Babies! (Well, society)

[DeliciousCookies 0]

I think this wouldn't be taken seriously ingame and it would ruin some of the atmosphere for players. In over 99% of the time in reality your offspring would die in the conditions of Chernarussia, with zero chance of ever growing up.

The thing is, everything really is hopeless in the atmosphere of DayZ (and we like it), you're all about survival, the last bit of human instinct you have left.

People murder each other for a can of beans. You can't form a place to settle because zombies are always around. Not even in the woods, the bandits will find you at some point and kill you and your delicious babies.

[7-75 callaghan 43]

I think this wouldn't be taken seriously ingame and it would ruin some of the atmosphere for players. In over 99% of the time in reality your offspring would die in the conditions of Chernarussia' date=' with zero chance of ever growing up.

The thing is, everything really is hopeless in the atmosphere of DayZ (and we like it), you're all about survival, the last bit of human instinct you have left.

People murder each other for a can of beans. You can't form a place to settle because zombies are always around. Not even in the woods, the bandits will find you at some point and kill you and your delicious babies.

[/quote']

Fine, but that isn't the point, people will always try. That is why humanity is still around seemingly against all odds. If people were actually more concerned about 'stealing beans' than having babies, then you and I would not be alive to have this discussion.

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Well I have been alive for over 2 weeks now' date=' my previous character even longer. All games involve time compression, no one with an actual life is going to dedicate enough time to it to actually run through the entire process of having a baby.

One way or another, something like this will eventually have to be added to deepen the game, and direct it away from the PvP, because there are 1000000s of titles out there that offer that.

[/quote']

There's other ways of discouraging PVP and expanding the scope of the game away from a deathmatch.

Reproduction is a controversial feature and isn't included in other games, and won't be in this one either.

p.s. - it has nothing to do with homophobia.

How is reproduction controversial? The depiction of sex may be, but reproduction isn't. I assume the controversy complaints come from US citizens, because the rest of the world can deal with it.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

I don't see the point of this whole reproduction thing, I mean why would people want to have babies? The incentives you mentioned are unrealistic, and the whole thing would feel really forced and unnecessary imo

[7-75 callaghan 43]

I don't see the point of this whole reproduction thing' date=' I mean why would people want to have babies? The incentives you mentioned are unrealistic, and the whole thing would feel really forced and unnecessary imo

[/quote']

Are you seriously asking me that question? I'll try to answer you patiently. And i'll assume you are very young, because most adults wouldn't even ask this question. And I don't mean to sound rude, but this seems obvious to me.

1. Because alongside our survival instinct, it is the single most powerful drive a human being has.

2. Because it is central to the notion of 'hope' - that life may go on, and one day be enjoyable once more. That our genes will be passed on and humanity won't be wiped from the face of the earth.

3. Because it increases the chance of group survival in the long run, adding more members with different talents to a group.( You can either spend four years doing a Human Genetics degree or just take my word for it).

4. Those are ideas, substantiated by scientific fact. But this might make it easier for you to comprehend - 3rd world nations, where honestly the conditions are far worse than sunny Chernarus, families are driven to have babies at a higher rate than normal. This is not a cultural thing, it is basic instinctual drive.

5. Selfishness and basic psychology - we see our children as extensions of ourselves, they immortalise us both poetically and genetically.

6. Caring for another person, either a child or partner, is a welcome distraction IRL in situations of high stress and trauma. Whether you want to get all Freudian about it, and refer to sublimation and so on, is a separate issue, but anyone who has been around a while will know someone who does this.

7. Sex is fun, it is enjoyable to insert your penis into a soft, moist, fleshy orifice and pump away until you no longer desire to do so. This is especially true in situations of high stress and mental trauma, it is therapeutic. So that, once again, goes against your anti-realism claim.

8. Unrealistic? What is possibly more realistic than reproduction, speak for yourself there, but not us. That was a joke by the way, but there is another factual truth within it.

