Canteens, utility belts, and more (now with PICTURES!).

[crazykage 1063]

Howdy fellow survivors and dev team! I come before you today to propose a few ideas, all related to one another, involving Canteens, Utility Belts, and more, including how they should be implemented and how they function IRL.

 

Now, I know that belts have already been suggested before in some manner or another. But not, I think, quite like this or in as much detail. And I don't think I have seen a picture of the kind of belt I would like to see in game, either. No, I am not talking about your simple leather strap you thread through your pants belt loop to keep your pants from falling down. Rather, I refer to this:

 

 

Oops. Howd that get in there :D ? Sorry, next pick:

 

 

THIS is the kind of belt I am referring to. A heavy duty, nylon weave adjustable belt designed for the attachment of modular equipment. But what kind of equipment is designed to be attached to this belt? Well, for starters, the very same kind of canteen found in this very game! But that isn't all, and that itself brings me to my next point: The canteen. I have mentioned this off hand in a few other threads, but haven't yet gone into this much detail. SO, read on to find out what I would like to see with the canteen in particular, how it relates to this belt^, and more.

 

 

THIS is your standard issue UN canteen, green, olive drab. But you may notice something missing (you sharp eyed devil you!). There is no outer pouch! And you are correct. This is the plastic canteen all by itself. This, I think should be a single, individual item found in varying conditions in the game. Like the current canteen, it should take up 2 inventory slots. But there is more:

 

 

THIS is an aluminum canteen CUP. Note the shape and folding handles. It is designed SPECIFICALLY to fit snugly on the bottom of the canteen you just saw. I also think this should be a single, individual item found in game, in varying conditions. It should, by itself, take up ONE inventory slot (its about half the size of the canteen), OR if COMBINED with the canteen, should continue to take up only 2 inventory slots. BUT THERES STILL MORE! Read on:

 

 

This is the aluminum heating stand. Again, note the shape. It is designed specifically to fit snugly around the canteen cup. When flipped upside DOWN, however, the narrower base still fits on the cup, but only partially, elevating the cup. This allows the heating stand and cup to be placed over a heat source, such as hot coals, and heat the contents of the cup while keeping the cup itself out of the fire and preventing the heat from burning the contents. Let me tell you folks, a true, salty Marine can cook a 4 star, 3 course meal using only the ingredients found in an MRE, a fire, and this handy contraption. I would NOT want to be out in the boonies trying to survive on my wits alone without it ("it" being the entire canteen set, more on that in a moment). This item, by itself, should take up only one inventory slot. Combined with the cup, still only one. The stand and cup combo, combined with the canteen, would take up only 2 slots all together. But there is STILL MORE!

 

 

THIS is the canteen pouch (note: the camo pattern was drawn on using brown and black permanent markers). Its the nice little olive drab cloth wrap you see in game, with the actual canteen inside it. Currently they are a single item in the game, but like all the items mentioned before, I think that it should be a single, individual item found in game, in varying states. Alone, it would take up a single inventory slot. Any of the items mentioned before (canteen, cup, stand) could be added to the pouch, together or separately (found a pouch and a cup or stand, but not the canteen? Cup, stand, and canteen can each be added to the pouch, separately or together). Any combination of those items, or all of them together, would take up two inventory slots.

 

ALSO note the small pouch on the side. Its a tiny little pocket. What is it for? WATER PURIFICATION TABLETS. Store those little pills in the pouch, along with the cup, stand, and canteen, and ALL TOGETHER they still only take up 2 inventory slots.

 

 

This little guy is a gator clip. It is used to attach the canteen pouch to the belt you saw in the beginning. In game, you would not be able to attach the canteen pouch to the belt without them. In game, they should be found in pairs, and take up only one inventory slot. Combined with the pouch/canteen/cup/stand, two inventory slots. Combine ALL OF THAT TOGETHER with the belt, and you no longer need to store that canteen in your pack or pocket. Its on the belt, ready when needed, and out of the way. EDIT: This item, as said, should be found in pairs, and should be STACKABLE.

 

 

Canteen inside cup, inside stand.

 

 

Canteen, inside cup, inside stand, inside pouch. This item, with gator clips, should continue to take up only 2 inventory slots.

