Primitive weapons

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Firearms are a lot easier to use than melee weapons, let alone homemade ones.

 

How? I mean it would be hard to win a sword fight against a trained swordsman but a sword isn't hard to swing about if you have the strength to lift it, neither is a hammer.

If you can use a hammer at a fairground to hit one of those things and ring a bell you can quite easily hit a person.

 

I'm not getting what you think should be so difficult about it, it should be tiring but that's about it not so hard that you can't do it properly.

[liquidsnake 275]

How? I mean it would be hard to win a sword fight against a trained swordsman but a sword isn't hard to swing about if you have the strength to lift it, neither is a hammer.

If you can use a hammer at a fairground to hit one of those things and ring a bell you can quite easily hit a person.

 

I'm not getting what you think should be so difficult about it, it should be tiring but that's about it not so hard that you can't do it properly.

What I'm trying to say is that an untrained sword wielder can't even slice through a doormat with a katana, which is capable of making a clean cut through steel. How can you possible expect an amateur to be even a little efficient with a sword? 

I don't like to bring up the walking dead (also, know that I'm not basing my arguments on a television series, this is just something I noticed in that series which seems true to reality), but *spoilers* when the governor tried to behead hershel and the swing didn't even kill him: *spoilers end* that was realistic. A random fool can not just pick up a sword and slice through everything they see. Amateurs can't even slice through a melon, let alone a human being

[UltimateGentleman 355]

What I'm trying to say is that an untrained sword wielder can't even slice through a doormat with a katana, which is capable of making a clean cut through steel. How can you possible expect an amateur to be even a little efficient with a sword? 

I don't like to bring up the walking dead (also, know that I'm not basing my arguments on a television series, this is just something I noticed in that series which seems true to reality), but *spoilers* when the governor tried to behead hershel and the swing didn't even kill him: *spoilers end* that was realistic. A random fool can not just pick up a sword and slice through everything they see. Amateurs can't even slice through a melon, let alone a human being

 

Well you can still do damage with them, I see what you're saying now but it wouldn't be so hard to use clubs or anything like that and spears would need a stabbing motion to be good it wouldn't be that hard to run someone through with them.

I'd love for katana's to be in the game but more than anything they should just be like a vanity thing katana's in reality are really weak and chip quickly so in game they should just break quick.

Would be cool to have one on your side in a sheath though even if it was never effective.

 

Actually a lot of weapons need a stabbing motion, trying to slice someone with a full gear set is beyond ridiculous. Maybe they should add a stab animation activated by holding the attack button? Right now for melee combat just mashing left click is really dumb.

 

I think swords are a bit ridiculous to have in this game though, instead of actual medieval spears maybe they could have a school building that spawns the occasional javelin?(not to throw though)

Or maybe you could snap a machete blade off and if they added superglue, glue it to another machete and then you have your makeshift sword.

[liquidsnake 275]

Well you can still do damage with them, I see what you're saying now but it wouldn't be so hard to use clubs or anything like that and spears would need a stabbing motion to be good it wouldn't be that hard to run someone through with them.

I'd love for katana's to be in the game but more than anything they should just be like a vanity thing katana's in reality are really weak and chip quickly so in game they should just break quick.

Would be cool to have one on your side in a sheath though even if it was never effective.

 

Actually a lot of weapons need a stabbing motion, trying to slice someone with a full gear set is beyond ridiculous. Maybe they should add a stab animation activated by holding the attack button? Right now for melee combat just mashing left click is really dumb.

 

I think swords are a bit ridiculous to have in this game though, instead of actual medieval spears maybe they could have a school building that spawns the occasional javelin?(not to throw though)

Or maybe you could snap a machete blade off and if they added superglue, glue it to another machete and then you have your makeshift sword.

