Dayz and its realisam, banditry and less ammo

[thelonewarrior 886]

There has always been two sides to the argument about dayz in real life, people would shoot on sight and become psycopaths or everyone would band together to survive.

We all know there would be some of both, but obviously minus the hackers, duping, masses of food and ammunition it would be very simple to stop spawn killing and meaningless slaughter if only there were a realistic amount of ammo.

People want to claim they like it the way it is, but finding 50 mags for an AS50 or even a M16 is virtually impossible in real life. Any weapon you find will have most 3-5 mags on average per soldier (if you find an assault rifle there)

So what im proposing is far less ammo in the standalone.

If your a bandit camping and the rifle you have found only has 10 rounds, are you really going to use it on an unarmed player that has nothing when around the corner could be a fully geared up player with 2-3 stagnag mags who is a real threat (which this much ammo should be a luxury)

Bandits would be more likely to rob people than shoot them, only stupid people would waste their precious ammo on people that are no threat.

Obviously this takes into account theres no way to hack, dupe or otherwise cheat ammo and weapons into the game, but I would like to see someone mod a map to use this as an experiment.

Maybe only have ammo when you find the weapon, and not just laying in every house and office building.

THIS IS NOT ABOUT REDUCING PVP., ITS ABOUT MAKING IT MORE TACTICAL

I simply would enjoy the game so much more if I and everyone had less ammo to spam making it more realisitc (most likely most of the ammo would have been used by the military in the initial outbreak of zeds, leaving only the few things they left behind laying around)

This would also seperate the noobs from the veteran players on sight.

Noobs running around with a couple of rounds firing at everything attracting zeds and getting mauled,

It would make players think more on their feet and having to weigh up whether firing and using their last few rounds is worth the risk.

So let the flaming begin, im sure many of you bandits with 18 NATO AS50 mags have plenty to say (which i imagine only negative responses will be from those kind of people who like to dupe ammo and never care about how much they spam)

Edited October 25, 2012 by Regulator Lone Warrior

[Inception. 9443]

The best players never aggro zombies.

But yes, I think ammo should be rarer. It would indeed make distinguishing a good player from a bad player clearer. It would also make the game harder. Zombies would be more difficult.

Edited October 25, 2012 by Inception.

[DrunkPunk 159]

gameplay > realism

that is always the answer to such things. sure, rare ammo would be cool, but it would create a very uneven playing field, as is already demonstrated in vanilla dayz. i agree pvp should be more tactical, but with the current weapons in place, it's always going to amount to the same thing: finding a sniper rifle and hanging out on a hill.

if you're looking for a more tactical approach, removing the overpowered weaponry would be the best way to go about it (thermal scopes, high power sniper rifles). that would force people to be a bit more careful, but I bet you'd see a lot less fresh spawn killing and a LOT less camping. if anything though, i would expect ammo to be about as abundant as it is and the weapons we find less frequent. but of course, reducing the frequency of weapons will just remove the majority of the fun from the game. it all goes back to my original line of this post.

[Goggalor 191]

I can agree with increasing the rarity of top tier ammo and weapons. I think the major problem at the moment is the hacking and duping. If this was solved I think top tier stuff would actually be difficult to come across and if not then it could be decided how drastic the reduction should be.

[jdz (DayZ) 238]

Derp. Try a private hive, the loot spawns are mich better than vanilla DayZ.

Don't try and force upon me what you want DayZ to be like

Edited October 25, 2012 by jdz

[tommes 331]

The best players never aggro zombies.

So you're prone all day?

But yes, I think ammo should be rarer. It would indeed make distinguishing a good player from a bad player clearer. It would also make the game harder. Zombies would be more difficult.

I play DayZ Redux from time to time, where there are very few sniper rifles in the game and where an alice pack is a rare find. Doesn't keep people from killing each other a bit. They just kill for a czech bagpack now. If they don't have ammo for their gun, they're gonna use their hatchet. Scarcity doesn't make bronies.

[That1neguy 5]

I hate to shit all over your parade buddy, but the simple fact of the matter is ammunition is stupidly common on the planet, with some 14 billion rounds of ammo produced annually around the world it will take a long damn time to run out if 90% of the population suddenly up and turned into zombies and the rest were left to survive. Some countries have such a surplus of common rifle caliber ammunition that they end up selling it to US consumers (I'm looking at you post cold war eastern block countries) by the crate. I personally own 2000+ rounds of 7.62x39 alone, you can buy Yugoslav surplus by the 1120 round spam can for around 220 USD. Ammunition proliferation is not the problem with this game, its the massive amount of duping/hacking/infinitely refilling magazines that are the problem.

