Simulating Morality?

[theswedishdude 2]

Let's start of by saying I'm really new to this game, and I haven't been playing for more than a week. But despite that, and all the glitches and flaws in the game, I'm in love!

However, there's one thing that bothers the sh*t out of me: And by judging from some of the other posts, I'm guessing at least a few of you will agree, and that's the "shoot on sight"-issue.

I'm perfectly aware that by now, at least 50% of the readers are thinking I should go f**k myself and stop playing the game if it doesn't suit me.

But this game is just way to good to let it be turned into a really big scale deathmatch.

I'm all for the freedom, and if a player wants to kill another player on sight, he or she should have that choice. But if I understand the vision of this game correctly, it's about total realism.

And that's why I'm proposing to try and simulate "morality". This may sound really complex, but it doesn't have to be. You can simulate a person bleeding by making them loose HP every second. You can simulate a broken leg by by making them not being able to walk, so why not simulate anxiety after killing a player?

This could be done by making the screen blurry, having a player hear weird/annoying sounds. Maybe having the body temperature going up and down to simulate some kind of cold sweat? Make the player shake just like when you are hurt?

I'm thinking this would be a "realistic" way to try and deal with the murder problems. Right now, a lot of players don't think twice about shooting an unarmed player in the back. But why should they? It's just a virtual character that can just respawn 10 seconds later. Sure they will loose their gear, and that sucks. But not nearly enough to make players reconsider before they ruin someone else's game.

This may be a shi**y idea, but I had to get it of my chest.

Flame away!

[Kozmas 30]

But, if I enjoy killing people, why on earth would I have anxiety afterwards?

[Aira 22]

No one with a working brain loves to kill people, especially not if the human race is in serious thread.

[theswedishdude 2]

But, if I enjoy killing people, why on earth would I have anxiety afterwards?

If you enjoyed killing people, wouldn't you be on death row long before the zombie outbreak?

I see you're point, if you want play a character that likes killing people, this idea sucks big time. But as I said in my post, if I understood the vision of this mod correctly, it's about realism (expect for the zombies. And unless you're a psychopath, killing someone is seriously going to f**k you up. Even if it's in self defense.

[Baelethal 102]

Please please please stop cluttering the forums with these posts. Use the search feature.

[Kozmas 30]

If you enjoyed killing people, wouldn't you be on death row long before the zombie outbreak?

I see you're point, if you want play a character that likes killing people, this idea sucks big time. But as I said in my post, if I understood the vision of this mod correctly, it's about realism (expect for the zombies. And unless you're a psychopath, killing someone is seriously going to f**k you up. Even if it's in self defense.

You take shit too seriously, buddy. When I play this game, I don't look at it, as what would I do in this situation? I play this because I enjoy playing it. I enjoy killing people in this game, so I should not suffer anxiety. If we have to suffer consequences for killing someone, we should also suffer consequences for killing zombies, or hell even having zombies coming after us. The sheer terror that you would feel when 10-20 zombies running at you in full blown sprint wanting to rip you apart would drive you mad eventually.

[Denuth 21]

I like your idea, fuck all the other jokers they just are mad cause they don't want to be penalized for killing another person. Which is stupid. If you kill someone in real life you have problems, anxiety all that shit. It makes sense. And the whole point of this is rockets idea of immersion not yours Kozmas. So when something is implemented at some point I'll be prepared to hear your bitching as well. Thank you for the thought out idea though. The more of these we get the better just try and post it in the suggestions area next time!

[sixbarns 217]

" so why not simulate anxiety after killing a player?"

Because not everyone is going to feel anxiety after killing a player. Or anything at all.a

It's also just a game and the players know that.

[Kozmas 30]

I like your idea, fuck all the other jokers they just are mad cause they don't want to be penalized for killing another person. Which is stupid. If you kill someone in real life you have problems, anxiety all that shit. It makes sense. And the whole point of this is rockets idea of immersion not yours Kozmas. So when something is implemented at some point I'll be prepared to hear your bitching as well. Thank you for the thought out idea though. The more of these we get the better just try and post it in the suggestions area next time!

