The stealth system, noise and stances.

[lachlan04@live.com.au 37]

This is in regards to how noise and stealth in general works in DayZ.

I saw some other topics cover it briefly but I thought I could expand on the idea. Currently moving on different surfaces creates different sounds but it does not neccesarily create less sound, some other topics have addressed this as well but it is hard to tell how much noise you are actually making towards other players. Hopefully this system will be more fine-tuned to create a more immersive and stealthy experience but I think that sound improvements and Improved zombie AI alone aren't enough.

Currently when you are approaching a village and wish to get in, loot and get out all the while remaining undetected you have a few options:

You can use any stealth weapons you happen to have like hatchets, crossbows and silenced weapons to take out zombies that wander into your line of sight or detect you briefly.

You can pick around the edge of the town, loot some sheds and smaller structures that don't have zombies around them at that moment and then get out of there with what little gear you acquired.

Or the final option is to painstakingly crawl and crouch run through small alleys and slowly loot all of the buildings.

The first tactic works fine for a bit while you have a hatchet, but once you find a primary that is a little to good to pass up, axing zeds in their heads (rhyme intended) is no longer a viable option, now you are forced to either find a silenced weapon or do the slow crawl if you want to remain unseen (the big problem here is not so much having to worry about a horde of zombies, but that the screaming horde will in turn attract a bandit).

Obviously you cant just find a silenced weapon on call so your best bet now would be to try and loot all the towns slowly and avoid any zed contact. This takes way too long. Now Don't get me wrong im not proposing that the zombies be made dumber or that being stealthy be made easier at all, Instead what I am suggesting is that we need more WAYS to be stealthy, sure we have the smoke grenades to attract zombies and flares and cans can be used for that purpose too, but having a variety of different techniques will be the difference between a fresh spawn who blunders through villages attracting all the zombies in his wake and a very experienced player who knows all the tactics and ticks to silently get in and out of a town with all the best gear it had to offer.

Here are some of my suggestions:

Stances:

Crouch/Prone: A sort of arms and knees crawl that allows players to be almost as stealthy as if they were actually prone but suffer from slightly less accuracy and a higher visibility the perk being that you move faster than if you were prone and you can also get up alot quicker in-case you do happen to get spotted.

Crouch/Straight: The In-between of standing tall and crouching this stance would share its attributes in a similar way that the Crouch/Prone stance does, stances like these would also be useful for taking cover behind different objects.

Stealth mode: Not suggesting too put an easy mode on for players that is the equivalent of auto-hover but a setting that made your player automatically adjust his speed depending on the surface you are on to create minimal sound would be very useful, especially in the cities where you are going between running on grass to the inside of a building and then out onto the street.

Tactics:

Smell: This could involve leaving a piece of raw meat out to try and attract/distract zombies to/from a particular location, it could also tie in with the defecation process that is apparently going to be in the SA

Sight: Zombies should investigate any corpses they wander across, being fairly dumb creatures though after lingering around the corpse for a bit they will wander off. Also other tactics like perhaps lighting a candle in a building could be used to make all the zeds right nearby wander over to check out what it is, meanwhile you would be looting some buildings that the zeds were originally standing in front of.

Sound: This is an important one, although you can chuck cans, being able to pick up a rock off the ground and throw it too distract a zombie would be obviously very useful, other actions like shutting doors and such could be performed slowly and quietly or quickly and run the risk of attracting zombies. This could cover lots of different actions E.g. you could chose whether to eat/drink quickly or slowly depending on whether you think the zombie outside will hear you hastily munching down on some baked beans or not, this could cover actions like refuelling, repairing, reloading and a multitude of other actions that make noise. This would be used for PvP tactics as well, imagine there is a guy inside a building that you want to take out, he doesn't know you are there yet and you have decided to go in for the kill when you realize that your current AK magazine only has 2 shots in it, instead of noisily loading in another mag like you would if there were zombies running after you, you slowly slide out the old mag and slide a fresh one in while barely making any noise, thus remaining silent and giving you the drop on him.

Thats all I have for now, remember its my first post so any good criticism is welcome.

[Mitunzz 90]

I like this in-depth suggestion, good job.

The current mod allows very minimal stealth and I would love to see more options to being stealthy in Standalone.

[Dango 23]

different surfaces should have different sounds for players to hear. also light and shadows should take into play. i mean night time it totally makes you invisible but in day time, sitting in the shadow of a tree should make you less visable. or lying down in tall grass with a guillie on should too. i very much like being stealthy and following people to take them out with one shot to the head with a silenced rifle but with the very basic stealth system we have right now it just is to ridiculous to be spotted by a zombie 50m away when your in a grass suit in the middle of a field.

