

Please don't remove ID's. The servers without them are massively less enjoyable for me (they discourage ad hoc grouping), and in almost no way better.

[thebigbobrowski 0]

i would be for removing name spotting and crosshairs but i do enjoy being in 3rd person when traveling and traversing buildings i dont really see it as an advantage when the whole server can also use it and if you take crosshairs out it effectively eliminates firefights while in 3rd person or at least to a degree. Overall i think its fine that these elements vary server by server that way everyone can play as they like with other players who enjoy a similar style i dont see how this is a problem to people who ask for the immersion of always 1st person if they can play on servers with people who also enjoy this. just my 2 cents.