Ideas for Humanity? :o

[Tsyn 215]

Alright, so after Rocket's post about removing humanity for the time being, but retaining the functionality (I think) I started thinking about what makes DayZ fun, and what would make it better. Not that my opinion really matters, but Rocket said he reads the forums, so I figured I'd give it a shot.

This thread is still building off of brainstorming, so let me know if any of it doesn't make sense.

Let's set two variables as I think about it - full negative and full positive. To reach full negative, it's pretty simple: be a bandit. Kill other players and loot their bodies for your own benefit. Reaching full positive is a bit more difficult in my opinion. Things that would help you (and others) survive would build positive humanity (like before, if I remember correctly). Things like healing someone in any way (morphine, blood bags, etc.) and perhaps killing a certain amount of zombies would give you a bonus to your humanity.

This is all basic things that I do believe were already in the game. This is where it gets a little weird. I'll separate my different ideas so things don't get confusing.

*As you progress through 'ranks' of negative or positive humanity, you may gain titles (I understand this is counter-productive as to the reason that Rocket removed the effect for the time being, but hear me out). As you begin going positive, perhaps your name would change color as well (this would only be on servers in which display tags unless a new system is released). These titles and name colors would distinguish what type of player you are inside DayZ. This would prevent completely friendly players from being killed by other friendly players for whatever reason... Maybe? This would also allow for the distinct discovery of bandit players, which might be bad.

*As you go full negative or full positive (this probably wouldn't be easy or fast) you would gain 'feats'. These benefits would be related to what type of player you are, bandit or survivor. If you were a survivor, or 'rescuer' would be a better word for it (if you're going full positive, I mean) then maybe you would gain a feat such as... More room to carry medical supplies, faster bandaging, etc (I haven't put much thought into the feats, but if this becomes an interesting thread, I might do so at a later date). Bandits and rescuers would have a totally different set of skills or bonuses and you would not be able to aquire them both. The only way something like that could work is if you went full negative and then decided you had a change of heart and went full positive - you would then lose the bandit skill or feats as you gained humanity. Same with the opposite way around.

Not sure how it would work if you died. Perhaps you lost some humanity in either way you progressing (toward the neutral mark) each time you die. Or perhaps you'd lose it completely.

Either way, this would add a lot of progression to the game in my opinion.

Anyways, just some ideas.

Discuss? ;)

Edited July 23, 2012 by Tsyn

[whatbadguy 21]

Hm..

[Vertisce 158]

So you are thinking like a (I know other games have done this) Mass Effect styled Paragon/Renegade system? I like the idea but I think instead of titles or ranks which are generally meaningless we have penalties and benefits to them. Penalize the obvious Renegade action with something like what I have suggested before such as, higher visibility and audibility to zombies. Reward Paragon with the reverse of whatever the penalty to Renegade is.

What would stop two buddies going around killing a bunch of people from exploiting this by healing and bandaging each other all the time though?

[Tsyn 215]

There would be different values for each act of either 'Paragon' or 'Renegade' as you put it. Killing a player would be pretty hardcore negatives, whereas blood bags would be a fairly small increase to your humanity.

The name titles would maybe prevent non-bandit players from killing you. Thought process might go something like... "Oh, he's been a rescuer for quite some time..." perhaps they'd approach you as a friendly, or leave you be.

I guess the idea of the titles is that the threat level for a positive humanity player would be much lower.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Tsyn

[zipper 69]

Your idea forces people to play a certain way. Those who would not shoot on sight would now be forced to do so. On top of it you already know it completely mimics the reason the bandit skin was removed, and it would be limited to only a select number of servers that have tags enabled. As you can see, suggesting ideas that force a certain gameplay lead to suggestions that penalize the gameplay of others, as Vertisce so eloquently stated. Since Rocket himself said he would not force people to play the game a certain way, and he said he wouldn't ever penalize people for playing the game however they see fit, you get no support from me.

On top of that you are doing this.

[Tsyn 215]

I'm not sure how this would force people to play one way though.

I also agree in a way that the tags are the exact same thing as the bandit skin, but I was attempting to conjure up some sort of identifier to separate bandits from friendlies. Not just bandits from neutral survivors that may or may not kill you on sight, but actual players that will help you if they can.

I'm not sure how the death matching is going to be fixed, but I suppose Rocket will figure it out at some point.

