Ghosting,Loot Farming (server hopping),Combat Logging. Possible Solution.

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

This has been mulled over for a long time and there have been many solutions to all of these problems. I thought I would give my suggestion to a possible solution to all these issues in one thread. So here goes....

 

So when a player joins a server a timer starts for that player. Let's say 1 hour*.  ( I'd like to point out that if a player has played in a server for more than an hour and decides to switch server they will not incur any of the penalties below with the exception of alt-f4ing. Same applies to players who leave and rejoin the same server but the 1 hour timer will still reset.)

 

Lets take for example the distance from one end of the Northwest Airfield to the other ( currently one of the prime places for loot farming), which is roughly 1700 meters. Let's round it off to 2000 meters. If the player changes server within the 1 hour* period, when they join another server they will not be able to loot any items within a 2000 meter radius for 20 minutes from that spawn location. Also the timer is reset to 1 hour* again. If they again leave and join another server within that hour* the loot radius is increased to 4000 meters for 30 minutes from that new spawn location, then 6000 for 40 minutes, then 8000 for 60 minutes. For the fifth time the player hops server within the 1 hour* limit their character will be spawned on the beach with no gear. 

 

On top of this, the player will not be able to move for 15 seconds for the first hop, 20 seconds for the second, 30 seconds for the third and a minute for the forth. The player will also make a noise in which the radius increases of which it can be heard ( a radar ping, radio static/chatter or something similar ). 50 meters first hop, 100 meters second hop, 200 meters third hop, 500 meters forth. The duration of the sound will also work on the same basis as the player not being able to move, using the same time frames. 

 

In addition to this, the players character will have a log-out timer regardless of if they log-out by the proper means or by alt-f4ing. A disconnect will always be incurred with a timeout. The players character will stay for at least 10 seconds. In regards to server hopping this will be increased too in the same fashion as server hoppers not being able to move when they log-in. 

 

Furthermore If a player disconnects while, bleeding, being shot at or hit by another player or being hit by zombies; the players body will remain in-game as if they had just been killed and they will spawn at beach when they log back in. Disconnects through Server crashes or restarts will not apply to these rules.

 

If a player is found being sent to the beach more than 3 times they will automatically get a 24 hour ban from playing in any server. 

 

Also values can be tried, tested, tweaked and changed to fit what's most suitable and effective. 

 

So in summary. A player that switches server within an hour of joining server will incur the inability to loot items within a 2000 meter radius, will not be able to move for 15 seconds, will make a noise in a 50 meter radius for 15 seconds. These values will increase for each additional server hop as stated above. 

 

[obsidienne 7]

well you will make a overload of work for the serverside, don't get me wrong, I agree, server hoppers should be adressed 

But let the dev collect the info and I think they're allready warned about it logwise

For myself I think this should be client sided trick : for example, blurring the view of the hopper, he will be an easier target and won't have an easy life after hopping,

you can set the blurring view for 2 hops in less than an hour, of course increasing it as the hops are

I bet it will slow down hoppers, especially in NO airfield area

[rossums 2190]

There is already a solution, it's just not turned on yet.

The developers have more pressing issues to attend with before worrying about minor gameplay problems.

Stability and security are the primary issues at this point in the release.

[Inception. 9443]

Is this regarding the Mod or the Standalone?

[Subject42 20]

Well i think your ideas are a very much too strict, the increase for every hop is unnecessary in my oppinion and there shouldn't be any bans given out for that but i like the idea that the character have to stay in-game when the player decides to quit before log-out timer runs out, i think that player shouldn't be allowed to connect to another server until his character has logged out from the first server.

[MrNomadic76 39]

In DayZ Epoch a lot of servers have safe zones around traders that don't allow firing of weapons or logging out, surely this can be adapted to create an exclusion zone around high value loot areas that do not allow logging out within a given radius of the loot zone and if anyone ALT F4's within an exclusion zone the database checks position and if inside said zone they are then spawned in a random area anywhere on the map upon logging back in. At least this way all players are forced to move out of an area to change server and in turn forced to travel back into a zone negating the benefits of server hopping as there's still a risk that you'll encounter other players on your trip back into a zone, or out. Of course server restarts would need to have warnings giving players ample time to move away from an area in time for a restart.

 

Say the radius was 1.5km around military camps and 2.5km around airfields (due to their larger area), when you come within that radius you'd receive a warning like 'You have entered an exclusion zone, logging out not permitted' and conversely, 'You have now left an exclusion zone, you are free to log out'.

 

Just my 2 cents/pennies/pesetas.

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

Is this regarding the Mod or the Standalone?

 

This is in regards to SA. 

