Bring back Markov at spawn

[zonfiar 5]

Recently played since this came in to effect. Game seemed pointless at that point because I was creeping all around looking for a building that I could enter (which there wasn't) only to finally find a building that had magazines but no weapons. Lots of ammunition and tin cans, but no weapons.

Eventually myself (and my brother who also joined) were chased by zeds with no defense at all. Without a way to defend ourselves it makes this mod a lot less appealing.

If this does remain that way than at least make it so that there is a spawn point for a markov somewhere nearby that after a little searching will yield the desired protection.

[rabb1t 13]

I was against the removal of the Makarov when it was patched out but it's not even that big of a deal now to survive without it. I think not having any food, water, or painkillers are more of a hindrance than not having a weapon.

Just get the fuck away from the coast and hit a deer stand, barn, or castle on your way up North and you will find a primary weapon and a handgun (probably both) within 30-40 minutes.

[Niemand (DayZ) 12]

I got painkillers and bandages when I spawn. :O

but nah, If a nub spawns with a makarov he does most likely not learn to get around Zeds. If there is no weapon at spawn all those morons that are not able to get a weapon are sorted out.

Call it Natural Selection.

[Shorttallguy 3]

NO WAY!!! DO NOT GIVE PEOPLE GUNS AT SPAWN!!! I love it the way it is. it makes you really feel like a survivor. It adds so much to the atmosphere and immersion.

[SwissArmy (DayZ) 5]

I don't agree with the original poster. I was worried at the outset that this was not good, but frankly it isn't, at least against the zeds. The bigger problem is the amount of murdering that seems to go on, with 'shoot on sight' types running around.

[Zeromentor 169]

You feel like nothing when you spawn, and even a single zombie is hell on your heels when you have no way to get rid of them. A team of players without guns has more fun than a single person, I admit, but in the end it was for the best.

If they do bring back a makarov for a spawner, then no more than 1 magazine should do. That's enough for 2 zombies, give or take aim, skill, and other random factors. And if a player jumps you for the extra mag, you'll probably blow it all in his direction, making his attack pointless, leaving him with less than he started.

But that's just my point of view. You get used to the flashlight.

[Streicherov 1]

I joined the mod when the makarov was allready taken away...

And well - i dont really found it that difficult to find my first weapon (hatchet) and starting of with nothing!

Actually I think that it gives u a far more intense experience since I felt so f*cking helpless in the beginning and was so scared without having seen my first zombie though!^^

---- I was like: THATS how i expected DayZ !!!!!!!!!

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

give the gun back aat spawn so I have a chance against the players who are just playing to kill others in the game. I spawn with no way to defendmyself, they have been killing players and taking their stuff, they win, I can't go into a city to try and supply myself cause they are setting up baricades as well was shooting everyone on sight/ gratz you made this game just about unplayable

[Jokerr (DayZ) 0]

No gun at spawn.It is best at it is.It encourages making friends.Come on guys,let's face it.You won't have a chance EVEN if you have a makarov against somewhen with winchester/lee enfield or even higher tier guns.Face it.

Try to survive.Stop whining.People like you ruin games with stupid suggestions.

[Shorttallguy 3]

give the gun back aat spawn so I have a chance against the players who are just playing to kill others in the game. I spawn with no way to defendmyself' date=' they have been killing players and taking their stuff, they win, I can't go into a city to try and supply myself cause they are setting up baricades as well was shooting everyone on sight/ gratz you made this game just about unplayable

[/quote']

but they have no incentive to kill you if you have nothing other then griefing and you have nothing to lose going against them cause you have nothing. plus this is part of the great dynamic of this game that makes it awesome. it forces you to make tough choices when dealing with other players and the hostile environment. if you wanna start killing people as soon as you spawn go play COD. in this game you have to work for it. i love it.

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

but they have no incentive to kill you if you have nothing other then griefing and you have nothing to lose going against them cause you have nothing. plus this is part of the great dynamic of this game that makes it awesome. it forces you to make tough choices when dealing with other players and the hostile environment. if you wanna start killing people as soon as you spawn go play COD. in this game you have to work for it. i love it.

