SKS : can't hit over 200m

[finnpalm 312]

 

I wish.  Because that would mean I could buy an AK for 50 bucks in Detroit.   I heard thats what a functioning AK cost in Somalia.

 

 

Again, it's not Somalia. That picture is from Liberia.

 

...you'd be surprised how wrong "Irl military training has everything to do with if you can shoot or not." is, at least the units I've seen. Granted, I'm an outsider looking in as a medic but, still...I could shoot before I enlisted. Training hasn't taught me anything I didn't know already, just reenforced shooter preference as foremost importance.

 

You may well have been a good shot before enlisting, sure. But like I said what you learn in the army is how to fight. Not just how to shoot. There's quite a lot of difference. Shooting on a range, or hunting, is very different from how you behave when your target is shooting back at you.

 

 

Weeeelll, no. Sorry, I'm a bit anal retentive, but a magazine is a magazine (or "magasin" in Swedish). A clip is called "laddram" in Swedish. Not that they're used much, but the old submachine gun ammo used to come in clips of 36 (six rows of six), which were then pushed into the 36-round magazine.

 

 

Are you sure you're not confusing clip and stripper-clip now? Don't get me wrong, because I know that both the term clip and magazine are used for the item you put your cartridges into before loading it into the weapon.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Strawman

[finnpalm 312]

Sorry for double post.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Strawman

[SFRGaming 718]

The way the current attachment system is, I think the SKS loses accuracy when you add the PU scope. I only say this because I nailed several Z's with iron sights @ 300m only missing twice, but making 8 kills. Adding the PU scope turned my SKS into a grease gun.

[Death By Crowbar 1213]

 

 

which was acknowledged by Dean

How long is he sticking around for again?

[hombrecz 832]

How long is he sticking around for again?

 

End of this year as minimum.

[urvile 20]

 

 

Are you sure you're not confusing clip and stripper-clip now? Don't get me wrong, because I know that both the term clip and magazine are used for the item you put your cartridges into before loading it into the weapon.

 

A stripper clip is a type of clip. I.E., all stripper clips are clips, but not all clips are strippers.

Although the terms magazine and clip are frequently used interchangeably, they are technically not the same thing, and it is incorrect to do so. IMHO, it's nitpicking and douchey to rag on people for it, but I still think it's good to know the difference.

 

The main functional difference is that magazines have some type of ammunition feed mechanism located within the magazine, like the spring loaded mechanism you would find in a typical m4/m16 mag that pushed up the next bullet into the chamber.

[Meenos 47]

i dont like the SKS. not because of the range, but because i like fully automatic weapons. However the sks is perfect at close range due to it semi automatic shots and pretty decent damage.

 

The pistols in game however work excellent:

 

ive probably made about 50 meter shot with the revolver. It did spread a few meters from shot to shot but 5 bullets on a non moving zombie (kind of far away) eventually hit.

 

i got a picture showing how far away the zombie stood, though the picture was taken after the zombie dissapeared. but he pretty much was arround that grass edge.

 

[finnpalm 312]

A stripper clip is a type of clip. I.E., all stripper clips are clips, but not all clips are strippers.

Although the terms magazine and clip are frequently used interchangeably, they are technically not the same thing, and it is incorrect to do so. IMHO, it's nitpicking and douchey to rag on people for it, but I still think it's good to know the difference.

 

The main functional difference is that magazines have some type of ammunition feed mechanism located within the magazine, like the spring loaded mechanism you would find in a typical m4/m16 mag that pushed up the next bullet into the chamber.

 

And a clip?

[urvile 20]

And a clip?

 

A clip is pretty much just a cheap simple bit of metal that holds cartridges together.

The sks, for example typically has an integral, non-removable magazine. You use the clip to push a bunch of cartridges down into the magazine. The magazine then holds the cartridges, and pushes each successive cartridge up into the receiver. The bolt then closes, chambering the round, yadda yadda.

this guy is a little condescending about it, but he makes the point ;)

 

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/24/dont-call-a-magazine-a-clip-we-spoke-with-an-ex-seal-about-the-difference-and-why-its-important/

[finnpalm 312]

A clip is pretty much just a cheap simple bit of metal that holds cartridges together.

The sks, for example typically has an integral, non-removable magazine. You use the clip to push a bunch of cartridges down into the magazine. The magazine then holds the cartridges, and pushes each successive cartridge up into the receiver. The bolt then closes, chambering the round, yadda yadda.

this guy is a little condescending about it, but he makes the point ;)

 

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01/24/dont-call-a-magazine-a-clip-we-spoke-with-an-ex-seal-about-the-difference-and-why-its-important/

 

Ah ok. So stripper-clip and clip is essentially the same thing?

[urvile 20]

Ah ok. So stripper-clip and clip is essentially the same thing?

A stripper clip is used to load a magazine by "stripping" the rounds off the clip into the magazine. You open the bolt, put the stripper clip on top of the magazine, push down and voila, your magazine is loaded. This is what the SKS uses in the video (and in the game). The stripper clip does not actually go into the weapon, and is not necessary for the weapon to function (it is not part of the weapon when in use). Instead of loading each round into the magazine with your thumb (which is slow, and exceedingly wearing when you are doing it a lot) you use a handy clip.

Edited March 11, 2014 by urvile

[urvile 20]

This is reflected in the game somewhat with the SKS, although the game shows the clip inside the weapon, which is incorrect. You can load the sks without a clip, pushing individual rounds down into the magazine, or you can use a clip to load the magazine. The game reflects this additional speed by allowing you to reload without opening the inventory UI, and by making the reload animation shorter.

