How to authentically strike the right balance of PvP in DayZ SA.

[wartzilla 182]

I don't like the PVE solution. I believe games like DayZ thrive on human interaction, and not PvE content.

 

PvP should be 'balanced' by adding more ways to interact in-game than shooting. As pretty much everyone has seen first-hand so far, the first implementation is working very well. That is to say.. Restraints, robbing people, forcing them to consume inedible items, or taking their blood. Personally, even though I am all for shooting anyone and everyone you see as a legitimate way to play this game, we've always let people go after doing this. It's more fun that way.

 

Adding more things like this would make people even more likely to try to 'take people' alive.

 

How about being able to cut off people's ears, toes, or fingers, Diablo-style? Personally I'd love to get an ear collection going. Let me display it around my neck. Make it so ears from corpses are degraded, and if the corpse was killed by a headshot, completely ruined. That way people whose grim inclinations drive them towards hunting people today might be tempted to try to capture people alive instead.

 

No guarantees they'll leave the people alive afterward, but going by our own experience I think many would.

Edited December 31, 2013 by wartzilla

[wartzilla 182]

Oh, fucking teamwork.......yawn...

 

 

#2 IS DAYZ!!!!!!!!!!!! Did you not know there was a humanity system in DayZ? With bandit skins?

Did you not know the bandit skins were removed after a very short while because they ruined immersion, were profoundly silly and not even slightly in line with the idea of a hardcore survival game?

[franciscojose 7]

#2 will ruin dayz

#3 wont change pvp at all.

Yep. This.

[libertine 351]

Did you not know the bandit skins were removed after a very short while because they ruined immersion, were profoundly silly and not even slightly in line with the idea of a hardcore survival game?

They were removed for a time, then brought back. Find me a server without bandit skins. I've never seen EVEN ONE! I've been playing for a long time. Did you know that the hugely popular Origins mod also has them, just more varied ones that changed as you progressed.

 

Its not a hardcore survival game, its a warzone, which im okay with, but right now it doesn't have a rhyme or reason. Add in bandit skins, then it makes sense. People aren't going to go ballistic in a zombie apocalypse when what matters is people shooting zombies, it doesn't matter who is doing the shooting as long as they're not missing.

[Ken Bean 175]

Voted #2, since #3 wouldn't make a difference and I'd personaly enjoy a sanity system.

Give em some paranoia, bad sleep, self talking and a Zed 1000 hunting them through the nights.

Edited January 1, 2014 by Ken Bean

[libertine 351]

Yep. This.

Oh? How so?

[InvisiMan2013 229]

Make it so that when people become murders, zombies are more easily attracted to them and they become zombie bate for an hour after their last murder... that'll cause people to think twice about kos.  

[Crakka 44]

Make it so that when people become murders, zombies are more easily attracted to them and they become zombie bate for an hour after their last murder... that'll cause people to think twice about kos.  

Thats the stupidest thing iv ever seen

[Roshi (DayZ) 397]

DayZ should be about trade offs - there are no limitations or rules against PvP but there may be consequences for engaging someone so it's a calculated risk. Things like limited ammo, risk of death from improperly treated injuries (you can still die eventually from an infected flesh wound even if you kill the guy outright) - hard balance to get right but I think this is the only way forward without losing what makes DayZ unique.

Edited January 1, 2014 by Roshi

[SalamanderAnder (DayZ) 1747]

I think PvP is often the result of boredom. If there was more satisfying content, you could remove some players from that PvP "pool." Of course, you're never going to get rid of griefers and people who just kill for fun, and I don't think they should. DayZ is supposed to be about paranoia. About not trusting that guy you just met. Directly punishing PvP probably wouldn't even change that TBH, people would still kill each other for gear and for safety, so it's clearly not an effective solution. I like that I feel paranoid when I'm in the game. It makes it tense and exciting. Without that, well, the game would be fucking boring as hell, pardon my French.

Edited January 1, 2014 by SalamanderAnder

[funionz 7]

People still argue this crap? We did this dance over a year ago

[DayZoey 110]

Read my sig.

 

If I don't know you then I can't tell if you'd screw me over for a laugh, one of us will die when we meet.

[Zeds_Undead_baby 8]

People still argue this crap? We did this dance over a year ago

 

Think that this is kinda the point of having forums to discuss an alpha stage of the game isn't it?

[jaginun 87]

Theres no natural environment with no punishment for your lifestile. ;-)

 

That's twisting my words, I meant a natural world in the way that it mimicks real life as much as possible, without any metagame influences.

 

Oh, fucking teamwork.......yawn...

 

 

#2 IS DAYZ!!!!!!!!!!!! Did you not know there was a humanity system in DayZ? With bandit skins? Which was a negative effect for them since i'd KOS them ASAP as a survivor and im sure almost everyone else did too.

 

Like others have said, the mod was an attempt to see what they wanted the game to become and what the community reacts to. They removed it because they don't want to effect artificially a players style of playing.

[Zeds_Undead_baby 8]

I think for me balancing PvP isn't about reducing the amount of PvP it is about altering the type of PvP to make the game more immersive. PvP is what gives DayZ it's intensity and paranoia. For me balancing PvP is about reducing the amount of player killing of fresh spawns for fun and increasing the about of interaction between established players. Whether that interaction ends in a gunfight or a new friendship is less important to me. 