I'm all for being identified as a bandit. I don't give half a shit about that. But to suffer physical consequences? That'll never happen.

[Cort 5]

If you enjoyed killing people, wouldn't you be on death row long before the zombie outbreak?

The possibility of being on death row is a deterrent. Take the deterrent away and see how many people will starting killing and enjoying it while they do.

We all have the capacity for murder in us, we are the offspring of the most ruthless survivors, our ancestors did the most cruel and unspeakable things to each other, not all of it was in self defense, much of it was for enjoyment or other more nuanced reasons.

Modern society is working and has made things more peaceful, in fact we live in the most peaceful time in all of human history, what happens when society goes away? We will revert to our previous ways for a time, maybe a long time.

If you want to hear a good talk that will put things in perspective and applies very well to DayZ: http://www.ted.com/t...f_violence.html

DayZ simulates morality in a post apocalyptic scenario almost perfectly by not enforcing any artificial punishments through silly game mechanics. This is what people would do to each other if there where no penalties for doing so since that is what the game does and people are doing it. The game is is own proof for how people would act in the situation.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Cort

[theswedishdude 2]

The possibility of being on death row is a deterrent. Take the deterrent away and see how many people will starting killing and enjoying it while they do.

We all have the capacity for murder in us, we are the offspring of the most ruthless survivors, our ancestors did the most cruel and unspeakable things to each other, not all of it was in self defense, much of it was for enjoyment or other more nuanced reasons.

Modern society is working and has made things more peaceful, in fact we live in the most peaceful time in all of human history, what happens when society goes away? We will revert to our previous ways for a time, maybe a long time.

If you want to hear a good talk that will put things in perspective and applies very well to DayZ: http://www.ted.com/t...f_violence.html

Ask a war veteran how much he enjoyed killing people. Tell the doctor who just lost a patient. Tell the parent who lost their child. It's Interesting how were are 7 billion people on the earth if we enjoyed killing each other so much.

[Cort 5]

Ask a war veteran how much he enjoyed killing people. Tell the doctor who just lost a patient. Tell the parent who lost their child. It's Interesting how were are 7 billion people on the earth if we enjoyed killing each other so much.

History doesn't bear out your argument, and there are many veterans who had no issue killing the people they did, they felt justified. Nazi Germany anyone?

[Jackftw 310]

But, if I enjoy killing people, why on earth would I have anxiety afterwards?

Do you enjoy killing people in real life?

[Kozmas 30]

Ask a war veteran how much he enjoyed killing people. Tell the doctor who just lost a patient. Tell the parent who lost their child. It's Interesting how were are 7 billion people on the earth if we enjoyed killing each other so much.

So you're speaking for every single war veteran that ever existed if they enjoyed killing people? Some did, some didn't. Plain and simple.

[Cort 5]

*deleted*

Edited July 22, 2012 by Cort

[Kozmas 30]

Do you enjoy killing people in real life?

DayZ is real life? Use common sense next time, please.

[Kozmas 30]

Why not you seem to be speaking for all of them too.

I'm not speaking for any of them. But I know that not every single one of them either hated or enjoyed it. No one thinks exactly the same.

[Cort 5]

I'm not speaking for any of them. But I know that not every single one of them either hated or enjoyed it. No one thinks exactly the same.

Sorry I read your message out of context, I agree with you.

[theswedishdude 2]

So you're speaking for every single war veteran that ever existed if they enjoyed killing people? Some did, some didn't. Plain and simple.

Can't say I speak for everyone, only the ones I've read bout' in the newspaper, seen in interviews and read books about. I'm yet to hear bout' a person who said they enjoyed killing , expect for the uncommon psychopath who lacks empathy. Maybe I'm wrong, could be I've just decided not to notice all the stories bout' all are blood thirsty predators that would go on killing sprees if they had the chance.

[Kozmas 30]

Can't say I speak for everyone, only the ones I've read bout' in the newspaper, seen in interviews and read books about. I'm yet to hear bout' a person who said they enjoyed killing , expect for the uncommon psychopath who lacks empathy. Maybe I'm wrong, could be I've just decided not to notice all the stories bout' all are blood thirsty predators that would go on killing sprees if they had the chance.