I'd also think a sword would be too much, but I was just using it as an example. I just think it's ridiculous to have proper ancient warriors lurking around Chernarus. Amateurs just aren't all that lethal with blades/blunt weapons. It's much like hand-to-hand combat. Amateurs are a far cry from being deadly with their mindless punching, but a martial arts (or any other fight sport) pro is genuinely lethal with punches in vital areas and in a specific manner. The same goes for most melee weapons. Survivors aren't pros.

[Whyherro123 2283]

well a sledgehammer is modernized because its still used today, i guess.

 

but anyway, you didn't cover how it literally takes multiple years to train in this kind of thing, its SUPER unrealistic, the average man cannot use a sling to kill someone, id be willing to say you have a 1/100,000 chance in actually succeeding, not to mention only a few people in the world today can actually use a sling. and shrimpy weapons like a knife on a broom stick again break in like 2-3 hits, if you even cut, might as well just use the knife, its way easier, and WORKS rather then a duck tape spear.

 

thing is in an apocalyptic situation people don't just pull out their old medieval weapon collection and start killing people in full military attire in the streets, and using plastic broom stick duck tape kitchen knives and start running around surviving, you would probably die in a week or two. you might as well use a shovel because its at least 5-10 times more efficient.

Dude, plenty of people around the world use slings. It is actually a pretty common hobby, about on par with archery, if not more popular because there are far fewer restrictions on where and how you can use a sling than where you can use a bow. Check slinging.org for more info.

And, a spear is far, far FAR more efficient than a knife. Knives don't kill through slashing, they kill through thrust. Guess what weapon allows the wielder to use more force in a thrust, with farther range, than a hand-held knife? A spear. Guess what weapon is focused on more in "basic" military training than the knife? THE SPEAR, in the form of the bayonet.

Would I use a spear over a rifle? Hell no. Would I use a spear or a sling if I didn't have a rifle. Abso-fucking-lutely, because a spear is a more effective weapon than a knife. A spear is a more effective weapon than a shovel.

[Whyherro123 2283]

Guns are a lot easier to master and the difference between a pro and someone who only knows the basics isn't insanely large. The latter would have less accuracy and that's pretty much it (the rest is minor). The difference between an experienced sword wielder and a newbie, for instance, is really big. A pro can easily make a clean cut through steel, while an amateur has difficulties with making a clean cut through a straw doormat.

I'd like to see your proof for "katanas can cut through steel" idea, because Katanas (and most Japanese-type swords, for that matter), suck ass in reality. Japan didn't have any good steel, which is why they folded the swords so much, to drive out impurities (and they were only folded about 15-30 times, any more than that would introduce too much carbon and make the steel too brittle). 

And, you want to know what the primary weapon of the Samurai was, at least during the time period when they were actual warriors, not peasant-murdering warrior poets? The spear!

[UltimateGentleman 355]

Something like a big claymore with its weight could probably cut in to steel good.

 

But if they were in the game you'd have to be able to cut people in half.

Imagine you could just run around like you were from Highlander chopping everyone up...

 

It would be hilarious but makes no sense.

Unless they added a museum somewhere or multiple where medieval weapons would spawn? Doesn't seem like the kind of area where a museum would have commercial value though.

 

Being able to make spears should be fine enough, the pitchfork should work as one for sure. Maybe they could add metal bars in, like the ones used to reinforce concrete for you to make a spear out of.

Though they'd be a bit heavy.

Metal poles of some sort anyway instead of just wood all the time.

 

 

Off topic but wouldn't it be cool if you could attach a mirror to a stick to look round corners? That would be fantastic in hardcore.

[soulfirez 901]

I'd like to see your proof for "katanas can cut through steel" idea, because Katanas (and most Japanese-type swords, for that matter), suck ass in reality. Japan didn't have any good steel, which is why they folded the swords so much, to drive out impurities (and they were only folded about 15-30 times, any more than that would introduce too much carbon and make the steel too brittle). 

And, you want to know what the primary weapon of the Samurai was, at least during the time period when they were actual warriors, not peasant-murdering warrior poets? The spear!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyO46RQhYkQ yeah thats sword looks like utter crap doesnt it....

