Don't keep asking for CHANGES because...

[meshcarver 154]

...the game as it is right now, design wise, is EXACTLY WHY IT IS SO POPULAR!!!

As soon as you start to chip and chisel away at the core aspect of this game (The ever present threat of PvP, trust shared/broken. Paranoia rides on the back of this...) then you will be chipping and chiselling away at WHY IT WORKS SO WELL.

And it does work extremely well. Look at sales of ARMA now, and look at the player count and it's in ALPHA!!!

Please, trust and accept the devs decisions on the way they want to take this game. I feel Rocket knows exactly what he wanted/wants to create with this- and right now he's spot on.

Really, apart from server connections/anims/ambient tracks etc and a general streaming of the connection issues in this mod (In other words, the non-core/game play elements), nothing should be added- as by adding something, something WILL be taken away, lost from it...

There, my two pence.

Also, I'd really appreciate if Rocket could at least maybe give his word to the community that he won't be swayed "by the masses" on this as some of us seem to worry. Already there's a feeling of the casual coming into this and complaining it's not forgiving enough!

THAT'S EXACTLY WHY IT IS SO GOOD AND YOU'RE HERE PLAYING IT!!!

It's a lot to ask though, a promise like that- so no problem if not... keep up the great work.

Take it easy everyone- rant over lol..!!!

meshcarver

[masacrualex 6]

Are you serious? Why NOTHING should be added? How long do you think people will play if nothing is added? More items, more features, are needed and lots of other things to keep the player base and the game interesting. I never heard of a game losing from adding... look at Team Fortress 2, if you follow the game from 2007 to today, you'll see how much it got.

You probably just got used to the alpha as it is, with the items and all that, you are afraid of change.

[oilman 72]

Man, this forum really has a lot of opinion pieces that would be better suited as posts in another thread than threads themselves.

He has given his word repeatedly. I suppose a simple search of all posts by Rocket would be too much to ask before making a new thread?

But, since you posted it anyway, I disagree with you, as I feel that there are definite features that are lacking (Any real incentive to team up, for example), but I disagree also with MasacruAlex, in that I feel adding features to keep the game 'interesting' is awful and leads to a bloated experience with no real direction. Team Fortress Two is a great example of this. What was once one of the most brilliantly designed (visually) games of the past decade has become a mess.

[masacrualex 6]

^ See? That's your opinion, but the activity of Tf2 and people spending $$ in it, believe otherwise, plus myself, I still play that. Same with DayZ. Tell me, why not add new features? New items? New things. That enhances the experience and keeps players longer. It's also in alpha for a reason, else it'd be called beta releasing next month. The devs obviously got plans to extend the mod further,.

Change has nothing to do with disabling PVP or disabling character death. That'll be there 4ever I assume since it's one of the core things of the mod. Wasteland.

[beeman 1]

It's true that rough, gritty gameplay is what's making the game so popular. The reason minecraft was so popular was because you could do whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted...and you could do it multiplayer too.

BUT adding features and tweaking things based on player feedback is a good thing. If ten thousand people play a game and eight thousand people believe x feature should be added/removed/tweaked, don't you think it's in the best interest of the game as a whole to make that change?

The beauty of this is that it has no publisher. The dude(s) workin' on this can do whatever the butt they want. Publishers are what leads to bad decisions in game-making. Player input, though typically septic, isn't exactly going to kill the game ;P

[Otleaz 3]

You couldn't be more wrong. You can quite easily make changes to this game that will make it significantly better without taking away from the "thing" that makes it good.

[oilman 72]

Tell me' date=' why not add new features? New items? New things.[/quote']

Because it's the first rule of good game design. (The second being, 'nobody likes an ideas guy'.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

A well rounded, bug-free and fitting feature is always better than 10 features slapped together.

Whenever someone says to add more 'things' (The three most common offenders in almost any genre are weapon, skins, and levels / maps) you can be sure that they haven't thought the idea through. You should never be asking, 'What else can I put in the game to make it fun?' You should ask, 'What else does this game need?'

[masacrualex 6]

Tell me' date=' why not add new features? New items? New things.[/quote']

Because it's the first rule of good game design. (The second being, 'nobody likes an ideas guy'.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

A well rounded, bug-free and fitting feature is always better than 10 features slapped together.

Whenever someone says to add more 'things' (The three most common offenders in almost any genre are weapon, skins, and levels / maps) you can be sure that they haven't thought the idea through. You should never be asking, 'What else can I put in the game to make it fun?' You should ask, 'What else does this game need?'

I cannot believe what I just read. I bet if I list the games I like here you'll say they all suck probably. Seriously if you think adding NEW things to a mod in alpha(which evolves) is a bad thing then you got issues lol. Also I never went around request , I only said they should add more stuff and everyone agrees.

