Why is everybody so satisfied with ARMA2 Engine?

[Jex =TE= (DayZ) 218]

The engine is awful and flawed and old. Arma is still a great game but it would be better if the inventory system was upgraded, the movement became more fluid, not getting stuck in doors like a retard and no dumb animations to pull out weapons I don't have on me.

[BigMikeHD 0]

Fristable I like how the Wrold looks I love the feeling that this game gives to me.

I can handle with den inventory system it´s okay. (There are some bugs in the system but 4 Alpha its okay)

For me the World looks realistic more than a BF3 where everything is poloshied and glowes.

And of course the simulation in the egnine is pretty good also the real ki

(sorry 4 my bad english)

[-MadTommy 367]

Why is everybody so satisfied with ARMA2 Engine?

It's very simple.. scale. Op you mention BF2.. common seriously?

You can throw a rock across maps on any other engine i'm aware of. Arma is the only engine that supports massive maps with ease.

[OrLoK 16185]

Hello there

I'm a long time player of the series.

Whilst we love the game, I'm fairly sure none of us are wonderfully happy with the engine, BUT it's the best there is on the market ATM that can simulate an almost full combined ops experience.

If you have a decent rig (mine is average) one can have massive battles over 100's of square km from a first person view and take part in any role, from engineer, medic, pilot, gunner etc etc. No other system can do that.

The BF series attempts to but on a far smaller and more arcade scale.

Also the beauty and bane of the Arma series is the fact it is so open and "easy" to mod.

Without that capability we would not have the thousands of great addons we have, one of which is DAYZ (which to be honest, compared to other Arma mods is very rushed and unfinished in comparison to A.C.E. or PRACS or i44 to name but a handful)

The bad side of this is that the game is open to exploits and was never really designed to support a game like this.

EG it's like taking the Mario Cart engine and modding a High end military sim with it.

Us wargamers also have to put up with many annoying issues but the Pros of the engine outweigh the Cons.

Rgds

LoK

[puppetworx 474]

Apart from not being able to strafe through doorways and the dodgy physics with ATVs (do not cross railway lines when one of your wheels are orange..) I'm pretty happy with it.

[notSLICK 26]

the inventory system takes time to use. it makes it a distraction that can leave you vulnerable to banditry or murder... just as it would be in a real life scenario. in tense situations, poor inventory managment can get you killed. this game rewards paying attention and thinking ahead. i've been playing FPS games since 1994, and i can honestly say that dayz provides the most thrilling, visceral, intense experience i've ever had while gaming. nothing even comes close. when you can feel your fingertips buzzing from adrenaline, and your hands are trembling , and you start to sweat, whether it be fear while getting attacked or the thrill of the hunt, no game can compare. I never played AWSD, i always used my own custom config (cntrl to fire Q and W to strafe... the rest is too weird to get into), but this game made me go back to awsd because i couldn't map my config in the arma engine. after a few months i'm almost as fluid with it as i was with my custom config (battlefield will be the final test, if i ever play it again).

TLDR: i agree that the engine isn't perfect for the mod, complaining about the inventory system is neato, but it works slow for a reason. it's still the most thrilling game experience i've ever had. i own a lot of games and haven't played any of them since i installed dayz.

[SillySil 295]

the inventory system takes time to use. it makes it a distraction that can leave you vulnerable to banditry or murder... just as it would be in a real life scenario. in tense situations, poor inventory managment can get you killed. this game rewards paying attention and thinking ahead. i've been playing FPS games since 1994, and i can honestly say that dayz provides the most thrilling, visceral, intense experience i've ever had while gaming. nothing even comes close. when you can feel your fingertips buzzing from adrenaline, and your hands are trembling , and you start to sweat, whether it be fear while getting attacked or the thrill of the hunt, no game can compare. I never played AWSD, i always used my own custom config (cntrl to fire Q and W to strafe... the rest is too weird to get into), but this game made me go back to awsd because i couldn't map my config in the arma engine. after a few months i'm almost as fluid with it as i was with my custom config (battlefield will be the final test, if i ever play it again).