I have a bandage and painpills' date=' and without a weapon they might as well be free, plus i might have picked something up on my way trying to find a weapon in the random spawning system, that pretty much requires you to go into a high risk area to find anything to use. If I wanted to play a game where i guy sits in a cornor all day to shoot people I'd go play COD, this game I play cause I get to try and survive in a world with zombies and other players, except I mght as well go play COD cause then at least I can move around the map and be able to do something rather then having to spent 20 hours on the game just to find a weapon, cause anytime i get remotely close I get shot by a guy who is sitting there waiting to shoot anyone who walks by.

No gun at spawn.It is best at it is.It encourages making friends.Come on guys,let's face it.You won't have a chance EVEN if you have a makarov against somewhen with winchester/lee enfield or even higher tier guns.Face it.

Try to survive.Stop whining.People like you ruin games with stupid suggestions.

Sorry, people like you who complain about people trying to make the game better with suggestions and explanations on how it could make the game more fare all around, ruin the game. I have defended myself lots with a Markov, sure I lose alot more then i win, BUT I STILL DEAL DAMAGE BACK. This encourages people NOT to sit somewhere and camp cause someone might just be able to screw you over while you camping spawn to grief cause you have awesome gear already.

[Slitter 11]

No gun at spawn.It is best at it is.It encourages making friends.Come on guys' date='let's face it.You won't have a chance EVEN if you have a makarov against somewhen with winchester/lee enfield or even higher tier guns.Face it.

Try to survive.Stop whining.People like you ruin games with stupid suggestions.

[/quote']

Sorry, people like you who complain about people trying to make the game better with suggestions and explanations on how it could make the game more fare all around, ruin the game. I have defended myself lots with a Markov, sure I lose alot more then i win, BUT I STILL DEAL DAMAGE BACK. This encourages people NOT to sit somewhere and camp cause someone might just be able to screw you over while you camping spawn to grief cause you have awesome gear already.

Having a gun at spawn will solve nothing. Before the makarov got patched out it was the same way it is now. Some people will kill you at spawn just because they can and a Makarov is to weak to fight back a well geared bandit.

I also don't get why you have to shoot zeds... they are a minor annoyance but you can shake them off just by running into a hill. And it is definetly possible to loot towns without aggroing zeds at all.

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

Having a gun at spawn will solve nothing. Before the makarov got patched out it was the same way it is now. Some people will kill you at spawn just because they can and a Makarov is to weak to fight back a well geared bandit.

I also don't get why you have to shoot zeds... they are a minor annoyance but you can shake them off just by running into a hill. And it is definetly possible to loot towns without aggroing zeds at all.

Example 1: Spawning without a weapon

Stealth: Is key avoiding zombies is a must, or you have to run attracting more til you can weave in and out of a building and out of sight/ or up a good enough this to zig around on.

Bandits: You die trying to look for a weapon most likely from this. No save. Just die.

Example 2:

Stealth: Is key, you only started with a weak weapon, and only a headshot well kill a Z and save ammo, but you now can maybe deal with one or two of them before having to run away, if there is a Z standing inside a bulding doorway you can easily snip the thing.

Bandits: Well probably kill you while looking for a BETTER weapon. You not going to do damage to them, but you well make them have to use some supplies, or you might luck out and kill them before they kill you.

Now with those two examples, which sounds more playable, and reasonable, I'd have to go with example two and the fact alone I can actually handle another player if I get off a few well placed shots, and also have some form of damage to them thus making their precious stuff, more important then hunting me at spawn for a could free items they can stow away in a tent somewhere

[Slitter 11]

That's just your opinion i like the first example more to be honest.

Also it puts a lot more value onto your live after you found some decent stuff because you know if you die it will all be gone and you won't have anything but a flashlight, bandage and 1 box of painkillers.

I like that when i spawn i have to find something to defend myself. Taht's just realistic for me. I don't own a gun IRL so it is much more immersive for me that i will have to find a weapon first.

Sure you can defend against bandits better but, meh, wouldn't want to lose that immersive feeling just because some people can't deal with no weapons.

