My rant on why DayZ is getting worse

[Alpha331 7]

The game is not that simple, but I'll try explain in a way you'll understand.

- Approach barn undetected

- Notice barn has no useful items

- Zombie spawns on you or is alerted in a very weird way

- You start bleeding

- You just realized you have no more bandages

- Oops, you're dead.

Does this happens to players who already have weapons? Nope. Once you have a way of defending yourself chances are you will only be killed by bandits and not by zombies, unless you are really stupid.

Bro, there are these towns called Kamenko and maybe Komarovo, small cities with a lot of loot, all you have to do is have a tiny piece of patience and crawl. After my first 2 hours of playing and getting mauled by zombies, I started crawling and hey, I actually managed to remain undetected, get a hatchet (IMO the best weapon in the game). From there you can pretty much kill any zombie you want without dying as long as move quickly and quietly.

I know you don't want advice, but if you're going to be pigheaded about it, you're going to have a really big learning curve.

Edited July 28, 2012 by Alpha331

[TheProphecy 33]

Well on the surface it sounds like good advice, but then ... who are you to criticise? No, don't answer that. Rocket has, as an individual come up with a game design that is so popular that a dated, and really buggy engine like the ARMA2-engine is being bought in numbers that ARMA2 only had in its inception, and then singularly because of Operation Flashpoint. Not only that, but DayZ is a mod in an alpha stage, normally we don't even get to see these things because a smaller group of developers and their friends are playing this. The success is so riveting that the game is being talked about all over the world. I would say if I had to bet on who has a better idea on what is required to make a game successful out of the two of you, even without knowing who you are. I would bet on Rocket, any day of the week.

With that said though, I agree with you that there are issues with this alpha mod. But lets not forget that the only reason that we know of them, is because Rocket made it an open alpha.

I play the mod. These forums are here to express opinions, and that's what I'm doing.

At some point, the, "this mod is in alpha" response becomes an excuse. I understand, it's not a flawless diamond. However, can you sit here and tell me that in the 4+ months this mod's been out that appreciable progress has been made toward becoming a standalone game?

[Colditz 54]

... But if the zombie notices you, FIRST, it runs a marathon runner's wet dream of a football field in record time, ...

Thank you so much, probably the only thing in the entire DayZ forum that made me laugh so hard that I actually spat my drink out. But now, back to topic.

I agree with you and jimykx, there are major issues with the game, I dislike how many people "sweetmouth" the Mod and talk in high praises of rocket, sure, he brings a pretty unique Mod out on the field, but all that sweetmouthing seems to be hiding the major problems that DayZ still has.

1) Zombies got the moves like jagger, the run in all kinds of directions, VERY FAST and most of the time their animations start lagging when they change direction or start hitting players, when I'm playing with a group and a zombie gets aggro'd we usually shoot him alltogether, but if he's too close, the only one allowed to fire is the guy being attacked while everyone else just goes prone, hitting the zombie in his twitchy attack animation makes it easy to miss him and kill your mate.

2) Nights, way too dark, only way to "make out stuff" in the dark is to set HDR to "High" and move Brightness and Gamma to Max., it should be slightly brighter, Night servers are almost ALWAYS empty, only people on there are usually those with NVG's, and they're having a nice time looting EVERYTHING without hindrance.

3) New Players, they're fucked, they get thrown into a world of hateful players that are hellbent on killing every other Player they come across, leave alone the buggy zombies and the horrible loot spawns. Last time I died I checked Elektrozavodsk (even the Market), then moved to Pusta and on to Mogilevka, in that time I found ONE Can of Soda and NO FOOD.... but a shitload of weapons, by the time I left Elektro I already had a AKM with 4 mags, Alice Pack and some nice tools (map,watch,etc.) but found no food.

My suggestion: Make ALL weapon spawns more rare. Increase spawn of food cans in Residential by a tiny bit. Give new players that start on the Coast some means to defend themselves, a Crowbar would be fine imho, right now they're food for everything they come across, most of them don't even know how the zombies work yet and what they should do if shit hits the fan, this issue really lowers the population of new players.

Last but not least) PVP. Why are people doing it ? Because pretty much everything else in DayZ apart from killing/hunting other Players is plain boring.

Reasons I believe to be for this:

• Helicopters got removed, for valid reasons, yeah, but they were a lot of fun for people.
  
• Pretty much ALL vehicles on the Servers are taken by the Server Owners or Clan Members
  
• Tents, Vehicles are STILL really buggy and sometimes their gear vanishes or just doesn't save
  
• The Mod's difficulty is way too low, there need to be Zombies in Fields, Hills and Forests, more varied zombies too, the game in general should be harder.
  
• Like said before, I understand that Chernarus is a eastern country, but you wouldn't even find that many guns in the whole of the U.S., there's guns and ammo EVERYWHERE.
  
• Killing People has no negative effects, a slightly higher amount of zombies and a better hearing range for them in terms of gunshots would make Shootouts less likely.
  

What does this have to do with PvPing ? Easy, most of the fun aspects of the mod are either still buggy, or got taken out because they were buggy and are being worked on. The only feature that's fun for people which more or less works as intented is... you guessed it... PvP.

EDIT: You also break your bones way too often, it's annoying. I alone broke my bones more often in DayZ than the entire population of the World has in probably two decades.

Open a door, door hits you, start bleeding like a stabbed pig all over the place, drop unconscious for 5 minutes, shock and leg broken > Die. Killed by Door in a Zombie Apocalypse.