9. The male - female reproductive pair is the basic unit of society. Once this is established in any scenario, larger groups may form based around this basic unit. This is how societies form on their most basic level. It would greatly encourage grouping and teamwork. It would lessen 'pointless PvP', and when PvP does happen, it would be far more exciting, with larger groups defending themselves as tribes. Again, more realism.

10. Why would it be 'forced'? It exists in real life, and is a real pressure. And some, like you, feel 'forced' to have children. At the end of the day, it is always up to them. You can make it your objective to be a baby killing bandit if you like.

11. It would add a great deal of gameplay depth, just as it adds depth to real life. Especially 'endgame' variety, it would add a particularly difficult challenge for experienced players, with perhaps (but not necessarily) a small bonus at the end of it.

12. I didn't mention the idea of actual babies/children in the game, but some seem to like that idea. Imagine how much more exciting it would be trying to keep a child NPC alive through that harsh landscape. I daresay some would get quite attached, and it would add to the tension and emotionality that is central to the success of this mod.

I could go on, but this is a reply to what I think is an obvious question, and not a thesis proposal.

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The real problem with it is metagaming it to the point where "clans"' date=' etc. simply keep enough female players in their ranks to retain that reward as a sort of buff. I'm not sure how to make a "reward" workable without unbalancing the rest of the game.

[/quote']

This is neither a metagame nor a problem, it is central to the concept of group survival. The whole point of being in a group is to have those perks that make the group worth more than the sum of it's parts.

Honestly, you would not need a real reward, or nothing beyond a new skin at least, because intrigue alone would be enough to start people on that road, and once experiencing the complex gameplay dynamics that it adds, I do think they would be hooked.

Maybe a non-material reward, other than skins - something psychology based. You can name your child, and when you die, if the child survives, you continue play as that survivor, with the loot that you had given him to carry. Just another suggestion within the overall idea.

[DeliciousCookies 0]

Fine' date=' but that isn't the point, people will always try. That is why humanity is still around seemingly against all odds. If people were actually more concerned about 'stealing beans' than having babies, then you and I would not be alive to have this discussion.

[/quote']

I don't think you understand how the human kind has survived or spread around the world but here's what matters about it.

Life does not usually succeed against odds and certainly against time "life" would ultimately perish, that's why there are extinct species in existance, and the atmosphere in DayZ is like our reason of becoming extinct, a disease.

Females would be less likely to survive because of the complications involved with pregnancy, hence even making it less likely that offspring survives and only decreases alive player count.

But the other point here to address what you said is that human sexual behavior is much different under the intense stress and fear we might imagine our characters would have. Libido would be nearly non-existant and there would be no sexual interaction out of lust/desire just because of that. The only point why to reproduce is our deducing of our end days, but I see this ultimately pointless and a useless feature because the mechanics would need to be too unrealistic to make it even remotely possible.

I understand why you'd want this, DayZ is like a tragedy story about humanity, and you want to put a happy ending to it, give hope and meaning to players but that's naive in my opinion and does not attract as much interest.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

This guy says what i'm thinking, so I'll just leave this here

This idea is ridiculous as are the comments even considering this as a possibility...

Human sexual behavior would be radically different in a post-apocalyptic' date=' zombified, hostile humans filled environment... People would have virtually no libido during that time of high stress, until they'd find a safe settlement and learn to cope with their shitty feelings about the world.

People would definitely not start to reproduce out of sexual desire since it's near a 100% death rate for their offspring, not to mention the harm caused to the female, which would make their gene-replication even less likely!

TL;DR: Learn behavioral biology, and come up with something that makes sense...

I think this is a joke anyway. xD

[/quote']

Anyway, it would be impossible to fit something like this into the game without it being made incredibly unrealistic, and like I said that would make it feel really forced and unnecessary

I suspect you're either trolling or just autistic

[7-75 callaghan 43]

Fine' date=' but that isn't the point, people will always try. That is why humanity is still around seemingly against all odds. If people were actually more concerned about 'stealing beans' than having babies, then you and I would not be alive to have this discussion.