Additionally i made it of the coast almost all of my lives. Only got shot at spawn maybe twice now, was fine with it, shit happens. But i wouldn't want a weapon just because of that.

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

That's just your opinion i like the first example more to be honest.

Also it puts a lot more value onto your live after you found some decent stuff because you know if you die it will all be gone and you won't have anything but a flashlight' date=' bandage and 1 box of painkillers.

I like that when i spawn i have to find something to defend myself. Taht's just realistic for me. I don't own a gun IRL so it is much more immersive for me that i will have to find a weapon first.

Sure you can defend against bandits better but, meh, wouldn't want to lose that immersive feeling just because some people can't deal with no weapons.

Additionally i made it of the coast almost all of my lives. Only got shot at spawn maybe twice now, was fine with it, shit happens. But i wouldn't want a weapon just because of that.

[/quote']

I only get to play on severs with people who just sit in places for hours on end to shoot someone. >w> only contact i had with other players is being shot or shot at.

Before when you found awesome gear, you didn't want to die and end back up with the little pea shooter of a Markov, my poor Kobra AK you well be forever missed. Mostly I find it as an annoyance, cause I can't defend myself from a zombie, let lone a player unless the game randomly spawns me somethign other then a tin can.

Spawning with an Axe would even be ok, for if you bump into that zombie hiding in a building, but I want something to stop that player hiding in a building that I have 1.5 seconds to fire several shots off at before they put me into respawn. Hell I might even take them with me. Thus their gear is forfeit cause they decided to be a douche

[zonfiar 5]

No gun at spawn.It is best at it is.It encourages making friends.Come on guys' date='let's face it.You won't have a chance EVEN if you have a makarov against somewhen with winchester/lee enfield or even higher tier guns.Face it.

Try to survive.Stop whining.People like you ruin games with stupid suggestions.

[/quote']

Wait, I thought this was an Alpha testing where suggestions are encouraged? Damn, didn't know my suggestion would be stupid and that I am whining. Dumbasses like you need to shut it and, if you have a comment, make it constructive without name calling from behind a keyboard.

If you have no way to defend yourself than its game over when a bandit comes upon you or a zombie happens to see you. I creeped around to countless buildings for a good 40 minutes. Yes, I survived, yes, I evaded the zombies. But there wasn't a weapon in sight. Virtually all the buildings I couldn't enter, so my long ass creep up to the building resulted in a waste of 10 minutes, just so I could turn around and retrace my steps to evade the zeds. When I eventually did find a building I could enter, tons of ammunition, but no weapons. When eventually spotted, I could do nothing.

If we are going to be limited to no weapon at start, at least let us use our fists or a knife or something against zeds. Granted, from another post I heard melee isn't in the original Arma 2, so probably not an option, but there has to be a way to defend yourself. Since we are going for realism here if a zombie were to attack me and I didn't have a weapon and nowhere to run, I certainly wouldn't just stand there and let it eat me. This is a simulation after all.

[Siri302 37]

While I like the fact that the starter gun has been taken away.. it actually convinced me to buy the game, loving the helpless feeling it added when I started playing, I had to learn to survive - and quickly. The implementation of this teaches players tactics and the value of equipment. That avoiding contact is far better than walking into town and blasting away at the first thing you see. My first day playing consisted mostly of just running away and creeping round buildings to find some form of nourishment. Eventually (nearing the end of the first day mark) I found an axe. I felt this inexplicable glee that at last I could defend myself and not just run away anymore, got myself an M16 now. ^^

The changes don't make this game impossible at all, all you need to do is adapt your ways of surviving and learn from your mistakes, I'll never forget how I ran blindly into a building looking for a gun during the first half hour only to be chased out by a small horde. You say you want an accurate and realistic simulation. Well, not every building you enter WOULD have weapons or any kind of useful supplies, its a risk you have to take. Don't get disheartened because you can get what you want - accept that the reality of the situation DayZ puts you in.