Thank you for this thread, I know there's probably many like this, but if there were none, than there'd be no one to hear our prayers and fears for the future of DayZ.

A friend of mine was filling up a gascan at a Station, I took a jerry can too to refill it, I come around the corner and we run into each other, it looked as if our heads bashed into each other, we both dropped unconscious, of course with broken legs and bleeding. We both died. Most of the time you can also just break your bones by being punched by a zombie (happens too often in my oppionion) or by running over uneven terrain.

Edited July 28, 2012 by Colditz

[santiagoaquino6@hotmail.com 37]

- Find a bush

- Run through bush

- Zombies are no longer chasing you

As for people exploiting. The idea of DayZ is that it's difficult... With difficulty comes cheaters, simple.

No, fuck you, with a crappy engine, exploits up the ass and an even crappier anticheat system comes cheaters. I've seen Starcraft matches and Dota matches and fucking competitive TF2 matches. There's no cheaters there.

[eliasr 6]

@ many previous posters

Please try to provide some constructive critic/suggestions/arguments instead of the "you = noob, fix yourself" comments.

@ jayp.uncensored

Clearly you also seem to be annoyed about people who exploits and hacks the game; Regarding the PVP: as seen in the last couple of changelogs they are fixing the exploits of disconnecting, of course this will be annoying for the people who prefer the PvE, as you are very handicapped in the start. So technically they are already fixing some of the "bugs" you don't like. I hope you will be happy for that.

On the other hand, I don't think they can "fix" the inventory problems right away, as some of those problems very likely could be related to the arma2 engine. Of course another layer of indirection (computer science term) could fix it, but it could be rather complicated to implement if the engine doesn't provide much functionality regarding the inventory.

OT:

I must agree about DayZ having trouble regarding the zombies and trouble of getting started. In known terms about Linux, the following could be applied to Dayz: "DayZ is only free, if your spare time has no value".

The "worst" problem in my opinion, is when you use 30 minutes - 2 hours to get ready for the game: Getting weapons, food/drinks and medics for a start, you will usually be shot in the middle of your search or by bandits camping at the hospital.

Today I had nothing on me and I went into the hospital in Cherno (yes I know it isn't safe), where I was assaulted by automatic riffles and grenades. - luckily I escaped by disconnecting.

Every player must start somewhere, and it isn't fun to run in 30 minutes to find a building with drinks and food to stay alive, to get annihilated by other players after you evaded a lots of zombies. The limitations DayZ requires of the servers practically makes them "donated server with voluntary underdog-admins" otherwise they will get banned; thus the admins can't play any role to enforce a play style which prefer either PVE or PVP and thereby there will always be some who struggle to get properly started in DayZ.

So you can use a lot of time to get prepared, and if you survive, you will finally begin to enjoy the game. Which is much better played with some friends than alone, as you got better chances to survive in a group with larger inventory and more firepower. I always expect other players as hostile unless they respond fast, and for new players i become their pray, as they don't know how to chat.

There a many other problems which already has been written in larger posts. I agree with most of it and I don't fell that i need to elaborate myself - So I will just refer to those earlier "large" posts.

I will only underline that the problem with the zombies spawning right beside of you, running or looting. It is extremely annoying and deadly. As well for their disregard to walls and doors.

With that said, I will give my version of why the current updates doesn't make DayZ better. I will also notice those which do, as I want to be fair towards the developers and provide suggestions.

http://stats.six-updater.net/mods/changelog/84950cc2-8d47-11e1-baaa-001517bd964c

First of All, 9 - 13 July, great updates. Those kind of fixes are always welcome. The zombies still seems to could hear you quite well, but It have reduced zombie assaults when I'm inside a shack or other building. I still lose items if I disconnect within a minute since I picked them up.

26. July:

Respawn button is disabled during DayZ play

This update seems odd to me. I wouldn't respawn if I had a good character. Only if my start was very bad or if I'm far far away from my friends after death. Perhaps it would be better just to remove the kill message when a player respawns, or make selectable respawn areas. The alternate choice would be to run to the nearest zombie so it can be used.

Hive now tracks login/logout (to assist in analysis for an ALT+F4 solution)

Fair enough, I understand that the community don't like that their victims just disappears. On the other hand,I also understand those who disconnects very fast, especially if they can't fight back. Nevertheless it wouldn't prevent Super F4 to close the game. - Perhaps PVP solution would be to let the player "stay" in-game a few seconds after disconnection. This is a problem which I would say looks for a solution which depends on a design decision for the mod.

------------------------------

I think it is good that there are made various performance updates, especially regarding the loading of DayZ. Myself i would like if the zombies would be less "laggy" animated and didn't spawn on you. Then remove their noclip ability and speedhack. And please keep some of the abilities to avoid zombies, even if they are considered bugs.

Serveral of my friends have noticed that we spawn in the server, quite some time before we are done with the final loading scene. I don't know if this was intentional, but it isn't much fun to join a server to see that you are dead.

Kind Regards

[Rich60 0]

I would like to see the starting equipment be as follows:

Hatchet

Knife

Flashlight

Matches

Bandage

With this loadout you could either go into town for better gear or live off the land until you decide to get better gear. With this gear you don't have to run into town and brave fully geared player killers to just get a start in the game. With starting equipment you can start playing the minute you spawn into the game rather then running into town not caring whether you live or die to get the equipment to start playing the game.

