Would this simultaneously fix Server Hopping and Ghosting?

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Problem with this? This won't solve the server hopping issue, or ghosting issue, server hoppers will just log off, then back out and run to the loot spawns again, it'll just take a bit longer, it'll in no way prevent it.

 

 

Obviously there's no way to completely prevent people from logging in to other servers in order to find more loot. How would you? The only way to completely end the practice would be to disallow people from switching servers at all, which I think you will agree is an impossibly restrictive solution. 

 

What this does it makes server hopping far, far less convenient. Server hopping is effective because it's fast. You check a room, find it empty, change servers and find loot. With my solution, every time you attempt this you've got to run for several minutes before checking for loot again.

 

Most wise server hoppers will realize this is no more efficient than simply staying on one server and moving on to another location. The benefit of re-checking the same location over and over again goes away if you have to run for 10 minutes every time you switch servers. Why would you check the same place when you could just move on and check somewhere else? It would become senseless.

 

So, yes, this would not "completely prevent" server hopping. Nothing will make it 100% impossible. What we have to do is make it so inconvenient and inefficient that people simply choose to stop doing it, and I think that's what this solution does.

 

 

As for ghosting, ghosting is to move from where you were seen and being a target, to being somewhere else, you wouldn't even need to log on another server with this, you just log off then back on, then run to where you know they were, the best they can do is "expect it", just as you "expect" ghosting right now. Doesn't solve either issue.

 

The issue with ghosting is that it allows you to safely get closer to your enemy. You can position yourself behind a sniper on his roost, or infiltrate a building you know has enemies in it and then spawn in behind them getting a "free" kill. 

 

Ghosting in order to get further away from your enemy and at a random position gives you no tactical advantage whatsoever. How would it? "Hey, there's a guy over there! Let me randomly teleport up to 1km away and then... return to where I am now, apparently? He probably won't even be there by the time I get back, but I'll totally show him!"

 

Really, it's just weird. Why would people do this? What advantage do you gain?

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Awesome, now I can just scan nicely defined borders to pick off people logging in.

 

With respect, that's ridiculous. There would be hundreds and hundreds of bump points. Possibly thousands. Camping one area in particular would be extremely inefficient. You could wait days before seeing someone appear.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Arma 3 breaking point, got it right a 8 minute timer every time you change servers.

 

This is probably the easiest solution, and the one they will go with eventually.

 

The one problem which persists is players logging in while crouched in a dark corner of a high-value area (or similar). Even if 8 minutes have passed, there's still a potential problem with people randomly appearing after you've searched an area. It does vastly improve the situation and all but solves ghosting, but I would love to see a system which basically prevents people altogether from logging in inside high value zones. Essentially a new log-in should place you in a tactically neutral position, and far from loot if possible. You would never be able to log in standing on top of a nice juicy weapon or a pile of ammunition.

[deebz1234 243]

great ideas, id say extend the blue zone or make it even more precise.

or fuck zones, you log out and back in too fast? too bad 10 minute timer eat it

[Funkmaster Rick 373]

Part of the problem with server timers and player restrictions of that sort is when someone joins a server that looks good on paper, but turns out to lag, give bad framerate, or in some way fail to operate optimally; if you force players to stick at that server for any length of time, it's only going to get them killed and piss them off. It's difficult to solve the server-hopping issue with any single idea because not all servers are created equal.

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

I came up with a slightly more complex system that would solve pretty much all of the above. 

 

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/156680-ghostingloot-farming-server-hoppingcombat-logging-possible-solution/

[lev 39]

With respect, that's ridiculous. There would be hundreds and hundreds of bump points. Possibly thousands. Camping one area in particular would be extremely inefficient. You could wait days before seeing someone appear.

 

Ridiculous?  Currently there are hundreds if not thousands of spawn points along the shore of Chernarus for new players to spawn in on and people roaming the shores and killing un-geared characters is already a problem.  No one looking to PK needs to wait days right now, what do you think will happen when we bump players into a very well defined radius outside of the cover of a town/buildings?  

 

Think for a few seconds please.  

Who is most likely to unlog in a town, particularly the main ones along the shore?  Mostly new players because they don't know what they are doing so why screw them even more by adding this completely illogical and unrealistic feature?

Why should players who take cover in relatively unimportant buildings get bumped out of the town? Honestly, there is no real reason except to satisfy your feature.

Are there better and less intrusive ways to fix server hopping and ghosting?  Yes, and a lot of them have been posted already.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Ridiculous?  Currently there are hundreds if not thousands of spawn points along the shore of Chernarus

 

No, there's definitely not. There's like 30.

 

 

 

people roaming the shores and killing un-geared characters is already a problem.

 

No, it's really not a major issue. I've never been killed at a spawn point. In Cherno or Elektro, sure, but I don't think people are really "camping the beaches" right now.

