Simple Question: How good are the new implemented antihack features working?

[TyrDaishi 36]

I'm especially interested in antihack measures regarding esp hacks.

 

I'm sure hackers read this forum asd well, so be at least so fair to imply if those hacks still work, thanks.

 

Maybe the playerbase that plays on private shards now can talk a bit about their encounters with hackers on privatly managed shards. Are they getting banned effectivly? Is it even possible to detect esp hackers? how many did you encounter?

Edited November 6, 2014 by TyrDaishi

[thelonewarrior 886]

My guess is that most hacks are now blocked or patched and in a couple of days they will start to leak through again and the hackers will find a way around it, that's what usually happens

ESP or any other hack will follow the same course

At the moment I think your fairly safe, but after a week at the most you won't be

Edited November 6, 2014 by Regulator Lone Warrior

[Mor (DayZ) 57]

We seen a decrease of 19.87653192 precent... <_< I have no idea how the hell do you think we can measure this up?!

You'll just get personal experience ranging from: nothing has changed its hacker haven to: hacks? what hacks? I haven't seen one for month... The only people with any indication will be devs\mods and they will feed you with usual "party line", that measures has been taken to deal with...blabla Without actually answering your question whether they were effective to reduce the amount of overall hacking (i.e. hackers moved to others methods)

Edited November 6, 2014 by Mor

[TyrDaishi 36]

I didn't ask for a statistic, I asked for individual experiences as for I'm aware that this can't be accuratly measured. If you want to make assumptions at least try to base them on what was actually written.

[Mor (DayZ) 57]

I understand, hence the second paragraph ;) I have seen a couple of these threads and you can rarely get anything from them. Especially with hot potato topic like hacking... However,  if you think that completely contradictory experiences will help you decide please go ahead. Just keep inmind that the mods will remove most things that can be used to substantiate the severity of hacking, since that info will also open the door for hacking ..

[TyrDaishi 36]

I personally think that it is idiocrazy to think talking about hacking will produce more hackers. You need to have certain specific personality traits in a individual that he even want to / or will use hacks, and the risk of exposing information about hacks leading to actual more hackers is slim to non existent (At least in my personal experience). Also if you want to consider persons who will write hacks those skills don't require the input of a few posts about the topic to enable them to do so. If I don't get a lot of feedback the reasons can be, obviously, manyfold in nature but I wouldn't have created this thread if I didn't wanted to use it, at least to a certain degree, as base to decide my future cause of action. Arguing over the usefulness after I already did it is quite pointless.

[thelonewarrior 886]

I personally think that it is idiocrazy to think talking about hacking will produce more hackers. You need to have certain specific personality traits in a individual that he even want to / or will use hacks, and the risk of exposing information about hacks leading to actual more hackers is slim to non existent (At least in my personal experience). Also if you want to consider persons who will write hacks those skills don't require the input of a few posts about the topic to enable them to do so. If I don't get a lot of feedback the reasons can be, obviously, manyfold in nature but I wouldn't have created this thread if I didn't wanted to use it, at least to a certain degree, as base to decide my future cause of action. Arguing over the usefulness after I already did it is quite pointless.

I agree that talking about hacks won't crate new hackers Ect

I can't say what I really think because it will get me banned from the forum, I got a warning before for saying what I think the real reasons are for them closing ANY post about hackers and hacking

This thread will likely get closed soon, with the standard response

I wish it wasn't that way on here, but it is

Edited November 6, 2014 by Regulator Lone Warrior

[TyrDaishi 36]

Well obviously too much talk about hacking can potentionally scare away future costumers, but if that would be the reason I would be really disappointed in bohemia interactives marketing department. After all strategys used and celebrated by big names like edward bernays or joseph goebbels are lying 70 years in the past now. Even the ideas still celebrated in the 60ies and 70ies regarding the "dumb consumer" are 40 years in the past. In the everlasting change of the consumers market in capitalism I consider this line of argumentation invalid.