Clearly you've never heard the stories of people killing each other in places like Vietnam and shit, the people they killed they would take one of their bodyparts, usually an ear as a trophy. If they didn't enjoy killing them, why on earth would they of taken trophies? I'm not saying every single person loved killing others but, there's a mix of everything. Some people were driven mad by killing other people, some people took their lives because they couldn't handle it. Some people were simply indifferent to it, and some people enjoyed it.

Edit: But none of that really matters, because this is only a game. If you're a passive person, and accidentally kill someone in DayZ, are you actually going to be so fucked up, that you're going to have to visit a psychologist to get over it? No, of course you're not. Any sane person will get over it quite quickly.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Kozmas

[sturmfalkerda 5]

Guys, I had a War Vet with a Winchester in electro covering me and laying down fire on a sniper with a ak on the hospital rooftop, 5 people came together and we armed ourselves, there was even a guy with a melee weapon right behind the War Vet healing him if he got hit, I went and grabbed a markov from the body infront of me, he told me he would cover me while I went up and looted the building, so we did, I was yelling if I found any of his ammo, eventually I hear I see him popping up! I am going to take a shot! and then after that I offered to go check, so I climbed the ladder, I yelled WOHOO!! YOU GOT HIM!! over the mic, as I walked to the top of the roof of the hospital with a m1014 I found on someone, I asked him if he wanted any of the loot, he said he was fine, so I let the guy next to me get the gear, I asked him if he had a steam account, he said he didnt use it much, I was so completely awe struck, as in REALLY AWE STRUCK, that I forgot to ask for his email or anything, he said he kind of prefers to stay lone wolf, he will help if he can, he was a war vet for was it 7? or 14 years? I dont remember, he told me hes on this server often and he wouldnt shoot me inless I shot back, we where friends, he then walked out of electro...... I forgot the name of the server, Deus was his name, He has more morality then anyone on this forums does possibly, He was litterally sitting there right infront of a random person with a hatchet and a bunch of other people running around to get weapons, he trusted us, none of us let him down, most awesome memory ever I have had on DayZ, This is more encouragement to why I am not a bandit....

I like this idea, it would make GTA IV players be punished, like really punished for killing other players, like a 10 minute Screen shake or Shaking gun, That would help alot, we could possibly make it so if you or your around someone who gets a bandit kill, your stamina goes up max for a while, like max as in running or aiming without the bar going down from max for like 10 minutes....

[haviv[3rdid] 57]

No one with a working brain loves to kill people, especially not if the human race is in serious thread.

What about someone from Colorado with bachelor's degree in neuroscience?

[kingfury4 65]

[reaper12d 10]

I don't think something physical should happen to the player if they kill other players, simply because in real life people like animals will form packs and kill those not of their packs out of need for security, protection, and want.

There is no real way for this game to take into account the human emotion that goes into taking a life or the effect of it. Many people could care less about taking another humans life as long as they feel it is justified in their own minds.

While I am not a fan of Bandits I do understand why players may choose that route, why go look for loot when I can just take it off the guys that just picked it up and ran off the airfield? That may be a real world reason or simply its because its a game people will do it because they think it is fun to grief other players.

Either way games are not real life and there will never be a way for people to feel any real emotion toward taking the "life" of a video game character.

Now as for an in game idea which this post is about I actually think a system of notoriety should come into play. I.E. the more players you kill the easier it is to find you as a bandit, kind of like the white dots people see for Zeds, now before people flip their lid over it obviously it would have a limited range (that way players don't just instantly know where you are and hunt you down from all four corners of the map you when you join a server) and everytime you perish your slate is wiped clean.

*Edited Continuation*

The justification for the visible "dot" would be that like any other story/game out there bandits will stake their territory and rarely venture far from it, which to me makes perfect sense.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Reaper12D

[reaper12d 10]

What about someone from Colorado with bachelor's degree in neuroscience?

To soon...