Stunned - knocking someone out with a club

[Perplexelerator 20]

This is an idea that I think would appeal to all kinds of players, from those who just want to help people to those who want to play as, er, demented sadists.

There are a few problems with this idea, and I will get back to them further down. There are probably other problems as well.

But I hope this feature could be implemented somehow.

I think it would be great if it would work like follows:

- As you get knocked out you fall and land/roll over on your back, and you are unable to move.

- You are not unconscious, but merely knocked out or stunned, so you get the near death blurred vision and hearing loss that is already in the game.

- You also have only 1st person perspective and can lift your head up a little and move it from side to side.

- You are unable to communicate, your mic won't work.

- You can hear the other player, but only barely due to the hearing loss.

- You suffer no blood loss.

The eerie and maybe humiliating bit is that you now are totally at the mercy of the other player. You are lying there helpless and can only wonder what the player will do next. He can loot you and run away. He can get in your face, taunt you, put a gun to your face and pull the trigger, or not. And you don't even get a word in.

This feature would be great for players who would like to loot other players, but not kill them.

It would also be nice for demented sadists. Also, their victims could have a little horror story to tell, like the following example:

"So I get knocked out cold, and I'm like oh no, not like this! I'm lying there, and I see this blurry figure standing by my legs with an axe. He then chops at one of my legs and slowly walks a few feet to the side. I'm bleeding badly, so the moment I come back to my senses I have to bandage. He then just pulls out a gun and shoots me in the face!"

This feature would also be great for people that are desperate to help other players, like those that are so scared of other players that they shoot everyone on sight. Sneak up on them, knock them out, and give them stuff! :D

While they are out cold, you could shout funny things in their ear: "Sorry to knock you out, mate, it's just the safest way to help people these days... Have a good one when you get back on your feet!"

Are you a group leader? Keep those pesky insubordinates in line. Knock them over the head, and tell them a thing or two, like "Next time you won't be so... alive!"

Are you a couple of bandits? Loot people the safer way. One points the gun, the other knocks the player out. Loot, shoot (or not), and run!

Are you drunk while playing with your friends? Give them a gentle tap on the head, and tell them how much you love them while they're down! Aww!

If you just want to be a ruthless killer, give yourself a challenge and kill in this way. Think of the added humiliation and the opportunity to taunt your victim before you kill him! (Lol, did I just say that? It's like a commercial for demented psychos.)

Joking aside, the point is that such a feature could support all sorts of playstyles and creative ideas.

You don't have to sneak up on people to knock them out. You could hide in buildings and knock them out when they come through a door. You could also manage to knock them out after they have seen you, but this is going to be harder.

I think the hitbox for the club should be strictly limited to the head, maybe even to only parts of the head if possible. So if you meet someone with an axe, the guy with the axe clearly has the upper hand.

I'm not sure how long the knock-out effect should last, but maybe somewhere between 30 seconds to a minute? Thieves must at least have time enough to loot and get to a relatively safe distance without having to sprint.

Important point: Clubs are totally ineffective against zeds.

One obvious problem with this feature is the following easy exploit: Knock somebody out, wait until the get-up animation has just finished and knock them out again, repeat over and over. The other player would be constantly knocked out and unable to do anything about it, so he would be forced to abort and disconnect.

A solution could be some kind of delay (like a cooldown effect) after the player had gotten back on his feet, so that you couldn't knock him out again until 10 or so seconds has passed. Maybe that could work?

Another problem might be that some people can't handle the humiliation and will just disconnect or Alt+F4. I don't know...

Also, if it is possible to loot everything they have, they might commit suicide to respawn. They might reason like this: "Well, if I respawn, at least I have SOMETHING." That's a good point, and suicides (of all sorts) should be avoided, IMO.

So maybe it should not be possible to take everything? One possibility is that if you take everything or nearly everything from them, they automatically get back the basic stuff they start with (flashlight, bandage, etc.). It's a bit silly, but there should be no good reason to commit suicide in the game, IMO.

I don't know, I think it could be a great feature, but could it be made to work in the game?

More importantly, have I missed something fundamental here and now have egg on my face? :)

To sum up:

- Club is totally ineffective against zeds.

- Hitbox on player: head or part of head.

- Getting hit over the head -> Lying on back, unable to move, unable to speak, blurred vision, reduced hearing.

- While knocked out: can be looted and/or killed.

- If everything or nearly everything is looted, gets back respawn supplies automatically after below mentioned cooldown effect to avoid suicide.

- Knockout effect duration: around 30-60 secs.

- Cooldown effect (time before player can get knocked out a second time): around 10 secs.

Let me know your thoughts. I'm pretty new to this anti-game.

[CerebralZombie (DayZ) 151]

I will finish reading the other half, but I could see something like this in game!

