It shall not punish gameplay styles

[legwiz 0]

Not being able to trust everyone you meet is part of the game' date=' just as important as your guns and gear and more challenging than any game of this caliber. If you eliminate this key aspect of the game you will take away from the spirit of the game, and the challenges you take.

I am glad the bandit skin is gone, it was too easy to identify player killers and it forced people to take sides, now you have a new level and dimension of gameplay which is mass paranoia and discovering for yourselves how you learn to trust one another.

Reputations while they play a key role also can be changed at will, anyone can change their name at anytime. Bandits always say they are friendly and how you deal with people you meet is up to you to decide. It is a freedom your given that not too many games explore. If you want to trade this freedom for what you deem as a personal security and comfort you are doing a disservice to the essence of the game experience.

It is less about being hard core than it is exploring options other games don't even touch. If something is not working for you then change things up, approach players differently, what players choose to do is up to them to decide and the game mechanics do not force me to play any way but how I choose and I hope this never changes.

[/quote']

Freedom is something I do enjoy in DayZ too, but tell me where do my point breaks your freedom? Am I suggesting to make PvE servers or PvP flags? No.

About approaching players differently, tell me what are all these many other approaches that differs from asking for "friendly" and don't shooting at sight? You don't know him, he doesn't know you, nothing to symbolize his intentions towards you, and life meaning shit. There is no other option rather than being quicker than him to shoot.

I just can't figure when people says that the game "is this way" and you have to find some way else to do. First, it's a game, not reality, you're limited to a game scope and cannot invent something from nowhere. Also, it's a Alpha, time to introduce new features as rocket said many times, so the hell the game is it and period, we're discussing and giving ideas that can handle some issue without taking the freedom it offers as a sandbox.

[Wüstenfuchs (DayZ) 105]

Form my personal experience, 9 out of 10 players have adopted kill-on-sight. With those odds, approaching strangers is no longer an option. Even the most patient person can only take certain amount of disappointments to realize that co-operating with strangers is pointless.

Since I personally refuse to adopt kill-on-sight, only option remains to stay with known friends and avoid strangers completely. I think this is a pity, because meeting up and interacting with strangers used to be a very interesting feature in this mod.

If the current trend continues and consequence is not introduced for mindless killing, eventually DayZ will be nothing but a team death match. Those who previously were friendly, will be converted into kill-on-sight or avoid-on-sight after they realize how small chance there is to actually meet someone who is friendly. Many will stop playing because they are not interested in death match without interaction.

[-A2L-Jono 1]

Everyone needs to realize that you are going to get killed a lot. You say you like to group up. Let's say if this happened in real life, not everyone is going to like that. There would be a lot of paranoia. I for one don't trust anyone unless I knew them prior. You need to get it through your head that not everyone wants to group up. There are no problems with the PvP system, people just need to stop being so trusting.

[worst2first 71]

Jono' pid='97946' dateline='1339551981']

Everyone needs to realize that you are going to get killed a lot. You say you like to group up. Let's say if this happened in real life' date=' not everyone is going to like that. There would be a lot of paranoia. I for one don't trust anyone unless I knew them prior. You need to get it through your head that not everyone wants to group up. There are no problems with the PvP system, people just need to stop being so trusting.

[/quote']

Did you even read what Wüstenfuchs wrote? The problem isn't naive people trusting strangers - the opposite has happened and DayZ is becoming nothing more than a team death match game that happens to have zombies.

[MayhemMike 3]

The problem with freedom is that at some point you will have good number of ppl abusing that freedom when there are no consequences.

For example, after you've spawned there is absolutely no reason (game-mechanicwise) why you shouldn't run into the closest town and kill the first guy you meet. If you succeed you might get some nice stuff to start your actual journey, but if you fail, nothing is lost.

[-A2L-Jono 1]

I haven't seen that at all. I have grouped up with many people. Even if it goes against my trusting and it worked fine. I wasn't betrayed or anything. There is nothing they could do to the PvP that would improve the game. It would just make it worse, just like having bandits did.