TLDR: i agree that the engine isn't perfect for the mod, complaining about the inventory system is neato, but it works slow for a reason. it's still the most thrilling game experience i've ever had. i own a lot of games and haven't played any of them since i installed dayz.

You don't need to make the inventory as inconvenient as possible to make to make it slow or distraction. It's just poor design.

[notSLICK 26]

You don't need to make the inventory as inconvenient as possible to make to make it slow or distraction. It's just poor design.

pressing 'g' is not complicated or inconvenient.

[zak757 146]

Just because the ARMA engine was built for a military simulator doesn't mean other engines can't simulate either.

I don't see what the VR Engine can do that the Cryengine 3 can't (with better graphics and performance).

[Lupin-III 44]

Codemaster's EGO engine for the newer Operation Flashpoint games could easily do a better job at this game. It's still got the bullet physics, the large play areas, better hit location, damage physics, has the wide variety of guns, far more building interiors, superior graphics, and still manages to run at a higher framerate. It's still a simulator engine, but it's more polished and better experience than the aging Real Virtuality system. I do prefer ARMA 2's aircraft and helicopter handling though and overall variety of vehicles.

I've got Operation Flashpoint: Cold War Crisis, ARMA, ARMA2 (obviously), Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising, and Operation Flashpoint: Red River... I've pretty much experienced everything both engines have to offer up to this point. The Real Virtuality system has not evolved much, and is barely a visual upgrade from what it looked like in Cold War Crisis.

The X-Ray engine from S.T.A.L.K.E.R. would also be a fantastic choice for a zombie apocalypse game.

[crush.lv@gmail.com 12]

Yes, DayZ reminds me a lot of STALKER. It's like a multiplayer version of the STALKER world.

As for the inventory, it's just a script on top of the engine. Someone just has to write a better script to handle moving of items from one place to another.

[PoisonedAl 128]

so you never used a very useful feature in ARMA 2

honestly you get into a game where your transport gets shot down and you and your team are stuck in the middle of nowhere on your own with nothing but high altitude air support you'll be happy you packed your backpack full of rockets and other supplies because your main gear space will not last in a fight against armor or even infantry player controlled or AI

Oh yeah of course.... I guess it's been awhile but I would swear blind there wasn't backpacks in ARMA II. *shrugs*

[-=seany=- 65]

A lot of the glaring, obvious bugs that people new to the Arma Engine run into while playing DayZ are really minor bugs for Arma. This is just a result of a new inovative idea being shoe horned into a game that was never intended or even expected to be used this way.

A perfect example of this is the getting killed by a door. To some one new to Arma this must seem ridiculous. But to long time Arma players it's so minor that no one every really mentions it. ( and Arma players make a LOT of noise when there is some thing that they need fixed in their game :D ). The main reasons for this are, firstly in Arma if you die, most of the time it's no big deal, you can get revived/respawn or restart the mission. Secondly, you could probably play 20 Arma missions and only ever interact with a door once. So you can see why getting killed by doors has been on the very, very long finger as far as bugs that need urgently fixing are concerned..until now that is. But as we know DayZ stand alone will address these kind of things

Another even better example of what must seem like a horendous bug in Arma to a new DayZ player is: the bug that causes you to stand up from prone while crossing the threshold/entrance of some buildings. When you are playing Standard Arma this bug is so insignificant, it will probably still exist for a long time and no Arma player would ever care. You can look on the extensive Arma bug tracker DevHeaven and I would put money it hasnt been reported. But, when this happens in DayZ it can be catastrophic. You instantly stand up unintentionally alerting all nearby Zombies.

Most of the glaring bugs that people new to Arma who are playign Dayz are as a result of the above. the same for the gear menu. In Arma it's a bit clunky, but it works pretty damn well. But in DayZ you are using it a hell of a lot more and add to that the fact it has been "hacked" to allow DayZ features.