Imagine having the ability to sneak up behind a player and whack him/her with the butt of your gun or a blunt object of some sort to knock them out? You wouldn't have to kill them, and you'd be able to loot them. I could work on many levels, and would be cool to see implemented!

[CerebralZombie (DayZ) 151]

Okay so I've read the rest, and see your points. They would definitely have to allow the player to only get knocked out once, get up, than wait 30sec to a minute after getting up to be knocked out once again. Also would have to make it so a player can't disconnect after being knocked out, or in many other situations too in that case. Most players that loot another player don't take all of their loot, so they should be fine in the suicide department. It would be more rare occasion to lose everything, although the player doing the knocking out may have just spawned and could only find a blunt object, but while looking for said blunt object, they would obviously find other supplies too.

I could see it being implemented into the standalone, but we will have to see what other features they have planned to fully make it work.

[Kajin 25]

The only real problem I see with this is that knocking someone out in real life so very rarely works like the way it does in the movies. In real life, if you hit someone on the head hard enough to knock them out then you've probably just given them a fatal brain hemorrhage that'll kill them a few hours down the road.

Maybe an electrified stun gun, or shotgun shells that shoot electrified bullets (that actually exists, btw.) Failing that, maybe a stealthy takedown animation that can only be used on someone from behind that causes you to grab them in a sleeper hold and strangle them into unconsciousness.

[CerebralZombie (DayZ) 151]

The only real problem I see with this is that knocking someone out in real life so very rarely works like the way it does in the movies. In real life, if you hit someone on the head hard enough to knock them out then you've probably just given them a fatal brain hemorrhage that'll kill them a few hours down the road.

Maybe an electrified stun gun, or shotgun shells that shoot electrified bullets (that actually exists, btw.) Failing that, maybe a stealthy takedown animation that can only be used on someone from behind that causes you to grab them in a sleeper hold and strangle them into unconsciousness.

So true! :lol:

I wasn't thinking that since just yesterday I heard of a few juvi teens knocked this lady guard out and took her keys then escaped for less than 24hrs. I pictured it like in the movies, when they may have been lucky, or had to hit her repeatedly.

[birdman 108]

If you have the skill to sneak up on someone you definately deserve to knock them out without losing (whatever the humanity system will be) humanity and get some well deserved l00t.

[Perplexelerator 20]

The only real problem I see with this is that knocking someone out in real life so very rarely works like the way it does in the movies. In real life, if you hit someone on the head hard enough to knock them out then you've probably just given them a fatal brain hemorrhage that'll kill them a few hours down the road.

Maybe an electrified stun gun, or shotgun shells that shoot electrified bullets (that actually exists, btw.) Failing that, maybe a stealthy takedown animation that can only be used on someone from behind that causes you to grab them in a sleeper hold and strangle them into unconsciousness.

I agree that realistically the club will not give the result I would like to have in the game, and it may seem rather contrived. A stun gun is a much better idea. :)

I would prefer the one you have to hold against the body, not the taser gun that shoots the thing with the wires and has a short range of a few meters.

Anyway, I wanted something that would incapacitate but not render unconscious, and I think a stun gun would come the closest to that. The problem with being completely unconscious would be that the victim would have to sit and stare at a black screen for 30-60 seconds, and I wanted to avoid that.

Being incapacitated (lying on your back) with blurred vision, reduced hearing and be able to move the head a little would make it a far more intense experience for the stunned person, only being able to lie there and wonder what the other player will do next.

So, from the victim's perspective I was going for the intense experience of helplessness, like holding your breath while you wonder whether the attacker will let you live or not.

From the attacker's perspective, I was first and foremost going for non-lethal incapacitation so that you could loot people without killing them. On the other hand, it opens up so many other possibilities for the attacker as mentioned with a few examples in the original post.

I will wait and see what happens with the standalone. Maybe something like this could be worked in to it, maybe not.

But I do feel there should at least be some way of looting without killing. Some way that will be more difficult than shooting, for sure, but certainly achievable.

Thanks for your input, guys.

[rn_max 202]

If whacking people over the back of the head is good enough for movies, then I don't see why not in a game. The blackjack was a mainstay of the Thief series as a non lethal attack and Looking Glass weren't inundated with players waving the reality card.

Tazers and stun prods are widely used by law enforcement agencies, so why not add them as well?

As for how, the means is already in place to incapacitate players using the low blood fainting mechanism.

Edited September 28, 2012 by RN_Max

[tigerww2 24]

how about a first hit knocks them out

if you keep bludgeoning them it starts dropping their blood pressure (but they dont bleed)

and it does hurt zeds

it does 3/4ths as much damage as a hatchet (its blunt, not bladed)

Edited September 29, 2012 by tigerww2