[Virfortis 111]

DayZ will never achieve social interaction because it is built on allowing players to do what they want in a chat room where they have a gun.

I'm sorry to say, I used to believe that community was the reason DayZ had gone to shit, but the truth of it is that it's the simple fact that DayZ is an FPS that makes it lack what gamers want. There's a very similar situation in a little browser based game called Sherwood Forest (Maid Marian Games) where it was a "global" chat room and you could team up to fight monsters.

You get on nowadays, there's tons of features and even a dungeon system, but nobody does much chatting...they just try to kill people who are a different color (I.E. not in your group).

You can say it's part of the game, but then it's not really a game is it? A game is something people play for entertainment...and very few people find pop-up shooting galleries fun when they're over 20. It simple, when players (can't call them gamers really) are put in an environment where they CAN kill people, they WILL. This is because they've been conditioned over the years that killing is "what is best in life" and think that's the only thing there is. They lack even the basic desire for social interaction.

[Wüstenfuchs (DayZ) 105]

Jono' pid='97946' dateline='1339551981']You say you like to group up. Let's say if this happened in real life' date=' not everyone is going to like that. There would be a lot of paranoia.[/quote']

Sure there would be paranoia, that's just normal. However, paranoia doesn't mean people would start killing other survivors on sight, it just means people are more cautious and don't trust each other easily.

Jono' pid='97946' dateline='1339551981']I for one don't trust anyone unless I knew them prior. You need to get it through your head that not everyone wants to group up. There are no problems with the PvP system' date=' people just need to stop being so trusting.[/quote']

If someone doesn't want to group up, the real life behavior would be to kill-on-sight? I don't think so. If you prefer to be a loner and happen to bump into other survivors, you can tell them to back off and leave you alone. Hunting other survivors down, shooting them in the back, and killing on sight is just retarded.

[-A2L-Jono 1]

If this happened in real life and I saw someone else that was armed that I didn't want to be with, I would see it as an opportunity to get more supplies and to eliminate the chance of being shot in the back.

[Wüstenfuchs (DayZ) 105]

Jono' pid='98014' dateline='1339553631']

If this happened in real life and I saw someone else that was armed that I didn't want to be with' date=' I would see it as an opportunity to get more supplies and to eliminate the chance of being shot in the back.[/quote']

Someone who can kill other person just like that would be considered to be a a psychopath (which are very small minority of the total population) and don't really represent the behavior of majority of people.

[Ejaculacid 19]

Jono' pid='98014' dateline='1339553631']

If this happened in real life and I saw someone else that was armed that I didn't want to be with' date=' I would see it as an opportunity to get more supplies and to eliminate the chance of being shot in the back.[/quote']

If you could kill another person just like that in real life, you are a psychopath (which are very small minority of the total population) and don't really represent the behavior of majority of people.

You're assuming people wouldnt crack under the stress of being in a DayZ environment ;)

[legwiz 0]

Jono' pid='97946' dateline='1339551981']

Everyone needs to realize that you are going to get killed a lot.

Yes' date=' and this is completely common to me, and it's not even near the real focus of this thread.

Jono' pid='97946' dateline='1339551981']

You say you like to group up.  Let's say if this happened in real life, not everyone is going to like that. You need to get it through your head that not everyone wants to group up. There are no problems with the PvP system, people just need to stop being so trusting.

So keep impossible to group up ingame is fine to you, but having someway to recognize people intentions or even reputation is limiting gameplay?

There is no "too much trust" problem that you say so, it's just otherwise, no one trusts nobody. I don't see how can you play with someone else without giving the minimum amount of trust. I think the extreme of the sides are just not good.

The real situation is: I try to kill him, because he thinks I will try to kill him. And this way, two persons that would be willing to group up, kill each other, capiche?

I thought I made it clear when I said that, even though I like to group up, of course I also like to PvP. I just don't like when I kill someone that would not harm me or vice-versa, without having a "clue", when other gameplay styles succeed to dirty even a player's word, and a "friendly" means nothing.

