kuma8877 39 Posted January 25, 2014 Totally agree with the need for game play balance, though I think it should start from the actual characteristics of the real world counterpart it is representing, and then be adjusted to what works within the dev's vision. It's harder to suspend your disbelief and be somewhat immersed if you've ever fired the real rifle in question whether it be the M4, SKS or whatever, and the game version acts nothing like it. At least in a game like this where there is some expectation of a level of perceived realism. I don't expect my BF4 weapons to function or feel the same way my ArmA weapons do, because I don't even have the slightest expectation of realism from BF4. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 Ballistics in all of those are hardly realistic when compared to real life counterparts. Why? Because it is a game after all and there has to be balance and there are limitations. I bought the original OFP from the day it was released in my area, so I don't need a history lesson. I played this series to death and back. When people talk about realism in simulations they often forget the balance factor which is much more important for a game to function properly than simply being realistic. That is not to say the simulation should be arcady, hell no but you have to restrain or add to the capabilities of weapons for example to balance the simulation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
soulfirez 901 Posted January 25, 2014 Ballistics in all of those are hardly realistic when compared to real life counterparts. Why? Because it is a game after all and there has to be balance and there are limitations. I bought the original OFP from the day it was released in my area, so I don't need a history lesson. I played this series to death and back. When people talk about realism in simulations they often forget the balance factor which is much more important for a game to function properly than simply being realistic. That is not to say the simulation should be arcady, hell no but you have to restrain or add to the capabilities of weapons for example to balance the simulation.You sure you played the early games cause they never balanced weapons to even teams out etc come on thats just rubbish .. You play arma2 check out the different sides what weapons they have in there general bag of tricks and tell me they have been balanced for gameplay , they havent they have been balanced to be as close to there real world counter parts as possible in a pc simulation.. The bloody nato forces always had the best crap to play with lol arma 3 does seem to be balanced hell all sides optics and vehicles seem to be a different looking clone of each other ( although there starting to add a little more individualisim to sides now slowly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 Ballistics in all of those are hardly realistic when compared to real life counterparts. Why? Because it is a game That is the problem right there. This should not apply to Dayz or Any bohemia produced game. They are built and were built on realism they own their success to authenticity and realism. As far as balance making the game as close to their real life counterparts is the best kind of balance the game can achieve. Balance has always been a non issue in mil sims and it should continue to be so. Let me ask one question what exactly would there be to balance if they made every single firearm in the game behave exactly like their real life counterparts ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
infammo 15 Posted January 25, 2014 I enjoy the mosin the most, simply because it is currrently the only weapon that feels like a rifle. Though, I have yet to have a chance to try the double-barrel with slugs. One of my favourite types of ammo. I am pretty much fine with any changes the developers want to make to the M4, not my weapon of choice but it is better than nothing. What I would really like to see, however. Is the sawn-off shotgun taking the sidearm-slot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Awruk 216 Posted January 25, 2014 Guns are lethal and dangerous. Deal with it. You are not John Rambo, learn how to move around without getting shot or face the consequences. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 You sure you played the early games cause they never balanced weapons to even teams out etc come on thats just rubbish .. You play arma2 check out the different sides what weapons they have in there general bag of tricks and tell me they have been balanced for gameplay , they havent they have been balanced to be as close to there real world counter parts as possible in a pc simulation.. The bloody nato forces always had the best crap to play with lol arma 3 does seem to be balanced hell all sides optics and vehicles seem to be a different looking clone of each other ( although there starting to add a little more individualisim to sides now slowly. Teams? What the hell are you on about? Why do you assume balancing relates to teams or weapons? There are limitations to consider, gameplay to consider etc. Yes they are trying to make it as realistic as possible but they can only go so far. Let me ask one question what exactly would there be to balance if they made every single firearm in the game behave exactly like their real life counterparts ?They can't that is the real issue. Because of limitations to technology and gameplay balance. Let me give you an example from Arma 3, well it goes for all the series really (discounting the mods). I can make a 2100 meter shot on a target with a .50 cal sniper rifle with AP ammo without a bipod deployed (well there are no bipods in the vanilla series). Explain to me how that is realistic and not just balanced for gameplay sake? