Why is hardcore so underpopulated?

[cels 43]

So just curious.. Is most if not all the negativity towards 3rd person pretty much because how it can be abused?

Edited February 28, 2014 by cels

[oregonized 673]

So just curious.. Is most if not all the negativity towards 3rd person pretty much because how it can be abused?

Pretty much.  Also, it isn't as immersive as first person view.

[Hoodoo7 14]

I used to always play 'regular' because I wanted to have the broadest view possible and used to hate HC. Then i watched a live view on twitch and realised just how BS it was when I realised how many people manipulate the various glitches to gain a unfair advantage.

I mean what retard makes a twitch stream where they are embedded in a wall of a building and is able to see through 3 floors? Wow great gaming!

Since then I switched to HC. It's a level playing field. I love that it's so much more unnerving to have a narrower FOV compared to Regular.

It took a few deaths and some practice but you soon learn. Anyone who wants to learn I highly recommend watching Twitch streams of Sacriel, Ngotie & Break. They are on every night and just by watching I learnt some good loot routes and game styles that helped me out when I switched to hardcore.

[louist 163]

Agreeing has zero effect on the matter even has no relation to something being harder ... Dont believe me have a running race with a friend, do 4km its even in relation to what each have to do yes then try the same over 40 km its still even again in relation to what you have to do but wow is it harder..

Now with your question which is harder view to take out a camper you will need to be far more specific as it matters to where he/she is camping the equipment used etc...

Now again land a helicopter in 1pp and in 3pp and tell me which is harder and it doesnt matter on any variations at all..

When your wrong grown ups can admit it but far to many grown physically people just havent developed maturity to admit when there wrong .. I have had to admit i am wrong on these forums a few times try it you may grow a little ;)

I'll admit that I don't have to stoop to personal attacks, if that helps.

We are, in fact, disagreeing. We're disagreeing, as far as i can tell, on the what constitutes difficulty, or, perhaps, how to compute it.

Your argument ignores the competitive aspect of the game, which fundamentally changes your definition of difficulty.

Is a limited view going to make the game more difficult on a limited scale? Sure. But on a macro scale where you take into account other players? No, it doesn't, and here's why:

The 1PP's limited field of view and lack of peripheral vision means you aren't as aware of your situation at any given time. It is harder to spot an enemy, harder to track their movements, and harder to avoid being flanked by his friends, making it easier for him to beat you.

But expand your viewpoint to include your opponent, and what do you find? His limited view makes it harder to spot you, harder to track your movements, harder to avoid being flanked by your friends, making it easier for you to beat him.

So what is the net change? Nothing. He has no advantage over you, and is at no disadvantage against you. If you and he are equally skilled and equipped, and the terrain doesn't favor one of you over the other, you won't have a harder time to beating him.

I don't see anything here you can disagree with, yet you do.

[louist 163]

Pretty much. Also, it isn't as immersive as first person view.

I find the opposite to be true. I lose myself in third person much more readily than in first.

[ChiefMasterKush 321]

So just curious.. Is most if not all the negativity towards 3rd person pretty much because how it can be abused?

I think so, I don't personally have a problem with 3pp.  Because everyone can do it but the game is so damn buggy right now its ridiculous.  I just prefer 1pp only servers.

 

I find the opposite to be true. I lose myself in third person much more readily than in first.

Huh?

[oregonized 673]

I find the opposite to be true. I lose myself in third person much more readily than in first.

Maybe stop using free look constantly and staring at your character.  

[chodeofwar 145]

So just curious.. Is most if not all the negativity towards 3rd person pretty much because how it is used?

 

Fixed this for you.

 

No. It promotes an unrealistic style of gameplay.

[cels 43]

So just curious.. Is most if not all the negativity towards 3rd person pretty much because how it can be abused?

 

Pretty much.  Also, it isn't as immersive as first person view.

 

Theres a mod(2017) that made it so 3rd person cant be abused(or used) like this... Pretty much it wont let you see people or zombies unless your character would be able to see it in 1st person.

 

Im hoping this comes to standalone cause i enjoy normal servers for all aspects besides the ability to peak over walls and such.

 

http://youtu.be/g0fWg1UkGP8?t=14m7s

 

If a mod can pull this off I hope they can as well in SA.

Edited February 28, 2014 by cels

[Dagwood 680]

No retort to my post, Louist? Still trying to defend your cheapened style with the "well at least we're all using the same cowardly tactics so it's fair!"?

Would you use the same argument if we all had access to x ray vision and teleporting hacks?