[joe_mcentire 2074]

due to the direction this gaming is heading (scarce ammo, close interaction with players like restraining etc) this idea needs to be discussed again. stealth gameplay needs its place ingame. so what can you do to create a realistic sneak and stealth experience on one hand and don't create a uber-mechanic as in skyrim?

 

how about a slow, careful and therefore almost noiseless movement, how about slow reloading of guns to make almost no noise, how about noiseless but far slower access to your backpack

Edited August 31, 2013 by joe_mcentire

[enforcer1975 1111]

different surfaces should have different sounds for players to hear. also light and shadows should take into play. i mean night time it totally makes you invisible but in day time, sitting in the shadow of a tree should make you less visable. or lying down in tall grass with a guillie on should too. i very much like being stealthy and following people to take them out with one shot to the head with a silenced rifle but with the very basic stealth system we have right now it just is to ridiculous to be spotted by a zombie 50m away when your in a grass suit in the middle of a field.

 

Most people are not as concealed as they might think. They stick out because they don't match the background by a nuance or because you see a solid object a bit higher than the grass. But it's normal that you stick out if you are silhouetted. With the zombies it's a major problem in scripting. They can only consider so many parameters ( surface, stance, speed, distance, daytime, weather ), if one isn't calculated right you have a bad result like a zed seeing you 5km away in tall grass while lying prone for hours.

[AP_Norris 1018]

I want the arma 3 stance changes :(

And I think noise made should depend entirely on surface and speed.

I can move just as quietly while standing as if I crouched only without my clothes rustling so much, but my figure would be larger...

If I was walking along gravel I'd have to be really gentle on how I put my foot down, paved roads not so much carpet not so much.

Broken glass should crunch under your feet and be a real stealth killer that players can make by breaking bottles at entrances.

[Karmaterror 982]

I don't have many issues with the current stealth system. I play it like the old metal gear solid games on ps1...where all the guards had FOV shown by a cone in front of them, Jus imagine the cones and try to stay out of them. Crouch walk/run keeps me fairly fee of zed trains. If I do accidently wonder into a zed FOV thiats usualy when I hit the deck and try to back up around the corner I jus turned.

 

Would defo like to see zeds investigating dead bodies, and distractions with meat and so on would be great. You could achieve the candle in a house thing by throwing a flare in there, but a candle would be more elegant and probs not as easy for players to spot.

 

I would like to see an "imitate zombie" button....then a zed could see you and not react, unless you got too close then you would be identified as an imposter lol. That could also fool players from a distance, if you were hopping round like one of the zeds :)

[joe_mcentire 2074]

I don't have many issues with the current stealth system. I play it like the old metal gear solid games on ps1...where all the guards had FOV shown by a cone in front of them, Jus imagine the cones and try to stay out of them. Crouch walk/run keeps me fairly fee of zed trains. If I do accidently wonder into a zed FOV thiats usualy when I hit the deck and try to back up around the corner I jus turned.

 

Would defo like to see zeds investigating dead bodies, and distractions with meat and so on would be great. You could achieve the candle in a house thing by throwing a flare in there, but a candle would be more elegant and probs not as easy for players to spot.

 

I would like to see an "imitate zombie" button....then a zed could see you and not react, unless you got too close then you would be identified as an imposter lol. That could also fool players from a distance, if you were hopping round like one of the zeds :)

now think about that: you don't have "only" npc enemies!

stealth may be also vital for PVP gameplay especially if you may want to surprise and/or then constrain someone.

[Karmaterror 982]

now think about that: you don't have "only" npc enemies!

stealth may be also vital for PVP gameplay especially if you may want to surprise and/or then constrain someone.

 

Yeah I know, I mentioned fooling players at the end. Tried to focus on zeds in my reply as most of the OP was about zeds ;)

[joe_mcentire 2074]

i just revived this thread becasue it kinda fits and i didn't want to make a new one ;). as i said before i just think for the way they are heading at the moment you would gain so much if you would introduce some elaborate mechanics and animations, stances for stealth and sneaky gameplay

 

prime examples could have been:

• slow opening of doors (as in amnesia) -> unfortunately also already declined by Dean
• slowly reloading of guns to reduce noise
• a unique "sneak" movement, to make as little noise as possible

Edited August 31, 2013 by joe_mcentire

[Dagwood 680]

Keep it simple. FOV and noise levels dependent upon player surface+ground surface and the speed travelled.

The more complicated the system or mechanic is, the more gamey it feels.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Dagwood