 

 

well you will make a overload of work for the serverside, don't get me wrong, I agree, server hoppers should be adressed 

But let the dev collect the info and I think they're allready warned about it logwise

For myself I think this should be client sided trick : for example, blurring the view of the hopper, he will be an easier target and won't have an easy life after hopping,

you can set the blurring view for 2 hops in less than an hour, of course increasing it as the hops are

I bet it will slow down hoppers, especially in NO airfield area

 

Blur effect would only work with players that have post processing enabled. As for server side overload, I think they could quite easily handle player tracking as mentioned in my original post. These are probably already tracked and added to the database anyway. 

 

 

There is already a solution, it's just not turned on yet.

The developers have more pressing issues to attend with before worrying about minor gameplay problems.

Stability and security are the primary issues at this point in the release.

 

Just because they already have a solution ( of which I've yet to see which covers all aspects of my original suggestion) doesn't mean it will necessarily work when it comes to pushing it to live. I also wouldn't consider these things as "minor gameplay problems" They are actually pretty game breaking and should be some of the foremost issues addressed next to stability and security. Nevertheless, this is a suggestion section which they can refer back to once the more important things are addressed. 

 

 

Well i think your ideas are a very much too strict, the increase for every hop is unnecessary in my oppinion and there shouldn't be any bans given out for that but i like the idea that the character have to stay in-game when the player decides to quit before log-out timer runs out, i think that player shouldn't be allowed to connect to another server until his character has logged out from the first server.

 

Too strict? I have to disagree. I think there should be zero tolerance for this kind of game play and use of exploits. It utterly undermines the core essence of what DayZ is about and at the end of the day, it's simply cheating, for which players should be punished and banned for. I actually thought I was being quite lenient with a 24 hour ban. 

 

 

In DayZ Epoch a lot of servers have safe zones around traders that don't allow firing of weapons or logging out, surely this can be adapted to create an exclusion zone around high value loot areas that do not allow logging out within a given radius of the loot zone and if anyone ALT F4's within an exclusion zone the database checks position and if inside said zone they are then spawned in a random area anywhere on the map upon logging back in. At least this way all players are forced to move out of an area to change server and in turn forced to travel back into a zone negating the benefits of server hopping as there's still a risk that you'll encounter other players on your trip back into a zone, or out. Of course server restarts would need to have warnings giving players ample time to move away from an area in time for a restart.

 

Say the radius was 1.5km around military camps and 2.5km around airfields (due to their larger area), when you come within that radius you'd receive a warning like 'You have entered an exclusion zone, logging out not permitted' and conversely, 'You have now left an exclusion zone, you are free to log out'.

 

Just my 2 cents/pennies/pesetas.

 

As much as this has had some success in Epoch it does have its flaws. It still doesn't address combat logging or server hopping to some extent as the player can merely move out of the exclusion zone and log out. 

 

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Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are many issues that could and probably would arise from my suggestion. But it is something that could perhaps be tried and test as something to fall back on if the current development ideas don't pan out as intended. Or even can be used to supplement the current development ideas that combat these issues. 

[Inception. 9443]

This is in regards to SA. 

 

Please post SA related things in the SA sections. Moved.

[MrNomadic76 39]

 

As much as this has had some success in Epoch it does have its flaws. It still doesn't address combat logging or server hopping to some extent as the player can merely move out of the exclusion zone and log out.

 

 

I just think your suggestions require a number of algorithms to be run by the central hive for each and every log in / log out, which will inevitably have an effect on performance, so everyone suffers, even legit players. I know players will just move out of the exclusion zone to log out but better that than laying down at the back of a barracks and swapping servers 5-10 times to get fully kitted. Running a minimum of 3km each time you want to check the same loot spot would be enough to put me off, that's for sure, especially if there was a chance to run into players enroute each time, kind of defeats the object of easy loot, no?

[MrNomadic76 39]

Please post SA related things in the SA sections. Moved.

 

 

My apologies, new here and still finding my feet.

[Crit 46]

Edit: post already addressed did not read entire thread

Easy! Cannot log out in high value loot spots, if a player alt4s or connection drops all that happens is charater gets moved away, not miles but far enough thats theres a bit of a walk back!

Edit: did not read entire thread

Edited December 21, 2013 by Crit

[Maelwaedd 0]

If a player logs but rejoins the same server there should be no penalty (this helps to deal with those who dc or their net crashes)

 

when a player joins a new server they spawn in a random spawn location using a separate list of spawn locations than those of a respawn, if a player switches server while in a respawn area there is no penalties

 

there would be alot less coding needed and it prevents those trying to server hop to loot certain locations, but still enables players to switch to a different server and join their friends with a minimal of hassle

 

I dont mind the idea of loot lockouts but think that it would be too hard to implement coding wise and server wise

[BelMarduk 169]