Beyond fixing the known bugs that others have talked about this game is a lot of fun.

I read somewhere that the makers of the core game are thinking of making there own version of a zombe mod. I hope the DayZ people get this stuff right before someone else beats them to it.

[ThatGuyCalledReptile 314]

Imo this game is far to fucking easy.

Let's say you just died and are on a fresh respawn. Run through whatever town you spawn in or near and run straight for the firestation. Nothing there? Run to the supermarket. Still nothing? Run to the Inns or apartments. If you still can't find something go get attacked by zeds and try again in a new spawn.

I'm a bandit because this game is far to easy. Zeds aren't a challenge. Only survivors. And I refuse to kill fresh spawns. Unless they are experienced enough to get far enough north to get into my scope or my groups sights then they are experienced enough to know that this game needs bandits to make it fun.

This game will only be a challenge once Zeds get harder or people get smarter.

[Darkrai 0]

I'm done playing dayz until the damn MAIN COMPONENT of the game is fixed. Which are the ZOMBIES, their movement is ridiculous. They can move through walls. They can hit you through walls. You cant shoot them when they are running, it is nearly impossible to hit them.

[Heiduk 265]

1. "It's Alpha" is not a valid excuse, it's an invitation to complain. If players who care about the game don't voice their opinions how are the developers supposed to know what is working and what isn't?

2. Right now I think whether or not the game is "easy" or "hard" depends a lot on how you play. If you want to "win" it's pretty easy by exploiting bugs in the PvE system, see ThatGuyCalledReptile's post. My mother would love the fact that zombies are well behaved enough to walk while indoors. Of course, once you win there isn't much left to do except PvP. If you choose to play a different way, life can be much more difficult.

I'm not saying ThatGuyCalledReptile's method is the wrong way to play, but I think it's unfortunate that it is currently one of the only effective ways to play, at least in the early game. Better zombies are clearly needed. Rich60's starting loadout could make surviving an option again, but I would rather find my own gear. Just don't make me revert to the dash and grab an hour into a new character because I'm already starving to death.

...clipped a bunch of good stuff...

Make ALL weapon spawns more rare.

...some more good stuff...

I agree with everything you said except for fewer weapon spawns. If anything there should be more weapon spawns. You should be able to get a shopping cart full of AKs at every overrun road block and burned out HMMWV. Ammo, on the other hand, should be much harder to find. I'd be happy if half the players in the gamer were walking around with their last round in the chamber, just praying to find another full mag. Of course, for this to actually work the ammo management system would have to be fixed too.

[dev0 19]

Hi Jim,

I read your entire post carefully and would like to respond to it.

With every update the game gets I lose a little bit of interest in the mod because it gets progressively worse.

First, new players lost any kind of self defense they had when they spawned. Thanks to this you are worthless and you have no method of protecting yourself against zombies or more powerful players. You can't push zombies, you can't even punch them like you would in real life. Damn, at least let us start with a melee weapon. A freaking spoon, I don't care.

You are right on this issue. New players are worthless. You should be aware though that this is on purpose. The whole point of taking away any valuable loot from fresh spawns is to promote cooperation and reduce the attractiveness to kill fresh spawns just to get their beans and their 2 mags of .45. That said, using your hands to push down Zeds or other players is in fact on an upcoming features list.

Second, it appears to me that now you are much more likely to aggro zombies. It has happened about countless time when I'm prone and suddenly see a zombie running, coming from like the other corner of the map and sprinting directly at me. Or I'm scavenging a small wooden house and suddenly a zombie spawns on top of me. How is this possible? Ow, and did I already mentioned that I had no way of defending myself?

I am not playing DayZ for months, so I am not aware of any drastic changes in zombie aggro behavior. I do know however that at least before the very latest patch (which is 1.7.2.4 and I haven't had the chance to play yet) the chance of aggroing a zombie if you are lying prone in no-visibility is very low, even if the zombie is close to stepping on you.

Also, I do not know details of zombie spawn behavior, but I have already seen zombies spawn directly in front of me just to have them despawn directly after. I believe that this is a feature that should prevent zombies spawning to close to players. If you encounter zombies spawning directly on top of you, this is most likely a bug and should be reported. Keep in mind though that DayZ is an alpha stage mod. Bugs are to be expected.

Then comes the bleeding. A zombie hits you once and you start bleeding like there is no tomorrow. Really? Bleeding from scratches should not be so aggressive and drastic ( but Honestly the bleeding is not what affects me the most).

There's only a certain chance for bleeding through a zombie attack, although it seems like there is an increased chance for bleeding on the first hit just after spawn (if this is the case and not just my subjective fealing, then it is most likely to introduce the bleeding mechanic early). Also, bleeding is not always sever. Most of the time its just a couple of blood per second. You can keep yourself alive for more than 30 minutes with 6000 blood if you loose 3 blood per second from bleeding. Also, nobody ever said, that a zombie only inflicts a scratch and doesn't rip or bite of a lump of flesh from your neck.

Fourth comes the running away from zombies. Do I have to say the obvious? It's almost impossible unless you take them indoors.

In the end you end up dying from thirst or hunger because you spent all of the time running away from a zombie that you could not kill, or trying to avoid them.

I absolutely agree that the current zombie mechanics are broken. Their behavior is crap. They move to fast, and personally I think you should easily be able to outrun most of them over the course of a couple hundred meters. There is good news though: fixing zombie behavior and animations is a top priority item on the DayZ todo list, according to several interviews with Dean "rocket" Hall.