You are either a console guy or new to gaming. You hate change but then again you love DayZmod? How's that? It's a change to arma 2. Shouldn't you hate it?

[oilman 72]

Console guy? Console guys are the PROBLEM.

Instead of wanting a polished and complete game, they're content to have new 'features'. (Oh boy! The next Call of Duty has a remote control car bomb!)

Regardless, what you just read is what practically every successful developer agrees upon. Gabe Newell and Sid Meier, two of the most prolific developers in video game history, have both described this issue in length. For example, the 'adhesive paint gun' which was originally going to be part of Portal 2, and was ENTIRELY coded, modelled and implemented, was removed before release, simply because it didn't quite fit in.

Sid Meier described implementing more features as a negative issue as well:

So I call it the Covert Action Rule. Don't try to do too many games in one package. And that's actually done me a lot of good. You can look at the games I've done since Civilization' date=' and there's always opportunities to throw in more stuff. When two units get together in Civilization and have a battle, why don't we drop out to a wargame and spend ten minutes or so in duking out this battle? Well, the Covert Action Rule. Focus on what the game is.[/quote']

If you want to suggest features, go for it. But if you want to then say it's necessary to add features, seriously, go learn about successful developers before you try and school others on how video games are made.

[masacrualex 6]

Console guy? Console guys are the PROBLEM.

Instead of wanting a polished and complete game' date=' they're content to have new 'features'. (Oh boy! The next Call of Duty has a remote control car bomb!)

Regardless, what you just read is what practically every successful developer agrees upon. Gabe Newell and Sid Meier, two of the most prolific developers in video game history, have both described this issue in length. For example, the 'paint gun' which was originally going to be part of Portal 2, and was ENTIRELY coded, modelled and implemented, was removed before release, simply because it didn't quite fit in.

If you want to suggest features, go for it. But if you want to then say it's necessary to add features, seriously, go learn about successful developers before you try and school others on how video games are made.

[/quote']

LMFAO you are such a HYPOCRITE! You just talked about Gabe Newell! That guy is all about NEW features and change and that's why I love him. Valve is the best out there. OF course a paint gun would not fit in an aperture science environment like Portal. Look at freaking TF2, so many awesome things and changes. You don't seem to know jack shit about Gabe Newell either and Valve.

WTF are you comparing here? We talked about NEW STUFF/ FEATURES! New items and you're telling me how GABEN didn't add a paint gun to Portal2? So irrelevant, first of well we talked in general of new things, new ways to enjoy the mod, we didn't talk about a specific gun, feature. Second of all you're such a hypocrite.

Also you must be trolling because I don't see how adding more weapons could be bad, like more pistol types, more rifles, more features to be able to build shit and do stuff. Dude you're just bad.

Won't bother to replay to you no more. It's not worth it.

[Leechman 8]

While I agree that the game is great as it is at this second, I disagree with the OP.

There are plenty of things to add and fix with this mod that will improve the experience. Rocket is great, but no developer/designer can think of everything. That is what the community is for.

Insulting other people is not helping your arguments.

[beeman 1]

The two knuckleheads arguing with each other need to calm down. Things do need to be modified/added/changed/removed.

But the other guy, somethin' somethin' alex somethin' really needs to calm down.

What oilman says is logical, relevent and completely intelligent. He's not contradicting himself, you just don't grasp what he's saying.

Oh man, i'm about to get dragged into this >_>

Okay nevermind what I just said, instead have a look at people like Gabe, Sid Meier, Will Wright and even the likes of Notch. What do they do? Make games they want to play. Then tweak them based on user feedback, strengthening features people love and cutting things that confuse people or are rarely used.

Will Wright used to handle feature creep simply by making more games. his dream was to have all of his games be individual parts to one whole Sim experience >_>

On the flip side of that coin, some dudes can't handle feature creep. Look at Peter Molyneux and his silly games. Not saying they're bad. Just silly. Disappointing and silly.

BUT there's still balance. That's what makes Gabe, Sid and so on such good developers/producers. They know the balance between adding fun stuff and not overcomplicating their products.

[masacrualex 6]

^ Yeah it's really intelligence to request halt of new stuff for a mod in alpha. Also for the sake of it, stop comparing this mod with big devs and games, they're different. This is a mod, not a stand alone game. It's just in alpha. Some of you don't know much when you call a game bad for having too many features, I'm yet to have ever heard of that or read of it or see people whine about it lol and I've played way too many games not to have had a chance to bump into it.

[Drake Sigar 9]

You silly bee, this isn't the Starwars special extended edition. We're talking about a mod which is in Alpha, it's nowhere near finished.

