helo's still endgame!

[AryanBoogeyman 185]

Did some of you ACTUALLY watch and understand the presentation?

 

It seems like some of you misunderstood a lot of what was said.. 

 

I personally found this presentation to be the most refreshing, and uplifting for what the future may hold for Dayz.. A lot of really good, and intelligent things are being done, and I really up until now had little faith that they were on a properly focused track for this game. Now I know they are.

 

If you are confused or think server hopping will get worse, etc.. I would suggest watching the video again.. and then research the parts that you do not fully understand.

 

 

I think you are correct in that they have an actual timeframe and roadmap presented.

 

What you fail to recognize is the ramifications of some of what they propose as it pertains to meta-game behavior. 

 

If you are confused perhaps watch the videos again and re-read some of the comments here.

[makomachine 263]

* M16 Rifles don't fit the game - it's extremely unlikely that a M16 rifle can be found laying around in Russia (withing 225km area)

* Random survivors with the ability to shoot guns and sniper rifles like veteran soldiers don't fit the game. I would prefer to make this more accurate - make women characters unable to shoot guns and if they try, make the recoil bump the rifle in their face.

* Running like crazy for hours doesn't fit the game. Make sure people get tired and make them rest so the road to Electro can last forever because it's the most interesting part of the game.

* Eating 50000kcal a day doesn't fit the game. Make a single can of tactical bacon last forever.

* Going around all day without pooping or peeing doesn't fit the game. Make sure characters take a break to poop in the middle of a firefight.

 

I just think these things take the game in the wrong direction. Also I demand an USB peripherial with an attached axe/matchete/gun/whatever to stab me/shoot me in the same pleace that I've been shot/stabbed in the game.

While I got a good laugh at this, along with a few "wut?" moments, I think you oversold your point sparky. I can learn to shoot a rifle accurately in real life - along with my wife - as we've done that with no formal training at all. Not quite the same as the "oh shit, here comes the ground experience" if we were to take it upon ourselves to helo jack the closest news helicopter. Your other points were nice and silly, but a bit far off the mark as it relates to this topic...

[AryanBoogeyman 185]

Was there a manual for the first fire built? Did someone just magically come up with how to build a pyramid? 

 

People are very resourceful. It would not be too difficult to do. You find a helicopter at the airport right? You would also find the mechanics hanger there too.. which would have all of the tools, and literature, supplies you should need. A man could spend 30 years building a helicopter in an apocalypse. But he would if he had a reason to. And nothing but death would stop him.

 

I get people not wanting this in game, but the argument over reality (IRL) and what is possible.. plausible.. is just silly. You cannot say that humans could not, should not, or would not be able to perform a task simply because other humans had mostly died off. You just can't. I mean, we had to start somewhere and look where humanity is now? 

 

 

Have you ever picked up any type of tool and tried to physically repair anything more complex than a nail-clipper?

 

Your comments grow more and more ludicrous.

[irl-calibre 744]

You assume too much.

 

Having seen the laughing stock that abundant helis make of the game in the mod, I speak from experience when I say they are better off left out.

 

Fixed wing small aircraft would do the same job but would have significant drawbacks that a military heli just doesn't have.

 

If you want a military flight game there are plenty out there. DayZ really needs to focus more on the survival aspects like Dean mentioned.

 

I disagree, in fact how many 100000 vehicle private hive servers do you think will we see? private hives ruined the mod, this seems to me like a solution for the public hive - I couldn't give a shit about custom private hives as I more than likely will go nowhere near them, even finding one that ran vanilla days - just to get away from the scripters were as rare as hens teeth.

[amiasfree 262]

Humans that have been trained, worked on and maintained that specific model of helicopter? Or just some guy that washed up on the beach?

 

How about the logistical concerns? Lubrications, oil, fuel, electricity, proper parts and tools...... did we wash up on the beach with any of that in our back pockets?

 

Helis are completely counter to the supposed survival aspects in DayZ.

Books didn't get sick. Also all of our characters seem to be military men and women, their fitness, hair, movement and how they handle weapons all seem to suggest that, it wouldn't be out of place for a pilot to be amongst the survivor's ranks. 

 

There are... one, two... three? Airbases and military bases + chopper crashes and military vehicles scattered throughout the map, should be more than enough places to find things you'd need to get a chopper running, hell you'd probably find half of it in civ shipping places. 

 

I have to disagree, part of survival for me is the idea that one day, you could rebuild, or at least attempt to. That means *all* technology should be up for grabs for those with the willpower to attempt to recreate/retroengineer it.

 

Also I want this to happen.

 

[AryanBoogeyman 185]

It's things like this that made me always think that all the books in game should be "skill books" (i.e. you cannot repair a helicopter until you've found & read a "Mechanic" skill book) :)

 

I'll be writing this in the suggestion subforum later haha :D

 

P.S. sorry for straying from the topic a bit..

 

 

If they absolutely have to have this level of pre-apoc tech in the game (which they will - too many COD scrubs paying to not do it)then that is not a bad compromise. 