 

Remember: buying a "certain" product is a way of "expressing" your "individualism" in modern days society. Reading about hackers won't change a damn thing about that.

I know you will take that line with the grain of salt it deserves ;)

 

[EDIT] Also the offered product is so niche right now that there is no need for concern. Oh and not to forget that every product that slightly resembles Dayz has the same problem regarding cheaters.

Edited November 6, 2014 by TyrDaishi

[danceswithzeds 22]

My guess is that most hacks are now blocked or patched and in a couple of days they will start to leak through again and the hackers will find a way around it, that's what usually happens

ESP or any other hack will follow the same course

At the moment I think your fairly safe, but after a week at the most you won't be

Wait are you sure you know what you are talking about? I thought that there are zero patches that have anything in them to prevent esp and other hacks.... I thought they let Battle Eye do all of the updates to find and ban hackers.

As far as I know, they only update patches to address duping and exploits that crash the whole game.

Can anyone else confirm I am correct? I don't think they have ever patched to stop the hacks because 1. They let battle eye do all of the anti hacking... 2. the engine will be so different by beta and final, that that will be the time to stop more hacking.

Edited November 6, 2014 by danceswithzeds

[ChainReactor 922]

Wait are you sure you know what you are talking about? I thought that there are zero patches that have anything in them to prevent esp and other hacks.... I thought they let Battle Eye do all of the updates to find and ban hackers.

As far as I know, they only update patches to address duping and exploits that crash the whole game.

Can anyone else confirm I am correct? I don't think they have ever patched to stop the hacks because 1. They let battle eye do all of the anti hacking... 2. the engine will be so different by beta and final, that that will be the time to stop more hacking.

 

BattleEye catches hacks, it doesn't prevent it. The devs job when it comes to anti cheating measurements is to find and close the loopholes and exploits that allow hacks. They have an entire team to do this and every patch is closing some loopholes. The sad thing about hackers is that they are constantly searching for new ones, which will occour during a dev stage in which there are massive code updates with every new update.

Edited November 6, 2014 by ChainReactor

[Mor (DayZ) 57]

You need to have certain specific personality traits in a individual that he even want to

Please :rolleyes: at some point religion tried to say something simliar about people the "pious" vs "sinner" but its nothing but BS.

What is hacking if not trying to get unfair advantage... Every Bambi says he find the game to difficult, is screamed at by hardcores to go online and educate themselves. Which is what pretty much every player does, they use online resources such as map, guides, apps etc. They use external maps on steam overlay or thier cellphone find their way around and find others ; find water pumps, and good items (spawn locations + plus server hopping to increase their chance to find items); for range finding and team coordination; trading etc.. Also many are using external teamspeak apps which gives a huge advantage in coordination while remaining silent..

With that inmind, what will be the next logical progress to gaining in-game advantage, that can be easily found online...

Anyway I am against hacking, but just because they are the bad guys, doesn't mean that they are mentally insane...

Edited November 6, 2014 by Mor

[thelonewarrior 886]

Anyway heres where my info comes from: (READ all 3 pages!!! I missed them the first time)

 

This applys to VAC, which I know isn't involved with dayz, but it also applies to any game, it just use the games in the article as an example

 

http://www.pcgamer.com/hacks-an-investigation-into-aimbot-dealers-wallhack-users-and-the-million-dollar-business-of-video-game-cheating/

 

and I quote from the lead hacks developer

 

"Tripwire closes loopholes as fast as possible, but Ultra Cheats is fast too. If a vendor's cheat stops working, Ultra Cheats stops selling it and the money stops flowing. Detected cheats come back online within hours, days at the most.

And these are only the cheats that we know about. “Anti-cheat can't detect what it can't get its hands on,” as Slayer said. Between that and the proficient closet cheaters, I can guarantee that you've played with way more cheaters than you think."