It is important for new players to remember these things when criticizing the Arma engine.

Personally, I think the biggest advantage of using the Arma engine is the sheer scale of the maps that can be used. That and the proper ballistics.

Edited September 7, 2012 by SeanOfTheDead

[venthos 605]

I for one really enjoy the feel of the ARMA2 engine. I'm sure the ARMA3 engine will be neat, but I was pleased to hear that DayZ Standalone will use the ARMA2 engine as its core and pull in ARMA3 engine code as they desire. The look and feel of DayZ is really quite enjoyable.

Any such engine bugs will be resolved during standalone's alpha/beta cycle as Rocket will have the ability to modify the engine.

[Sir Diealot 46]

A bit OT, but: When playing ArmA 2 (not DayZ), most of the bugs and 'clunkiness' of the UI that many complain about, dont even come to play. This is because for, example; you use rocks for cover, not something to climb on, you very rarely, if ever, need to go through doors (and never when proned) and in most cases you'll never have to use the UI (which I agree, is not the best, but you do get used to it) after the initial weapon switch, if even that. ArmA 2 is about tactics, positioning, awareness and teamwork (to name a few 'features'). Not that DayZ isnt any of that, but its additional features would require a more sophisticated platform, which is why we are getting the standalone, on a 'new' engine that fixes such things.

[KrystoferRobin 67]

I love the Arma engine because I've been a long-time player of Arma2, and seeing it in its full glory, as it was intended, forgives mods like DayZ their flaws. The inventory is a bit flakey, but when you're playing a specific role in a squad, and you start your missions fully kitted, it's not an issue you find often. I rarely if ever need to CHECK my gear, let alone loot/move shit around. When you're saddled up cruising across the desert on the assault, the terrain is spectacular, and those first volleys of return fire are positively terrifying. DayZ doesn't have a hell of a lot of largescale battles, so the quirks show a lot more. The mod really has taken the worst aspects of an otherwise fantastic platform, and utilized them as heavily as possible. I think other engines would have been better suited to this mod, absolutely. I do not fault Arma for DayZ's problems, and I do not fault DayZ for Arma's.

[EndEffeKt 87]

What is wrong with the ARMA2 engine, IMO I couldn't think of a better one.

And you want to change the engine because your on a shitty notebook? I just don't understand!?!?!

get a real PC before judging, maybe?

Maybe play ARMA 2 and you will see how great it is or the original flashpoint. There are a fair few bugs, yes but it is Alpha ffs!

Wow :D Straight in the face. No seriously, are you actually reading the opening post or are you just reading the title and half of the first sentence, before you rage boy?

As I said I didnt want to talk about graphics or some sort of performance issues, because thats all my crappy notebook (new ones on the way for godssake).

But it seems I could actually start a quite interessting discussion here. Thanks folks, you really showed me some good points why to love and why to hate this engine. And furthermore we get some overall impressions of what the people expect for the standalone version of this game, regarding design and handling.

[Sneakers O'Toole 57]

I like the game but there are some really lame aspects like

*the movement in buildings is awful, thew way the character stops for 4 secs if you jump on or off stairs is retarded.

*and how you cannot turn inside even though you can see there is adequate room, and your primary is strapped to your back horizontally.

*the ladder animation is also retarded, the fact that (at the top) there is no intervening state between being on the ladder and being off the ladder.

*the fact atv's and bridges create new crazy physics

*getting in/out of water pushes you through the floor.

*helicopter rotors seem to have the physical properties of dark matter.

*the capriciousness of the opendoor/remove cat wire soft select mechanism.

Is this lame stuff going to be able to be taken care of in the hybrid engine?

Also they really need to add the reverb to gunshots;the game needs air. Also it needs a texture overhaul, 'skyrim' mountain between cherno/electro is particularly ugly.