But what you said, zonfiar, about being able to use fists I totally agree with. I get that it could be difficult to add. But come on, no ones going to stand there and get taken down if they get cornered with no weapon, of course they're going to punch and kick the hell out of those zombies. Or at least, I know I would. Heck, if there was a chair in that room I think I'd do some damage brandishing it. If not, I'd unleash hell throwing random household objects, just for a chance to live a little longer - but I guess that might be out of the question.. :P

All I can say is that it isn't the game you should be suggesting that changes, you need to change. Be persistent and patient, you'll reap the rewards eventually. :)

[wolfsburg62 66]

I like it better, I like the AXE!!

[Date (DayZ) 0]

Crowbar or axe plz.

[zonfiar 5]

I like it better' date=' I like the AXE!!

[/quote']

But you can't use the axe, can you? I haven't seen any changes to that effect yet, and haven't come across one yet.

---

While I like the fact that the starter gun has been taken away.. it actually convinced me to buy the game' date=' loving the helpless feeling it added when I started playing, I had to learn to survive - and quickly. The implementation of this teaches players tactics and the value of equipment. That avoiding contact is far better than walking into town and blasting away at the first thing you see. My first day playing consisted mostly of just running away and creeping round buildings to find some form of nourishment. Eventually (nearing the end of the first day mark) I found an axe. I felt this inexplicable glee that at last I could defend myself and not just run away anymore, got myself an M16 now. ^^

The changes don't make this game impossible at all, all you need to do is adapt your ways of surviving and learn from your mistakes, I'll never forget how I ran blindly into a building looking for a gun during the first half hour only to be chased out by a small horde. You say you want an accurate and realistic simulation. Well, not every building you enter WOULD have weapons or any kind of useful supplies, its a risk you have to take. Don't get disheartened because you can get what you want - accept that the reality of the situation DayZ puts you in.

But what you said, zonfiar, about being able to use fists I totally agree with. I get that it could be difficult to add. But come on, no ones going to stand there and get taken down if they get cornered with no weapon, of course they're going to punch and kick the hell out of those zombies. Or at least, I know I would. Heck, if there was a chair in that room I think I'd do some damage brandishing it. If not, I'd unleash hell throwing random household objects, just for a chance to live a little longer - but I guess that might be out of the question.. :P

All I can say is that it isn't the game you should be suggesting that changes, you need to change. Be persistent and patient, you'll reap the rewards eventually. :)

[/quote']

Understood completely. Not suggesting every building have weapons in them, but after 10 minutes of creeping at least let me enter the building to find it empty. Last spawn I was in a high density area of buildings, as well as a high density area of zeds. Creeped everywhere, went up to tons of buildings, and no weapons. One way to solve this is if the spawn points are static to place a gun within, say, 1,500 meters of the spawn point, that way the player knows if they are careful, if they search, without knowing where or which direction, they might find a weapon nearby (might being the key if another player snags it, or make the weapon spawn with your spawn). I understand the whole survive concept, that is not the issue. My issue is to give some sort of way to defend yourself. Fine, no gun? I can live with that no problem. Make me search for it, can do that to.

Most of my gameplay anyway is creeping around looking for loot instead of shooting zombies. In fact I can't recall the last time I've been "into town and blasting away at the first thing you see". I avoid towns like the plague, and only shoot zombies when they are chasing me. Can't recall ever shoot on sight, either players or zeds.

For some reason everyone (from the posts of course, certainly not everyone) thinks that if a player wants to spawn with a gun than they want to A) kill humans with it (common insult on here of course being called a COD kiddie), or B) kill the first zombie you see. I suggest bringing gun spawn back for neither reason. Only there as a self defense mechanism. I don't know, spawn it with one magazine then, but if melee is not an option than something else needs to be.

[herd 69]

NO. How else will I pwn all the noobs at the beach?

[Stoop_Kid 2]

Why not just start with a melee weapon that has limited durability? Say, 100 strikes rather than the usual amount?

That way you have a way to kill a few Zs, but you're useless against a group. I know a lot of people follow the "not everyone has a gun" argument, and I agree, but it's not unreasonable for people to have axes, crowbars, whatever that can be used for short-term defense.

[zonfiar 5]

Why not just start with a melee weapon that has limited durability? Say' date=' 100 strikes rather than the usual amount?