 

 

Canteen set attached to belt with gator clips.

 

 

Some more items that could be in game. See next picture for description.

 

 

Here, the belt is laid out with several more items that could be added to the game at some point. From left to right:

 

Canteen set

 

Butpack: Could take up 2 inventory slots if stored in pack, BUT if attached to a belt, you gain access to 4 new inventory slots. Attaching it would require 2 gator clips)

 

IFAC pouch (Side pouch): This is the carrying pouch for standard issue USMC personal medkits. The medkit is gone, now its just a handy little pouch. I use this as an example or placeholder for an item in game that would be SIMILAR. One inventory slot in pack, BUT if attached to belt with 2 gator clips, grants access to 2 inventory slots.

 

Medkit: This is an old, Vietnam era med kit pouch, with med kit. The current med kit in game could be used for this purpose (imagine it instead of my nam kit), OR this could be added in as well. EITHER one could be attached to the belt using a pair of gator clips. Kit would function exactly the same as it does currently, taking up 4 inventory slots in your pack, and capable of holding 6 medical items.

 

 

Furthermore, most of the "Assault Vests" found in game (I refer to them as LBV's, or Load Bearing Vests), are of the same kind that are designed to be attached to this kind of belt system. In this picture, I show how my LBV attaches to my belt using simple Velcro straps secured tightly with a snap button. The two straps on the left most end are undone, to show functionality.

 

Combining the belt with the LBV (would not attach to a stab or bullet vest) would have the convenient effect of adding all of its inventory slots (4 for the butpack, and 2 for the side pouch, 6 in total) to those of the vest. Meaning that with the belt/butpack/side pouch combo attached to the LBV, the LBV would now have a total of 14 slots (2X7 configuration), making it all conveniently located and condensed under a single drop down bar, rather than separating the extra slots into yet ANOTHER bar. Then, the belt could have its own bar, without inventory slots (if combined with an LBV. Without the LBV, the slots would appear under the belt's tool bar). I imagine it would work the same way as a rifle. You see the bar with the rifle picture and name, and drop it down to see all the attachments. The belt would work the exact same way.

 

 

The belt, and all attachments, strapped to my LBV, and worn comfortably.

 

EDIT:

 

Another suggestion for an item that could be attached to the utility belt (thanks to spiderdude20):

 

A magazine pouch. In game item would take up 2 inventory slots. If attached to belt, could function like ammo can, granting access to expanded, specialized inventory, say 4 slots, except were the ammo can only allows ammunition, the magazine pouch only allows for the storage of magazines. Either 4 single slot magazines (c-mag, speed loaders, FNx45 mags), or 2 2-slot magazines (30 rnd, 40, or 60). Stored in your pack or in a pocket, the item would be inert. But attaching it to a belt would enable access to those slots.

 

 

This is an example of my own pouch that I have that is designed for this kind of belt. Like the others, uses gator clips. This is a US model, but another version could be used, or the "US" could be replaced by "UN" in game.

 

 

The pouch, opened to show a pair of coupled stanag magazines inside.

 

I believe it necessary to have such a modular item in game. When hunting and cooking and other things are implemented, it will be necessary to have a way to carry some of our items (canteen, magazines in a pouch, butpack, knife w/sheath, pistol holster, etc.) in such a manner that we free up inventory space for other things, like the cooking pot, food, matches, wood, stones, tools (for repairing items/vehicles?) etc. WITHOUT this, we will NOT have enough inventory space to carry all that we need, and still be able to take advantage of all that the game will eventually have to offer us. ESPECIALLY if backpacks become a rarity, as has been said recently. This system would greatly enhance gameplay in the search for more items to round out a player's survival kit. As it is currently, there is no use for matches or cooking pots. But when those things are implemented, I would like to be able to carry them without sacrificing space for other items that are no less important.

 

I think it would balance out nicely when you consider that in order to be able to free up that inventory space, a resourceful survivor will need to find the belt, the attachments, AND gator clips. Finding everything you need might take some time. But once you DO manage to get it all, you will free up significant amounts of inventory space as a reward.

 

Here, I conclude my lengthy suggestion. Thank you for reading, and for your comments agreeing that it should be implemented, or, as the case may be, for your constructive criticism. Good day.