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 What I would really like to see, however. Is the sawn-off shotgun taking the sidearm-slot. Yes, if it isn't already (I haven't tried yet) it should definitely be like a sidearm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 They can't that is the real issue. Because of limitations to technology and gameplay balance. Let me give you an example from Arma 3, well it goes for all the series really (discounting the mods). I can make a 2100 meter shot on a target with a .50 cal sniper rifle with AP ammo without a bipod deployed (well there are no bipods in the vanilla series). Explain to me how that is realistic and not just balanced for gameplay sake? Hmmm I really gotta ask how is it not ? Although using arma 3 is probably a bad example since its futuristic and based off fake weapons. Point I am saying its not up for the developers to put forth stupid gimps on weapons such as accuracy atleast not in a mil sim in order to balance the weapon. Dayz in particular does not need to do this since it has the best way to balance a weapon by simply controlling its loot chance and now in stand alone the total number of said weapons of that make in rotation. There won't be another situation like the As50 in the mod, they can now control the loot spawns and have say 1 weapon of a kind spawn across all of the servers. As far as making a 2100m shot with a 50 cal my stance on dayz and arma has always been that it needs a total overhaul to closely mirror real life shooting. Each time I post this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 Same goes for sniping in Arma 2 and OFP really. I am not even going to mention Arma 1 because it was just terrible. Also Arma 3 weapons are not fake, the majority of them are based on real weapons such as the one I mentioned: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 Same goes for sniping in Arma 2 and OFP really. I am not even going to mention Arma 1 because it was just terrible. Also Arma 3 weapons are not fake, the majority of them are based on real weapons such as the one I mentioned: MY biggest gripe with the sniping in Arma is that in an attempt to streamline elevation adjustments by simply allowing you to adjust the zero by 100s of meters they actually gimp and reduce max potential of the weapons. If they would adopt a mil system and allow you to adjust the elevation in mils you could if skilled push 5.56 rounds out past 1000m, push .308 aka 7.62 nato rounds past 1300m. Not only that but since you can only adjust the elevation in gross adjustments of 100s of meters at long range there is alot of degree for error when you are stuck with a range in between adjustments. ACE system of sniping fixes every single one of the problems that Arma 2 vanilla shooting suffers from. Rocket and team should take notes and copy that ballistic model. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 I would love to have the ACE system in Dayz. Would make the Sunday coast snipers redundant and make sniping an actual challenge. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 On a side note, to this date I still have no idea why there are no bipods in the Arma vanilla series. OFP ok, that was like more than a decade ago, Arma 1 fiine, Arma 2 umh still no bipod?, Arma 3 really like really bipod...anyone? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 On a side note, to this date I still have no idea why there are no bipods in the Arma vanilla series. OFP ok, that was like more than a decade ago, Arma 1 fiine, Arma 2 umh still no bipod?, Arma 3 really like really bipod...anyone? Even the bipods in Stand alone are stupid. ACE has the right idea on bipods. Shift + space = deploys the bipod onto the dirt reducing sway dramatically but instead we got this dumb menu option to deploy the bipod and it has no effect on sway and does not restrict movement or lock you in and worst of all it magically makes the gun more accurate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 Does it actually make you more accurate? I haven't noticed a difference but I could be wrong. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 Does it actually make you more accurate? I haven't noticed a difference but I could be wrong. Ask gews it makes your weapon insanely accurate. It's so stupid. http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/166937-so-about-the-mosins-new-compensator/#entry1693672http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/157148-correcting-sa-ballistics/http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/161661-accuracy-comparison-dayz-vs-arma-2/http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/158441-weapon-zeroing/ All these mistakes is starting to make me think the game will end up being terrible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funky_mish 75 Posted January 25, 2014 Rule 1 of these forums: don't argue about guns with Gews. You're just going to look silly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 Well this being alpha and the balancing hasn't been perfected, I am sure they will sort it out one way or another without it being ridiculously "OP", Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lancer 2-2 14 Posted January 25, 2014 The weapons should be more accurate than they are now and the Mosin bug of firing to the left over 300 (while it can be compensated for) should be fixed. Rate of fire of Revolver could be reduced slightly. All guns should be much, much louder and heard from far away and also attract zombies. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weedmasta 784 Posted January 25, 2014 The weapons should be more accurate than they are now and the Mosin bug of firing to the left over 300 (while it can be compensated for) should be fixed. Rate of fire of Revolver could be reduced slightly. All guns should be much, much louder and heard from far away and also attract zombies. Yeap. With regards to sound though, it seems to be bugged generally. Something is seriously wrong with it. Sometimes you hear a shot 200 meters away and sometimes you don't hear your m8 shooting right next to you it is messed up. Plus the random eating, drinking, reloading, foot steps and zombie sounds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DropBearChick 1216 Posted January 25, 2014 You put 6 rounds into a guy chasing you with an axe? I only need one! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gibonez 3633 Posted January 25, 2014 The weapons should be more accurate than they are now and the Mosin bug of firing to the left over 300 (while it can be compensated for) should be fixed. Rate of fire of Revolver could be reduced slightly. All guns should be much, much louder and heard from far away and also attract zombies. Is that a bug though ? I always assumed that was just the random variation playing its role again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