While we would all be on a level playing field, the game would still be the worse for it. So while I can't deny your logic, I can say with confidence that the game and the gameplay it provides is cheapened by all of the negative side effects that come with the inclusion of 3rd person.

[PhillyT 554]

Fixed this for you.

 

No. It promotes an unrealistic style of gameplay.

 

So does playing a style that is reminiscent of a man recovering from a terrible car accident.

[DeatHTaX 1217]

So this thread had like two pages yesterday...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puy52LVqG7c#t=3m04s

Edited March 1, 2014 by DeatHTaX

[tommes 331]

Honestly, the better PVP players are in 3PP as a whole.  You get a higher number of new spawns as well, but people who like to shoot people are going where the people are.  1PP is the safe place for people who want the luxury of running around town exploiting the 90 degree view the game saddles the player with.

Those guys aren't better at PvP. Take away their ability to peek around corners and they'll stand there stripped naked. It's like riding a bike with support wheels. You'll lose your feeling for balance. Your capabilities of real bicycle riding will suffer. They'll start to feel weird riding a bike without support wheels and will avoid that at all cost.

In the end the so called mil sim mechanics are much more gamey as CoD will ever be. It's a pity it has grown so normal only few realize that. So Rocket hat to adhere to the masses and leave 3PP in SA. Now we have playground DayZ and maybe soon something close to being what Rocket actually wanted with hardcore mode. Hopefully the nimbus of hardcore can draw enough players out of their comfort zone.

[punkvegita 44]

The 1PP's limited field of view and lack of peripheral vision means you aren't as aware of your situation at any given time. It is harder to spot an enemy, harder to track their movements, and harder to avoid being flanked by his friends, making it easier for him to beat you.

But expand your viewpoint to include your opponent, and what do you find? His limited view makes it harder to spot you, harder to track your movements, harder to avoid being flanked by your friends, making it easier for you to beat him.

 

 

Wow your right bro regular mode is a lot easier than hardcore mode lol

[guppy22143 1081]

I like using 3rd person not for the abuse, but to determine the best angle to take cover in. I shoot in 1st, but it's a lot easier to navigate to cover with a larger FOV. I play in both Hardcore and regular, but like regular more because I have the option. It also adds more depth to firefights, more outcomes. I like it like that.

[PhillyT 554]

Those guys aren't better at PvP. Take away their ability to peek around corners and they'll stand there stripped naked. It's like riding a bike with support wheels. You'll lose your feeling for balance. Your capabilities of real bicycle riding will suffer. They'll start to feel weird riding a bike without support wheels and will avoid that at all cost.

In the end the so called mil sim mechanics are much more gamey as CoD will ever be. It's a pity it has grown so normal only few realize that. So Rocket hat to adhere to the masses and leave 3PP in SA. Now we have playground DayZ and maybe soon something close to being what Rocket actually wanted with hardcore mode. Hopefully the nimbus of hardcore can draw enough players out of their comfort zone.

 

I kill plenty on Hardcore.  It is just as easy to get the drop on people since they aren't nearly as aware of their surroundings.  The area around the Berezino train station and the backyards of that area are perfect for it.  Get on someones flank or rear and they have no chance.  By the time you start shooting, they are dead.  

 

Rocket didn't have to adhere to anything.  Rocket had to settle for the terrible engine that he was offered.  You get to play as a man bravely trying to learn to walk again, complete with super slow turn speed, snail pace strafing, and unending endurance.

[guppy22143 1081]

I kill plenty on Hardcore.  It is just as easy to get the drop on people since they aren't nearly as aware of their surroundings.  The area around the Berezino train station and the backyards of that area are perfect for it.  Get on someones flank or rear and they have no chance.  By the time you start shooting, they are dead.  

 

Rocket didn't have to adhere to anything.  Rocket had to settle for the terrible engine that he was offered.  You get to play as a man bravely trying to learn to walk again, complete with super slow turn speed, snail pace strafing, and unending endurance.

A fight is a game of wits. Unless you are hacking, there is no way to cheat. What is in the game can and should be used to better your chances at survival. Just no, that no matter how much they "Wall peek"; they can always be outsmarted. They can ALWAYS, ALWAYS be killed. It's all a matter of using patience.

Wall peeking is a strategy. Not a tactic.

Using a tactic without a strategy is useless, and vice versa. So simply think and outsmart them. They have holes in their fighting technique.

[Dagwood 680]

But if he's in the 3rd floor window of an apartment completely covered from view, how is the guy actually traveling around the map supposed to outsmart him? The person "wall peeking" with his invisible head has essentially guaranteed to have the jump on his opponent.