[/quote']

I don't think you understand how the human kind has survived or spread around the world but here's what matters about it.

Life does not usually succeed against odds and certainly against time "life" would ultimately perish, that's why there are extinct species in existance, and the atmosphere in DayZ is like our reason of becoming extinct, a disease.

Females would be less likely to survive because of the complications involved with pregnancy, hence even making it less likely that offspring survives and only decreases alive player count.

But the other point here to address what you said is that human sexual behavior is much different under the intense stress and fear we might imagine our characters would have. Libido would be nearly non-existant and there would be no sexual interaction out of lust/desire just because of that. The only point why to reproduce is our deducing of our end days, but I see this ultimately pointless and a useless feature because the mechanics would need to be too unrealistic to make it even remotely possible.

I understand why you'd want this, DayZ is like a tragedy story about humanity, and you want to put a happy ending to it, give hope and meaning to players but that's naive in my opinion and does not attract as much interest.

That is quite an assumption on your part, and I have studied human genetics for years, so you may begin eating your hat. Read my detailed post giving reasons. In such situations, birth rate increases massively regardless of the increased risks. Anyway, I think I covered it in enough detail. I am certainly not offering a 'happy ending', but another challenge. Hope drives us all, even if we know that probability suggests that the child will die a premature death. I daresay the naive one is you sir.

In particular the comments on libido, the notion that 'extinct species are in existence' and a number of other things. How old are you anyway? Not trying to play the age card, but intellectual + emotional maturity, besides an understanding of genetics and anthropology is pretty fundamental to grasping what I am saying.

[Gaidoon 19]

This guy says what i'm thinking' date=' so I'll just leave this here

This idea is ridiculous as are the comments even considering this as a possibility...

Human sexual behavior would be radically different in a post-apocalyptic, zombified, hostile humans filled environment... People would have virtually no libido during that time of high stress, until they'd find a safe settlement and learn to cope with their shitty feelings about the world.

People would definitely not start to reproduce out of sexual desire since it's near a 100% death rate for their offspring, not to mention the harm caused to the female, which would make their gene-replication even less likely!

TL;DR: Learn behavioral biology, and come up with something that makes sense...

I think this is a joke anyway. xD

Anyway, it would be impossible to fit something like this into the game without it being made incredibly unrealistic, and like I said that would make it feel really forced and unnecessary

I suspect you're either trolling or just autistic

Lol i Think your trolling actually this is a good thread and you can put just about anything you want in a game with the Dev Files Not everyone is embarrassed about Sex like you This game is for adults after all.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

You're missing the point anyway, even if it was realistic it would be IMPOSSIBLE to fit this mechanic into a game that covers such a short timespan

[Gaidoon 19]

You're missing the point anyway' date=' even if it was realistic it would be IMPOSSIBLE to fit this mechanic into a game that covers such a short timespan

[/quote']

DayZ is getting Ported to Arma 3 They can fit the feature in since the game is still in development.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

Lol i Think your trolling actually this is a good thread and you can put just about anything you want in a game with the Dev Files Not everyone is embarrassed about Sex like you This game is for adults after all.

Uh, I've no problem with the portrayal of sex. What I have a problem with is how unrealistic, forced, and unnecessary this would be

[Gaidoon 19]

Lol i Think your trolling actually this is a good thread and you can put just about anything you want in a game with the Dev Files Not everyone is embarrassed about Sex like you This game is for adults after all.

Uh' date=' I've no problem with the portrayal of sex. What I have a problem with is how unrealistic, forced, and unnecessary this would be

[/quote']

You don't have to have Sex with anyone it's not a forced feature even if it was added and the goal of DayZ is to make it as realistic as possible so it's fitting the Devs goals at the moment.

[7-75 callaghan 43]

This guy says what i'm thinking' date=' so I'll just leave this here

This idea is ridiculous as are the comments even considering this as a possibility...