 

Coupled with a passive skills system this could be a good way of handling it.

 

Nothing as asinine as just reading a Popular Mechanics mag and then building your own airport but over time( a LOT of time) and with regular practice a specialist could amass the skills to get your vehicle running. 

 

I'm all for a different game experience but I'm really against having EZ mode anything in DayZ.

 

Make the player-base work for it Rocket.

[Katana67 2907]

Did some of you ACTUALLY watch and understand the presentation?

 

It seems like some of you misunderstood a lot of what was said.. 

 

I personally found this presentation to be the most refreshing, and uplifting for what the future may hold for Dayz.. A lot of really good, and intelligent things are being done, and I really up until now had little faith that they were on a properly focused track for this game. Now I know they are.

 

If you are confused or think server hopping will get worse, etc.. I would suggest watching the video again.. and then research the parts that you do not fully understand.

 

The overall presentation was great, I loved it.

 

However, I (and this thread) am taking issue with the specific approach they're using to implement things like helicopters. I watched it, and Rocket blatantly asserted that we'll HAVE to switch servers to find parts (due to the allocation of loot by the hive). It's pretty clear cut. I'm taking issue with that approach.

 

Simply because someone arrives at a different conclusion, doesn't mean that they didn't understand what was being presented. Not being condescending works wonders.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Katana67

[BlinkingRiki182 54]

While I got a good laugh at this, along with a few "wut?" moments, I think you oversold your point sparky. I can learn to shoot a rifle accurately in real life - along with my wife - as we've done that with no formal training at all. Not quite the same as the "oh shit, here comes the ground experience" if we were to take it upon ourselves to helo jack the closest news helicopter. Your other points were nice and silly, but a bit far off the mark as it relates to this topic...

 

I know it was all a little far-fetched :) I just wanted to make my point - it's just a game. I know it's unlike any other game but it's still a game. I think realism shouldn't be the absolute dominant force that has to dictate what should and what shouldn't be in the game. I understand the "realism" argument but I think you are taking it too far. There are many other things that are unrealistic in this game already :).

[makomachine 263]

Was there a manual for the first fire built? Did someone just magically come up with how to build a pyramid? 

 

People are very resourceful. It would not be too difficult to do. You find a helicopter at the airport right? You would also find the mechanics hanger there too.. which would have all of the tools, and literature, supplies you should need. A man could spend 30 years building a helicopter in an apocalypse. But he would if he had a reason to. And nothing but death would stop him.

 

I get people not wanting this in game, but the argument over reality (IRL) and what is possible.. plausible.. is just silly. You cannot say that humans could not, should not, or would not be able to perform a task simply because other humans had mostly died off. You just can't. I mean, we had to start somewhere and look where humanity is now?

Now, now Irish - while we agree on the resourcefulness and resilience of man, I think you may have over reached here. I can put a caveman in a helicopter and he'll never fly it. We didn't build a fire, then a car, then a space shuttle. You are missing the dots along the way that build on each other. Just wouldn't be time in an apocalypse to do those steps.

Reminds me of something I heard a long time ago around evolution. Some people argue that birds came from dinosaurs. No matter how many lizards you throw off of a sky rise building,they won't ever fly... Progress and evolution of man is iterative - and this seems beyond what would happen to joe blow apocalypse survivor.

[AryanBoogeyman 185]

Books didn't get sick. Also all of our characters seem to be military men and women, their fitness, hair, movement and how they handle weapons all seem to suggest that, it wouldn't be out of place for a pilot to be amongst the survivor's ranks. 

 

There are... one, two... three? Airbases and military bases + chopper crashes and military vehicles scattered throughout the map, should be more than enough places to find things you'd need to get a chopper running, hell you'd probably find half of it in civ shipping places. 

 

I have to disagree, part of survival for me is the idea that one day, you could rebuild, or at least attempt to. That means *all* technology should be up for grabs for those with the willpower to attempt to recreate/retroengineer it.

 

Also I want this to happen.

 

 

 

Love the Mad Max theme.

 

That would seem to be reasonable IMO. Not a fully functioning Huey with pristine LMG door gunners.

 

Cobbled together scraps of the pre-Apocalypse FTW.

 

Totally with you on that.

 

What people don't get here is that in a scenario with no running water and no electricity, everyone will be scrabbling just to survive the elements never mind waltzing around abandoned airfields looking to power up and joyride a Raptor or such.

 

 

Edited for mistaken identity. My apologies.

Edited March 28, 2014 by AryanBoogeyman

[Deathlove 2286]

I know it was all a little far-fetched :) I just wanted to make my point - it's just a game. I know it's unlike any other game but it's still a game. I think realism shouldn't be the absolute dominant force that has to dictate what should and what shouldn't be in the game. I understand the "realism" argument but I think you are taking it too far. There are many other things that are unrealistic in this game already :).

AH nearly destroyed Diablo 3 and that was just a game to.

 

They removed it and the games gotten allot better.

 

Meta things like this for helicopters can make or break the game big time. I can already see esp/hackers homing in on parts before anyone gets the chance to obtain them. >.<

[makomachine 263]

Also I want this to happen.