 

:)

Edited February 16, 2014 by Crazykage

[Damnyourdeadman 1045]

It is already in game,although not exactly like it.My proposition is to be able to attach the canteen on the harness saving precious inventory space.

 

Edit:Yes i'm aware of that,sorry in advance for posting before you finished the complete suggestion list.To be completely honest i made a suggestion topic before seeing you post but i had it taken down when i saw you had already planned it :)

To be honest,i love the idea of the utillity belt/military harness to come with diferent attachments.Also the abillity to attach/detach the pouches/sheaths as you please depending on you personal taste. (along with the entraching tool ;) )

Edited February 16, 2014 by Damnyourdeadman

[crazykage 1063]

It is already in game,although not exactly like it.My proposition is to be able to attach the canteen on the harness saving precious inventory space.

 

 

*pic removed for space

 You jumped the gun a bit, didn't you ;) ?

 

I DID say to come back when I was finished editing the final product.

 

This picture only shows the LBV, to which EVERYTHING else I mentioned above would be attached.

 

What I am suggesting is not in the game AT ALL. 

[crazykage 1063]

Other items that could be attached to this belt:

 

Knife w/sheath

 

Hatchet w/sheath

 

walkie talkie w/carrying pouch

 

Pistol holster

[Pvt_Larry (DayZ) 98]

Batman utility belt anyone? Just sayin'.

[Spiderdude20 32]

Batman utility belt anyone? Just sayin'.

Except not as many slots, and no ability to generate any item at anytime, :P. As for the OP, I love this idea, and it would make a lot of sense in an apocalypse like this. Hell, a pistol holster would be a big sell for me, it would have only four slots on it, just enough to fit in a pistol.

 

*Edit* Magazine pouches! Forgot about that!

Edited February 16, 2014 by Spiderdude20

[crazykage 1063]

*Edit* Magazine pouches! Forgot about that!

Yes, of course. I completely forgot. I will add this to my original post.

 

Thank you.

[crazykage 1063]

I REALLY hope the devs see this, and it gets them thinking.

 

Without some kind of modular system like this, and with backpack scarcity on the horizon, it will be extremely difficult for a player to carry all the survival tools available in game. We have no use for them now, but eventually cooking pots, matches, wood, stones, tools (and whatever else is added in later) will have functionality. A system like this forces the player to search long and hard to find all the necessary components, but if successful, the hard work is rewarded with significant amounts of freed up inventory space.

 

Just think: if you had a place to attach your canteen (two slots), a knife (two slots), a pistol holster (4 slots), a mag pouch (4 slots, but only for magazines), a med kit (4 slots), and a butpack (4 slots, universal storage), all that would free up a total of 20 inventory slots. The trade off is that, with the exception of the universal storage of the butpack, only SPECIFIC items can be attached, and to do so requires the belt and the gator clips.

Edited February 16, 2014 by Crazykage

[Spiderdude20 32]

I REALLY hope the devs see this, and it gets them thinking.

 

Without some kind of modular system like this, and with backpack scarcity on the horizon, it will be extremely difficult for a player to carry all the survival tools available in game. We have no use for them now, but eventually cooking pots, matches, wood, stones, tools (and whatever else is added in later) will have functionality. A system like this forces the player to search long and hard to find all the necessary components, but if successful, the hard work is rewarded with significant amounts of freed up inventory space.

 

Just think: if you had a place to attach your canteen (two slots), a knife (two slots), a pistol holster (4 slots), a mag pouch (4 slots, but only for magazines), a med kit (4 slots), and a butpack (4 slots, universal storage), all that would free up a total of 20 inventory slots. The trade off is that, with the exception of the universal storage of the butpack, only SPECIFIC items can be attached, and to do so requires the belt and the gator clips.

Before anyone says anything about how we already have a first aid kit in game that has six slots, that takes up four, maybe six slots in your backpack to begin with? Imagine having that, and the med kit at your disposal? 10 slots for medical supplies, hell yeah!

[majo 23]

I'd rather have the option to find an ordinary belt where I can attach snap hooks to, instead of finding a military belt like this.

I'm aware there will be military equipment but I am much more looking forward to all the craftable stuff.

