If you guys want realism....

[Kaizen (DayZ) 0]

No 3rd person across all servers and no Cross hair. I personally only play in veterans but making this so would create for a more engaging and immersive gameplay imo. Everybody should try NO 3DP (3rd person).

Just wanted to say that thanks! Let me know what you guys think

[Blasty 0]

Also anyone who requests no third person should only be able to run for five minute intervals, and should have to push all bicycles up hills.

[jwo7777777 7]

ArmA developers themselves said third person is legitimate BECAUSE a real person has tactile awareness of closeness of things around them. The nearest the ArmA engines can get is to offer 3rd person. They encourage use of 3rd person for understanding the position of the players body in relation to surroundings.

[kahoots 0]

The issue I have with first person is that while it is way more immersive, its not really realistic. When I'm walking in the forest the trees are not jumping around my vision , giving me vertigo. It's just way too nauseating to me. I love that you can't see over tall grass while crawling not too mention not being able to see around corners, but again , too jumpy for me.

[Chimonanthus 9]

I support the first two posts (though I'm not sure if Rocket would actually love the idea of working hard on the codes to implement the "push your bike uphill" thing XD ) (about the running 5 minutes, I'm okay if by running you're talking about sprint / 2xW)

3rd person is definitly an immersion killer in DayZ.

In understand the difficulties, but you should have to rely on noises and shadows.

[heretic (DayZ) 76]

Another "Everybody should play my way because my way is the only way to play" type thread to add to the thousands of others.

How about giving players choices rather than taking them away? Now there's a novel idea!

[Soldier of Failure 14]

Dont want 3rd person? Try a sever on expert. US hardcores are quite nice.

^^ thats some damn magic right there.

[Chimonanthus 9]

Another "Everybody should play my way because my way is the only way to play" type thread to add to the thousands of others.

How about giving players choices rather than taking them away? Now there's a novel idea!

I'm gonna have to stay polite. :dodgy:

The main problem with 3rd person in DayZ (and Arma2) is you can see without having to show yourself (which is basically "cheating" in ambush scenarios IF the point of the game is realism and the fear of every corner in an zombie apocalypse and Rocket decides what's the point of the game, not us).

Basic irl ambush theory: If you're camping at a spot where you can see the eyes of the enemy, your eyes should be possible to be seen (and shot) by the eyes of the enemy. (I hope it was clear :S)

Solve this problem and everything's fine for the realism part of fights except for the intuitive close range aiming (which isn't there for better or worse, see

).

I believe the third person system of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 solved this problem but I can't remember for sure :S

[lukewishere@hotmail.co.uk 7]

I'm gonna have to stay polite. :dodgy:

The main problem with 3rd person in DayZ (and Arma2) is you can see without having to show yourself (which is basically "cheating" in ambush scenarios IF the point of the game is realism and the fear of every corner in an zombie apocalypse and Rocket decides what's the point of the game' date=' not us).

Basic irl ambush theory: If you're camping at a spot where you can see the eyes of the enemy, your eyes should be possible to be seen (and shot) by the eyes of the enemy. (I hope it was clear :S)

Solve this problem and everything's fine for the realism part of fights except for the intuitive close range aiming (which isn't there for better or worse, see

).

I believe the third person system of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 solved this problem but I can't remember for sure :S

[/quote']

Still doesn't deter from the fact that just because it's your preferred way of playing, doesn't mean it's the only way. Let others play in third person and you go play a first person server. Problem solved. Or are you having nightmares about people playing in third person?

[Ha1 12]

Let the 3rd-Mode stay in the game pls.

[Arnie (DayZ) 21]

Normaly I play my fps games in first person but not arma II. Reason, simple for some reason this game makes me motion sick in first person. The first time I played the single player campaign in arma I had to get away from the computer after 20 minutes because I was about to throw up. Tried it again the next day, same story. This NEVER ever happened to me in another game and I've been playing games for almost 30 years now.

Its something with the graphics engine I tell you, even turning the head movement down all the way still makes me feel sick. No 3rd person, no arma II for me or DayZ.

[Chimonanthus 9]

(...)

Still doesn't deter from the fact that just because it's your preferred way of playing' date=' doesn't mean it's the only way. Let others play in third person and you go play a first person server. Problem solved. Or are you having nightmares about people playing in third person?

[/quote']

I purposely pointed out "my way" wasn't the only way by precising only Rocket may decide what he wants in the game.

Nightmares? You're very funny aren't you?

By looking at how he took away the guns from new characters, I think (my pathetic little mortal idea) Rocket would agree with the idea of reducing the ease of 3rd person fights for a more realistic approach (although those who talked about surrounding awareness and people having nausea while playing the game might point out reasons good enough to drop the suggestion of taking out 3rd person).

If Rocket decides there is a reason to keep 3rd person or no reason to stop people from using 3rd person, I will accept it. I'm the customer so I can decide whether I want to play it anymore or not.

I'm a customization whore, I just love looking at my character. But yeah, I hate being shot by someone who can know his surrounding like he's a bunch of cameras looking at many directions and shoot me without taking the risk of showing a part of his face in the hallway and give me one chance to know I'm gonna be shot soon if I don't move. I do not use 3rd person servers without accepting the possibility of me being ambushed the way I just talked about.

