Chernarus Plus; climate, vegetation and ground variety

[Septimus 9]

I did a short search about Chernarus Plus and what was already suggested, the results were a bit broad to be honest, so I decided to share my bit anyway.

I've read a decent amount of excerpts from what Rocket said about the actual Chernarus Plus, I understand him and and his team are keeping the actual content pretty the close to the chest for obvious reasons, so maybe some of the things I suggest will be pretty obvious and some of them not so much, but these are features I'd really like to see in the standalone, and I know people will agree on some of them so here it goes;

The only recurring bit of information was that the map was going to be larger and if they wanted to keep 200 or more players on each server they would have to work on that. So considering those facts and seeing that the servers now are more than capable of handling 100 players, the map is going to be twice as large to say the least.

That said, it'd really suck to see a single climate or type of ground on Chernarus Plus. If there is enough variety on a single map there won't be a real need for additional maps, and since it's pretty obvious Rocket and his team are not complete morons, it definently won't have a single type of ground or vegetation on a map that is twice as big so here it goes;

- I want to see at least 3 types of ground on Chernarus, the usual lush grasslands of the original Chernarus, a tundra or may be arctic soil I don't know, and desert, perhaps semi-arid. But in a nutshell there should be, GRASS - SNOW - SAND, for people who are not so familiar with the types soil, and these features may even bore more amazing features;

• Since it would be pretty surreal to have grass turning to into frozen ground in one pixel, we'd need 2 other types of ground to compensate for the "degrade" effect, obviously.
  
• The means of survival changes according to the environment and habitat, it'd be really cool to actually see the variety of means of survival in a single game. Not mention the variety of items. You'd need a different ghillie suits for each of these climates, otherwise you'd be a sitting duck for others. You'd need actual thermal clothing in order to survive in the cold, in even colder climates you'd still need shelter or heatpacks. In the desert if you're wearing the thermal clothing you'll get dehydrated perhaps 8 times as fast haha. If you are in regular clothes 4 times as fast. If you are in desert clothings 2 times as fast compared to the normal climate.
  
• Say you have a coyote back pack with all slots full, you have an as 50 at your back, and a L85 AWS at your hand (why you would need thermal vision in desert climate beats me but anyways) Because you are carrying a lot you're losing fluids faster. The maths are up for debate.
  
• Now since it's harder to reach those places, it should be more rewarding when you do. More military loot, more vehicles, less zombies if Rocket decides they actually give a shit about the climate. This I think, is a key point for the variety's existence, other than cosmetic value.
  

- Now for the cool effects that we might see in those different environments;

• Frostbite: After a while, if you don't have thermal gear to protect you from the cold, you are bound to have this. Effects should be obvious, shaking hands therefore bad aim. Perhaps painkillers should help, this is up for a debate but even if you do use those painkillers to suppress the effects you are eventually going to get..
  
• Gangrene: Now it really sucks to be you. I'm kind of indecisive about the effects, maybe after sometime you drop dead, if it actually moves further away from your extremities. Even so bad aim should be incurable with pain-killers and limping should follow, eventually death. Now I know for a fact that some of you might really enjoy chopping off your friends fingers, arms and legs with a hunting knife for fun, but I don't really see how that adds to the gameplay. I would love to see it though, perhaps if it's not the trigger finger sometimes it's ok to chop a finger, or a leg could be substituted with a prosthetic leg considering our survival was surgeon before the zombie apocalypse (sarcasm).
  
• Cold: You get cold faster. (duh) But when you're in desert at night it's freezing, and at arctic it's now really cold.
  
• Sleepiness: This is something I'm not really sure of, maybe I want to see this because I want to slap my friend in-game because he suddenly thinks it's a good idea to sleep in the middle of a blizzard. But it really can contribute to the gameplay, lone wolves would sometimes give in to the cold in the tundra, start moving slower and slower and die eventually.
  
• Mirage: When you're dehydrated and in a desert, even though your hydration meter doesn't cause you to lose blood, if it's say, light red, there should be a chance that you'll start seeing mirages. Towns, players, oasis, zombies, travelling vehicles you name it.
  
• Sunburn: Sun burns, it hurts, you lose blood and fluids, and bandages aren't gonna stop it. Happens when you are out in the sun in deserts for extended amounts of time without shade or shelter.
  

- Now for the elevation, as I don't think vegetation is subject that should be debated for so long and there aren't any spesific types of shrubs that I'd love to see in the standalone.

• Mountains: I really want to see mountains in the standalone, like proper mountains; rocky, impossible to climb unless there are certain routes that you know for a fact that they will eventually lead you to the top or whatever, otherwise you might meet dead ends. Now whether or not there should be good loot sometimes is up for debate, but I really think that it would make a difference for setting up camps, hiding stuff. But what I'm sure of, is that PvP in the mountains would add to the game as there players must come up different strategies.
  