My final issue comes with the fact that it seems to be easier to find windshields, tires and engines in small villages than it is to find food.

I guess I have to clearly disagree with you on this point. I strongly believe reducing the amount of loot available to players will actually help the game evolve and improve. I could provide you with reasoning on which effects I think a reduced amount of loot in the game will have, but then again that will only be a hypothesis without actual proof. I think we simply have to agree to disagree on this one then.

After this specific patch (1.7.2.4) I had to create this thread. Why? Because of the "[NEW] Hive now tracks login/logout (to assist in analysis for an ALT+F4 solution)"

YES, I use it. NOT IN PVP. But in PVE. Why? Because I got tired of spending hours walking and avoiding zombies, finding only crap loot and aggrowing that only zombie that I have no way to kill and that I will end up dieing to. So I adopted the tactic of sprinting to a place where I can find loot, logout to loose the aggro, login and loot.

Do I have to mention again why am I forced to do this?

Honestly, I truly believe that the next patch will make you start with only a stick and give you the option: "stick it up your ass and enjoy" or something like that. Because that's where the mod is heading.

I have to strongly disagree with you on this point again. DayZ is meant to be harsh and unforgiving. It tries to punish you wherever it can and whenever you screw up. This is the essence of the game. Without wanting to drive you away from DayZ, but if you cannot find fun, satisfaction or at least an impulse beating the game at screwing you over, then maybe, this game simply isn't for you. You shouldn't try to beat a game that isn't beatable, but instead you should try to avoid loosing for as long as you can.

If the game wasn't hard enough because of the lag and bugs, now you can't even have your own problems because it will penalize if you disconnect for any reason and when you come back short while you will be stunned for a couple of minutes just to avoid from other players to jump from servers to pick loot were they start. What about switch and/or add some basic game mechanics so people don't try to exploit the mod? Me and my clan were having a lot of fun for the last week until it was all f*d up again..

Instead of changing the mechanics to avoid exploits, why don't you add basic things that MAKE the players NOT feel the need to exploit? I believe adding a melee weapon to starting characters would solve half of these issues.

Seriously, I love this mod. It's one of my favorite game modifications but I think it lacks some sense in it's features right now. Instead of immediately preventing players to do something you do not want them to do: alt-f4 to avoid being killed by zombies, or increase brightness to see better at night why don't you try to actually investigate why that is happening and fix it from the root?

Let me do the hard work for you. Players increase gamma and brightness because you can't see anything at night. I enjoy this but honestly, In real life I live in a small village where there is very little light pollution, and in the night you can see much better than what you see in the game (which is pretty much pitch black). Not to mention when there is full moon, you can see almost as well as if it was day. I'm not telling you you should be able to see much better at night because I understand perfectly the important component of fear etc the night brings, and I do not want to make the different light sources obsolete, but why not lighten up the night just a little small bit?

I agree with you that the night needs a fix. In fact Dean Hall agrees with us as well. As he stated on one of the plentiful interviews he conducted in the last weeks, the ArmA II engine was never designed to actually render night scenarios without the player having access to night vision goggles. So adjusting the light level at night when not wearing NVG never was a priority and simply never done. We should expect this do be fixed at some stage. Be aware though that DayZ is an alpha stage mod and such an fix, depending on technical aspects, might only come in a stand-alone version of the game. This might be disappointing at first, but then again, there simply are certain limitations to what the ArmA II can and cannot do.

I know it's a week argument, but I want you to keep this in mind when arguing about how zombie mechanics need to be fixed: Zombie behavior is buggy, glitchy and absolutely not nice at the moment. However, personally I have not been killed by a zombie ever yet. I have been killed by players, I have been killed by bugs and glitches. I have never been killed by a zombie. Zombies need fixing, I don't think they need a nerf though.

[magmatrix 38]

1- You sound like you're a horrible gamer. If you honestly think the game is that hard seriously consider quitting.

2- Don't jump on here hating on the game when it isn't even fully developed. Its in Alpha, I don't care what you say.

He is not talking about the game being hard, but about it being broken in an number of ways.

Also, he said he love the game...

[dev0 19]

Actually he was talking about the game being to hard. Also, pointing out broken aspects of a game is not only fair deal, but absolutely necessary to allow the developers to improve the game further. However, the OP reads more like it is suited well by a nice piece of cheese than constructive critique. Just pointing out.

[jimykx 57]

First I want to thank guys like tempestfeir, Xeroph,jayp.uncensored,TheProphecy,Colditz and Dev0 because they actually read, understood my point, and even though they might not agree with everything I said they shared their feelings about what they think is wrong and helped turn my whole post a lot more constructive.

So the game is too hard for you so you want Rocket to make it easier on you, or you will quit?

You're basically complaining about some of the main features of DayZ (survival, sneaking, avoiding zombies), this is probably not the game for you.

I'm complaining about the problems in the core mechanics of sneaking and avoiding zombies. If you can't take the time to understand someone's thread this is probably not the place for you.

Dimes123 has a pretty good answer to you.

Impossible? Now that is simply not true. I've played the past two days doing ONLY scavenging (alone), killed about 200 zombies, and only ran into other players twice (they didn't see me though), have 0 murders and I've been all over the map. It works just fine, so "impossible" is sheer nonsense.