Human sexual behavior would be radically different in a post-apocalyptic, zombified, hostile humans filled environment... People would have virtually no libido during that time of high stress, until they'd find a safe settlement and learn to cope with their shitty feelings about the world.

People would definitely not start to reproduce out of sexual desire since it's near a 100% death rate for their offspring, not to mention the harm caused to the female, which would make their gene-replication even less likely!

TL;DR: Learn behavioral biology, and come up with something that makes sense...

I think this is a joke anyway. xD

Anyway, it would be impossible to fit something like this into the game without it being made incredibly unrealistic, and like I said that would make it feel really forced and unnecessary

I suspect you're either trolling or just autistic

Robbl, I see that you are 18, that tells me a lot, without meaning to sound mean, but you are too young to comment on the realism, and details of these matters. I assume 'DeliciousCookie' is of a similar age. Mr Cookie, you mention behavioural biology, yet haven't mentioned your background? I have a degree in human genetics, and I don't like misusing it like that, but I feel I need to make it clear that I know very well what I am talking about. I actually have a multi-disciplinary background, including anthropology, and am very well versed in the spread of civilisations and in particular encounters between different cultures and tribes.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

You don't have to have Sex with anyone it's not a forced feature even if it was added and the goal of DayZ is to make it as realistic as possible so it's fitting the Devs goals at the moment.

Well why don't you suggest every bloody bodily function while you're at it then?

[Gaidoon 19]

This guy says what i'm thinking' date=' so I'll just leave this here

This idea is ridiculous as are the comments even considering this as a possibility...

Human sexual behavior would be radically different in a post-apocalyptic, zombified, hostile humans filled environment... People would have virtually no libido during that time of high stress, until they'd find a safe settlement and learn to cope with their shitty feelings about the world.

People would definitely not start to reproduce out of sexual desire since it's near a 100% death rate for their offspring, not to mention the harm caused to the female, which would make their gene-replication even less likely!

TL;DR: Learn behavioral biology, and come up with something that makes sense...

I think this is a joke anyway. xD

Anyway, it would be impossible to fit something like this into the game without it being made incredibly unrealistic, and like I said that would make it feel really forced and unnecessary

I suspect you're either trolling or just autistic

Robbl, I see that you are 18, that tells me a lot, without meaning to sound mean, but you are too young to comment on the realism, and details of these matters. I assume 'DeliciousCookie' is of a similar age. Mr Cookie, you mention behavioural biology, yet haven't mentioned your background? I have a degree in human genetics, and I don't like misusing it like that, but I feel I need to make it clear that I know very well what I am talking about. I actually have a multi-disciplinary background, including anthropology, and am very well versed in the spread of civilisations and in particular encounters between different cultures and tribes.

When you have a man and woman with no hope left such as a zombie Apocalypse they may feel a need for human contact and engage intimately You know like I'm a virgin your a virgin were about to die so what's to lose situation? You could add a blackout screen. Anyway If the Mod is going for realism this needs to be added if not add in Zombie Mutations and All that shit from L4 dead.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

I am seriously lost for words here

[7-75 callaghan 43]

You don't have to have Sex with anyone it's not a forced feature even if it was added and the goal of DayZ is to make it as realistic as possible so it's fitting the Devs goals at the moment.

Well why don't you suggest every bloody bodily function while you're at it then?

Now you are just getting angry without saying anything insightful or constructive in the way of criticism. Urination and defecation would not add gameplay depth. Unless of course it were used in combination with my suggested 'scent' mechanic' date=' in which case I would love to see it included. But either way, please stay on topic, do not troll, or I will have to ask a moderator to get involved. It took long enough to get this topic back on track after it came under the attack of barely comprehensible and mindless Christian fundamentalists.

Allow me to reassert this point, in case you didn't take the time to read my detailed response to you, which seems increasingly likely -

4. But this might make it easier for you to comprehend - 3rd world nations, where in some honestly the conditions are far worse than sunny Chernarus, families are driven to have babies at a higher rate than normal. This is not a cultural thing, it is basic instinctual drive.