Hopefully there will be enough materials around to craft some kind of similar belts like the suggested one. In the end of the day my toon should look like a survivor and not like a soldier :rolleyes: 

 

 

Did anyone already suggest to craft improvised armor out of newspaper and duct-tape which can be used to protect arms and legs?

[crazykage 1063]

bump

[crazykage 1063]

Daily bump.

 

Any developers care to chime in with their thoughts?

[crazykage 1063]

anybody got any new thoughts or opinions?

[crazykage 1063]

bump

[crazykage 1063]

Bump. Anybody else have anything to add? Love it, hate it?

 

Honestly surprised more people aren't chiming in....

[Corto 34]

I like to think that the purpose of looting in the game is not to be able to carry as much as you can just by yourself, but to complement what you are carrying with what the rest of your party is carrying. Even if you like to play alone, it is about about smart looting, keeping what you really need and not what you may need if conditions arises. This is something you learn when you go out camping/trekking and you know you can't carry everything for every possible (although improbable) situation. I like playing smart versus trying to carry everything I stumble upon. I always use the hunting backpack, a vest and raincoat and even then, fully armed, with 600 rounds on the ammo box and plenty of food I still have a lot of room to spare. Quality over quantity.

Edited February 20, 2014 by Corto

[crazykage 1063]

I like to think that the purpose of looting in the game is not to be able to carry as much as you can just by yourself, but to complement what you are carrying with what the rest of your party is carrying. Even if you like to play alone, it is about about smart looting, keeping what you really need and not what you may need if conditions arises. This is something you learn when you go out camping/trekking and you know you can't carry everything for every possible (although improbable) situation. I like playing smart versus trying to carry everything I stumble upon. I always use the hunting backpack, a vest and raincoat and even then, fully armed, with 600 rounds on the ammo box and plenty of food I still have a lot of room to spare. Quality over quantity.

 

I get what you mean, but consider that many items that have no purpose now, will be a necessity later: cooking pots (4 slots), frying pans (4 slots), matches (one slot), fire wood (?), stones (2 slots, not entirely sure of purpose), knives (2 slots, may be needed for hunting?), tools (however many), repair kits (later, guns will be found in varying conditions), medical (varying slot consumptions, will likely become more complex and fleshed out later) and any other item I am forgetting that is later added.

 

I would rather not be forced to carry these necessities while abandoning other items that may be no less important. The game is still in its early development stages, but eventually there may be many things we need to survive. Adding in this system will add a layer of depth to the process of becoming well equipped, simply by affording the player more options, and more things to find.

 

I am an avid outdoorsman myself, well trained in the arts of land navigation and basic survival skills (shelter construction, snare traps, etc etc). While I am not here to brag about my outdoor l33t skillzorz, I WILL say that I own all of the equipment in the pictures, and would not want to go out in the wilderness without them if they were available to me. If they were NOT available, I would make every effort to find these items (in the event of some kind of collapse of society).

 

No, you CANT carry EVERYTHING possible. But you CAN carry everything you NEED, and this is an item that would help one do so. Why WOULDNT you want to have a utility belt like this?

 

I am not suggesting that players should be able to carry everything in the game. But some kind of system allowing us to carry more items will be needed later on I think.

 

Soon, backpacks will be a rare find. Food lying about will be more scarce. Hunting and cooking food may become a more viable option than searching for canned beans to keep oneself fed. Having a method (which is earned through searching for the items) to carry more, and in a realistic fashion, will, I think, help to flesh out the survival aspect of the game. I would even be willing to say that these items, being IDEAL to a survival kit, should be rare finds. But once acquired, highly beneficial.

Edited February 20, 2014 by Crazykage

[Corto 34]

I believe you have all the stuff you say you have, because I have it too. But as I did more camping trips, I grew tired of carrying so much, so I started experimenting with how little I could carry and still be comfortable. That's why I love to play this game light. I'm not saying that it's impossible to carry a lot of stuff because I have seen mountaineers carry extremely large backpacks (I don't know how the f they manage with their thin bodies). I would love to talk about outdoorsmanship all day, honestly, but bottom line is this game does not accurately represent real life. For example, I have never heard of somebody carrying wood logs in the backpack, hehe. I still think we are not going to need to carry a frying pan or a cooking pot to cook meals if they do this right. With a knife and wood sticks you can quickly improvise a way to cook from raw meat to some vegetables (like potatoes, sweet potatoes, onions, eggplants, etc). Wood should be readily available and abundant in such a heavy forested country. You know all of this stuff. Still, I think that adding inventory expanding items is going to lead to having hoarders on the game instead of smart players.