 

Slings are as big a sport as archery ??? wow when did they add them to the olympics?? Insanely hard weapon to use hey i give you props for being able to use one i cant and i have tried a few times there is a real art to it good on you for masterying it( or effectively using it) but its one of those weapons that ancient armies that used it they grew up using them they didnt wash up on the shore of a foriegn country as some average joe office worker and pick up a sling and be lethal with them .. Reality you should try it some time.

[over9000nukez 199]

Dude, plenty of people around the world use slings. It is actually a pretty common hobby, about on par with archery, if not more popular because there are far fewer restrictions on where and how you can use a sling than where you can use a bow. Check slinging.org for more info.

And, a spear is far, far FAR more efficient than a knife. Knives don't kill through slashing, they kill through thrust. Guess what weapon allows the wielder to use more force in a thrust, with farther range, than a hand-held knife? A spear. Guess what weapon is focused on more in "basic" military training than the knife? THE SPEAR, in the form of the bayonet.

Would I use a spear over a rifle? Hell no. Would I use a spear or a sling if I didn't have a rifle. Abso-fucking-lutely, because a spear is a more effective weapon than a knife. A spear is a more effective weapon than a shovel.

i would never use a sling because i wouldnt know how to use it, if you handed me a sling and said use it or die, maybe, but other then that the chances of a person actually connecting are almost none.

 

as for a spear i don't know if we're talking about the same thing

 

 

although in the video it SEEMS successful, the spear starts to fall apart on the first hit. to 2 waterbottles.

again id rather just use a hand held knife, its way more dependable and doesn't start falling apart on your first swing. Now a bayonet is different, its attached to a gun, and not duck taped on, its built for the gun so they connect better, and don't fall off each other.

 

For the sling we could probebly take an online poll and ask how many people know how to use a sling. and if you told that guy you linked me to (the guy throwing a ball for his dog) to use it ON someone and KILL them with a rock or something im pretty sure he would be extremely unsuccessful.

[stryker007 39]

I fear the weapon availability balance is about right.  Make weapons and ammo scarce especially assault weapons then when someone finds one they will be God like.  Also worse still (and very very likely) that scarce assault rifle will end up in the hands of some ass-part troll who will then set about ruining the game for everyone.

 

[EDIT] I think other weapons such as the machete need to be much much much much much more effective.  I was on a server being trolled by two northern sister shagging inbreds.  I'd been killed then 20 mins later ran into them again as they were spawn trolling... under fire I got into the only building in town with no rooms so shut the door and stood right behind it machete raised to hit the guy with the m4 who was chasing me....

 

The gimp was so unskilled he just charged in opened the door AND was too slow to shoot me before I'd hit him in the head with the machete... of course it had no real effect on him and I was gunned down...

 

So in short, make melee weapons much more deadly

Edited May 7, 2014 by stryker007

[GunnyITA 107]

-Life preserver

-knuckles

-chopper

-Umbrella

-Walking stick

-Whip

-Throwing knife

-Throwing axe

Edited May 7, 2014 by GunnyITA

[UltimateGentleman 355]

So in short, make melee weapons much more deadly

 

Yes.

Melee weapons should be deadly to humans and average on zombies, mostly requiring headshots.

If someone slices your arm with a machete you're hardly able to lift an M4 to shoot them easily.

 

Sledgehammers would be great for sneaking up and breaking someone's legs or straight up executing them, unless they have a helmet, then knockout or dazed vision at least.

 

I had a machete one time and started attacking this guy on the stairs of a police station(I figured he was some KoS guy, there's no reason to be in Berenzino with full gear other than to kill people) so I slashed him a few times in the back and ran away, then when he started bandaging himself I ran up the stairs and sliced him at least 4 more times, before he could finish bandaging.

 

So at least 6 machete slices, 6 points of bleeding and 6 attacks.