[Dankine 377]

were there an apocalypse, there would still be warehouses and gun shops etc stacked to the rafters with ammo. I don't think you have a point from a realism standpoint.

[Steak and Potatoes 13480]

I hate to shit all over your parade buddy, but the simple fact of the matter is ammunition is stupidly common on the planet, with some 14 billion rounds of ammo produced annually around the world it will take a long damn time to run out if 90% of the population suddenly up and turned into zombies and the rest were left to survive. Some countries have such a surplus of common rifle caliber ammunition that they end up selling it to US consumers (I'm looking at you post cold war eastern block countries) by the crate. I personally own 2000+ rounds of 7.62x39 alone, you can buy Yugoslav surplus by the 1120 round spam can for around 220 USD. Ammunition proliferation is not the problem with this game, its the massive amount of duping/hacking/infinitely refilling magazines that are the problem.

Agreed I have over 4000 rounds of various types and a reloading station I use myself wont run out anytime soon

[Muncywolverine 236]

Uh, i'm assuming your not from america?

We all have guns and plenty of ammunition. If a survivor raided my little apartment he'd find a handgun, a scoped hunting rifle, and a shotgun. He'd also find a bunch of canned food and waterbottles. He'd also-ALSO find hydrogen peroxide and other medical supplies...

Hell this stuff is pretty common.

[xaden3 2]

I'm working on a custom version of dayz myself. i have slowed down zombies to walking and increased there numbers, made them attack vehicles, spawn even if your in vehicles and loot spawns while your in vehicles. Currently I'm trying to adjust the rate of ammo and food to make it hard to come by. The idea of just ammo with weapon spawns didnt occur to me so imma try that. If anyone can think of some other stuff to try I'd love to hear it.

[Stafoo 61]

Perhaps you could make Magazines rare and then boxes of ammo common? This would somewhat accomplish what you want since I doubt anyone would want to reload a magazine in the middle of a fire fight and people won't complain about ammo being uncommon. It would also allow people not to carry around 3 DAMN MAGS WITH 10, 4 and 5 BULLETS.

[Inception. 9443]

Well what I said was purely out of wanting the game to be more difficult as apposed to realism. I've got over ten thousand rounds of various ammunition and several firearms stored in my house. I'd be fine for a long time.

[That1neguy 5]

Well what I said was purely out of wanting the game to be more difficult as apposed to realism. I've got over ten thousand rounds of various ammunition and several firearms stored in my house. I'd be fine for a long time.

I think you will find if duping and hackers spawning items is eliminated, you will not feel that there is an overabundance of ANYTHING. If this is fixed, and in the future if a large part of the player base feels its to easy to get these things, it can always be adjusted.

[sostronk 334]

Is Chernaraus in America?

[xx_fr0st-w0lf_xx 53]

PvP will not be reduced by making ammo/items more scarcer or by making zombies harder you want to know why?

There is 2 things you can do in dayz.

1) Get Loot

2) kill other players

Once you finish #1 whats left?

Once we get that into our heads then we oculd think that maybe the way to reduce PvP is to add other things to do in the game, but what could we add to a zombie mmo that can be realistic and fun??

[thelonewarrior 886]

PvP will not be reduced by making ammo/items more scarcer or by making zombies harder you want to know why?

There is 2 things you can do in dayz.

1) Get Loot

2) kill other players

Once you finish #1 whats left?

Once we get that into our heads then we oculd think that maybe the way to reduce PvP is to add other things to do in the game, but what could we add to a zombie mmo that can be realistic and fun??

Thats just a closed minded approach to the mod, theres plenty to do, just few people see beyond killing people but thats a whole other topics with no point in going into

Again, not trying to reduce PVP, just make it more realistic.

Removing high level weapons has no effect, ive played on modded maps with no high tier snipers DMR being the longest range weapon avaliable and now everyone on there has a DMR with 100+ rounds and just spams them

There is also massive zed increased spawns on the server, this has forced players to be more cautious and stealthy as in cherno you can easily gain 100+ zeds and not have the ammo to deal with them (witth normal ammo spawns) It doesnt stop players killing players because their is too much ammo.