The game does have its bugs, agreed - version number ought to give you a hint on why though. Killing zombies however is very easy, particularly when you've learned to adapt to the way they aggro. Don't leave yourself in open terrain. I killed about 100 zombies in about 30 minutes using an AKM in the NW airfield. They even managed to knock me down once, but still survived, even though they were walking through stairs and jumping through concrete. I got a bit lucky, but the bottom line is that if you learn how to adapt, you will have few problems, even when just doing PvE.

All you talk about in here is "killing" so I assume you do not have the mental capabilities to understand where I want to go with this thread.

The game is way too easy as soon as you have a weapon, the only real thread after this are other players who are more powerful. Before having any sort of gun you are pretty much fucked because zombies will spawn on you, you will aggro them in weird ways or you will die of hunger or thirst if you spend too much time sneaking and only finding trash.

As I said before, new players are worthless.

Well on the surface it sounds like good advice, but then ... who are you to criticise? No, don't answer that.

He's a player, so he's technically a client expressing what he thinks that is wrong with the product he is using. Not that he bought the mod itself of course.

Rocket has, as an individual come up with a game design that is so popular that a dated, and really buggy engine like the ARMA2-engine is being bought in numbers that ARMA2 only had in its inception, and then singularly because of Operation Flashpoint. Not only that, but DayZ is a mod in an alpha stage, normally we don't even get to see these things because a smaller group of developers and their friends are playing this. The success is so riveting that the game is being talked about all over the world. I would say if I had to bet on who has a better idea on what is required to make a game successful out of the two of you, even without knowing who you are. I would bet on Rocket, any day of the week.

So Rocket is the only person with good ideas on game features just because he made this? Don't you think that out of the millions of gamers none of them had thought about a game like this? The only thing that differentiates Rocket from someone else with this idea is that Rocket actually knows how to create the code and has the knowledge on how to shape and create the mod( and had the luck to be the first one doing it).

Also fisk, Rocket hasn't been beatified yet. He's a normal person. What are you? Some sort of ass-licker I'd say.

But lets not forget that the only reason that we know of them, is because Rocket made it an open alpha.

But lets not forget that the only reason that we are discussing this, is because Rocket made a suggestion box on the forums.

Bro, there are these towns called Kamenko and maybe Komarovo, small cities with a lot of loot, all you have to do is have a tiny piece of patience and crawl. After my first 2 hours of playing and getting mauled by zombies, I started crawling and hey, I actually managed to remain undetected, get a hatchet (IMO the best weapon in the game). From there you can pretty much kill any zombie you want without dying as long as move quickly and quietly.

I know you don't want advice, but if you're going to be pigheaded about it, you're going to have a really big learning curve.

I'm sorry that you even bothered making that worthless answer, but I've seen better DayZ tutorials on youtube already.

But lets not forget that the only reason we are here, is because Rocket made a suggestions box in the forums.

Edited July 29, 2012 by jimykx

[tobiassolem 173]

I play the mod. These forums are here to express opinions, and that's what I'm doing.

At some point, the, "this mod is in alpha" response becomes an excuse. I understand, it's not a flawless diamond. However, can you sit here and tell me that in the 4+ months this mod's been out that appreciable progress has been made toward becoming a standalone game?

Everyone's got an opinion, in the end it is facts that make a difference.

Fact is that making and perfecting a mod takes a lot of time, there are mods out there that have been worked on for years. DayZ still has a very small team working on it and Rocket has said that the "standalone" thing is a goal that is going to happen "somewhere in the future", when that is, we don't know. He himself has speculated on 2013 maybe(?). How many mods with the complexity and gameplay value out there do you know of that have been developed for "4+ months"? Seriously, can you find one? Do you know any game mods at all that by month 5 since the inception were deep into making it standalone?

To me you just come off as another entitled spoilt player that got something for free and aren't happy with it. I remember back in the very late 90'ies when Counter-Strike alphas were played on a massive scale at the school I was teaching, it took roughly a year before it truly was playable and it peaked somewhere around 2004. Compared the development of CS, considering we're only a couple of months since the very first release, I think you are behaving like the noobs in DayZ, running around, dying again and again and finally giving up "Game too hard and boring". - you need patience in and with this game, particularly considering how difficult it is dealing with/working woth the ARMA2-engine.

[tobiassolem 173]

All you talk about in here is "killing" so I assume you do not have the mental capabilities to understand where I want to go with this thread.

The game is way too easy as soon as you have a weapon, the only real thread after this are other players who are more powerful. Before having any sort of gun you are pretty much fucked because zombies will spawn on you, you will aggro them in weird ways or you will die of hunger or thirst if you spend too much time sneaking and only finding trash.

The game is "too easy" once you get a gun? Have you even played 1.7.2.4? Firing anything that isn't silenced aggroes pretty much every zombie within sight.

At the same time you say the game is too difficult in the beginning, yet the majority of players are able to handle it fine. Once you realize that losing one or two aggroed zombies is as easy as crouching in a bush out of sight, or running through a building, it isn't that difficult, and if you've aggroed more - well, you've probably been too impatient.

He's a player, so he's technically a client expressing what he thinks that is wrong with the product he is using. Not that he bought the mod itself of course.

He's downloaded a mod that in no way guarantees anything. It's an alpha test less than half a year in development led by a guy who doesn't do this full-time. "Client", "product", seriously - could you guys act more entitled?