Jono' pid='97993' dateline='1339553238']

I haven't seen that at all. I have grouped up with many people. Even if it goes against my trusting and it worked fine. I wasn't betrayed or anything.

One person experience doesn't make statistics.

[DryGulch 32]

I'm sure rocket will eventually re-introduce some kind of punishment for the murderers who end up with low humanity.

Every time you post on this topic, you're sure Rocket is going to start penalizing players for engaging in PVP. I sure as hell hope you're wrong because that goes against the idea of a sandbox entirely.

[MulePunch 0]

The problem is not the game...but the old saying that a few bad apples spoil the bunch. My first day playing this game (quite a while ago now) I came up on a guy in the woods who whose overlooking on a town. I was so excited I had found another player. I sat behind him for about 3 minutes trying to chat to him to ask is he was friendly. He never moved. All of a sudden I see him start to look around, so I begin to type Frien....that as far as I got before he turned around and shot me in the face. Once that happened, I said never again. From that point on, I have changed by play style from friendly to KOS. I will not actively track another survivor down; however, if you get to close to me...I will shoot you. I see so many people baiting others into helping them out (saying they are low on blood and need a transfusion) only to see the person that was going to help out die in chat. I trust no one but my real life friends in this game.

[gator (DayZ) 22]

Rocket said he took out bandit skins because it was giving him trouble with updating / coding. it had nothing to do with punishing game styles or anything like that.

The problem with the "gamestyle" choices that you are all complaining / posting suggestions about is that they are only relevant if this is a game that needed balancing. It isnt. It is a multiplayer arma map with zombies, thats all it is. If and when a "game" is made, then balancing playstyles and whatnot will be relevant. Until then, you are all just bitching about something that only exists in your minds / fantasy as to what thype of game this mod will become.

[Virfortis 111]

I'm sure rocket will eventually re-introduce some kind of punishment for the murderers who end up with low humanity.

Every time you post on this topic' date=' you're sure Rocket is going to start penalizing players for engaging in PVP. I sure as hell hope you're wrong because that goes against the idea of a sandbox entirely.

[/quote']

So does abusing the respawn function, using that as an excuse to kill everyone like an on-rail shooter, but you don't seem to be against that.

[DryGulch 32]

So does abusing the respawn function' date=' using that as an excuse to kill everyone like an on-rail shooter, but you don't seem to be against that.

[/quote']

First of all, I don't think you completely understand what an "on-rail shooter" actually is. Here's a hint, it's not DayZ. Timecrisis was one.

Secondly, PVP and dying is part of the mod, an integral part. I think if you look at the game engine that it is built on, you might get more of an idea. I hate that this has to be pointed out to some people, but there you go.

Lastly, it's not "abusing the respawn function", both players have an equal opportunity to win/survive the encounter. Abusing a game mechanic tends to yield an unfair advantage.

Sadly, none of this is going to get through to you.

[legwiz 0]

I'm sure rocket will eventually re-introduce some kind of punishment for the murderers who end up with low humanity.

Every time you post on this topic' date=' you're sure Rocket is going to start penalizing players for engaging in PVP. I sure as hell hope you're wrong because that goes against the idea of a sandbox entirely.

[/quote']

I may not agree with a system punishment to a game style either, it would limit it. I think, if something needs to be done against a gamestyle that is being repudiating by most, it shall be done ingame, by the other players.

Oh wait, who am I going to kill? The first guy I encounter with? And if he is not a murderer? I will kill for nothing. Ok, I'm gonna be friendly. Well, sad for me, he put a bullet in my head while I was trying to say hi. He indeed was not willing to kill me, but he thought I WERE a murderer, and there were nothing that could told him the opposite, nothing but my word, that worths as much as the words from the real murderers. Just clairying that this is encounter of two "willing to group up" persons. Oh wait again, if he was a bandit by the very first, nothing would change.