 

What if acquiring gear wasn't the only thing you could pick up on your Chernarus travels. What if you could also acquire knowledge about the complexities of surviving in a zombie apocalypse (e.g. vehicle repair, medicine, hunting, crafting etc). What if this knowledge and skill was then a trade-able commodity (i.e. you could teach people). This way whilst killing people allowed you access to their gear (maybe in a damaged state) their knowledge would disappear at death. Maybe knowledge could be learned by finding certain books but also with practice at doing whatever task it is. 

 

In addition to knowledge being a trade-able commodity it would also mean that players value their life more and would be less likely to risk it killing fresh spawns.

 

These sets of knowledge and skill could mean you are more efficient, faster or more accurate on doing certain things in the game. You could even be held up for someone to 'steal' your car repair skills. :-)

 

For me DayZ is a sandbox and whilst certain play-styles should not be purposefully prevented every action in the game should have consequences. Do I take the beans or the ammo? Do I shot the guy or hide in a bush?

[Lancer 2-2 14]

3rd Option.

 

DayZ is about survival, but a part of survival is looting a building when you realise that running across the neighbouring field are three other players, armed to the teeth with ranged and melee weapons, wearing helmets, masks and all.

 

Do you train scoped rifle out of the window and open fire, killing them all? Or risk them going to ground and flanking your position?

Do you wait for them and then try to parley with them?

Do you sneak out of the door and make a run for it hoping they stop to search the building and didn't see you?

 

See DayZ is about choices, right now it is plagued by people who choose KoS new spawns and have a very single minded approach to what they want from DayZ and I will admit that in a post-apocalyptic world you will have gangs or groups of people who will range from survivors, zombie slayers to bandits as well as the lone survivors who will do what ever they can to survive.... though I do condemn the fresh spawn killing as it is rather unrealistic and does not fit with the game's... immersion.

 

So right now PvP is unbalanced and partially because there is no need to team up except for at some point I might get lonely and would like the idea of talking to someone and exploring the world and killing bandits together. But it is not just the lack of a need for help, but also the easy of available for higher grade weapons not too far from the coast or on it... once they are removed and we can a rather even spread of civilian available weapons across the map, sticking near the cost won't be that attractive, especially if military grade weapons are in the North and centre of the map only.

[serenityrick 218]

 

#3 wont change pvp at all. 

 

I beg to differ.

 

If zombies are numerous, fast and ultimately dangerous... shooting someone for the sake of shooting them, especially near a town, would and should get about 20+ zombies sprinting at you. They should be faster than your jog and if you aren't able to lose them in the X amount of seconds your sprint lasts (Im guessing it won't be infini-sprint forever), then your only choice is to unload all your ammo into them which could attract even more.. and you may die reloading because they are on your ass like white on rice.

 

If that happens a few times to people, suddenly risking all the cool shit you have isn't worth it. It won't STOP PvP (nothing should) but it will certainly change how people approach situations like that in the future

 

EDIT - Basically coming across someone in a city (like looting the same house and running into eachother) and automatically shooting them SHOULD be a death sentence for the shooter as well.. dozens if not hundreds of zombies should converge on that location and there's no escape. Would create a pretty cool dynamic actually. You run into someone and you don't trust them at all but you both acknowledge that shooting the other would mean death for both.

Right now that isn't even close to happening since zombies aren't a threat at all

Edited January 1, 2014 by serenityrick

[Guest]

Players don't need "punished" for killing , they should be rewarded for surviving and doing what's necessary.

[Zeds_Undead_baby 8]

Players don't need "punished" for killing , they should be rewarded for surviving and doing what's necessary.

Not punished but there should be consequences for everything you do in the game. Spawn killing is not authentic and there should be certain consequences that deter it...

 

Killing for gear, food, self-defense, being a bandit etc should all have different consequences to the cold-blooded murder of someone who has no weapons and is not a threat. There should be a positive and negative side of every action you take in the game.

[Khad (DayZ) 293]

[...]

In the mean time don't put any lame morality systems in place that prevent players from playing the way they want to.

You say it, Sir!

[atmaca (DayZ) 48]

Pushing teamwork won't help because bandits team up with real life friends too. We need some kind of punishment so they can't be like "omg I pwnd 10 bewmbies on balota cuz that's how I roll lololol". I don't care whether it's a holy thunder or a megazombie spawning just behind him. Any punishment can make him give up on that idea will do the job 

[Zeds_Undead_baby 8]

Pushing teamwork won't help because bandits team up with real life friends too. We need some kind of punishment so they can't be like "omg I pwnd 10 bewmbies on balota cuz that's how I roll lololol". I don't care whether it's a holy thunder or a megazombie spawning just behind him. Any punishment can make him give up on that idea will do the job 

Needs to be an authentic consequence of the action though rather than a punishment from god....IMHO. :-)

[gibonez 3633]

Yea absolutely nothing rocket does will change the pvp. Best thing he can do is embrace it and make it challenging.

[brzator47@gmail.com 524]

Players don't need "punished" for killing , they should be rewarded for surviving and doing what's necessary.

People already see skins as "punishment for banditry", even though heroes get a different skin as well. It will be the same with whatever you do to reward survival. People also say they don't want any playstyle to be favoured in the game but don't realize that already is the case with current gameplay mechanics. Some sort of humanity system that is an improvement over the mod is a must imo.

[soulesseye 35]

I agree I think the devs should have a go at balancing by adding other features first. Just adding stuff to stop or reduce a certain play style probably won't work in the way they expect. More to do and more danger from the environment/zombies will help balance PvP IMHO.

 

PvP should be in the game but it should be geared up groups against other geared up groups or individuals fighting over resources rather than 'for fun'.

 

resources so much is what i think...there needs to be something though this game gets so boring as a straight up death match pvp game