That way you have a way to kill a few Zs, but you're useless against a group. I know a lot of people follow the "not everyone has a gun" argument, and I agree, but it's not unreasonable for people to have axes, crowbars, whatever that can be used for short-term defense.

[/quote']

Agree completely.

[thywolf@live.ca 3]

I'd unleash hell throwing random household objects' date=' just for a chance to live a little longer - but I guess that might be out of the question.. :P

[/quote']

Tin cans, finally a use for them

[Siri302 37]

zonfiar, You can use axes now - if you find them of course, I found mine in a barn, if that helps you the next time you are in a fix for a weapon. Of course you wont get any guarantee of one spawning in there, and you may even come across a gun instead. Then again, you may find a gun with no ammo - hence why the axe is a better find in my opinion. 2 swings usually does the trick, I hear only one blow to the head is sufficient but I ''double-tap'' just to be certain considering how buggy the zombies can be, plus it's a silent kill. I believe you can use crowbars and knives too? Not verified this myself, I see no reason why not if this isn't in the game yet, as my friend had a crowbar equipped but said he couldn't use it as a weapon..

About the blasting at the first thing you see - I never played the game with the starter weapon, I wouldn't know what it was like 'back then' but thinking about what it must of been like, whether it applies to you or not - people were probably more likely just to shoot something to get it out of the way, rather than walk around it because if they die, they knew they were just going to re-spawn with the same items. Therefore they had no real sense of loss. I avoid large settlements completely, even if there is far greater loot to be had there - I don't want to get mixed up in any bandit shenanigans or zombie hordes. Teaming up (with trust-worthy people, obviously) will bring you far more goods in much less time, as I have found, having been able to raid the North West airfield with a friend - no shots fired at us, and we didn't have to kill any infected either, and I only had my axe. People who are just spawn killing, whether you have a weapon or not are just a fact of the game, as they would probably be a fact of life - it's going to be unfair, and getting valuables is going to be due to luck in a lot of cases. Some people seem to think this has taken the fun out of the game, because you find yourself at such a disadvantage when you re-spawn, but I find it invigorating. You're given far more of a drive to search for things to keep you alive, spawning with a weapon means you can pretty much do what you like right off the bat, whereas with nothing you have a real sense of desperation. Sneaking round isn't so hard and after a few attempts at in-land barns I finally found an axe (like you said I had also collected countless amounts of ammo but had found no guns). But if I, and so many others can survive without a starter weapon and still enjoy the ups and downs, then I don't see what is stopping you from doing so too?

Yes it can feel like a huge waste of time, exploring a whole town looking for a weapon and all the trouble you go to yields little or nothing - whether it is down to crappy spawns or the fact another player has already been through and looted everything. It's disheartening. But you just have to think ''ok I'll try the next place''. I think this is one of the factors that makes this game great. It goes against conventional ideas of what games should be like, it doesn't give you any easy handouts. Hell, I think it's very gracious to spawn us with a bandage and a flashlight, I mean I don't carry either of those things off-hand in reality.

I totally get what you're saying that you feel too much at a disadvantage without anything to defend yourself with, probably more so from other players it seems these days, without hand-to-hand being an option, but I really don't think new players should spawn with a weapon of any kind.

Perhaps more blunt weapons need to be added to the game - I'm sure adding ''branches'' could be a feasible idea, you could just find those laying in relative abundance on a forest floor, right? When I spawned for the first time, there was a wooded area right across from me if I remember correctly - this could be a suitably realistic and easy way to arm yourself with a basic weapon which could take out the odd zombies, so long as you attract no hordes by being reckless. Since the forest was the first place I headed to get out of the open of the coast anyway, new players with any sense could easily stumble upon a branch, or those looking for them would be able to find them quickly after a re-spawn. Not sure if a branch would be a durable option though..

Hey Thywolf, I hear tin cans can be used to distract the infected too! .. never actually tried that theory out.. But maybe just going for a direct head-shot with them would be a better use ;) I mean you should be able to bottle zombies over the head with the whiskey bottles I've found laying round too. I know it could only be a one-shot chance really ... but that is still a chance!

..damn I write a lot..