Hogwash. Its kind of hard to come up with anything right now, as not all dynamics are known. That said, there are a myriad of reasons for the need to server hop, specially in the current builds. Until loot starts to dynamically respawn, and/or all loot spawns correctly, server hopping many times is the ONLY way to survive. I have died three times of starvation (not thirst, there's water in every town) because ZERO food as its already been looted, over a number of servers. Another issue is ping kicked/battle eye not responding kicks (yes I know BE is not going to 'protect' SA, but if vac or whatever can do random kicks...), ALPHER game crashing (Ive had the game crash at least 6 times), or whatever other reason, can not necessarily be differentiated from an alt-F4 or a meditation to server hop. There can not be any punishment for disconnecting and reconnecting to whatever server, aside from a logout timer, and your (very vulnerable) avatar remaining for a period of time (if a player, or zombie is within 'x' number of meters). Both of which I very much agree with having.

[gibonez 3633]

only one solution.

 

Private hives .

 

Having a global character that is not tied to each server was stupid anyway. Server hopping and ghosting will always happen on the crappy public hives thats why everyone moved to private ones in the mod.

[beardedcap 22]

I think that your solution is way too complicated OP.  However I think that a more simple solution would be to have a timer when you click exit to leave the server.  I.E. 20 seconds or so.  If people alt-f4 they should implement a timeout period where the character is still in that server for 20-30 seconds after they disconnect, it would also disable them from joining a new server in that time.

[WarAndRuin 19]

Ban for combat logging.

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

Hogwash. Its kind of hard to come up with anything right now, as not all dynamics are known. That said, there are a myriad of reasons for the need to server hop, specially in the current builds. Until loot starts to dynamically respawn, and/or all loot spawns correctly, server hopping many times is the ONLY way to survive. I have died three times of starvation (not thirst, there's water in every town) because ZERO food as its already been looted, over a number of servers. Another issue is ping kicked/battle eye not responding kicks (yes I know BE is not going to 'protect' SA, but if vac or whatever can do random kicks...), ALPHER game crashing (Ive had the game crash at least 6 times), or whatever other reason, can not necessarily be differentiated from an alt-F4 or a meditation to server hop. There can not be any punishment for disconnecting and reconnecting to whatever server, aside from a logout timer, and your (very vulnerable) avatar remaining for a period of time (if a player, or zombie is within 'x' number of meters). Both of which I very much agree with having.

 

I don't see why it's hogwash? It's a perfectly legitimate suggestion that could be tried and tested behind closed doors to see if it's achievable. Just because you personally perceive to not be achievable doesn't mean it isn't, so please do not dismiss someone's suggestions with such flippant remarks. Also nobody stated that this be implemented immediately, if at all. There really shouldn't be any kind of restrictions implemented at this stage of the build, it's an alpha, we need freedom to go to any server and do as we please so the dev team can record as much analytical data as possible, that is not up for debate. 

 

If the dev team read this thread and take it into consideration that's all that matters. You only have to look at my past suggestions to see a lot have already been implemented. I try to think outside the box instead of repeating the same basic idea like, put in a logout timer. It still doesn't address Ghosting and Loot farming. I just hope they give the idea a go, after-all Alpha is R&D at the end of the day. 

 

No harm in making suggestions but there is harm in blankly dismissing them.  

[RoflwaffleSi 1]

server hoppers/loot farmers are hardly even a problem and this solution would make the game worse, what needs to happen is that loot actually respawns so people don't need to server hop to farm, you can't blame ppl for server hopping for loot atm because the loot system sucks so much. So many more things need to be addressed in DayZ over this and its hardly a problem, pvp ghosting is the issue not loot farming and combat logging needs to be fixed asap. When you can't get loot in servers because it doesn't respawn and everyone combat logs when they die so their body disappears and you can't loot it you can't say loot farming via server hopping is really a valid issue that needs attention at this point.

[cenobite (DayZ) 14]

My server jumping solution. Is simple.   When you join the game, you can only "jump" servers 2 times an hour, any more your character is reset. When you log out, character stays in game for additional 15 secs or so, helps to avoid CbL'rs.   But if you cant kicked leave server etc, as long as you join same server, no character reset.

 

30 minutes on a server is more enough time to avoid server jumpers "value" of jumping.

[mercules 1290]

server hoppers/loot farmers are hardly even a problem and this solution would make the game worse, what needs to happen is that loot actually respawns so people don't need to server hop to farm, you can't blame ppl for server hopping for loot atm because the loot system sucks so much. So many more things need to be addressed in DayZ over this and its hardly a problem, pvp ghosting is the issue not loot farming and combat logging needs to be fixed asap. When you can't get loot in servers because it doesn't respawn and everyone combat logs when they die so their body disappears and you can't loot it you can't say loot farming via server hopping is really a valid issue that needs attention at this point.