 

 

 

No one looking to PK needs to wait days right now, what do you think will happen when we bump players into a very well defined radius outside of the cover of a town/buildings?  

 

Honestly nothing. Like I said, there would be far too many spots to ever camp any one of them effectively.

 

 

 

Think for a few seconds please.  

 

Okay, I did that. Now what?

 

 

 

Who is most likely to unlog in a town, particularly the main ones along the shore?  Mostly new players because they don't know what they are doing

 

What does not knowing what you're doing have to do with where you choose to log out?

 

 

 

why screw them

 

I fail to see how this "screws" anyone.

 

Why should players who take cover in relatively unimportant buildings get bumped out of the town? 

 

For all the reasons I stated above?

 

 

 

Honestly, there is no real reason except to satisfy your feature.

 

I really don't even know what that means. "Satisfy my feature?" Come on.

 

 

 

Are there better and less intrusive ways to fix server hopping and ghosting?  Yes, and a lot of them have been posted already.

 

For example?

[mercules 1290]

Ghosting in order to get further away from your enemy and at a random position gives you no tactical advantage whatsoever. How would it? "Hey, there's a guy over there! Let me randomly teleport up to 1km away and then... return to where I am now, apparently? He probably won't even be there by the time I get back, but I'll totally show him!"

 

Mosin with a long range scope and most of those "blue zones" would in reality be about 500 meters from the area they were looting very likely allowing them to shoot the person through a window or as they exited. 

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Mosin with a long range scope and most of those "blue zones" would in reality be about 500 meters from the area they were looting very likely allowing them to shoot the person through a window or as they exited. 

 

Come on dude. That's what you're going with? Given the terrain and features of the map, you honestly think a completely random teleport is going to give you a line of sight to shoot someone you've just seen? Let alone "through a window?"

 

If you see someone, shoot them. Teleporting away to some random location is not going to give you a tactical advantage.

 

most of those "blue zones" would in reality be about 500 meters

 

Okay, so make them further away. Obviously. I'm not suggesting the developers use the actual fucking zones I've laid out. It's just a concept image.

Edited December 24, 2013 by ZedsDeadBaby

[mercules 1290]

Come on dude. That's what you're going with? Given the terrain and features of the map, you honestly think a completely random teleport is going to give you a line of sight to shoot someone you've just seen? Let alone "through a window?"

 

If you see someone, shoot them. Teleporting away to some random location is not going to give you a tactical advantage.

 

 

Okay, so make them further away. Obviously. I'm not suggesting the developers use the actual fucking zones I've laid out. It's just a concept image.

 

Then when demonstrating a concept maybe make it more accurate to what you envision and want. As it is your Blue Zones, especially if it moved me to the "closest" blue zone area outside the current red I am in would put in me prime camping spots with a very short sprint. 

The ultimate solution would be blindingly simple. 1 Character per server. Problem solved. 

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

Then when demonstrating a concept maybe make it more accurate to what you envision and want.

 

Nah. That would take a ton of time and would require testing and balancing in the game to get right. It's called a concept for a reason. 

 

 

 

As it is your Blue Zones, especially if it moved me to the "closest" blue zone area outside the current red I am in would put in me prime camping spots with a very short sprint. 

 

How would it put you any closer to that spot than if you just ran there from where you're standing? 

 

 

 

The ultimate solution would be blindingly simple. 1 Character per server. Problem solved. 

 

And like 100 new problems created.

 

If you want a simple brute force solution, then put a 10 minute timer on logging in after logging out. One character per server would be a goddamn nightmare.

Edited December 24, 2013 by ZedsDeadBaby

[mercules 1290]

Nah. That would take a ton of time and would require testing and balancing in the game to get right. It's called a concept for a reason. 

I didn't say perfect, I said "more accurate". We don't throw a gravy boat on a table as the design for a new ship, they build a scale model and work from there. ;)

 

 

How would it put you any closer to that spot than if you just ran there from where you're standing? 

I am making an assumption that your "teleport from Red Zone to Blue Zone means the closest blue zone around the Red Zone, yes? If so then most of those areas directly around most red zones are in tree lines and places with cover where I could easily camp someone who I knew was in the building I just combat logged from.

 

 

And like 100 new problems created.

Such as? Name 10.

 

One character per server would be a goddamn nightmare.

Because of what factors? I hate to tell you this but the Mod survived off private servers... and not the 1000+ vehicles, self-bloodbag, starter gear servers for a while and it worked just fine. In fact in many ways it worked better than a Hive. For one thing you if people combat logged they couldn't play on that server until they thought it was safe to come back. They couldn't farm loot by hopping. They also couldn't ghost.

If you wanted to play with friends who can't play as much as you, you can have a server you all play on and one you play on alone or with one other friend. You were all in the same area and you didn't have to do the, "Hold on, I died and had to gear up again so I am in Stary right now I'll have to run over to where you logged out." bull every time that friend logged in for an evening's play.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

I am making an assumption that your "teleport from Red Zone to Blue Zone means the closest blue zone around the Red Zone, yes?