Stealth is still the key to survival, but its far too easy to run past the zombies, so why not just make it harder?

Carrying 10 rounds opposed to 100 is going to change a lot for a player, wasting them would be stupid and likely get them killed.

Maybe some people have a lot of ammo supplies, but the majority wouldnt and theres no way you would be able to carry more than 100-200 rounds with all your other gear you need.

Besides, like I said the military would likely seize any of these supplies they come across in the early days for their own use.

Im not trying to force a playstyle, im trying to make it harder for all players and not just one type of player.

If I wanted to 'force' a playstyle I could say no AS50s and that would only affect snipers

Im saying make the game harder in general by reducing ammo, so this affects all players and not one type of player

Edited October 26, 2012 by Regulator Lone Warrior

[xx_fr0st-w0lf_xx 53]

Thats just a closed minded approach to the mod, theres plenty to do, just few people see beyond killing people but thats a whole other topics with no point in going into

Again, not trying to reduce PVP, just make it more realistic.

Removing high level weapons has no effect, ive played on modded maps with no high tier snipers DMR being the longest range weapon avaliable and now everyone on there has a DMR with 100+ rounds and just spams them

Carrying 10 rounds opposed to 100 is going to change a lot for a player, wasting them would be stupid and likely get them killed.

Maybe some people have a lot of ammo supplies, but the majority wouldnt and theres no way you would be able to carry more than 100-200 rounds with all your other gear you need.

Besides, like I said the military would likely seize any of these supplies they come across in the early days for their own use.

That, i would love to try out new things with new people but 9/10 times its going to result in a bullet in the back of my head.

Less ammo is a possibility but in my opinion as long as you can kill other players, people will kill other players. Why shouldn't kill that man with 3 bullets when I can find 10 more on him, ammo will be so scarce pople are going to kill for ammo (I know counter productive but thats my prediction)

The best thing to do is make sniper rifle ammo very limited compared to any ther ammo, this way snipers wouldn't waste them on unarmed people but for regular ammo maybe decrease it a tiny bit

[Inception. 9443]

I think you will find if duping and hackers spawning items is eliminated, you will not feel that there is an overabundance of ANYTHING. If this is fixed, and in the future if a large part of the player base feels its to easy to get these things, it can always be adjusted.

Mmm, I suppose.

[That1neguy 5]

Thats just a closed minded approach to the mod, theres plenty to do, just few people see beyond killing people but thats a whole other topics with no point in going into

Again, not trying to reduce PVP, just make it more realistic.

Removing high level weapons has no effect, ive played on modded maps with no high tier snipers DMR being the longest range weapon avaliable and now everyone on there has a DMR with 100+ rounds and just spams them

There is also massive zed increased spawns on the server, this has forced players to be more cautious and stealthy as in cherno you can easily gain 100+ zeds and not have the ammo to deal with them (witth normal ammo spawns) It doesnt stop players killing players because their is too much ammo.

Stealth is still the key to survival, but its far too easy to run past the zombies, so why not just make it harder?

Carrying 10 rounds opposed to 100 is going to change a lot for a player, wasting them would be stupid and likely get them killed.

Maybe some people have a lot of ammo supplies, but the majority wouldnt and theres no way you would be able to carry more than 100-200 rounds with all your other gear you need.

Besides, like I said the military would likely seize any of these supplies they come across in the early days for their own use.

Im not trying to force a playstyle, im trying to make it harder for all players and not just one type of player.

If I wanted to 'force' a playstyle I could say no AS50s and that would only affect snipers

Im saying make the game harder in general by reducing ammo, so this affects all players and not one type of player

Sure you can do that, just don't claim you are doing it because of "realism" when its not realistic and is instead done for balancing.

Edit: and the ammount of ammo you can carry is entirely dependent on the person and the caliber, I could carry a brick of 2000 .22lr as easily as I could carry 5 - 600 rounds of 5.56, and thats not including loaded magazines in a chest rig.

Edited October 26, 2012 by That1neguy

[sostronk 334]

Play WarZ. There is alot less ammo and weapons in that. Its still a deathmatch. There in no reason not to kill someone and there is no benefit in keeping them alive. Humanity sees some really small nerfs to bandits (like movement speed). But they have almost no effect at all. For the serious bandits, like I was before I quit, there needs to be larger handicaps for bandits. Once you get to a certain point your profiting from banditry so much that there is no challenge whatsoever.