So Rocket is the only person with good ideas on game features just because he made this? Don't you think that out of the millions of gamers none of them had thought about a game like this? The only thing that differentiates Rocket from someone else with this idea is that Rocket actually knows how to create the code and has the knowledge on how to shape and create the mod( and had the luck to be the first one doing it).

Coming up with opinions and ideas is one thing. Anyone with hands and fingers can type whatever they want. Understanding how a game is made, balanced, and enjoyable is quite another. So many game development studios caved in because entitled people shared their "opinions", SOE being one of the most notable. They ruined SWG because a lot of people felt it was too hard to become a Jedi - after all, everyone wanted to be one. So they caved in to people sharing their "opinions" and "ideas". What actually works is a completely separate thing, if you give players exactly what they wish for, if a game poses too little challenge, if it becomes imbalanced, then the "fun-factor" and sense of achievment disappears. It is a complex balancing act best done by experienced people who know what they're doing. Opinions and ideas are nice and dandy, but they're pipe dreams. Realizing something isn't about just knowing how to code (lol).

Also fisk, Rocket hasn't been beatified yet. He's a normal person. What are you? Some sort of ass-licker I'd say.

I've been a part of several modding projects myself. None ever were even near as successful as this mod. This is simply staggering. I can however say that I am impressed by people who are capable of people who can realize something like this, and not just be blabbermouths and walking opinion-generating meatbags.What you call "ass-licker" is what I call respect for someone who has done more for a lot of people in a short time than you or I have, or perhaps ever will.

[dra6o0n 15]

1) Game isn't getting harder or easier, players are adapting to it far too easily over time, so the devs wants to 'change up' some stuff.

When this occur, perception or views on each individual in the community, and each kind of people (elitists, casuals, hardcores, etc.) will be different and views will obviously clash.

2) This is a mod, it's severely limited to what ArmA II can do, and it is not a independent game or based on a custom game engine or library for it to be better adaptable... The mod makers may not be real programmers and may not be able to fully code a game from scratch.

Mods for games can be great, it provides a free way to play a game in a certain way, but once you expect too much out of it, conflict ensues in the community because everyone thinks it should be a game designed in their view. All development of a game and mod is of entirely on the developer's view, what they want, you get, what you hate, they 'may' change it.

3) There will be plenty of other games in due time with similar gameplay, 'The War Z' will be a good development because they do three things correct: They have the experience of making and publishing their own F2P MMOFPS game (War Inc. Battlezone), they have a large funding, and is a real company. They planned and designed the game years ago in secret. They are a independant studio so they should be able to have a greater potential than DayZ would ever get.

Did I mention that DayZ only said they are considering 'standalone' versions after 'The War Z' was announced?

DayZ mod for the Arma III engine would not be too different than the current version, because it will be a mod and as all mods it is severely limited to the engine it's used in. Bohemia might 'design' their engine to be better for modders, but there will be more bugs and obvious limitations for mods in the end.

Why do I think that DayZ and Arma II mods are that limited? Well Bohemia interactive codes their game and hardcoded most values into the base engine, and while mods can 'influence' these codes, they cannot change it down to the core. Mods cannot create 'imaginary' new code values from scratch unless the engine permits them to (For example, if you want to make a launcher like the Six Launcher, it won't be possible if the game engine doesn't allow 'public' types for it to talk to third party codes).

Edited July 29, 2012 by dra6o0n

[dra6o0n 15]

First I want to thank guys like tempestfeir, Xeroph,jayp.uncensored,TheProphecy,Colditz and Dev0 because they actually read, understood my point, and even though they might not agree with everything I said they shared their feelings about what they think is wrong and helped turn my whole post a lot more constructive.

I'm complaining about the problems in the core mechanics of sneaking and avoiding zombies. If you can't take the time to understand someone's thread this is probably not the place for you.

Dimes123 has a pretty good answer to you.

All you talk about in here is "killing" so I assume you do not have the mental capabilities to understand where I want to go with this thread.

The game is way too easy as soon as you have a weapon, the only real thread after this are other players who are more powerful. Before having any sort of gun you are pretty much fucked because zombies will spawn on you, you will aggro them in weird ways or you will die of hunger or thirst if you spend too much time sneaking and only finding trash.

As I said before, new players are worthless.

He's a player, so he's technically a client expressing what he thinks that is wrong with the product he is using. Not that he bought the mod itself of course.

So Rocket is the only person with good ideas on game features just because he made this? Don't you think that out of the millions of gamers none of them had thought about a game like this? The only thing that differentiates Rocket from someone else with this idea is that Rocket actually knows how to create the code and has the knowledge on how to shape and create the mod( and had the luck to be the first one doing it).

Also fisk, Rocket hasn't been beatified yet. He's a normal person. What are you? Some sort of ass-licker I'd say.

But lets not forget that the only reason that we are discussing this, is because Rocket made a suggestion box on the forums.

I'm sorry that you even bothered making that worthless answer, but I've seen better DayZ tutorials on youtube already.

But lets not forget that the only reason we are here, is because Rocket made a suggestions box in the forums.

Zombies do not have full animations that makes them easier to read with body language, and how they are controlled by the server severely makes them laggy and buggy.

In fact, blame Bohemia for this because how NPC operates and how AI function still is down to the core on the game engine.

You can mod or customize it to make AI 'smarter' but they won't act 'smarter', but so long as bugs and limits are in the animation, you can't fix it.

