Can we please have guns hitting where we aim at?

[infiltrator 275]

I am really surprised that a game with such strong connections with arma has random dispersion. Weapons like the M4 should be more difficult to handle, but they should never shoot to the left or right of where you aim - I don't want "fake" innacuracy, where I seemingly can control my gun with ungodly skill but in return I get magical bullets that veer off the trajectory on some random cosmical dice throw. I want the gun to be hard to control (based on what gun it is and my trigger discipline) but shots should always go where the sights indicate.. What we have now is an extremely annoying mechanic that is favored by contemporary commercial shooters and should be absolutely avoided.. at least in my opinion.

[ASDF991 8]

Guns in the SA are to easy to figure out currently, nothing needs fixing, no gun will hit directly where the sights are at.

[Sutinen 635]

Yep.. It's horrible. I hope it's just an alpha thing.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Sutinen

[Hrki 94]

hmm i think also your aim depends on quality of your "aim" attachment if its badly damaged or damaged or eaven ruind its not precise like vorn or pristine and also try to shoot bullet by bullet or burst fire not spray... and also i hope they will fix that when you shoot him in backpack you dont ruin all items inside...

Edited February 7, 2014 by HrkiGV

[Jack Dant 158]

Guns in the SA are to easy to figure out currently, nothing needs fixing, no gun will hit directly where the sights are at.

You are wrong. A gun will always hit exactly where the sight is at. The difficulty is in lining up the sight with the target.

 

Comparing the SA to Arma 3, I'm always surprised by how much more difficult but rewarding Arma3 aiming is. There is a whole lot of weapon sway, and getting the target into the sight is hard. But once you have it there, the bullet will hit.

[razguul@gmail.com 80]

Agreed, it's very annoying when you aim at something 50-100m off and you can see the shots hitting way off target. There is no reason why this happens, it's not realistic at all.

[infiltrator 275]

hmm i think also your aim depends on quality of your "aim" attachment if its badly damaged or damaged or eaven ruind its not precise like vorn or pristine and also try to shoot bullet by bullet or burst fire not spray... and also i hope they will fix that when you shoot him in backpack you dont ruin all items inside...

 

Definitely not. I've had several pristine sights where bullets go wherever they please in the imaginary cone around my sights.

[Hrki 94]

Definitely not. I've had several pristine sights where bullets go wherever they please in the imaginary cone around my sights.

 

 

umm ok :D i just noticed when you are at full sprint (with hands in combo stage) you are pretty untargetable if you are 100+ metters away from me and if you are running horiznotaly in my scope... thats bad .... and also i got some scenes when i shooted 30 bullets with m4 in guy and he manage to run away like WTF

Edited February 7, 2014 by HrkiGV

[crazykage 1063]

Guns in the SA are to easy to figure out currently, nothing needs fixing, no gun will hit directly where the sights are at.

Bullshit. And I would know. You are either a useless troll, or totally ignorant of marksmanship principles.

[wuffi (DayZ) 18]

You are wrong. A gun will always hit exactly where the sight is at. The difficulty is in lining up the sight with the target.

 

Comparing the SA to Arma 3, I'm always surprised by how much more difficult but rewarding Arma3 aiming is. There is a whole lot of weapon sway, and getting the target into the sight is hard. But once you have it there, the bullet will hit.

Sorry but that is simple not true.

(If we talk about real life guns they definitely do not hit exactly where the sight is all the time)

You have to consider bullet drop and wind.

If lets say there is strong wind that often changes direction you will hit absoultely NOTHING with (just for example) a scoped hunting rifle at 300 yards.

[Dragor69 12]

You are wrong. A gun will always hit exactly where the sight is at. The difficulty is in lining up the sight with the target.

 

Comparing the SA to Arma 3, I'm always surprised by how much more difficult but rewarding Arma3 aiming is. There is a whole lot of weapon sway, and getting the target into the sight is hard. But once you have it there, the bullet will hit.

 

This is wrong also. A gun will only hit where you are aiming if you have zeroed the weapon for that distance.  If you knock that weapon then you could lose the zeroing. Done this many times on range days. Only once its zeroed correcting can you adjust the sight for range (page up/down). So running around elktro searching every building for loot is not going to keep your weapon perfectly zeroed.

 

Source: Grunt

[infiltrator 275]

Sorry but that is simple not true.

(If we talk about real life guns they definitely do not hit exactly where the sight is all the time)

You have to consider bullet drop and wind.

If lets say there is strong wind that often changes direction you will hit absoultely NOTHING with (just for example) a scoped hunting rifle at 300 yards.

 

This is so very wrong. First, there is no wind in the game yet. When and if its implemented we can consider it a factor. 

 

Even if we PRETEND there is wind, the only wind that we could pretend existed would be the kind that changes direction every milisecond and is able to blow down the Z axis.

 

Second, even if you zero and shoot at a target that is on the perfect distance, there's still dispersion, so I don't know how can you come up with that explanation. Just zero in at 200 meters, shoot at a wall 200 meters away and you'll see what I mean.

[sQubanny 13]

This is so very wrong. First, there is no wind in the game yet. When and if its implemented we can consider it a factor. 

 

Even if we PRETEND there is wind, the only wind that we could pretend existed would be the kind that changes direction every milisecond and is able to blow down the Z axis.

 

Second, even if you zero and shoot at a target that is on the perfect distance, there's still dispersion, so I don't know how can you come up with that explanation. Just zero in at 200 meters, shoot at a wall 200 meters away and you'll see what I mean.