[crazykage 1063]

I believe you have all the stuff you say you have, because I have it too. But as I did more camping trips, I grew tired of carrying so much, so I started experimenting with how little I could carry and still be comfortable. That's why I love to play this game light. I'm not saying that it's impossible to carry a lot of stuff because I have seen mountaineers carry extremely large backpacks (I don't know how the f they manage with their thin bodies). I would love to talk about outdoorsmanship all day, honestly, but bottom line is this game does not accurately represent real life. For example, I have never heard of somebody carrying wood logs in the backpack, hehe. I still think we are not going to need to carry a frying pan or a cooking pot to cook meals if they do this right. With a knife and wood sticks you can quickly improvise a way to cook from raw meat to some vegetables (like potatoes, sweet potatoes, onions, eggplants, etc). Wood should be readily available and abundant in such a heavy forested country. You know all of this stuff. Still, I think that adding inventory expanding items is going to lead to having hoarders on the game instead of smart players.

 

Firstly, thanks for the input.

 

But secondly, I feel I have to disagree, insofar as that I not only want to see this in game, but that I think it SHOULD be in game. There is no reason to deny players options. And while I agree that we should all play smart, and not carry things we don't need, I don't imagine many people would pass this option up in a "real" situation if it were available to them. A utility belt such as this enables a person to travel light, carry many essentials that are easy to access, out of the way (in that they do not inhibit movement), and in an organized fashion. With JUST the items shown in the twelfth picture, I can carry all that I need to survive, potentially for several days. A knife, paracord, compass, map, small food items, multitool, flashlight, spare batteries, and more.

 

Having such an item in game would do the exact same for players as it would in real life. With it, we could conceivably carry all that we truly NEED without a backpack (which again, are soon to be a lot more rare), keeping other essentials back at our camp, OR simply have a backpack with more room in it.

 

Again, I would also like to emphasize that the great benefit of having this additional storage could be offset by the fact that not only do you need a belt, clips, AND the item itself to attach to the belt, but also by making the belt and clips rare finds.

 

I still see no reason why the item should NOT be in game at some point, or why the option shouldn't be available.

[Corto 34]

You're right. There's not reason why players shouldn't be given more options, provided they have to pay for it in agility, stealth and endurance. I prefer to go as light as I can not only in real life but also in games. So I think that's just me and that's no absolute truth. I have an military belt, with the metal hole on it. I replaced it with a regular nylon/cotton belt with the strangle system (I don't know how it's called). So, that's just me honestly.

[terminal_boy 860]

You can lash just about anything to a sturdy belt if you have rope and duct tape.

[haven923 65]

I was actually going to write up a post on this exact topic as my first presentation to the forum/devs, but you did a splendid job!

Few things I would like to add:

 

The LBV (I call it the same thing) is designed in a manner that it can be worn over body armor.  This compatability could be up to the dev's opinion and could present a in-game trade-off dilema:  inventory space or protection.

Modern standard issue US Army mag pouches come in two varieties:  velcro-closed double pouch (the 1x2 suggested in OP) and 3-mag pouches (3 mags side-by-side-by-side in a wider, but thinner pouch).  A lot of people I have seen attatch first the 3-mag pouch to the front of their armor (such a pouch does not normally fit on an LBV) and then three single-mag pouches attatched proportionately on top of that.  That gives you a grand total of 9 magazines.  A standard combat load for the US is 210 rounds (7 magazines, one in rifle).  Some form of modularity would be an interesting dynamic to the game with some pouches compatible with some systems and not with others.  The clips in OP, correct me if I'm wrong, are used in the ALICE modularity system.  ALICE is interesting in that it is compatible with MOLLE (US Army's primary at the moment, incorporates weaving layers of fabrick and snap buttons in place of clips).  Some pouches could go without using the clips.