Dude still mutilated me with his M4 and bandaged himself up.

 

 

I'd love slings, especially if you could just put random shit in them, even grenades if they add them. But no way in hell should it be a case of aiming, clicking then you hit the target. You should have to learn how to time it right.

However this would probably lead to huge issues with all the lag in the game.

 

It could still be a very good item when audio is made realistic. Group of guys you want to dodge, get your sling out and throw your flashlight or something so that it smashes on a wall and distracts them.

[Whyherro123 2283]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyO46RQhYkQ yeah thats sword looks like utter crap doesnt it....

 

Slings are as big a sport as archery ??? wow when did they add them to the olympics?? Insanely hard weapon to use hey i give you props for being able to use one i cant and i have tried a few times there is a real art to it good on you for masterying it( or effectively using it) but its one of those weapons that ancient armies that used it they grew up using them they didnt wash up on the shore of a foriegn country as some average joe office worker and pick up a sling and be lethal with them .. Reality you should try it some time.

Again, do some research into the matter, don't just mindlessly spout information you got off a Japanese Sword-skills-testing competition. 

Ever hear about "bias".? Of course the Japanese are going to say their sword can cut through 700 people in a single swing.

Here is a question. Can you take a katana, grab the tip, and bend the blade down to the handle without it snapping somewhere in the middle? I am willing to bet that you can't.

You can do that with the better Scandinavian-type swords, called ULFBEHRT. They could thrust, slash, and hack through mail like nobodies business.

 

But, enough about swords. Let us get back to discussing real weapons.

[soulfirez 901]

Again, do some research into the matter, don't just mindlessly spout information you got off a Japanese Sword-skills-testing competition. 

Ever hear about "bias".? Of course the Japanese are going to say their sword can cut through 700 people in a single swing.

Here is a question. Can you take a katana, grab the tip, and bend the blade down to the handle without it snapping somewhere in the middle? I am willing to bet that you can't.

You can do that with the better Scandinavian-type swords, called ULFBEHRT. They could thrust, slash, and hack through mail like nobodies business.

 

But, enough about swords. Let us get back to discussing real weapons.

Didnt spout crap you said they couldnt cut steal i linked a video that showed they can cut steal . You said slings where as a big a sport as archery and i pointed out there not , not even close the amount of active archers way outwieghs those using slings a simple google of archery clubs followed by one on sling clubs try it and tell me which is bigger and again archery is an olympic sport firing slings is not so basicly your spouting crap from your own bias.

You seem well educated just not very logical with how you apply that knoledge ( a parrot can be taught facts and figures etc but it can use that information in a logical mannerr..

 

But ill leave you to it before you start talking artillery again in a talk about melee weapons.

 

PS real weapons slings there is a reason they didnt dominate battle fields through out the ancient and medieval ages (there cheap yes and can be effective in the right hands i dont see any of those right hands in average joe oh but wait logic aint your strong point is it whyzero...

[Whyherro123 2283]

i would never use a sling because i wouldnt know how to use it, if you handed me a sling and said use it or die, maybe, but other then that the chances of a person actually connecting are almost none.

 

as for a spear i don't know if we're talking about the same thing

 

 

although in the video it SEEMS successful, the spear starts to fall apart on the first hit. to 2 waterbottles.

again id rather just use a hand held knife, its way more dependable and doesn't start falling apart on your first swing. Now a bayonet is different, its attached to a gun, and not duck taped on, its built for the gun so they connect better, and don't fall off each other.

 

For the sling we could probebly take an online poll and ask how many people know how to use a sling. and if you told that guy you linked me to (the guy throwing a ball for his dog) to use it ON someone and KILL them with a rock or something im pretty sure he would be extremely unsuccessful.

That is not a spear, that is a butcher knife DUCT-TAPED to a handle. There is a major difference between a purpose-made weapon and a field-expedient one. 