[hr']

I am seriously lost for words here

Good, if you have nothing intelligent to say, then better not to speak at all.

[RobbL (DayZ) 26]

Maybe I could see just sex working to an extent, I mean it's in GTA (although it's only there mainly for novelty reasons)

But if you think full-blown reproduction is a good idea for this game I suggest you go outside and socialise with real people for a bit

[Gaidoon 19]

You don't have to have Sex with anyone it's not a forced feature even if it was added and the goal of DayZ is to make it as realistic as possible so it's fitting the Devs goals at the moment.

Well why don't you suggest every bloody bodily function while you're at it then?

Now you are just getting angry without saying anything insightful or constructive in the way of criticism. Urination and defecation would not add gameplay depth. Unless of course it were used in combination with my suggested 'scent' mechanic' date=' in which case I would love to see it included. But either way, please stay on topic, do not troll, or I will have to ask a moderator to get involved. It took long enough to get this topic back on track after it came under the attack of barely comprehensible and mindless Christian fundamentalists.

Allow me to reassert this point, in case you didn't take the time to read my detailed response to you, which seems increasingly likely -

4. But this might make it easier for you to comprehend - 3rd world nations, where honestly the conditions are far worse than sunny Chernarus, families are driven to have babies at a higher rate than normal. This is not a cultural thing, it is basic instinctual drive.

[hr']

I am seriously lost for words here

Good' date=' if you have nothing intelligent to say, then better not to speak at all.

[/quote']

Dude i need to add you on Skype your one of the few smart people i know on these Forums Plus those weren't Real Christians they were just trolling. back on topic though I wouldn't mind a scent function it could help imagine smelling like shit so you need to find a nearby stream to wash off from your baby making before the zoms find you.

[DeliciousCookies 0]

I don't need a resume to challenge your idea, I still think you're wrong about it.

I suspect you generalize the situation in Chernarussia way too easily and confuse events taking place in the real world .vs DayZ and not see that the conditions are vastly different in this apocalyptic atmosphere.

Everyone you encounter is practically a stranger and you won't know them for long, There is no life-time for pairs to really bond (Yet this still happens, during certain periods), no safe haven for groups to settle in for too long, resources are scarce and too often you die looking for supplies.

The place is disease ridden, and people deal with high levels of stress and fear on a daily basis.

Sure, people still do it. But they all die eventually and even faster in this world if they do it.

But no, no person who has thought about and decided to be a realist would do it as there are no survivors in the end in DayZ.

There still is hope to it and that's why you think this should be included? I think that is a vague idea and not really what most would be interested in.

But I think you used your assumptions about my personal life in attempt to make your idea seem less vulnerable, I might be wrong about this of course.

We're probably on the same page when it comes to biology anyway if you do hold a degree in genetics and anthropology, you just don't meet me at an agreement on this game subject.

I've said what I've wanted to say now, there's just no point going further for my part.

[mbbird 0]

Does this suggestion include edible babies?

[Gaidoon 19]

I don't need a resume to challenge your idea' date=' I still think you're wrong about it.

I suspect you generalize the situation in Chernarussia way too easily and confuse events taking place in the real world .vs DayZ and not see that the conditions are vastly different in this apocalyptic atmosphere.

Everyone you encounter is practically a stranger and you won't know them for long, There is no life-time for pairs to really bond (Yet this still happens, during certain periods), no safe haven for groups to settle in for too long, resources are scarce and too often you die looking for supplies.

The place is disease ridden, and people deal with high levels of stress and fear on a daily basis.

Sure, people still do it. But they all die eventually and even faster in this world if they do it.

But no, no person who has thought about and decided to be a realist would do it as there are no survivors in the end in DayZ.

There still is hope to it and that's why you think this should be included? I think that is a vague idea and not really what most would be interested in.

But I think you used your assumptions about my personal life in attempt to make your idea seem less vulnerable, I might be wrong about this of course.