• Valleys: Where there are is elevation, there are valleys, where there are valleys, there is the advantage of higher ground. I think this pretty much covers it.
  
• Blizzards: You get cold faster, and therefore all the other effects faster. You move slower and of course visibility is minimum if not zero.
  
• Sandstorms: Visibility, dehydration maybe if you don't have desert gear, slower movement.
  

TL;DR: Read the bold parts, if you are interested read more.

There are other stuff that I like to add, which I'll with time, which I don't have now, but for now, what do you guys think?

Edited October 12, 2012 by Septimus

[Brint 40]

I like your ideas, they would add a lot to the game I think. Would you plan of snow actually falling though? Because I know people whine about their FPS when it rains.

[Sam.B 18]

I really want mountains in the standalone but i am not so sure about the desert idea. It seems a bit out of place even though Chernarus is nearby Takistan. If there was some kind of transition between Chernarus and a desert it would be pretty good.

[IncognitoNico 71]

Like the ideas so have beans! :) but you gotta keep in mind the realism... Chenarus is based in a real life place, located in Russia... where are you going to find a desert in freaking Russia? I think they should have different types of environment, but not Desert maybe have some places colder or hotter than other places and also have those tundra environments That's why I think for a desert it would be better to bring out another map, I believe they said they wanted to have some of the custom maps in the mod, so we could have takistan or falujah for a desert envitonment.

[skilpad 43]

Cool

[Septimus 9]

I really want mountains in the standalone but i am not so sure about the desert idea. It seems a bit out of place even though Chernarus is nearby Takistan. If there was some kind of transition between Chernarus and a desert it would be pretty good.

Like the ideas so have beans! :) but you gotta keep in mind the realism... Chenarus is based in a real life place, located in Russia... where are you going to find a desert in freaking Russia? I think they should have different types of environment, but not Desert maybe have some places colder or hotter than other places and also have those tundra environments That's why I think for a desert it would be better to bring out another map, I believe they said they wanted to have some of the custom maps in the mod, so we could have takistan or falujah for a desert envitonment.

I actually did keep realism in mind, and I know for a fact that Chernarus is based on a real place which I thought was Ukraine since we can see sea to our south and east. And even though it's only based on those places for political reasons (Takistan, Pakistan I mean come on) I think small sacrifices can be made from both Geological, Geopolitical and Geomorphological aspects, as in no 220km2 or 1000km2 map could have both arctic, forested and desert climates in real world.

But I must say I only thought Chernarus Plus was related to Chernarus name-only, which is really dumb I know. But I think, and this really is a personal view that you shouldn't really spend time on, having a large map that is say 880km2 - which is 4 times the size of the map right now, and having 4 times the amount of maximum players right now, which basically means 800 players per server, experiencing all the possible climates on a single map should really satisfy the players. I mean changing servers with the gear you have on you is only cool with the situtation we're in right now.

Also bear in mind 800 players per server means, when it's full there will be on average 0.8 players per square kilometer, which is roughly 4 times lower then today's Kamchatka, which is a radioactive peninsula that is 270,000 km². And less servers with greater populations is a good thing in my opinion, people can't go in to empty servers to farm good loot, more clan wars, less admin abuses since not everyone can afford to host a 800 player server.

But if you argue that major cities would really be overcrowded, that could easily be solved with changing spawn points, which will roughly solve the problem, if you still debate it'll be overcrowded, I must say where there is loot, there are people.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Septimus

[karlthecoolguy@hotmail.com 9]

I actually did keep realism in mind, and I know for a fact that Chernarus is based on a real place which I thought was Ukraine since we can see sea to our south and east. And even though it's only based on those places for political reasons (Takistan, Pakistan I mean come on) I think small sacrifices can be made from both Geological, Geopolitical and Geomorphological aspects, as in no 220km2 or 1000km2 map could have both arctic, forested and desert climates in real world.

But I must say I only thought Chernarus Plus was related to Chernarus name-only, which is really dumb I know. But I think, and this really is a personal view that you shouldn't really spend time on, having a large map that is say 880km2 - which is 4 times the size of the map right now, and having 4 times the amount of maximum players right now, which basically means 800 players per server, experiencing all the possible climates on a single map should really satisfy the players. I mean changing servers with the gear you have on you is only cool with the situtation we're in right now.

Also bear in mind 800 players per server means, when it's full there will be on average 0.8 players per square kilometer, which is roughly 4 times lower then today's Kamchatka, which is a radioactive peninsula that is 270,000 km². And less servers with greater populations is a good thing in my opinion, people can't go in to empty servers to farm good loot, more clan wars, less admin abuses since not everyone can afford to host a 800 player server.

But if you argue that major cities would really be overcrowded, that could easily be solved with changing spawn points, which will roughly solve the problem, if you still debate it'll be overcrowded, I must say where there is loot, there are people.

Its really unlikely that the arma 2 or 2.5 engine could even handle 800 players lol

[Zeppa 562]

I would like them to introduce seasons... no need for actual desert, maybe hot days at summer and cold at winter...