Take an actual knife-blade, drill a hole in the tang. Insert the tang into a slot in an actual shaft, not a plastic fucking broomhandle, and put a couple of rivets (some screws) through the holes in the tang. Boom, you've got a spear that won't fall apart after the first stab.

ADDITION:

Holy shit, I actually watched the video, and I now know why that spear (hahaha) failed. AGAIN, A SPEAR IS NOT A SLASHING WEAPON. YOU DON'T SPIN IT ABOUT YOUR HEAD TO CUT UP AN ENEMY. YOU TAKE IT IN BOTH HANDS AND DRIVE THE POINT THROUGH THE ENEMY'S TORSO.

Literally, that spear failed due to a whole slew of reasons:

1) Poor design. The spearhead could still have some lateral movement, due to it BEING DUCT-TAPED ON. This lateral movement caused the binding to fail

3) Poor use. I REPEAT, SPEARS ARE NOT FOR SLASHING.

 

I cannot stress that fact enough, and it goes for any weapon, really. If you use it for a purpose it is not intended for, THE WEAPON WILL FAIL. I guarantee that if he tried to use the spear in the fashion it was designed for, TO STAB, it would have been much, much more effective.

 

Also, here is a video of someone using a sling on a watermelon. Granted, a watermelon is very different from a human skull, but imagine what would be damaged if the projectile hit you in the torso, or leg (which would be far easier to hit than the head)? A broken bone for sure, with ruptured organs and internal bleeding at worst. 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT4h9mNEhvs

 

Want to know what weapon the Romans feared most? HINT: It wasn't the bow, it wasn't the sword. They had very specialized tools for removing lead sling shot from inside the body, after it penetrated through their armor.

[Whyherro123 2283]

-snip-

 

That is for damn sure. If I stab you in the upper chest with a knife, you should bleed out/choke to death on your own blood relatively quickly.

[Whyherro123 2283]

Didnt spout crap you said they couldnt cut steal i linked a video that showed they can cut steal . You said slings where as a big a sport as archery and i pointed out there not , not even close the amount of active archers way outwieghs those using slings a simple google of archery clubs followed by one on sling clubs try it and tell me which is bigger and again archery is an olympic sport firing slings is not so basicly your spouting crap from your own bias.

You seem well educated just not very logical with how you apply that knoledge ( a parrot can be taught facts and figures etc but it can use that information in a logical mannerr..

 

But ill leave you to it before you start talking artillery again in a talk about melee weapons.

 

PS real weapons slings there is a reason they didnt dominate battle fields through out the ancient and medieval ages (there cheap yes and can be effective in the right hands i dont see any of those right hands in average joe oh but wait logic aint your strong point is it whyzero...

But....they did. The Romans hired thousands of slingers to serve as auxiliaries in their armies, in order to counteract the thousands of slingers other armies already had!

Want to know some actual information as to why the bow is more prevalent over history? It is a higher class weapon, used by the nobility. The sling was literally a peasant's weapon, being capable of being woven out of string, while a bow took time and money to make (bowstaves, strings, and arrowheads aren't free.)  That, coupled with the fact that bows are easier to use than a sling, led to the sling falling out of favor IN EUROPE...and only in the 1700s, when gunpowder weaponry became more available.

The sling is still in use today by peasants and farmers in the Middle east. They were used to throw grenades over housing blocks into American troop convoys.

 

And, please refrain from the ad-hominem attacks. Last I checked, I haven't insulted you yet.

[Whyherro123 2283]

Didnt spout crap you said they couldnt cut steal i linked a video that showed they can cut steal . You said slings where as a big a sport as archery and i pointed out there not , not even close the amount of active archers way outwieghs those using slings a simple google of archery clubs followed by one on sling clubs try it and tell me which is bigger and again archery is an olympic sport firing slings is not so basicly your spouting crap from your own bias.

You seem well educated just not very logical with how you apply that knoledge ( a parrot can be taught facts and figures etc but it can use that information in a logical mannerr..

 

But ill leave you to it before you start talking artillery again in a talk about melee weapons.