Same scenario, hardcore server:

That camper in the apartment has to peak his real, visible, vulnerable head around the window frame every time he wants a visual on his field of fire. While he is still almost impossible to see if he's playing smart, there is still an opportunity for out wandering survivor to spot his ambusher.

3rd person may still require wits and skill, but not nearly as much as playing without a persicope.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that you can actually lean around corners without using wall hacks? Just because it's harder to master you can't bring yourselves to ditch your easy-cam.

[louist 163]

Maybe stop using free look constantly and staring at your character.

I can't, he's too stylish, in his puffy jacket, beanie, and big orange backpack.

[louist 163]

But if he's in the 3rd floor window of an apartment completely covered from view, how is the guy actually traveling around the map supposed to outsmart him? The person "wall peeking" with his invisible head has essentially guaranteed to have the jump on his opponent.

Same scenario, hardcore server:

That camper in the apartment has to peak his real, visible, vulnerable head around the window frame every time he wants a visual on his field of fire. While he is still almost impossible to see if he's playing smart, there is still an opportunity for out wandering survivor to spot his ambusher.

3rd person may still require wits and skill, but not nearly as much as playing without a persicope.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that you can actually lean around corners without using wall hacks? Just because it's harder to master you can't bring yourselves to ditch your easy-cam.

May I point out that in 1PP, you can currently see through walls?

[guppy22143 1081]

But if he's in the 3rd floor window of an apartment completely covered from view, how is the guy actually traveling around the map supposed to outsmart him? The person "wall peeking" with his invisible head has essentially guaranteed to have the jump on his opponent.

Same scenario, hardcore server:

That camper in the apartment has to peak his real, visible, vulnerable head around the window frame every time he wants a visual on his field of fire. While he is still almost impossible to see if he's playing smart, there is still an opportunity for out wandering survivor to spot his ambusher.

3rd person may still require wits and skill, but not nearly as much as playing without a persicope.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that you can actually lean around corners without using wall hacks? Just because it's harder to master you can't bring yourselves to ditch your easy-cam.

Easy-cam? Piss off. I like to RP, not cheat.

Anyway, he can't shoot without peakin' his head out. Can he?

Even if he DOES get the jump on you, if he's as unskilled as you say, he'll miss. Right?

[louist 163]

No retort to my post, Louist? Still trying to defend your cheapened style with the "well at least we're all using the same cowardly tactics so it's fair!"?

Would you use the same argument if we all had access to x ray vision and teleporting hacks?

While we would all be on a level playing field, the game would still be the worse for it. So while I can't deny your logic, I can say with confidence that the game and the gameplay it provides is cheapened by all of the negative side effects that come with the inclusion of 3rd person.

I don't deny it cheapens the experience, as that is entirely subjective, and I happen to believe it myself.

My point is merely that neither is easier or harder than the other, because both, while being completely different, even out. This holds true for your X-ray and teleporting argument. Yes, getting a kill would be easier. And not dying would be harder.

Until zombies become a threat, 1PP won't be harder. When they do, that limited vision, against an opponent who doesn't suffer from it, will make hardcore harder.

[PhillyT 554]

But if he's in the 3rd floor window of an apartment completely covered from view, how is the guy actually traveling around the map supposed to outsmart him? The person "wall peeking" with his invisible head has essentially guaranteed to have the jump on his opponent.

Same scenario, hardcore server:

That camper in the apartment has to peak his real, visible, vulnerable head around the window frame every time he wants a visual on his field of fire. While he is still almost impossible to see if he's playing smart, there is still an opportunity for out wandering survivor to spot his ambusher.

3rd person may still require wits and skill, but not nearly as much as playing without a persicope.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that you can actually lean around corners without using wall hacks? Just because it's harder to master you can't bring yourselves to ditch your easy-cam.

 

 

How about you just play the game without needing to use terms like "easy cam" because honestly, it sounds more like you want to be able to have an easier time by exploiting limited visibility to ensure an advantage...

[leitberkley 4]

From playing both i think..... Hardcore is more intense. 3pp is more awareness. Its also not an advantage if every one can do it. Its kinda like peripheral vision. Where as fp is like tunnel vision. The ultimate solution, in my opinion? Dayz and oculous rift. Hope to have that combo someday!

[GrappleX 354]

Still can't understand how some of you even post from your high horses.

 

Seriously, the font must be tiny from up there.

Edited March 1, 2014 by GrappleX