 

Ehem... No one "needs" to server hop for loot. I haven't yet and usually end up with a gun, a mag, food/drink/canopener, backpacks, better clothes, and medical gear. I have yet to "server hop" once. Check out this episode and you will clearly see at least one server hopper and I suspect the guys he shot and looted were likely server hoppers too because of the loot they had. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2CPHHzRrcc Jump forward to about 9 minutes in. You will see Server Hopping, Combat Logging. 

Now the guys in the group, if they were a group and not a bunch of single players who happened to all log into the same server at the same location, might have gained their gear by running around, but I suspect they were hopping in, grabbing things from a couple barracks, and then hopping to a new server. This actually creates the situation you are saying it solves since instead of someone taking what is there and then leaving these people grab the ammo and clips from multiple servers so all you find is a gun, no ammo on several servers thus making it more likely for those people to hop on a different server to find the ammo server hoppers pulled from the one server. 

In addition you spend an hour running to a military spawn, but they spend 2 minutes hopping into the server, grab stuff, then another 2 minutes hopping to the next one. Most likely they hit the first one after running there and found a gun and at least a mag. They could move on, but instead they will swipe the mags from half a dozen servers by hopping and leave not just one server lacking a mag, but 6 or so. The don't "need" to hop, they do it get more than they need, to hoard things. THAT screws up the loot tables worse than they are just from loot only spawning on restart.

[LACE6077 0]

Well, i think its ok if someone use server hopping for farm. But the standalone need definitly something against this damn combat logger (fairplay u damn fa***?!) what do u guys think about a combat mode? If you are in combat mode and you log out, you die. Everyone is happy gg wp lets do this!

Edited December 23, 2013 by LACE6077

[quobble 175]

Sigh...

[desryachri 95]

If a player is found being sent to the beach more than 3 times they will automatically get a 24 hour ban from playing in any server.

I'd uninstall the game..

[.VincenT. 45]

This has been mulled over for a long time and there have been many solutions to all of these problems. I thought I would give my suggestion to a possible solution to all these issues in one thread. So here goes....

 

So when a player joins a server a timer starts for that player. Let's say 1 hour*.  ( I'd like to point out that if a player has played in a server for more than an hour and decides to switch server they will not incur any of the penalties below with the exception of alt-f4ing. Same applies to players who leave and rejoin the same server but the 1 hour timer will still reset.)

 

Lets take for example the distance from one end of the Northwest Airfield to the other ( currently one of the prime places for loot farming), which is roughly 1700 meters. Let's round it off to 2000 meters. If the player changes server within the 1 hour* period, when they join another server they will not be able to loot any items within a 2000 meter radius for 20 minutes from that spawn location. Also the timer is reset to 1 hour* again. If they again leave and join another server within that hour* the loot radius is increased to 4000 meters for 30 minutes from that new spawn location, then 6000 for 40 minutes, then 8000 for 60 minutes. For the fifth time the player hops server within the 1 hour* limit their character will be spawned on the beach with no gear. 

 

On top of this, the player will not be able to move for 15 seconds for the first hop, 20 seconds for the second, 30 seconds for the third and a minute for the forth. The player will also make a noise in which the radius increases of which it can be heard ( a radar ping, radio static/chatter or something similar ). 50 meters first hop, 100 meters second hop, 200 meters third hop, 500 meters forth. The duration of the sound will also work on the same basis as the player not being able to move, using the same time frames. 

 

In addition to this, the players character will have a log-out timer regardless of if they log-out by the proper means or by alt-f4ing. A disconnect will always be incurred with a timeout. The players character will stay for at least 10 seconds. In regards to server hopping this will be increased too in the same fashion as server hoppers not being able to move when they log-in. 

 

Furthermore If a player disconnects while, bleeding, being shot at or hit by another player or being hit by zombies; the players body will remain in-game as if they had just been killed and they will spawn at beach when they log back in. Disconnects through Server crashes or restarts will not apply to these rules.

 

If a player is found being sent to the beach more than 3 times they will automatically get a 24 hour ban from playing in any server. 

 

Also values can be tried, tested, tweaked and changed to fit what's most suitable and effective. 

 

So in summary. A player that switches server within an hour of joining server will incur the inability to loot items within a 2000 meter radius, will not be able to move for 15 seconds, will make a noise in a 50 meter radius for 15 seconds. These values will increase for each additional server hop as stated above. 

I think this idea is PERFECT! Although I would say you have one "hop" or server change every hour without punishment, it would really suck to get punished for misclicking 1 time etc.

[.VincenT. 45]

If a player is found being sent to the beach more than 3 times they will automatically get a 24 hour ban from playing in any server.

I'd uninstall the game..

why? if you cant play the game, nobody needs people that server hop cause they cant find loot legit. Its basically explpoiting which I think is against the tos or what its called so you could be banned permanently for doing it once, get on with that.