Differences of realism as IRL and game. (M4 Accuracy)

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

For TL;DR: Don't be a douche and say that M4 inaccuracy is "Realistic". This game will go down like WarZ if they don't fix this. Shooting 400 rounds at 60m in a fight with other players because bullets go everywhere and don't hit where I'm aiming at GREATLY REDUCES THRILL, SUSPENSE AND FUN. It just becomes like a random mortar fight.

 

 

 

 

Some people seem to have a hard time grasping the difference of realism in real life and games.

 

When you press 'W', your character walks. Shit, that's not realistic? Shouldn't we make the movement like the QWOP game so that we can control every muscle?

 

No. Absolutely not, it would be a nightmare.

 

Likewise, let's talk about weapon handling for example. Sure, you need training to hit well. However, think about this: What if you had to control recoil with your mouse? It would be a fuckin' joke. The gun moves randomly - you can control that with your reflexes in real life. But if I had to control that with my mouse? That's impossible.

 

That's why games have to remain as games.

 

 

 

 

Now, to my main point:

See BF4, for example. When you are 'suppressed', your shots go everywhere. As in, I am looking at the guy at 100 yards with a 8x scope, my scope is directly ON TARGET, and my shots just go to some random place.

Sure, it tries to simulate 'being suppressed and getting stressed to the point my combat effectiveness is hindered', but here's the thing you learn in Game Design 101: When users feel that what they expect and the results are unmatched, they feel frustration.

 

So therefore, looking at a 100m away target, and my holosight directly on target (free of parallax, btw) and not hitting it? That's bad game design.

 

If you want it to be 'realistic', and not be able to shoot accurately, make scope veer extreme. However, at least make the round go where the reticle is at. M4 has 344 MOA right now.

 

It's just a matter of 1 code line, devs. I even put up feedback for christ's sake. Just please fix this fast. I'm a dev too so I know. This is ONE CODE LINE. It will literally take you 3 seconds, no 1 second to fix this.

Edited December 21, 2013 by mark3236

[daze23 549]

I'll point out that bullet drop is a major factor in this game, and the m4's have zeroing

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

I'll point out that bullet drop is a major factor in this game, and the m4's have zeroing

 

Please try out the M4, you'll enjoy it.

[daze23 549]

Please try out the M4, you'll enjoy it.

I have. first thing I did with it was try to shoot a zombie that looked to be around 300 meters away. it took me a moment to realize that "100" in the top-right was zeroing (the UI fades out and leave that number for some reason), and it could be adjusted

 

do you have a lot of experience with the shooting mechanics in Arma games?

[Advent1 126]

Am I the ONLY one who has had no problem with the M4's accuracy? On the off chance that I do get into a fire fight, or I'm sneaking up on bandits, my shots always hit. The only time the M4 has been "inaccurate" was when firing at a target 300+ meters away.

And like the above posters have stated, always adjust zeroing accordingly. That plays a huge role in actually hitting your target. I believe the M4s default zeroing is on 100 and certain scopes default is 200 like the ACOG sight.

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

Am I the ONLY one who has had no problem with the M4's accuracy? On the off chance that I do get into a fire fight, or I'm sneaking up on bandits, my shots always hit. The only time the M4 has been "inaccurate" was when firing at a target 300+ meters away.

And like the above posters have stated, always adjust zeroing accordingly. That plays a huge role in actually hitting your target. I believe the M4s default zeroing is on 100 and certain scopes default is 200 like the ACOG sight.

it gets bad groupings, if you know what it means.

Edited December 21, 2013 by mark3236

[deedlede2222 3]

Mark is correct. Shooting at a zombie 50 meters away and missing even though the red dot is on its chest with the correct zeroing in maddening. I have to wait until it's 20 meters away for an effective hit. Bullet spread is not that pronounced in real life.

[svenbreakfast 231]

You're thinking about this way too much at this stage of the development.

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

Mark is correct. Shooting at a zombie 50 meters away and missing even though the red dot is on its chest with the correct zeroing in maddening. I have to wait until it's 20 meters away for an effective hit. Bullet spread is not that pronounced in real life.

 

Yes, that's why I want to say. If the devs want to simulate 'untrained state', disable aiming down sights and only make hip fire available and enable aiming down when your character has shot more than 1000 rounds (sarcasm).

 

Seriously, if they want to simulate untrained state, make the scope veer (like, make it shake like crazy). But don't make the weapon config file so that it will never hit precisely.

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

You're thinking about this way too much at this stage of the development.