[KrystoferRobin 67]

You can't put that in the video game or it would be extremely hard to implement and it would probably end up being annoying anyway. That's why you let people tap the button and move a tiny bit. Even tho moving like that is unrealistic it's there to compensate for not being able to move your body without moving your legs. And I'm not talking about leaning all the way.

Oh but you can lean just a little bit sir. you can also aim off-center of your view. You could use this or if you don't want to pony up for it, there are homebrew variations. Or a webcam can work as well (I used this a bit, it works fairly well once it's set up. The TrackIR is better).

Here's what is essentially an ad for the TrackIR. If that doesn't sell you on it, nothing will. As a heavy Arma2 player, this was the single most important piece of hardware for me, hands down. Worth every penny. If you don't have a lot of pennies, there are alternatives that work fairly well (but still, nothing compares to the real thing). I am not affiliated with, paid by, or otherwise invested in this hardware, I'm just a huge fan, and can't see how anyone plays without it.

Semi-Related Edit:

The guy demoing the TrackIR...... Here's what the elevated situational awareness provides you. Just a video of him murderfucking everyone because of his huge advantages provided by cover of darkness, use of cover, hit and run, and better awareness. Also a good showcase of why some of us are absolutely smitten with Arma2, no matter how flawed it may or may not be.

Edited September 7, 2012 by KrystoferRobin

[Fraggle (DayZ) 15720]

I'm pretty sure all of that is getting looked at. Read through this thread, much of that is because of the current engine and what it was originally intended for. The standalone will allow them access to the engine so they can polish thing's till their hearts content.

[Banicks 55]

Hall has already answered this regarding his stand alone intentions. Arma 2 will be used, or rather a so call 'Arma 2.5' will be used because:

- The engine has been around and stable for quite a few years

- The experience Hall and his team have with the engine will mean they can develop it into something more befitting the desired DayZ stand alone experience

- The engine will be refined, presumably graphically so that the majority of systems can run it

That alone is enough to convince me that DayZ, from a technical stand point alone will not encounter too many issues. Where as if it was a completely new Arma 3 engine, early adoption may prove more troublesome than beneficial.

Put it this way, it is better to have a game released fully functioning without issues, than to release a game that has better graphics but keeps crashing or having issues.

[Maniacmike (DayZ) 24]

the inventory system takes time to use. it makes it a distraction that can leave you vulnerable to banditry or murder... just as it would be in a real life scenario. in tense situations, poor inventory managment can get you killed. this game rewards paying attention and thinking ahead. i've been playing FPS games since 1994, and i can honestly say that dayz provides the most thrilling, visceral, intense experience i've ever had while gaming. nothing even comes close. when you can feel your fingertips buzzing from adrenaline, and your hands are trembling , and you start to sweat, whether it be fear while getting attacked or the thrill of the hunt, no game can compare. I never played AWSD, i always used my own custom config (cntrl to fire Q and W to strafe... the rest is too weird to get into), but this game made me go back to awsd because i couldn't map my config in the arma engine. after a few months i'm almost as fluid with it as i was with my custom config (battlefield will be the final test, if i ever play it again).

TLDR: i agree that the engine isn't perfect for the mod, complaining about the inventory system is neato, but it works slow for a reason. it's still the most thrilling game experience i've ever had. i own a lot of games and haven't played any of them since i installed dayz.

Yep I agree with everything u said, I've been playing online FPS since Doom2 on a serial cable from PC to PC!

[Just a Goat 25]

Ballistics realism. That's the most of it right there, OP.

[Jex =TE= (DayZ) 218]

The gear menu has never worked "well" in arma - it fucking sucks, period or have people never tried going to a weapons crate and looked though the hundreds of items available because arma simply cannot handle the task of attachments? Fortunately it looks like Arma 3 has finally caught up with the world as it was 5 years ago.

[CyberTyrant 6]

Why is everybody so satisfied with ARMA2 Engine?

I'm not. I think it sucks.