 

PS real weapons slings there is a reason they didnt dominate battle fields through out the ancient and medieval ages (there cheap yes and can be effective in the right hands i dont see any of those right hands in average joe oh but wait logic aint your strong point is it whyzero...

And, protip: I can cut through steel too, with a splitting axe, normally used for chopping firewood. I do it with chains all the time, it isn't that difficult. The steel used in the video you linked probably was a very mild steel, low in carbon, which would make it "softer". If that was a high-carbon steel pipe, the edge would have broken/chipped/otherwise been damaged, something I am sure those swordsmen (ha), would've done anything to avoid.

[over9000nukez 199]

That is not a spear, that is a butcher knife DUCT-TAPED to a handle. There is a major difference between a purpose-made weapon and a field-expedient one. 

Take an actual knife-blade, drill a hole in the tang. Insert the tang into a slot in an actual shaft, not a plastic fucking broomhandle, and put a couple of rivets (some screws) through the holes in the tang. Boom, you've got a spear that won't fall apart after the first stab.

ADDITION:

Holy shit, I actually watched the video, and I now know why that spear (hahaha) failed. AGAIN, A SPEAR IS NOT A SLASHING WEAPON. YOU DON'T SPIN IT ABOUT YOUR HEAD TO CUT UP AN ENEMY. YOU TAKE IT IN BOTH HANDS AND DRIVE THE POINT THROUGH THE ENEMY'S TORSO.

Literally, that spear failed due to a whole slew of reasons:

1) Poor design. The spearhead could still have some lateral movement, due to it BEING DUCT-TAPED ON. This lateral movement caused the binding to fail

3) Poor use. I REPEAT, SPEARS ARE NOT FOR SLASHING.

 

I cannot stress that fact enough, and it goes for any weapon, really. If you use it for a purpose it is not intended for, THE WEAPON WILL FAIL. I guarantee that if he tried to use the spear in the fashion it was designed for, TO STAB, it would have been much, much more effective.

 

Also, here is a video of someone using a sling on a watermelon. Granted, a watermelon is very different from a human skull, but imagine what would be damaged if the projectile hit you in the torso, or leg (which would be far easier to hit than the head)? A broken bone for sure, with ruptured organs and internal bleeding at worst. 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT4h9mNEhvs

 

Want to know what weapon the Romans feared most? HINT: It wasn't the bow, it wasn't the sword. They had very specialized tools for removing lead sling shot from inside the body, after it penetrated through their armor.

well if you think that a spear should be made like that i guess that makes more sense, i was thinking you wanted duck taped weapons. i dont know though, getting those materials would just be a waste of time when you could grab an axe thats already made, but if you had a lot of time, and the spear did a good output of damage when you spent a while making it, id like it

[Ludz 17]

You know that wont happen though.

 

All the PVPers will be pissed.

 

They will be angry cause there are no SCar hs because the dev team is too busy making spears.

How can you tell that ? i love modding games (i.e M&B before i leave) and there will be support once game release (road map said). And i know i m not the only one. Never say never :)

 

Edit : oh and i forgot what matters.

 

My 2 cts :

 

Weapons that can be easily upgradable will be cool. for exemple wraaping barbed wire on the baseball stick making it more offensive and can cause bleeding.

 

I hope we'll have at least katanas. and ince Arma III has dismemberment, we may see it on Dayz; i hope

 

B)

Edited May 7, 2014 by Ludz

[soulfirez 901]

But....they did. The Romans hired thousands of slingers to serve as auxiliaries in their armies, in order to counteract the thousands of slingers other armies already had!

Want to know some actual information as to why the bow is more prevalent over history? It is a higher class weapon, used by the nobility. The sling was literally a peasant's weapon, being capable of being woven out of string, while a bow took time and money to make (bowstaves, strings, and arrowheads aren't free.)  That, coupled with the fact that bows are easier to use than a sling, led to the sling falling out of favor IN EUROPE...and only in the 1700s, when gunpowder weaponry became more available.