The devs at Dayz are practically at Bohemia's demise, but I'm pretty sure that the game company depends on DayZ for it's sales as it's probably one of the major reasons people buy Arma II (So is Bohemia at Dayz's demise, because if the mod utterly gets destroyed and no one buys the game to play it, they cannot continue to make a profit until Arma III).

Edited July 29, 2012 by dra6o0n

[Louis13245 29]

He's downloaded a mod that in no way guarantees anything. It's an alpha test less than half a year in development led by a guy who doesn't do this full-time. "Client", "product", seriously - could you guys act more entitled?

So more formal words were used instead of 'participant' and 'creator'. Doesn't change the fact that the mod is in alpha and requires the participants to voice their concerns over certain aspects of the game. True, some may see it as whining or complaining amongst other more unsavoury terms, but it's still an important part of the game's development. Call it a devil's advocate or something. All it requires is for the reader of the post to ignore the negativity and focus on the issues which are very real.

What you call "ass-licker" is what I call respect for someone who has done more for a lot of people in a short time than you or I have, or perhaps ever will.

You're right with the fact that calling other's 'ass-licker' is uncalled for. But just as a small side note, your wording made me wince. While I respect Rocket for creating the game, claiming that he has done something for a lot of people is a bit over the top. You make it sound like he's changed people's lives for the better. Leave that type of wording for people who actually help others. Instead, something like 'respect for someone who has created a popular innovative game from a old and tempermental game engine in a short time, a greater acheviment than you or I have, or perhaps ever will'. Otherwise, I agree with you on this point.

Edited July 29, 2012 by Louis13245

[jimykx 57]

The game is "too easy" once you get a gun? Have you even played 1.7.2.4? Firing anything that isn't silenced aggroes pretty much every zombie within sight.

At the same time you say the game is too difficult in the beginning, yet the majority of players are able to handle it fine. Once you realize that losing one or two aggroed zombies is as easy as crouching in a bush out of sight, or running through a building, it isn't that difficult, and if you've aggroed more - well, you've probably been too impatient.

Once you realize that it's not all that beautiful and simple because playing the game and avoiding zombies is much more complex and involves much more than just "crouching in a bush out of sight". If one of those "one or two aggroed zombies" that is running towards you at incredible speeds hits you and you start bleeding from that only hit, and you already used your starting bandage, you're screwed. And don't tell me "if you were a good player you wouldn't be hit by zeds so easily and bleed so much" because the system is way too bugged for all of the escape methods to work properly without any variances.

He's downloaded a mod that in no way guarantees anything. It's an alpha test less than half a year in development led by a guy who doesn't do this full-time. "Client", "product", seriously - could you guys act more entitled?

I'll say again, this is a suggestions box and it's his "entitle" to express his opinion. If there is a way to post suggestions it's because the devs/dev want to read them or atleast want to look like they do.

Coming up with opinions and ideas is one thing. Anyone with hands and fingers can type whatever they want. Understanding how a game is made, balanced, and enjoyable is quite another. So many game development studios caved in because entitled people shared their "opinions", SOE being one of the most notable. They ruined SWG because a lot of people felt it was too hard to become a Jedi - after all, everyone wanted to be one. So they caved in to people sharing their "opinions" and "ideas". What actually works is a completely separate thing, if you give players exactly what they wish for, if a game poses too little challenge, if it becomes imbalanced, then the "fun-factor" and sense of achievment disappears. It is a complex balancing act best done by experienced people who know what they're doing. Opinions and ideas are nice and dandy, but they're pipe dreams. Realizing something isn't about just knowing how to code (lol).

You probably do not know you are talking to someone who also played SWG pre-CU and STILL PLAYS. I agree with you with the fact that it failed in that aspect but you still do not understand my point of view. You can't relate both cases simply because SWG pre-CU WORKED. You had to grind to get a jedi but you COULD get a Jedi. In DayZ, analyzing an whole situation before acting is not enough because there is constantly the factor of luck, because there is so much randomness. SWG was solid, the randomness zombie spawning or aggrowing in DayZ is the opposite of solid. My suggestion of a current "easy fix" would be for them to add a melee weapon at start of some sorts. Do you understand it now? Do I have to make it easier?

I've been a part of several modding projects myself. None ever were even near as successful as this mod. This is simply staggering. I can however say that I am impressed by people who are capable of people who can realize something like this, and not just be blabbermouths and walking opinion-generating meatbags.What you call "ass-licker" is what I call respect for someone who has done more for a lot of people in a short time than you or I have, or perhaps ever will.

I've been part of several modding projects myself. I created models and textures while the rest of the team coded the mod and its inner workings. Of course it was not nearly as successful a this mod but let me tell you one thing. We all did it because we enjoyed it, because we felt good with what we where creating and with the fact that we were learning. We had a small community that played on our server and we accepted their criticism and changed and shaped the mod thanks to it, of course that we did not leave the main development line and we kept the focus on what we where trying to create. Going back to the SWG problem, listening to the players too much was what caused those design problems, LISTENING TOO MUCH.

The criticism, in our case, was used to make what we build something with a better structure overall, not something totally different.

WE, just like Rocket, worked on the mod for FUN because we like it. We did it more for ourselves than for others. I'm pretty sure that there would be no DayZ if Rocket felt forced on working on the mod and didn't feel any fun , enjoyment or fulfillment from it.