That's where it limits the gameplay. And no, me and a bunch of other players don't have outside game friends. So what? Now this is another requirement, besides a nasa pc to play this game at 60fps?

[DryGulch 32]

That's where it limits the gameplay. And no' date=' me and a bunch of other players don't have outside game friends. So what? Now this is another requirement, besides a nasa pc to play this game at 60fps?

[/quote']

I only quoted the last bit , because the first was some barely legible moaning about how it's hard to trust people in the game..THAT IS THE GAME.

Now, to address the bit I did quote. You either

A: Get better at avoiding or ambushing other players, the map is pretty big so it's really not that hard.

B: Use the very forums you are posting on to form a group or join a clan (welcome to the internet).

Nasa PC? My rig is four years old, you need to stop moaning for the sake of it or join the rest of us in the marvelous world of modern PC gaming.

[legwiz 0]

..THAT IS THE GAME.

No, not yet.

And it's funny that everyone who manifest against the suggestions just tell to find another way to do things ingame, but don't expose clear arguments about how these changes would affect them negatively. I cannot see either how can things become worst in this point.

[DryGulch 32]

..THAT IS THE GAME.

No' date=' not yet.

And it's funny that everyone who manifest against the suggestions just tell to find another way to do things ingame, but don't expose clear arguments about how these changes would affect them negatively. I cannot see either how can things become worst in this point.

[/quote']

I've given you clear and sound suggestions for some of your issues. As for PVP:

Q: Turn PvP Off?

A: No. PvP is a core part of the DayZ atmosphere and we aren't going to restrict it. Just go inland away from the built up towns along the coast where players spawn.

^ Taken directly from the Forum FAQ.

Now, what other grievances do you wish to air. I might add that starting threads about the community , that are essentially PVP moaning threads is a bit underhanded. There is a formal PVP thread on the forums for this.

[legwiz 0]

..THAT IS THE GAME.

No' date=' not yet.

And it's funny that everyone who manifest against the suggestions just tell to find another way to do things ingame, but don't expose clear arguments about how these changes would affect them negatively. I cannot see either how can things become worst in this point.

[/quote']

I've given you clear and sound suggestions for some of your issues. As for PVP:

Q: Turn PvP Off?

A: No. PvP is a core part of the DayZ atmosphere and we aren't going to restrict it. Just go inland away from the built up towns along the coast where players spawn.

^ Taken directly from the Forum FAQ.

Now, what other grievances do you wish to air. I might add that starting threads about the community , that are essentially PVP moaning threads is a bit underhanded. There is a formal PVP thread on the forums for this.

Ok, last time quoting a last-posts thread reader, who incredibly understood SHIT of what has been discussed until some posts ago.

[DryGulch 32]

..THAT IS THE GAME.

No' date=' not yet.

And it's funny that everyone who manifest against the suggestions just tell to find another way to do things ingame, but don't expose clear arguments about how these changes would affect them negatively. I cannot see either how can things become worst in this point.

[/quote']

I've given you clear and sound suggestions for some of your issues. As for PVP:

Q: Turn PvP Off?

A: No. PvP is a core part of the DayZ atmosphere and we aren't going to restrict it. Just go inland away from the built up towns along the coast where players spawn.

^ Taken directly from the Forum FAQ.

Now, what other grievances do you wish to air. I might add that starting threads about the community , that are essentially PVP moaning threads is a bit underhanded. There is a formal PVP thread on the forums for this.

Ok, last time quoting a last-posts thread reader, who incredibly understood SHIT of what has been discussed until some posts ago.

My apologies if I failed to understand some of your points , perhaps you could get someone you know who speaks English at a higher level of proficiency to post on here for you?

[legwiz 0]

Many other guys have posted with a opinion very similar to mine.

Still belive the problem is the writer?

[DryGulch 32]

Many other guys have posted with a opinion very similar to mine.

Still belive the problem is the writer?

Yes, because I've calmly and rationally addressed every one of your complaints despite the difficulty in reading your posts. If I have missed anything then you're free to communicate them.