 

Something I am very sincere with are holsters.  That, however, will be continued in a separate thread...

[mithrawndo 166]

Lovely sales pitch. I read the whole thing in the voice of Billy Mays. You sir, have my beans.

 

Just to nit-pick: A gator clip is a synonym of a crocodile clip used in electrical engineering (and when not conductive, to hang your clothes!), those things you hook onto your belt are actually gator clamps (slide and lock rather than spring loaded). Not that it matters, but I felt that what I giveth with one hand, I should take away with the other!

[Lupine 14]

Before anyone says anything about how we already have a first aid kit in game that has six slots, that takes up four, maybe six slots in your backpack to begin with? Imagine having that, and the med kit at your disposal? 10 slots for medical supplies, hell yeah!

 

Yeah I agree, 10 slots for meds/pills/bandages in a first aid kit. When i was back packing i absolutely packed my first aid kit with everything under the sun, from needles (sewing)ointments, antiseptics, pain meds, sizzors, gauss pads, tapes, razors scaple and sterile blades.. you name it. packed into a tiny clip lock box. it weighed heeps mind you, but it got used a lot on my travels.

[haven923 65]

I lied, there is already a topci on holsters, but I don't feel it has what I think it really needs.

So, holsters...

PICTURE HEAVY!!

We have one and it works really well.  The problem is it doesn't really do anything other than hold a pistol.  Holsters should give a boost (i.e. faster draw speed) and therefore make it a decision on wether you want an 8-slot vest or a nimble back-up/CQB gun.  I also feel that there should be a different variant of the chest holster (under arm) with the ability to hold at least one clip for the FNX45/future clip-fed pistols.

And now you are asking "What tangent are you working off of now?"  Here it is:

There are holsters that clip to belts (the same 2" belt showin in OP) and strap around your thigh.  They can be fixed or modular in design so that you have the possibility of having a bit of extra modularity on your thigh that you could throw a FAK or some extra magazines on.  Such a holster is frequently used in the military because it could attach to a normal belt as well and puts the pistol not only in easy reach, but also well below the soldier's body armor and out of the way.  I mentioned fixed and those could come in two variants:  a thigh variant like the thigh MOLLE panel mentioned earlier, or a simple on-belt design like civilian and law enforcement.

The holster I would most like to see is a "bucket" holster.  This type of holster is traditionally leather and functions similarly to the chest holster in that the weapon slides in and is not necessarily clipped in.  I actually own a bucket holster.  You can see it here sitting nicely between my jury-rigged knife and my multitool (both of which I always wear on me in uniform).



I love it, it's a true work of art and serves its use to the best I could ever wish.  What do you use it for, you ask?  Well, it holds an amazing little pistol.

(Please note that I do NOT have a bubble butt... the leather strap that ties it to your leg was bunching up the back of my pants and I didn't notice until after I posted...)

And in its full beauty...



That is a Rossi Ranch Hand, chambered in .45LC.  It is in a family of firearms called the "Mare's Leg."  Legally, it's a pistol.  I wouldn't try it as a concealed carry weapon, though...  Why would we have one of these, you ask?  In The Community's List of Suggested Weapons for Dayz Standalone there is one Winchester 1895 Lever Action Rifle.  The original Mare's Legs were cut-down variations of similar lever-action rifles (tube-fed, rather than box).  This would be a recipe gun that would require a hacksaw... much like a certain sawn-off shotgun currently in the game that *gasp* could use the same holster!  While it is a niche request, I feel that it would be a valid addition to the sand box that would allow for a lot more expression, easier inventory management (much like the OP mentioned, for later on in the build when there are a lot more items that you may/may not need to carry around).



It really is a simple addition to the game that would require the use of a belt (unless you wanted to add a western-style ammo belt incorporated into the holster... PLEASE!!!

While you may say that this is far-fetched, keep in mind that there is a civilian population that once lived where we are located in the world of DayZ.  By that right, anything is possible.  That may be a cop out, but anything with enough thought becomes plausible.  Besides, a lot of people have an interest in "cowboy guns."  Mossberg certainly knew that when they made this beautiful .30-.30 with a cool little back scabbard...

Edited February 21, 2014 by Haven923