The sling is still in use today by peasants and farmers in the Middle east. They were used to throw grenades over housing blocks into American troop convoys.

 

And, please refrain from the ad-hominem attacks. Last I checked, I haven't insulted you yet.

By the time of marion reforms the sling was almost never used in roman armies. As you say it is a peasant weapon and can be well used by people who have trained/practiced with it over long periods( sheep herders and such) but its not something you cant easily train men with as you can with a bow( yeah a bow aint easy to use but for mass fire in one direction it is not so with slings.

 

If you got 20 guys from these forums and gave them bows and told them to fire at a group of targets 50 m away they may not hit them ( some probably would) but they would atleast all be firing in the right direction. Do the same thing with slings and they would shoot all over the place.

 

Add to that a sling has a fairly straight trajectory that doesnt allow for firing over(if you do fire up and over it severly limits the potential damage caused by the weapon becoming more of a harrasing tool which some would say arrows where to but to a much higher degree) a wall of men presenting shields to protect the archers from guys using slings and the tactic then falls on its ass which is why it didnt become the range weapon of choice of profesional armies through these centuries. It was effective in early antiquity but its use slowly died out as tactics quickly negated its use in long standing profesional armies it was still used and i dont doubt people still use it today easy to make ammo almost endless...

 

Bows a noble weapon wow primitive cultures have been using them for centuries your american right?? Did native indians not use Bows I am not sure they have a nobility class in the culture....The natives of new guinea many of who still live as they did thousands of years ago main range weapons throwing spears blow darts and BOWS strange there is no nobility class in there culture either.

 

As for the steel in that vid yeah it did look pretty mild but steel( I believe they use Australian steel to make there swords these days our steel is actually quite good hell even the americans where importing alot of it..) none the less your claim was it couldnt cut steel it can ,when did i say you couldnt cut steel with an axe or another type of sword ?? I didnt its just yourr usual style of deflecting and do mental gymnastics to keep going when you have been shown to be wrong.

 

Insult you hmm when you stop talking like a self inflated git ( even when you have shown to be wrong) ill stop pointing out ya flaws till then carry on whyzero...

Edited May 8, 2014 by SoulFirez

[Dziara 0]

Craftable improvised granades (made from spray cans etc.). All sort of craftable weapons like in Dead Island.

[Whyherro123 2283]

By the time of marion reforms the sling was almost never used in roman armies. As you say it is a peasant weapon and can be well used by people who have trained/practiced with it over long periods( sheep herders and such) but its not something you cant easily train men with as you can with a bow( yeah a bow aint easy to use but for mass fire in one direction it is not so with slings.

 

If you got 20 guys from these forums and gave them bows and told them to fire at a group of targets 50 m away they may not hit them ( some probably would) but they would atleast all be firing in the right direction. Do the same thing with slings and they would shoot all over the place.

 

Add to that a sling has a fairly straight trajectory that doesnt allow for firing over(if you do fire up and over it severly limits the potential damage caused by the weapon becoming more of a harrasing tool which some would say arrows where to but to a much higher degree) a wall of men presenting shields to protect the archers from guys using slings and the tactic then falls on its ass which is why it didnt become the range weapon of choice of profesional armies through these centuries. It was effective in early antiquity but its use slowly died out as tactics quickly negated its use in long standing profesional armies it was still used and i dont doubt people still use it today easy to make ammo almost endless...

 

Bows a noble weapon wow primitive cultures have been using them for centuries your american right?? Did native indians not use Bows I am not sure they have a nobility class in the culture....The natives of new guinea many of who still live as they did thousands of years ago main range weapons throwing spears blow darts and BOWS strange there is no nobility class in there culture either.