You might be respectful but you are not humble at all and that blinds you from the fact that you are not the only person In the planet who does things (besides Rocket, of course)

Edited July 29, 2012 by jimykx

[captainwaffles 41]

I've actually gotten into a forest and ran 20 maybe 30 ft from it without it right behind since i vaulted. it lost interest. then ran at me again D:

Its because when you lose them they search the area for a little bit you need to try and keep hiding or move

[captainwaffles 41]

anyway rocket said he wanted to add in punching

[MinxinG 50]

Jezus newbies, I learned how to survive in DayZ by dying, just because you are new here doesnt mean that you need a "handcap", jeez, fucking man up and start thinking what you can do with the 'rules' of DayZ...

Zombies aggro too easy? No shit!! It needs to be this way, I personally think that the zombies SHOULD AND NEED to be waay more deadlier, the game is too easy, If they aggro you can run like a chicken that he wont catch you, simple as that. "In real life" ( people love to mention it here, forgeting that this is a video game ) you would run like a bitch, you wouldnt think of punching the zombies since you dont know if they are infectious or dont feel pain or even both!, I wouldnt take a chance...

So stop bitching and learn like I did, and trust me, if you think that this is hard, you should try one of the last patches that Rocky totally made aggro fucking awesome, you get 3 bars of "eye" while crounching and 4 bars "ears" walking normally ( not running )

MAN UP BITCH!!!

i ruled :>

Edited July 29, 2012 by MinxinG

[dra6o0n 15]

Add additional combat on top of all item layers:

When you have no weapons equipped you can cycle F key to find a 'shove' action, which inflicts 0 damage, has a 35% chance to knock a target down to the ground ('makes them use a animation that makes them fall and remain in a dead state for a split second then enter prone state), and causes 'dazed' when the target falls and hits the ground (depends if the ground is soil, or concrete).

*Hitting the ground will inflict it's own set of damage based on the impact.

Using a 2handed weapon will make you use a stronger 'shove' that inflicts 400 base damage on hit, as you are whacking a target with a weapon, and 40% chance to knock down a target, and causes 'dazed' on hit on a player (it's not bare hand shoving it's like rifle butting a player).

** Attack speed of shoving changes based on the bulkiness of the weapon/tools.

Using a one handed weapon will allow you to use a bare hand shove or a pistol whip (cycle F key to use them), the pistol whip inflicts 600 damage on hit and has a 30% chance to knock down a target. Headshots with pistol whip inflicting more damage and higher knock down chance with a chance to incapacitate (KO) a actual player.

The chance increases by 50% onto the base chance when you use it on a target from behind, meaning if you get someone at gun point from behind you can knock them out to loot their stuff without killing them outright.

Shoving does push a target back some distance (about 1 meter) so it's possible to shove a zombie off a roof to it's death... Or a player for that matter. It doesn't work if a wall is blocking it, but the player can still be knocked down at his own location.

Edited July 29, 2012 by dra6o0n

[colsteel 1]

I take it you play on a server with no one else on it?

nope just no where to go and get out fast and got team mates to back me up. I do get killed some in the cities though i tend to run the other direction if there is gun fire. i also play alot at night when you cant c crap. thats always fun and as long as i can c a few buildings i know i can tell where to run.

[emagut 7]

Jezus newbies, I learned how to survive in DayZ by dying, just because you are new here doesnt mean that you need a "handcap", jeez, fucking man up and start thinking what you can do with the 'rules' of DayZ...

Zombies aggro too easy? No shit!! It needs to be this way, I personally think that the zombies SHOULD AND NEED to be waay more deadlier, the game is too easy, If they aggro you can run like a chicken that he wont catch you, simple as that. "In real life" ( people love to mention it here, forgeting that this is a video game ) you would run like a bitch, you wouldnt think of punching the zombies since you dont know if they are infectious or dont feel pain or even both!, I wouldnt take a chance...

So stop bitching and learn like I did, and trust me, if you think that this is hard, you should try one of the last patches that Rocky totally made aggro fucking awesome, you get 3 bars of "eye" while crounching and 4 bars "ears" walking normally ( not running )

MAN UP BITCH!!!

i ruled :>

if i said that u rule, does that make you happy?

Does it make you and future posts understand that this is not about how hard/easy the game is but how could the changes could be focus to give a better game experience and the work that has been done over this time in game that doesn't make everyone happy but you? Seriously..go eat a biscuit!

I totally agree with jimykx and i was having a lot of fun EVEN using exploits to overcome some game issues and if not, i wouldn't use it even if i know it was possible.

Of course its alpha, bla bla bla rocket discovered the cure for cancer, oh wait, he just created a new mod..sorry but some stuff like zombies don't spawn around specific perimeter from the player should be TOP priority to modify in game instead trying to modify a LOT of different that not necessarily comes in good time/place. But sure, who am i to question what should be done...i'm just saying, this is not my project and i'm just enjoying the product of someone.

Another thing i would like to understand, this is a zombie outbreak right? the game is not about to extinguish the human race..so of course it depends of the human values of who are playing, and that will affect the game experience of everyone who starts playing the game. Co-op lead to better easier approach, but players out there in DayZ don't seem to understand that, and randomly starts killing fresh spawns instead of trying to create gangs and dominate zones in map. This is just the experience i had in game and something i would love to see in future: A game were you can dominate keys spots in map to overcome the opposite gang and survive with a lot of story that could make a movie..but maybe that's another game.

I'm looking forward to keep an eye on further development in DayZ even if i don't agree with some changes at this point.

Edited July 29, 2012 by emagut