 

Battleye are trying ill give them that, but anyone who does a little research will discover that most people use a small hack to get an advantage (I said in another post I played alongside a hacker in the mod for over a month without knowing, a proper hacker, not a script kiddie, he knew all the tricks to get around battleye and it wasn't until after 1 month of hacking and NOT showing anything suspicious on the logs that he admitted it to me after he was banned, he then simply used another steam account and was back in action as he had bought 10+ copies of the game on a sale weekend)

 

Battleye ban and the updates prevent hacks, yet we keep seeing them, so my predication is this circle will continue forever until the game gets abandoned like the mod did

 

Once the admin tools were in and we learned to use the logs to see who killed who, most obvious hackers were banned, what we really need is decent admin tools that cant be abused, like seeing how much damage players are taking, how fast they are moving (but no locations) ect to weed out hackers

 

Battleye ban and the Devs patch the game, but I think this circle will continue until the game gets abandoned like the mod because lets face it, they wont spend the next 10 years patching the game to keep up with hackers

Edited November 6, 2014 by Regulator Lone Warrior

[TyrDaishi 36]

I meant it in quite the opposite way that you describe (mentally insane is a phrase that I wouldn't use in this context anyway). I'm saying that I trust people enough to acknowledge that cheating is not giving them an real advantage (or skill(set)) or will enrich their personal experience but will instead make the game dull and boring within a quick timespan. Because you obviously can't enjoy the game in an engaging, immersive and deep experience if you cheat. Someone who doesn't understand this is maybe measured below average IQ, but not insane. If they personally enjoy the game more because they cheat, well good for them really. But as you might know, expectation versus reality is a big letdown if analyzed correctly, because despite the wishes of many cheaters there is seldomly the reaction they think they inflict in others. That's just not how human nature works.

 

But instead of doing evidently seemingly freudian analytics of human instinctive behavior maybe we can return to the essence of my initial question. In a time where the individual needs fueld by capitalistic suggestions comes before everything else moral discussions are unfortunatly pretty much irrelevant. Because that is where I draw the line between the aids you described and cheats, from a perspective of morally acceptable or inacceptable behavior. The everlasting problem here, of course, is that their are as many opinions as assholes on this planet and the good old world with black and white faded away pretty much completly in the last century. My most objective argument about the topic would be that the creator of the virtual world we are talking about don't allow cheats by their rules, while the other aids are generally and openly accepted. Because the Authority about this lies by the creator from a legal standpoint of view after all.

 

As much as I enjoy such discussions anyway;)

[danceswithzeds 22]

BattleEye catches hacks, it doesn't prevent it. The devs job when it comes to anti cheating measurements is to find and close the loopholes and exploits that allow hacks. They have an entire team to do this and every patch is closing some loopholes. The sad thing about hackers is that they are constantly searching for new ones, which will occour during a dev stage in which there are massive code updates with every new update.

can you provide a link to where the patch notes say... "fixed current esp hack", or "fixed current speed hack".... or "fixed current "steal people's gear" hack". ?

If what you are saying is true, that they did stop previous esp and speed hacks....... then my God, we have the fastest hack writers on the planet that only devote their hacking skills on the latest Dayz version of stable. Because I've never noticed a drop in hacks except sometimes from BE global bans.

I'm not talking negative about Bohemia. I actually don't mind the current hacking status because I think they will prevent it a lot more in Beta and Final release.

If what you are saying is true, that they are trying hacking currentl in each patch, then they need their money back from BE and they need to just give up until the engine is rebuilt.

[ChainReactor 922]

can you provide a link to where the patch notes say... "fixed current esp hack", or "fixed current speed hack".... or "fixed current "steal people's gear" hack". ?

 

That's security sensitive stuff that you will never find on any patchnotes. A general info like in the latest patchnotes is enough.

 

 

then my God, we have the fastest hack writers on the planet that only devote their hacking skills on the latest Dayz version of stable. Because I've never noticed a drop in hacks except sometimes from BE global bans.

 

Sadly, that is partly true. I checked a cheating forum a couple of times because i couldn't believe why they put so much effort in this game. Some of them use DayZ as coding practice because its much easier in an Alpha game then in a finished game ( logically ). I wont share any details here, if you're interested, just do some research on your own.