[Septimus 9]

I like your ideas, they would add a lot to the game I think. Would you plan of snow actually falling though? Because I know people whine about their FPS when it rains.

Well why not, but then again I'm not on the dev team so I wouldn't now about the aspects, although if they're going to be like flying pollen that gives me a heart attack on a regular basis whenever I'm on the scope, I see no harm in that.

I would like them to introduce seasons... no need for actual desert, maybe hot days at summer and cold at winter...

You do realise that'd mean on a spesific server it'd take 3 months for seasons to change? ^^

If you want to make that faster you'd have to make days shorter, if you want seasons to change weekly how short the days would be?

It could be static though, permanent winter servers etc. But I don't see how that adds to gameplay as beginners would never choose to spawn on a winter or summer server since it only carries penalties for them.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Septimus

[Bludy 324]

i'd love climate intervention..and having it creating trouble when trying to survive, i want to be forced to stay under a shelter fearing to froze

[Hydra (DayZ) 472]

There had better be some brooding nearly-grayscale abandonned soviet factories and power plants around... Gotta give the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. players some love :D

[hawc 63]

Chernarus is based on czech republic, the home country of Bohemia Interactive (you may know some games they made like arma2 and OA).

And suggestions are supposed to be realistically achievable.

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

Hawc. :facepalm:

Which sea is to the south and east of the Czech Republic?

Edited October 12, 2012 by Chabowski

[Bat (DayZ) 230]

What Hawc said. The map won't be twice as big and we won't have 200 players per server.

But seasons could be interesting. There's already a version of Chernarus in summer (for AOCR) check it out on youtube.

Now the main problem for dynamic seasons is that it would require like a year of development to have something that may look really shitty. Because you have a lot of stuff to program, a lot of textures to change, and a lot of problems in the way (it would require every texture and a lot of models to change dynamically, I imagine the whole shit to clip awfully every second and other horrible texture blending problems. It might look really bad.)

However I'm not against making the north part of the map slightly colder, with a bit of snow on the ground (just some basic map editing), and also replace rain by snow when you're up north. Also your body temp would drop faster so you would have find the right clothes to travel to devil's castle or the airfields.

[Bat (DayZ) 230]

Hawc. :facepalm:

Which sea is to the south and east of the Czech Republic?

On the original satellite data for chernarus the sea is actually a river.

check this out :

Edited October 12, 2012 by Bat

[mr_chabowski@live.co.uk 2416]

On the original satellite data for chernarus the sea is actually a river.

Obviously I need to work on my fictional geography.

EDIT AGAIN:

Found what I was looking for here

There are areas North of the Povrly river exactly the same as in Chernarus. Those Bohemia Interactive dudes are badass.

Chernarus+ is going to blow peoples minds.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Chabowski

[Zeppa 562]

Here you go, map of RL "chernarus" on googlemaps.

They should shorten the day aswell ingame, so people that play only days could experience the night time too. Like 6h day 6h night.

And I would like the seasons made aswell, like month of everything or so... I dont think the time should be directly linked to server timezone. That "Povrly" in the map is our elektro..

https://maps.google....ved=0CCUQ8gEwAA

Edited October 12, 2012 by Zeppa

[Septimus 9]

Well I guess this thread is now about real life Chernarus.

Good work chaps.

[starwarsfan@gmx.de 450]

A big 'No, no' on the different terrain idea. A lush forrest area like chernarus is right now next to a desert terrain? Just doesn't make sense. I guess mountains could be featuring snow terrain up top, though I doubt that any of the 'mountains' on chernarus would be high enough for that to be plausible. I much prefer Zappa's suggestion about adding seasons. It's much more authentic and you wouldn't be able to escape the climate by simply walking a few miles, you'd actually have to deal with it. That would also bring more value to different clothing. You might not be needing that big ass jacket now, but summer's coming to an end and you could be needing it in a few days.

Also, a mirage is not a hallucination and is not dependent on your state of mind or how thirsty you are.

[TD-4242 12]

In order to achive the transitions within a reasonable amount of geographic distance the maps would have to be much larger. One of my suggestions from my post here http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/100361-list-of-suggestions-trying-not-to-repeat-others/ was to have maps run on servers that stitch together. To get from a low desert to a snow capped mountain should take a least 30-45 mins in stright high way like road by car at top speed and really should be more like 2-3 hours though that may be getting too big.

Huge maps!! One World! (or at least many very large worlds)

Problem: As it is, once you have a car the current map size gets small very fast, a helicopter makes it down right tiny. It is difficult to find a truly secluded spot.

Suggestion: making maps/servers able to be linked seamlessly together (as long as the maps are designed to stitch together of course). I'd guess that with a central Hive server it could be made to automatically sign you into neighboring servers. These could be run on the same host if the hardware is strong enough or multiple hosts. Eventually this would lead to a huge world.