 

It will LITERALLY take 1 second for the dev to fix. Is it too much for me to ask for when I paid for the product?

Edited December 21, 2013 by mark3236

[daze23 549]

It will LITERALLY take 1 second for the dev to fix. Is it too much for me to ask for when I paid for the product?

pretty sure it would literally take longer than one second

 

do you have experience with the shooting mechanics in Arma games?

[inexorable 26]

 

What if you had to control recoil with your mouse?

 

Are you saying that you are shooting on full mode on a target 500m away ? no wonder you can't hit anything

 

by the way, you can control recoil with your mouse, just play Counter strike for example and you'll see

[svenbreakfast 231]

It will LITERALLY take 1 second for the dev to fix. Is it too much for me to ask for when I paid for the product?

 

Ok. I see what's going on here. Take some advice and cut your losses now. You've spent your money on a product that is not for you. 

 

Also look up the term "literally". 

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

Ok. I see what's going on here. Take some advice and cut your losses now. You've spent your money on a product that is not for you. 

 

Also look up the term "literally". 

 

1. Open weapons_m4.cpp or whatever source file devs are using

2. Ctrl+f 'dispersion'

3. Change 0.1 to 0.0001.

Done.

 

If you don't think about the opening time, changing does take 1 second.

 

Do you even code, bitc*

Edited December 21, 2013 by mark3236

[svenbreakfast 231]

What you just described is what you consider coding?

[LouisK 85]

Are you saying that you are shooting on full mode on a target 500m away ? no wonder you can't hit anything

 

by the way, you can control recoil with your mouse, just play Counter strike for example and you'll see

 

Weapons not only go up when shooting, unlike CS the weapon actually moves everywhere here in Arma. Either ways so far I've had no problems when aiming, yet I haven't tried to shoot anything 300m away from me, wouldn't try it unless i have a decent scope either.

 

@OP: Stop being so aggressive, if you're mad the door is right there -insert door image here-.

Edited December 21, 2013 by LouisK

[inexorable 26]

1. Open weapons_m4.cpp or whatever source file devs are using

2. Ctrl+f 'dispersion'

3. Change 0.1 to 0.0001.

Done.

 

If you don't think about the opening time, changing does take 1 second.

 

Do you even code, bitc*

 

actually it would be "change 0.0001 to 0.1"

[inexorable 26]

Weapons not only go up when shooting, unlike CS the weapon actually moves everywhere here in Arma. Either ways so far I've had no problems when aiming, yet I haven't tried to shoot anything 300m away from me, wouldn't try it unless i have a decent scope either.

 

@OP: Stop being so aggressive, if you're mad the door is right there -insert door image here-.

 

they actually move on the side too in CS, i never said CS was realistic, but i played a lot of Arma, and you can control recoil

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

What you just described is what you consider coding?

 

Uh... it's a part of fixing bugs, that's for sure. Not everything takes a long fucking time like you think. For example, changing perceived brightness when you have sunglasses would only take

 

-(void) glasses_on

{

[gameview setBrightness 0.8];

}

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

actually it would be "change 0.0001 to 0.1"

nope. "Dispersion", not "Accuracy". Higher it is, more spread.

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

I have. first thing I did with it was try to shoot a zombie that looked to be around 300 meters away. it took me a moment to realize that "100" in the top-right was zeroing (the UI fades out and leave that number for some reason), and it could be adjusted

 

do you have a lot of experience with the shooting mechanics in Arma games?

 

Yes. I played ARMA, ARMA2, ARMA:OA, DayZ mod and this.

[svenbreakfast 231]

I think you need to stop chatting in the forums and get your ass to Prague. You are the white knight the dev team has been praying for. Just make sure they don't pay you hourly since you "code" so fast.

[mark3236 (DayZ) 77]

I think you need to stop chatting in the forums and get your ass to Prague. You are the white knight the dev team has been praying for. Just make sure they don't pay you hourly since you "code" so fast.

 

Sarcasm doesn't help your argument here, the fact that the fix for this will take a fraction of a second doesn't change.

 

And what I'm mad about is that I've had the feedback up for some time, and there was ZERO feedback on it, though it's just a fucking 1 second fix. I would appreciate if the dayZ dev commented on this thread at least saying something like

 

"It was a game design decision, get over it"

Edited December 21, 2013 by mark3236

[svenbreakfast 231]

Hang tight. We've increased efficiency from a literal second to now mere fractions of seconds.

 

C'mon man, you're too fun.

[inexorable 26]

nope. "Dispersion", not "Accuracy". Higher it is, more spread.

 

right, my bad