[oilman 72]

Okay nevermind what I just said' date=' instead have a look at people like Gabe, Sid Meier, Will Wright and even the likes of Notch. What do they do? Make games they want to play. Then tweak them based on user feedback, strengthening features people love and cutting things that confuse people or are rarely used.

[/quote']

Haha, if you weren't defending me, I'd rage at you for putting Notch and Sid Meier on the same level. :p

But seriously, what something something Alex is saying is a common opinion, and one that I once held, a while ago when I was younger. I'm not trying to 'write off' anyone or any point of view, and I'm sorry if I did. But I'm just offering my own opinion, which has only come about from my own experience with game design.

[beeman 1]

I don't think anyone here is saying that the mod is bad...and I"m not comparing this game to any other retail products. I am, however, pointing out development philosophies used by people who've earned a lot of money and most importantly, renown for them.

If you'll notice, I've suggested quite a few changes/additions just within the last couple hours...but I also try to keep my suggestions within the limitations of the development team and game engine....and the overall spirit of the mod.

What's a good example of a game that's got too many features to be user-friendly? Hmm...Armed Assault, for starters. Ever heard of X3: Reunion? EVE Online? Perpetuum?

Complexity is good. Complicated gameplay is not. That's what I interpreted from oilman's posts, whether or not that's what he meant.

That's also what Egosoft realized with their X games. That's why X: Rebirth is going to be so different to the previous games.

That's why CCP are making Dust514. That's why Bohemia...well, they're keepin' on keepin' on...and I'm perfectly okay with that >_>

Actually, believe it or not, ArmA is a dumbed-down version of their Virtual BattleSpace product...which is used by some countries to help train soldiers...

[Kenny (DayZ) 3]

/thread

[oilman 72]

Kenny, that's hardly a good addition to the discussion, and '/thread' just shows an unbelievable amount of arrogance and ignorance.

[Kenny (DayZ) 3]

Discuss what? Lame thread, doesn't help with anything, it only stirs people. Come with a real suggestion.

[worbat 13]

Kenny is right, this thread is as stated befor a post that should be in another thread, it also ads nothing and contributes very little. Rocket has stated that he wishes to make a development roadmap with his plans for the future, stating that the mod should have no aditional content is just silly, because you don't know what content is coming.

Please think befor you post.

[Howser (DayZ) 0]

The only "change" i want to see in this game.

There is no zombies in wilderness, no roaming zombies. It would be a more precaution and exacting if there would spawn around 5+ zombie randomly outside citys (wilderness area). Only bad thing i see about this is spawn locations that could be memorized and people will just walkt around it.

[robertstuartmarshall 1]

^ See? That's your opinion' date=' but the activity of Tf2 and people spending $$ in it, believe otherwise, plus myself, I still play that. Same with DayZ. Tell me, why not add new features? New items? New things. That enhances the experience and keeps players longer. It's also in alpha for a reason, else it'd be called beta releasing next month. The devs obviously got plans to extend the mod further,.

Change has nothing to do with disabling PVP or disabling character death. That'll be there 4ever I assume since it's one of the core things of the mod. Wasteland.

[/quote']

Not all of us are clamouring people who keep demanding more, more, more to enjoy our gaming. The game, as it stands, is almost perfect aside from a few glitches and bugs - tents not being trustworthy, direct channel being sketchy at best, etc - and I don't need thousands of new hats to keep me coming back.

So far Rocket has managed to create one of the best gaming experiences I have had since the joy of first playing STALKER:SoC and I want as little change to the game as possible.

[dunkhan 8]

I think many people here are missing the point of the OP. It seems almost as though they read the first few words and the title and then posted, but no one ever does that so it must be coincidence. Yes the OP says he doesn't want to see any changes, but when I read the OP the message I get is 'trust the devs'. I doubt he would argue against adding content if the devs planned to add it. In the context of a million new players on the forum all screaming for pvp restrictions, pve only zones, different maps, tanks, map markers, nerfed zombies etc I think he has a point. I think people are overly emotional on this forum in general. I think it might be an age thing.

[duffbeeer 2]

Yeah OP actually was trying to say to trust rocket with his vision. He will ofcourse change the game and develop it further and he said he has a plan for the future. We just dont need a thousands suggestions threads about how the game should be changed because Rockets ideas are simply the vision we love. just trust him and dont try to change it.

[Viktor_Berg 0]

There's plenty to improve in the mod, just like there is plenty to improve in the game (which is outside of rocket's scope, but should be mentioned nevertheless). What you are confusing, OP, is adding new features that fit within the established type of gameplay, or altering the gameplay to change the game into something different. Nobody wants the second alternative, but the first alternative is definitely welcome.