I support the main suggestion of this thread and suggest we take 3rd person off or change it in all servers to enhance the experience for ALL PLAYERS (i might be wrong). If you don't think it would enhance it or that you believe it would make it worst, please explain why.

Future people, please restrain from doing anything else but making constructive replies and/or suggestions.

Let's all be "openminded" :rolleyes:

(Sorry for the long post and my poor English as it isn't my primary language)

[Quaby 93]

Another "Everybody should play my way because my way is the only way to play" type thread to add to the thousands of others.

How about giving players choices rather than taking them away? Now there's a novel idea!

I'm gonna have to stay polite. :dodgy:

The main problem with 3rd person in DayZ (and Arma2) is you can see without having to show yourself (which is basically "cheating" in ambush scenarios IF the point of the game is realism and the fear of every corner in an zombie apocalypse and Rocket decides what's the point of the game' date=' not us).

Basic irl ambush theory: If you're camping at a spot where you can see the eyes of the enemy, your eyes should be possible to be seen (and shot) by the eyes of the enemy. (I hope it was clear :S)

Solve this problem and everything's fine for the realism part of fights except for the intuitive close range aiming (which isn't there for better or worse, see

).

I believe the third person system of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 solved this problem but I can't remember for sure :S

[/quote']

It isn't really overpowered if everyone can do it. It's your choice to give yourself a handicap by staying in 1st person, but that doesn't mean other people have to. Besides, the game isn't 100% realistic;if it was, it wouldn't be fun. It gives some liberties for gameplay and this is one of them.

[Chimonanthus 9]

(...)

(...)

It isn't really overpowered if everyone can do it. It's your choice to give yourself a handicap by staying in 1st person' date=' but that doesn't mean other people have to. Besides, the game isn't 100% realistic;if it was, it wouldn't be fun. It gives some liberties for gameplay and this is one of them.

[/quote']

I would agree with you only if I didn't disagree with you first statement.

It is overpowered when used correctly.

Imagine a building with hallways forming a "H". You're on the left vertical way planning to go to the right side of the building.

The enemy is on the upper side of the right side. EVERYONE is using 3rd person. The enemy is a bandit camping a rare loot building and his third person view allows him to see you walking in the middle hallway. You are very careful and you're not even making a sound but your third person doesn't allow you to know there is a player in front of you "looking at you".

You should realize the rest: the enemy pops his head out and sprays his bullets into you before you get the time to point him if you weren't looking exactly where his head would pop out.

Third person becomes a sort of X-ray vision cheat when both opponents are at close distance where they could normally easily spot each other.

A situation where both players wouldve been forced to pop their head out to make sure the hallway is clear (if they are both careful and tactical survivors) and see each other would make it far more fair.

I understand the pleasures of Third Person view, I really do. But I believe that in a game where you need so few bullets to take a player down, "Xray" + surprise is overpowered.

I suggest they lower the distance of the camera in third person view to a minimum. At least show some body part when peeping through a hallway.

What do you guys think?

[ThomasTheCreeper 9]

I really dont see why you have a problem with the third person. Yes it might make ambushes and such easier for the attacker, but there is a really easy fix for this. Dont play on servers with 3dP on.. I only play on servers without 3dP to avoid this. Each to his own..

[heretic (DayZ) 76]

Another "Everybody should play my way because my way is the only way to play" type thread to add to the thousands of others.

How about giving players choices rather than taking them away? Now there's a novel idea!

I'm gonna have to stay polite. :dodgy:

The main problem with 3rd person in DayZ (and Arma2) is you can see without having to show yourself (which is basically "cheating" in ambush scenarios IF the point of the game is realism and the fear of every corner in an zombie apocalypse and Rocket decides what's the point of the game' date=' not us).

Basic irl ambush theory: If you're camping at a spot where you can see the eyes of the enemy, your eyes should be possible to be seen (and shot) by the eyes of the enemy. (I hope it was clear :S)

Solve this problem and everything's fine for the realism part of fights except for the intuitive close range aiming (which isn't there for better or worse, see

).

I believe the third person system of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 solved this problem but I can't remember for sure :S

[/quote']

Staying polite is definitely the way to go. Thank you.

In that vein, it seems to me that as long as everybody on the same server is playing by the same set of rules there is no significant problem.

Personal preferences aside, both sides of the 3rd vs 1st person argument are already catered for.

And as for realism... this is a mod to a computer game. It can only ever hope to approximate reality. Both 1st and 3rd person views are deeply flawed for a variety of reasons. Both are a compromise in order to constrain a virtual environment to the limits of playing on a flat screen/s.

If you prefer 1st person view, play on servers with 3rd person disabled. If you prefer 3rd person view, play on servers with it enabled.

Non existent problem solved.

[ORiGiN Machinima 215]

I agree with the above.

So long as there are options for playing on servers with 3DP and no 3DP then both sides will be happy.

Why create problems that need not be created?