[danceswithzeds 22]

he then simply used another steam account and was back in action as he had bought 10+ copies of the game on a sale weekend.

And here is why I think many game companies just pay Battle Eye to ban a few people rather than bother making their game cheat proof.... They sell 5 to 10 copies to one scumbag cheater so they make more sales.

Think about it... Even if a cheater makes 2 or 3 people give up playing and supporting the game...... that cheater will purchase 5 to 10 different copies of the game for when he gets banned by BE.

Has no one else asked if this is why companies just pay BE to simply ban people every now and then rather than make their game nearly cheat proof?

[TyrDaishi 36]

Guys... if you think that the market value of a few hundred cheaters that buy multiple copys of a game is more than the total market value of the costumers that will buy a game only if it is relativly cheatfree you are way off the track. Also given the total amount of money that was already made by selling the alpha it doesn't hurt the company one bit to pay a few bucks to make the game harder to exploit. If you spent more you save more in taxes, so why not doing it for the right thing ;)

[thelonewarrior 886]

And here is why I think many game companies just pay Battle Eye to ban a few people rather than bother making their game cheat proof.... They sell 5 to 10 copies to one scumbag cheater so they make more sales.

Think about it... Even if a cheater makes 2 or 3 people give up playing and supporting the game...... that cheater will purchase 5 to 10 different copies of the game for when he gets banned by BE.

Has no one else asked if this is why companies just pay BE to simply ban people every now and then rather than make their game nearly cheat proof?

 

I hate to say it. but that's what I thought

 

This is what I posted a while ago and was given a warning by the Mods not to say this, implying I would be temporarily  banned if I continued saying things like this

[TyrDaishi 36]

I hate to say it. but that's what I thought

 

This is what I posted a while ago and was given a warning by the Mods not to say this, implying I would be temporarily  banned if I continued saying things like this

 

If that is indeed the case I can only repeat myself: The person who decided this has a poor understanding of market dynamics and how consumer decisions are formed. To express personal opinions like yours are well within the rules of this platform and simply excercising your right to the freedom of speech, well within your rights considering the given rules of this forum (as mentioned).

Edited November 6, 2014 by TyrDaishi

[danceswithzeds 22]

Guys... if you think that the market value of a few hundred cheaters that buy multiple copys of a game is more than the total market value of the costumers that will buy a game only if it is relativly cheatfree you are way off the track. Also given the total amount of money that was already made by selling the alpha it doesn't hurt the company one bit to pay a few bucks to make the game harder to exploit. If you spent more you save more in taxes, so why not doing it for the right thing ;)

First let me repeat that I think Bohemia and Dean are doing an awesome job of working on this cool game. I love Dayz, it's the coolest game I've ever played in terms of concept. I also think hacking will be fixed in beta and final release. So there is no reason to panic... The game will be fine I promise guys....

now, to the quote above.....

But we have not seen any evidence to support what you are saying what soever for the case of Dayz so far.

Dayz is unlike any other game in history. It is attracting a very different kind of player. Lots of Eastern European players I've personally never played with before, for example.

How can you compare the "market value", and "players" of Dayz to any other game?

How do you know that Dayz players are not 50 times more likely to pay for 5 different copies of Dayz and Steam account so they can keep ruining people's day with the fun hacks that are so easy to buy?

Because from the actual real experience of me playing the game for 10 months, reading up on different forums,..... etc...... I believe 100% that for some reason, there are a lot of people who enjoy ruining people's day in Dayz more than other games.

Edited November 6, 2014 by danceswithzeds

[OrLoK 16182]

Hello there

 

As you know we dont allow discussions about hacking and security here for obvious reasons, so I shall close this.

 

There's plenty of other places and ways to can discuss this topic so feel free to continue somewhere else.

 

Im doing you the courtesy of closing rather than hiding this as some points are of interest but as per usual there is a lot of falsehood flapping about and thats not on.

 

Closing.

 

Rgds

 

LoK