What happened to melee combat? (mod)

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I feel like the melee combat code was changed in one of the recent patches.

 

Back before these changes the melee weapons were reliable. You could dispatch zombies as they came at you without fear of being bitten. It's drawback was how close you had to get and only being able to deal with one at a time.

 

Now, it feels like every time I try to kill a zombie with a melee weapon I always have to get bit first. It's like they get close enough for you to hit them, but for some reason the hatchet swings and misses almost every time, then they bite you and finally you can kill them.

 

Am I imagining this? Was this changed for a reason? Is it a bug?

Edited December 1, 2013 by bad_mojo

[callsignBravo (DayZ) 323]

i've felt the range has gotten less but fortunatly the crowbar had a damage buff to put it on par with a hatchet, 

i made a point of practicing dodging in hitting and getting out before getting bit, but it only works indoors.

[Zedertone 378]

I've noticed it aswell, It's rather annoying. Have you tried Epoch? The 1.0.2.5 build they've got on epoch, you can't hit a zombie without even getting bitten lol. But yeah, I have noticed it in 1.8.

[Markokil321 5]

Yep i have also noticed this, and it sure is annoying.

Would be cool if they were to up the melee weapon range slightly or even lower the zombie hitting range by a tiny bit. :o

Edited December 2, 2013 by Markokil321

[TIC 1050]

This is addressed in the changelog for the next update.

 

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/149483-rolling-changelog-181/

[enforcer1975 1111]

That's the fun in "close combat" you can hit eachother. Having an axe or crowbar doesn't automatically hold them of a distance.

[r4z0r49 4761]

We changed the range of all melee weapons to fit a little more realistically so you can no longer hit at 4 meters. Makes using the melee weapons a little harder we should have this addressed in the 1.8.1 update.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

If the zombies can hit me before I can hit them with a machete, that's not realistic at all. I don't care what range the melee weapons get as long as the zombie attack is balanced accordingly.

[r4z0r49 4761]

"Before you can hit them" Now ask the testers this same question and they will reply the opposite they can hit them fine without being hit this topic has been brought up maybe 20 times so far. The end result as always some find it easy others find it harder.

 

Its about balance and balance takes time to get correct. Even big games like Battlefield, wow all have issues trying to balance everything and they all get paided. We do this for free so show a little respect .  

[GOD™ 2795]

Sigh...

 

 

[Death_Dealer 3155]

I've been playing vanilla DayZ (just got back into it) for a few days now and have never once gotten hit by a zombie while using melee weapons

[sausagekingofchicago 4711]

Back before these changes the melee weapons were reliable. You could dispatch zombies as they came at you without fear of being bitten.

Sounds... boring and disappointing.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

"Before you can hit them" Now ask the testers this same question and they will reply the opposite they can hit them fine without being hit this topic has been brought up maybe 20 times so far. The end result as always some find it easy others find it harder.

 

Its about balance and balance takes time to get correct. Even big games like Battlefield, wow all have issues trying to balance everything and they all get paided. We do this for free so show a little respect .  

 

I'm sorry if my post came across as disrespectful. I mean no disrespect and appreciate all the hard work you've done. I just have a passion for DayZ and can't help but speak my mind when it comes to its development. I might disagree with you sometimes, but I'll always respect your opinion and your work.

 

I understand the whole "balance takes time" thing. I'm just a little confused as to weather you want melee to stay relatively the same(after balancing) or you want to ramp up the difficulty of using a melee weapon. You say it will be address in 1.8.1, but right before that you say it makes using them harder. Are they harder because they need fixing, or are they harder because you want them to be harder?

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

Sounds... boring and disappointing.

 

Yeah. Well reliable things are usually pretty boring since they're so consistent.

 

Should we gives the rifles some messed up random trajectory? It would remove the boring and disappointing consistency of the bullets always flying straight.

 

Point being, I don't play DayZ for the amazing axe wielding dancing skills. Dancing around a barn swinging an axe at a slow walking zombie is one of the worst parts of DayZ in my opinion. Just let me hit the damn thing and let my bad decisions be the thing that gets me killed..... not the difficulty of swinging a melee weapon.

Edited December 3, 2013 by bad_mojo

[r4z0r49 4761]

I'm sorry if my post came across as disrespectful. I mean no disrespect and appreciate all the hard work you've done. I just have a passion for DayZ and can't help but speak my mind when it comes to its development. I might disagree with you sometimes, but I'll always respect your opinion and your work.

 

I understand the whole "balance takes time" thing. I'm just a little confused as to weather you want melee to stay relatively the same(after balancing) or you want to ramp up the difficulty of using a melee weapon. You say it will be address in 1.8.1, but right before that you say it makes using them harder. Are they harder because they need fixing, or are they harder because you want them to be harder?

 

The main issues with melee.

 

1/ Your unable to get up to zeds without agroing them even if you sneak.

2/ Single bullet is fired meaning you can miss when in panic state.

3/ Zeds do not hit players, Players hit them selfs when zeds are within 3 meters and line of sight!

 

 

So we tried to correct each one.

 

1/ You can now sneak right up behind zeds in most case's even touching them before they agro meaning you get well within a realistic attack range with melee.

2/ Someone suggested some time ago about swapping the single bullet to a spread shot something we are testing. This will allow you to hit the zed even if you do miss ie should allow the zed some movement freedom but still allow the player to hit the zed. The issue here is trying to get the dmg correct so you don't hit a vehicle and blow it up :-)

 

3/ this is always going to be hard when the zed is attacking the player we are working on a new system to help here.

 

As it stands from the next patch melee is more a offensive weapon then a defensive weapon. IE take the zed on your terms before they agro not after.

[TIC 1050]

I believe each melee weapon should be altered with their ranging capabilities if this were possible so in this case. 

 

they'll be unique in their own ways but the ones that are obviously stronger shouldn't be as common to find (Hatchet, Machete; these seemed to be more "sought" out in terms of an post apocalyptic world realistically.)

 

I'd also like to add that a melee weapon shouldn't only be used as a weapon, but as a tool just like a hatchet is and perhaps a crowbar could open wooden crates you see as loot items and opening them could give you a high possibility of junk loot or perhaps something very valuable ;)

 

 

Hatchet: Far

Machete: Far

Baseball Bat/Spiked: Average

Crowbar: Short

 

In variation, I'd like to see more different types of melee weapons and how it can affect your character by it's weight which means using them often could make your character feel "hot" and this could make you more hungry/thirsty as this type of movement can burn calories in which of course, can be replenished but in such consequence, you can sleep in a tent which would suffice enough. :)

 

Perhaps we could see things such as;

• Sledgehammer
• Golf Club
• Sword(Wooden, or entirely metal material. Would match the environment of historical sites like castles but need to be very rare.)
• Walking Stick

Edited December 3, 2013 by TIC321

[enforcer1975 1111]

Add penetration thresholds like in LibMod.

If a weapons penetration value isn't equal or more than the armor value of a vehicle it won't do any damage. f.e. Makarov has an AP of 1, M4 has an AP of 1.5, AKM has an AP of 2, HMMWV ( unarmored) has Armor of 2, none of the first two can damage the hull and hit anything that lies underneath but the AKM can damage the hull and hit what's inside, tires are always damagable ( Armor 0 )

Then you don't have to bother about being able to "kill" a car with an axe.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

Thanks for the reply Razor, it was very informative. I see the direction you're going with it, I just don't think it's the best course of action. I hope I'm wrong and the game is better for it.