Yeah, BUT, 200m is pretty of a distance.. have you ever fired a normal weapon? I did, it was a standard m4a1 with some barrel modifications and it was really hard to 'take down' targets at 50m And you gave an example of 200m, imagine, firing with an automatic weapon in such a distance.. I find the mossin pretty accurate, when firing to zombies. The things change, when aiming to ppl, it is rly hard to hit them. Remember, it is alpha..

[crazykage 1063]

I really don't understand how people CONTINUE to argue that the dispersion in game is NOT ridiculous. It has been CLEARLY established that dispersion in SA is highly random and is a WIDE cone, and has been established with the use of SCIENCE....

 

Even Dean Hall has seen the wisdom of the great science, and has agreed to implement changes to the ballistics system based on the findings of that science...

[Dragor69 12]

Add the fact that you supposed to be a survivor so you are not going to be proficient at shooting. I have experience and my grouping are 10 cm at 100m prone. I cant even keep the rifle steady stood up. Its shoot and hope.

[Jack Dant 158]

Sorry but that is simple not true.

(If we talk about real life guns they definitely do not hit exactly where the sight is all the time)

You have to consider bullet drop and wind.

If lets say there is strong wind that often changes direction you will hit absoultely NOTHING with (just for example) a scoped hunting rifle at 300 yards.

 

 

This is wrong also. A gun will only hit where you are aiming if you have zeroed the weapon for that distance.  If you knock that weapon then you could lose the zeroing. Done this many times on range days. Only once its zeroed correcting can you adjust the sight for range (page up/down). So running around elktro searching every building for loot is not going to keep your weapon perfectly zeroed.

 

Source: Grunt

 

Corrections accepted. I was talking about bullet dispersion (which is what's incorrectly modelled ingame), and forgot to clarify about bullet drop. But in typical in-game iron sight ranges (0-200m), bullet drop is not that signicant. A difference of 5cm up or down is not going to make a centermass shot any less lethal.

[soulfirez 901]

I do wish they had gone the path of sway rather than overly excessive bullet dispersion . Sway makes more sense in the hands of an un trained shooter and with the inclusion of bipods it makes more sense to me than bullet dispersion balancing......

 

But i am no dev so i can only guess at there intent with bullets dispersion...

[Disgraced 1123]

This has not been my experience at all (as of last stable build, though).

With both a mosin with scope and M4 with optics, I could head shot zombies from about 200 yards with almost unerring accuracy.

Maybe it's changed with this stable or maybe better sights really matter THAT much. Hard to say. I was crouching or standing, after stopping running for some time and holding the right mouse button to hold my breath after sighting (quick mouse2 click), though.

I'll be interested to try this stable build this week. It's too easy so I've been delving back into the mod for my fun.

[eleventhavenue 204]

No gun is less accurate because the user is poor. The user can be less accurate, of course. But that's another thing...

I do think gun performance currently just is placeholder, though.

[Sutinen 635]

Sorry but that is simple not true.

(If we talk about real life guns they definitely do not hit exactly where the sight is all the time)

You have to consider bullet drop and wind.

If lets say there is strong wind that often changes direction you will hit absoultely NOTHING with (just for example) a scoped hunting rifle at 300 yards.

Yeah, and that is in normal ArmA 2. The dispersion is very minimal so you don't even really notice it. For some reason they decided to change them.

[louist 163]

Add the fact that you supposed to be a survivor so you are not going to be proficient at shooting. I have experience and my grouping are 10 cm at 100m prone. I cant even keep the rifle steady stood up. Its shoot and hope.

No backstory has ever been given to your character behind the title "survivor." That title doesn't impart any Information as to your proficiencies in any way, shape, or form. Please don't try to argue that the character doesn't know how to use guns, as there is no evidence in the backstory (which, again, consists of a single word) either way.

Edited February 7, 2014 by louist

[-Gews- 7443]

I'm of mixed opinion.

 

You can't fully simulate shooting in this game. It is not feasible. A great many factors are left out. In addition shot placement is less crucial. If the firearm's true "mechanical precision" was used, there would be very few situations in which players would notice any important differences between the accuracy of most weapons.

 

 

I am okay with some form of exaggerated dispersion PROVIDED the values are [a] based on real life logical [c] not frustratingly high and [d] implemented with the intent of increasing REALISM and not for any sort of "balancing".

Edited February 7, 2014 by Gews

[infiltrator 275]

I'm of mixed opinion.

 

You can't fully simulate shooting in this game. It is not feasible. A great many factors are left out. In addition shot placement is less crucial. If the firearm's true "mechanical precision" was used, there would be very few situations in which players would notice any important differences between the accuracy of most weapons.

 

 

I am okay with some form of exaggerated dispersion PROVIDED the values are [a] based on real life logical [c] not frustratingly high and [d] implemented with the intent of increasing REALISM and not for any sort of "balancing".

 

You can't fully simulate shooting in any game, it will never be fully simulated anywhere apart from a shooting range.. but I think that we can go a long way from here to making it more realistic AND enjoyable at the same time.

[-Gews- 7443]

You can't fully simulate shooting in any game, it will never be fully simulated anywhere apart from a shooting range.. but I think that we can go a long way from here to making it more realistic AND enjoyable at the same time.

 

Agreed.

[TheWanderingMan 170]

I've never had any trouble with weapon accuracy.

 

Don't use Hollywood movies as an example of how firearms work irl. You'd be lucky to hit anything beyond 10 meters with a pistol if you were standing and that's with a 9mm. Anywhere beyond 400m using a 5.56 chambered rifle is practically ineffective anyway. Most 'sniper' rifles are only effective up to 1000m and anything beyond that is classed as harassing fire.

 

Games are never fully realistic, but arma and dayz come the closest that I have ever seen.