The humanity idea is in no way forcing someone to play one way. If you subtract all identifiers from bandits and survivors, then place the humanity idea on the current game, you would get more of a sense of an RPG on top of a shooter game. This would not only allow people to play the way they want to, but they would get a sense of progression. This would also make teams of players slightly more helpful.

I'm not going to defend my ideas, simply because other people see things that I do not. I place the suggestions, and I'll clarify anything that I feel was misinterpreted.

Cute picture, it almost made me give a shit ;)

Edited July 23, 2012 by Tsyn

[DryGulch 32]

At least lie to me and tell me you used the search tool.

Edited July 23, 2012 by DryGulch

[tarquinbb 28]

i think humanity should merely change your DEATH MESSAGE name to red (bandit) or blue (survivor).

for example you might kill a guy and it would say "Crackbeard was killed." then you know he was a bandit and feel good. otherwise it might say "Crackbeard was killed." and it would make you feel like a douche (unless you're a bandit in which case it might be sweet to know you killed a good guy as well).

Edited July 23, 2012 by tarquinbb

[Dimes123 60]

it should make you talk to yourself, which attracts zombies. no one is forced to play this way, its up to you

[Ramirez77 6]

Humanity is gained in tiny amounts by killing zombies.

Humanity is gained in significant amounts by healing.

Humanity is lost through murdering people.

People criticize this idea (Unless he was talking to someone else or misread the post) because it "forces people to play a certain way", so instead of punishing either side, just reward both.

Don't have a lot of ideas for perks, here's just a few off the top of my head.

Bonuses for Negative Humanity (Focused on PvP/Offense):

More Silent Movement

Faster Speed

Bonuses for Positive Humanity (Focused on PvE/Defense:

Faster Heal Time/Slower Bleeding

More Health

I like the colored Nametags idea, but it might make it to easy to spot and kill bandits.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Ramirez77

[zipper 69]

*As you go full negative or full positive (this probably wouldn't be easy or fast) you would gain 'feats'. These benefits would be related to what type of player you are, bandit or survivor. If you were a survivor, or 'rescuer' would be a better word for it (if you're going full positive, I mean) then maybe you would gain a feat such as... More room to carry medical supplies, faster bandaging, etc (I haven't put much thought into the feats, but if this becomes an interesting thread, I might do so at a later date). Bandits and rescuers would have a totally different set of skills or bonuses and you would not be able to aquire them both. The only way something like that could work is if you went full negative and then decided you had a change of heart and went full positive - you would then lose the bandit skill or feats as you gained humanity. Same with the opposite way around.

This is what I am talking about. Rewarding people for their play style will split the community into two extremes, forcing them to pick one side or the other. It is a solid idea for an MMO that has distinct factions that are fighting against each other. But not for an open world survival mod where people are supposed to have the freedom to do what they want. On top of that, the minute you reward banditry, everyone and their mom will be on the coastline shooting brand new players that spawn in. People already have problems with being killed after a fresh spawn. This would magnify the problem x1000.

[SalamanderAnder (DayZ) 1747]

Humanity is gained in tiny amounts by killing zombies.

Humanity is gained in significant amounts by healing.

Humanity is lost through murdering people.

People criticize this idea (Unless he was talking to someone else or misread the post) because it "forces people to play a certain way", so instead of punishing either side, just reward both.

Don't have a lot of ideas for perks, here's just a few off the top of my head.

Bonuses for Negative Humanity (Focused on PvP/Offense):

More Silent Movement

Faster Speed

Bonuses for Positive Humanity (Focused on PvE/Defense:

Faster Heal Time/Slower Bleeding

More Health

I like the colored Nametags idea, but it might make it to easy to spot and kill bandits.

Give a bandit more speed and silence? So basically turn him into more of a banditing machine.

I think abilities/perks undermine one of the most unique qualities of this game, which is skill. And I'm not talking about XP points that unlock "skills," but I mean real knowledge. This game is a skill based game. The only way to be successful is to develop skills, like:

Scanning your surroundings.

Not travelling on the tops of hills or through open areas.

Knowing how to break line of sight effectively.

Positioning yourself strategically.

Using tactics like flanking and close-quarters clearing techniques.

Exercising discretion when necessary.

Managing your equipment.

That is why this game is so authentic. Rocket says himself, he wants to give the players tools. Not just grant them abilities.