We're probably on the same page when it comes to biology anyway if you do hold a degree in genetics and anthropology, you just don't meet me at an agreement on this game subject.

I've said what I've wanted to say now, there's just no point going further for my part.

[/quote']

Your confusing your personal opinion with the fact Reproduction is the most basic survival instinct.

[DeliciousCookies 0]

Your confusing your personal opinion with the fact Reproduction is the most basic survival instinct.

No, I'm not.

It's just a bit more complicated than you'd think, reproduction is the result of environmental conditions and all sorts of weirdoe gene-influenced behavior and the act of sex itself. People don't consciously feel a sense of "survival", it's just our genes, our "selfish" genes that make blueprints of structure/behavior in order to replicate.

For example, a human might abandon his/her child because it looks weird or ugly, in a sense that is a mechanism for our genes to show preference for more healthy gene vehicle. The environment plays a big part in our sexual desires aswell, our libido is lower when we are stressed and so on.

Having sex at the wrong time might result in worse overall gene reproducing, so it's not all about having sex all the time, since resources are scarce and others are better candidates for mates than some others.

It is a common misconception that "reproduction is the most basic sense of survival", that is not simply the case, only in genetics it would apply more in the words of "Reproduction is the primary function of our genes"

And from that genome everything you do is to make your genes reproduce, and it's most definitely not always to procreate with another human being.

Ever wonder why people want to be with a good looking gal rather than ugly? Because they look and probably are more healthy, that's all it is all about, to signal another gene vehicle of our "great" genes and health.

ps. And by survival I meant the way you put it, we would want to look after ourselves during hard times and procreating is not the first thing to happen.

[Orphen (DayZ) 14]

What the OP is suggesting is basically a reward for working co-operatively (Something most friendly people have been asking for in DayZ).

The way he proposed his idea however was pretty silly considering the setting of DayZ.

Read inbetween the lines and don't jump on the hate wagon, guys.

[7-75 callaghan 43]

Your confusing your personal opinion with the fact Reproduction is the most basic survival instinct.

No' date=' I'm not.

It's just a bit more complicated than you'd think, reproduction is the result of environmental conditions and all sorts of weirdoe gene-influenced behavior and the act of sex itself. People don't consciously feel a sense of "survival", it's just our genes, our "selfish" genes that make blueprints of structure/behavior in order to replicate.

For example, a human might abandon his/her child because it looks weird or ugly, in a sense that is a mechanism for our genes to show preference for more healthy gene vehicle. The environment plays a big part in our sexual desires aswell, our libido is lower when we are stressed and so on.

Having sex at the wrong time might result in worse overall gene reproducing, so it's not all about having sex all the time, since resources are scarce and others are better candidates for mates than some others.

It is a common misconception that "reproduction is the most basic sense of survival", that is not simply the case, only in genetics it would apply more in the words of "Reproduction is the primary function of our genes"

And from that genome everything you do is to make your genes reproduce, and it's most definitely not always to procreate with another human being.

Ever wonder why people want to be with a good looking gal rather than ugly? Because they look and probably are more healthy, that's all it is all about, to signal another gene vehicle of our "great" genes and health.

ps. And by survival I meant the way you put it, we would want to look after ourselves during hard times and procreating is not the first thing to happen.

[/quote']

Without going into the specifics of those individual theories, that I agree and disagree with to varying extents, and which you have simplified into some kind of genetics monolith which I assure you isn't an undisputed group of ideas among geneticists, I just want to make it clear that for me at least, my libido increases in times of stress. Perhaps not a normal reaction, but I find sex a great way to de-stress. Of course, I am not normally at risk of being found by a Zed in such scenarios. But people are not as similar as you seem to portray them, and there is such a thing as 'danger-sex'. In fact, sexual behaviour is one of the most varied human behaviours I can think of, and one of the few things that makes some of you people interesting at all.

Jk jk, but the point, as usual, stands.