[scoffield77@gmail.com 192]

I'm all for getting rid of Regular servers.

idc about 3rd and crosshairs, but player tags and seeing your pos plus other players pos (that are near you) on the map is a little re-fucking-diculus

[Chimonanthus 9]

Your right... If some people want to play games where "cheating"(call it what you want) is possible, sure. Let's not talk about this anymore and let's give them the choice.

Sorry for the trouble guys :angel:

[heretic (DayZ) 76]

I'm all for getting rid of Regular servers.

idc about 3rd and crosshairs' date=' but player tags and seeing your pos plus other players pos (that are near you) on the map is a little re-fucking-diculus

[/quote']

I do agree with you re tags (and crosshairs for that matter)... They are daft. Maybe more suited to recruit servers. But I think that getting rid of regular servers seems a bit excessive.

Aren't all of these server side options anyway?

---

Your right... If some people want to play games where "cheating"(call it what you want) is possible' date=' sure. Let's not talk about this anymore and let's give them the choice.

Sorry for the trouble guys :angel:

[/quote']

Calling people who don't want to play the game your way "cheats" seems a bit much. If the game makers included these OPTIONS, then I think it's down to them to decide if using them constitutes cheating or not.

When you get around to making a computer game and/or a mod, you get to set the rules. Then when people break those rules you get to call them cheats. In the meantime you're just being a leetist troll, not the angel you see yourself as.

Please refrain from trolling your narrow minded opinions on the forums. Attitudes like yours are already driving Rocket to despair. Please don't spoil things for the rest of us.

Perhaps I could point you to Rockets Facts of Life;

http://www.dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=14753

[Chimonanthus 9]

Your right, my mistake (except for the Facts of Rocket's life part, I didn't see any point related to what I said, I always precised Rocket was the one to have the final word). I stupidly considered using the word "cheating" wouldnt make any trouble but I shouldve said the right words.

I think it can give an unfair power in some situations. Clear enough?

I understand I must have hurt you very much to bring you to call people narrowminded people and trolls in a suggestion thread instead of Private messages. Please, http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/316/773/59d.jpg .

[You called me a troll. I was butthurt myself, I had to troll ;P No real offense intended]

[dallas 5195]

I believe ArmA has had 3rd person since 2001, it's also had multiplayer since 2001 I believe.

[joikd 25]

I despise 3rd person and will never have it on my server. But, it appears that the majority of players prefer it. So, as long as its a server option, I'm fine with it. It's not like someone can transfer the tactical advantages of a 3rd person server over to a non-3rd person server.

Also, it serves one other excellent purpose that benefits me (as a player) and my server.

[Delta Smoke 01 765]

Another "Everybody should play my way because my way is the only way to play" type thread to add to the thousands of others.

How about giving players choices rather than taking them away? Now there's a novel idea!

"Stoke me a Clipper, Il be back for christmas" Is the correct term ur looking for mate :P Rimmer messes ACE rimmers saying up :D Red Dwarf FTW !

[heretic (DayZ) 76]

Your right' date=' my mistake (except for the Facts of Rocket's life part, I didn't see any point related to what I said, I always precised Rocket was the one to have the final word). I stupidly considered using the word "cheating" wouldnt make any trouble but I shouldve said the right words.

I think it can give an unfair power in some situations. Clear enough?

I understand I must have hurt you very much to bring you to call people narrowminded people and trolls in a suggestion thread instead of Private messages. Please, http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/316/773/59d.jpg .

[You called me a troll. I was butthurt myself, I had to troll ;P No real offense intended']

No, you haven't hurt me at all. No offence taken. I know that I'm not a cheat in any sense of the word. But branding all players that use 3rd person view as cheats! Well, I think that you recognize that as being more than a little antagonistic and behaviour typical of trolling?

As for me calling those who wish to impose their play style on others narrow-minded... I stand by that. I believe it is a narrow minded view. There are enough options available for everybody to be able to play DayZ in a manner that suits them.

My personal stance is to promote player options and choice rather than restrict them.

As to 3DP giving players an unfair power in some situations. I don't dispute that it may do so. However, as long as the same rules apply to all on any one server... is it really worth all the disagreements?

I have a more than 30 year history with wargames/RPG's etc. From back in the days when we all used pen, paper and dice. OPTIONAL RULES were just that. As long as it was agreed between players which optional rules applied at the start of a play session, there was no need for heated debate or accusations of cheating.

Both parties in this debate are catered for. Whilst we may have to agree to disagree on this occasion, perhaps I can leave you with a matter on which I feel certain that we will see eye to eye.

Let's deal with the hackers that are spoiling DayZ for everybody first rather than split the legitimate player base into opposing camps over something as minor as 1DP vs 3DP.

Thanks for reading my views. I look forward to further constructive debate in the future and hope that we won't always hold opposing viewpoints.

Be safe in Chernarus!

---

Also' date=' it serves one other excellent purpose that benefits me (as a player) and my server.

[/quote']

Fresh meat! :)

---

"Stoke me a Clipper' date=' Il be back for christmas" Is the correct term ur looking for mate :P Rimmer messes ACE rimmers saying up :D Red Dwarf FTW !

[/quote']

You're right, of course. And always a pleasure to meet a fellow smeg head. We're everywhere...