 

Absolutely not. That would make the system predictable and exploitable. It functions precisely like spawning. You move randomly to one of the blue zone bump points. I'm nearly certain I've used the term "randomly" several times in this thread, but I'll double check. :)

 

 

Such as? Name 10.

 

There's really only one that matters. It makes squad play basically impossible. It's hard enough to find 8-10+ spots on a server to join with my squad now; you want me to wait for those spots to open up on one specific server? Gross. No way.

 

Other problems: server downtime means I basically have to start over or not play. Server owners now also basically own characters - if they ban or kick a player, that person loses access to their entire character. Also, what if a server owner decides to stop paying their bills or shut the server down? I lose my entire character? Gross.

 

Further, it essentially gives people multiple characters. People could play on 10 different servers, get all geared up with weapons and food, and then when any one character dies they can just swap to another server and keep playing no penalty. Death should delete your one and only character.

 

Maybe if there are "official" servers which have a larger map, 250+ slots and some guarantee of up-time then a one-character-per-server system would work. As it is now, it would be awful.

 

If you want a simple solution, it has already been proposed. Just make people wait 5-10 minutes to log back in after a logout.

[mercules 1290]

Absolutely not. That would make the system predictable and exploitable. It functions precisely like spawning. You move randomly to one of the blue zone bump points. I'm nearly certain I've used the term "randomly" several times in this thread, but I'll double check. :)

"One Of" so let me get this straight. If I get disconnected in Balota I could end up teleported to the blue area around say... NEAF? I could end up 10k away from where I was? Why not just make people spawn at the coast every time at that point?

 

 

 

Other problems: server downtime means I basically have to start over or not play. Server owners now also basically own characters - if they ban or kick a player, that person loses access to their entire character. Also, what if a server owner decides to stop paying their bills or shut the server down? I lose my entire character? Gross.

Yeah, because your character never goes away for no reason in DayZ. :) What is that? Start your own server, now you can assure your 8-10 guys have slots AND your characters don't go away. Works for the Mod.

 

Further, it essentially gives people multiple characters. People could play on 10 different servers, get all geared up with weapons and food, and then when any one character dies they can just swap to another server and keep playing no penalty. Death should delete your one and only character.

Yeah, it does, which is actually kinda awesome because now instead of either being several klicks away from my friend who logged in today but not yesterday I can have a character on a server with just him and log out when he does yet still play on a different server. Also, to gear up on 5 servers means you went through 5 times the trouble of gearing up on a hive(maybe multiplier of 6 since you couldn't server hop to farm) so death will still hurt JUST as bad. Trust me I've been playing on both the public Hive and private servers for the last year or so.

On the public Hive I basically got geared up and then logged out near an area where my friends are and don't play. I don't want to make my friends wait an hour for me to run to where they are and/or gear up again. With the private servers if I get really bored I hop onto a new server and play for a bit with a brand new character and don't affect my play time with friends in the tiniest way.

 

Maybe if there are "official" servers which have a larger map, 250+ slots and some guarantee of up-time then a one-character-per-server system would work. As it is now, it would be awful.

Been doing it for a year. I thought it would be awful too. Even lost characters and work to server shutdowns, even an Epoch Server with a bunch of work into a base in very hostile environments. It isn't that big a deal.

[Statik (DayZ) 2695]

You disgust me.

 

[superkyle 6]

I absolutely LOVE this idea. PLEASE devs at least consider this.The inconvenience it might cause severely aids in ghosting, server hopping and combat logging. So a team cant lock down a city (at least on the outskirts), big deal, it aids in everything else.

[thefairy 12]

The one character per server would actually pretty much sort the problem, except it would then be open to Admin abuse.  Have seen in Dayz Mod where admins were able to figure out hiding spots for vehicles, no matter where we hid them.

[Atomizer 53]

One character per server would also ruin one of the best aspects of DayZ at the same time, the fact you have this one global character, that can be used across any servers on the public hive, if you made it one character per server, you basically have private servers not connected to a hive, I have no desire to play on private servers. And private hives will be coming soon, there you can have your one character per server.

[Shadyfizzle 80]

What it should be is similar to the mod where there is a logout timer and a combat timer, there should also be a timer between switching servers(like 5-10 mins), like in breaking point. This would eliminate ghosting as it would take 10 minutes to switch to another server to move into better position then 10 minutes to switch back. Server hopping for loot would be more inconvenient as it would take longer to do. Combat logging or otherwise improper exiting of the server should leave your character in game for 30 secs or whatever the combat/logout timer is.

 

if this has already been proposed it is because it is a good idea, there will never be "safe" zones in dayz

Edited December 25, 2013 by Shadyfizzle