 

You lost me, and then you brought me back. :). If I can't have a true survival game, then this is my second choice!

[jukaga 271]

server hopping will become "OSR" - other server reconnaissance.  then acquisition teams move out based on intel and try and secure what your home server needs, while others try to hold on to what you have on your home server. I kinda like it tbh.  Of course there is a great chance i'm completely wrong.

So we're combining DayZ with Sliders? Personally I'm hoping for private hives/whitelists not cross server hopping for supplies on a massive scale.

[irl-calibre 744]

So we're combining DayZ with Sliders? Personally I'm hoping for private hives/whitelists not cross server hopping for supplies on a massive scale.

 

suppose it comes from not being able to put everyone in the one world, those pesky inherent flaws per chance?

[AryanBoogeyman 185]

How about ..... helis in AND Stinger missiles?  Lock on - fire and forget heat seekers?  Why not have fully functional APCs and MBTs?

 

Of course then you would need heli gunships to fight the tanks... Apaches anyone?

 

I mean... it's all possible right?

 

Slippery slope engaged.

[irl-calibre 744]

How about ..... helis in AND Stinger missiles?  Lock on - fire and forget heat seekers?  Why not have fully functional APCs and MBTs?

 

Of course then you would need heli gunships to fight the tanks... Apaches anyone?

 

I mean... it's all possible right?

 

Slippery slope engaged.

 

i'd say the goal will be more to strip the helo rather than destroy it, plus it may very well be a helo controlled by heroes not necessarily Bandits, we did much good wrok with helo's in the mod.

[Deathlove 2286]

i'd say the goal will be more to strip the helo rather than destroy it, plus it may very well be a helo controlled by heroes not necessarily Bandits, we did much good wrok with helo's in the mod.

You know damn well every ass hole kid is going to try to put together one to KOS everyone easier.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Deathlove

[Katana67 2907]

Yeah, if anything, they're making helicopters MUCH HARDER to maintain/acquire. I don't think it's an issue of it being a "slippery slope" to other vehicles.

 

The Rezzed presentation pretty much limits the scope of vehicles to that of the mod. Yet it makes them harder to maintain/find/repair. That part makes sense.

 

However, the way in which we're supposed to gather loot for the helicopter is what is silly

 

Helicopters provided a great bit of tension in DayZ. Everyone stopped in their tracks when they heard a helicopter chopping off in the distance. And hiding in a bush while the helicopter's searchlight looked for me was an incredibly memorable experience.

Edited March 28, 2014 by Katana67

[irl-calibre 744]

You know damn well every ass hole kid is going to try to put together one to KOS everyone easier.

 

"try" being the operative word.  hopefully they have a competent pilot as well, if it's going to have the sophistication of " take on helicopters"

[makomachine 263]

i'd say the goal will be more to strip the helo rather than destroy it, plus it may very well be a helo controlled by heroes not necessarily Bandits, we did much good wrok with helo's in the mod.

This crosses into other things I don't want this game doing. No good guys against bad guys for me thanks. We have thousands of games with Team A against Team B - why are we trying to make this into that? Open world apocalyptic survival game - please leave it this way BI!

[shagohad 124]

all i want is private hives and this can all be regulated by sensible admins

[irl-calibre 744]

This crosses into other things I don't want this game doing. No good guys against bad guys for me thanks. We have thousands of games with Team A against Team B - why are we trying to make this into that? Open world apocalyptic survival game - please leave it this way BI!

 

 

there are consequences to your actions in this game m8, positive actions are termed as Heroic, Negative one's are termed Bandit - that is not the same as blue v's red,  have you not figured that out yet ffs?

[Deathlove 2286]

there are consequences to your actions in this game m8, positive actions are termed as Heroic, Negative one's are termed Bandit - that is not the same as blue v's red,  have you not figured that out yet ffs?

But as it stands there is way to much grey area in the game in terms of conduct and standards. Something viewed as heroic can get you killed if your not careful considering it can be shown as a weakness more than a strength. And visa versa with bandit.

[irl-calibre 744]

yer oul hole, it's that "grey area" what makes the game unique..

[makomachine 263]

there are consequences to your actions in this game m8, positive actions are termed as Heroic, Negative one's are termed Bandit - that is not the same as blue v's red, have you not figured that out yet ffs?

Sorry mate - you just don't get the thrill of the apocalypse. When is it ok to kill someone? When you are starving and they have a can of beans? When you are afraid because someone is armed? When shot at first? When robbed at gun point? When they have a backpack cooler than yours? When you see someone else shooting another person and don't know why? You just don't get it mate. There is no black and white, and everyone's morality as defined today will be tested. Defining positive actions and negative actions with this environment is hardly 'good guys vs bad guys' - do you even play this game? That's part of the thrill of the human encounter - not a checkbox of 'yep, bad guy skin, time to blast them'...

Although this is a topic already talked about in other threads - will refrain further as it's not the topic at hand...

Edited March 28, 2014 by makomachine