 

As for the steel in that vid yeah it did look pretty mild but steel( I believe they use Australian steel to make there swords these days our steel is actually quite good hell even the americans where importing alot of it..) none the less your claim was it couldnt cut steel it can ,when did i say you couldnt cut steel with an axe or another type of sword ?? I didnt its just yourr usual style of deflecting and do mental gymnastics to keep going when you have been shown to be wrong.

 

Insult you hmm when you stop talking like a self inflated git ( even when you have shown to be wrong) ill stop pointing out ya flaws till then carry on whyzero...

Damn near almost every culture has/had a warrior class at one point, even if it was a hunting society. The bow and the spear are present in the arsenal of almost every one of those warrior cultures. 

And, yes, the Native Americans (they tend to really resent the term "Indian", so I would avoid it in the future) had a warrior class, and often different warrior societies based upon the usage of different weapons, and different weapons would be restricted to different societies, with more weapons "unlocked" as one rose up in rank. The bow, the sling, the spear and the warclub were usually in their roster.

 

The point of me bringing up cutting steel with an axe is to point out that what they are doing is not all that exceptional. Literally every sword designed for combat can cut through mild steel. Not surprising, considering that, from a certain angle of perspective,  that is what they were designed to do. Pointing out that a katana can cut through steel pipe pretty much elicits a "So? Everything can do that, some swords even better!" reaction from the sword community, from what I've seen ( I am not a member, I obviously prefer the more common, effective weapons that were spears and axes)

Another point for the sling, this one a little more modern. Want to know what weapons the Spanish Conquistadores were most concerned about during their expeditions into Central America? It wasn't the maquahuitl, that is so commonly talked about. It was the sling, which was capable of leaving dents (fatal concussions, mind you), that struck with the force of musket fire.

So, yes, slings are difficult to use. However, I believe that they are a worthwhile addition to the Day Z arsenal, due to the fact that they are:

 

1) effective

2) logistically efficient

3) easy to make

4) DIFFERENT. Literally every game that markets itself as "survival" has a goddamn bow in it. Self-bow, crossbow, it makes no matter. Variety is the spice of life, let us live a little!

 

Oh, and reported, by the way. I asked you nicely to stop, and you effectively laughed and carried on. I don't know what form of repercussions being a cockhole has, if any, but enjoy them. You've earned them.

[Whyherro123 2283]

 

 

 

I'd love slings, especially if you could just put random shit in them, even grenades if they add them. But no way in hell should it be a case of aiming, clicking then you hit the target. You should have to learn how to time it right.

However this would probably lead to huge issues with all the lag in the game.

The timing part is actually pretty simple, so long as you don't spin it too fast. Experts on the forum I referenced earlier recommend that you actually sling it rather lazily, as it is the centripetal force conferred to the rock that makes it so deadly, not the speed at which it spins.

The main difficulties I have with using a sling are:

1) estimating trajectory. Once the sling is released, the projectile will fly off tangentially to the point of release. Estimating this arc is difficult, because you have no real "aiming point" like you do on bows, where you can aim down the shaft.

2) Aerodynamics of the projectile. Rough rocks fly anywhere and everywhere, smooth rocks are semi-accurate, and lead shot I can put through separate windowpanes from 50 paces. This is due partially to the trajectory mentioned above (lead shot is all the same weight, so it will follow the same flight path, dependent upon point of release) and aerodynamics (rough rocks have induced drag (air resistance) that seriously affects accuracy, round rocks have less, and glandular lead shot has the least, plus lead shot isn't nearly as affected by wind, due to it being of higher weight and density than most rocks)

 

I seriously recommend picking up slinging as a hobby. It is fun, dirt-cheap (free rocks, and lead is given away by tire places in the form of wheel weights), a workout (yes) and, most importantly, FUN. There is nothing like making sonic booms with nothing more than a bit of woven cord and your own muscle power.

Plus, there is the fact that it is pretty much unregulated, at least in the US. You can't get arrested for making, owning, and using a sling, like you can with bows and firearms. Using them within city limits, yes, but don't be that thick and you will be essentially left alone.