[urvile 20]

So yeah, all stripper clips are "clips." Not all "clips" are strippers though. The M1 clip, for instance, is not a stripper. it goes whole and complete with its rounds into the magazine.

Edited March 11, 2014 by urvile

[finnpalm 312]

Thanks. I'm assuming that's what Rickenbacker was referring to then. :)

 

So basically, magazines (which I have luckily been calling them, although I got confused because of a post here on the forums) can be external or internal, and clips are sort of a speed loading item.

 

I've shot weapons with both internal and external magazines, but never used a clip to load either.

 

The more you learn..

Edited March 11, 2014 by Strawman

[BadAsh (DayZ) 1513]

Or it's lost in translation. In Swedish a clip is called "magasin". You can see how that can easily get confusing for a Swede. ;)

 

No it isn't. A magasine is called a "magasin" in Swedish, a clip is a "laddram".

[finnpalm 312]

No it isn't. A magasine is called a "magasin" in Swedish, a clip is a "laddram".

 

Yes. Thanks. Rickenbacker already alerted me to that earlier in the thread. Stupid language barrier. :)

 

I always used the word magazine, but someone said that was wrong and I got confused.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Strawman

[deebz1234 243]

the sks IRL is a useless tit.

 

but its a true zombie gun. A workhorse.

 

decent at 100m, useless 200+

 

irons only go to 300m irl iirc.

 

Groupings at 100m are brutal

Edited March 11, 2014 by deebz1234

[hombrecz 832]

So once we get AKM, we can expect the same bad accuracy as with SKS?

I hope not.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Hombre

[Martmital 436]

From my experience none of em can hit the bloody target at 200m...

[finnpalm 312]

Doesn't the AKM have pretty lousy accuracy irl, or am I mixing it up with the AKSU?

[Mr Jizz 313]

I'll guarantee you that 95% CAN hit a deer at 300m with an SKS, M4 might be a bit more trouble since of the short barrel but still doable. Exhale bout 2/3, hold your breath and gently start squeezing that trigger. There's your hit.

 

Here's the thing, you and I might be able to hit a deer at a respectable range, but you and I don't represent the 1.7-Million people that bought this game.  I didn't direct that comment at hunters, or retired/active military personnel, or hobbyists... hopefully that's obvious.  I would never question you/their skill in or out of a game. However, a very large portion of the people playing this game have never fired a gun, never hit a target, never shot a live animal, etc. Furthermore, many of them are in places other than North America where gun ownership is difficult and far more uncommon.

 

Of course anyone has the potential to be a good shot, given some of the great tips you offered, some time at a range, maybe an instructor-led lesson; but this isn't the case, nor should it be something to be defensive about.

 

The point of my response is that time and time again Dean & Co. have reminded us that the vision for this game is one of survival, NOT a PVP war-simulator.  Of course its an interesting aspect, but part of what makes it so great is that it hasn't devolved into a giant sniper battle.  The fact that its both difficult and unrewarding to kill other players has everything to do with keeping this game on track and preserving objectives akin to survival in an apocalypse.

[Valadain 270]

Here's the thing, you and I might be able to hit a deer at a respectable range, but you and I don't represent the 1.7-Million people that bought this game.  I didn't direct that comment at hunters, or retired/active military personnel, or hobbyists... hopefully that's obvious.  I would never question you/their skill in or out of a game. However, a very large portion of the people playing this game have never fired a gun, never hit a target, never shot a live animal, etc. Furthermore, many of them are in places other than North America where gun ownership is difficult and far more uncommon.

 

Of course anyone has the potential to be a good shot, given some of the great tips you offered, some time at a range, maybe an instructor-led lesson; but this isn't the case, nor should it be something to be defensive about.

 

The point of my response is that time and time again Dean & Co. have reminded us that the vision for this game is one of survival, NOT a PVP war-simulator.  Of course its an interesting aspect, but part of what makes it so great is that it hasn't devolved into a giant sniper battle.  The fact that its both difficult and unrewarding to kill other players has everything to do with keeping this game on track and preserving objectives akin to survival in an apocalypse.

 

If shooting is made falsely difficult by a random cone of fire, however, it just flat out isn't authentic. You never have to worry about someone being a good shot. You have no reason to practice and become a better shot yourself. That would be a major failing of the game, in my opinion.

[Mr Jizz 313]

If shooting is made falsely difficult by a random cone of fire, however, it just flat out isn't authentic. You never have to worry about someone being a good shot. You have no reason to practice and become a better shot yourself. That would be a major failing of the game, in my opinion.

 

The learning curve is non-existent when all you have to do is point and click.  There's no anticipation of the kick, no dragging finger pull, no wind, no concussion, no gun jams, no sight flaws or adjustment (other than range zeroing).. Maybe you've missed my point as well.  It may need to be tweaked, but why are you so concerned with shooting something beyond 200 meters with a military weapon, if not to improve your chances of taking down another player? If you're worried about hitting a yet-to-be-added game animal, go find a Mosin.

 

EDITED TO ADD: On a separate note, perhaps this is a good argument for persistent skill development of characters. Shooting accuracy is certainly a learned skill that requires practice and consistent technique.  If you get killed you lose the skill and start over from scratch.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Mr Jizz

[xRann 126]

The learning curve is non-existent when all you have to do is point and click.  There's no anticipation of the kick, no dragging finger pull, no wind, no concussion, no gun jams, no sight flaws or adjustment (other than range zeroing).. Maybe you've missed my point as well.  It may need to be tweaked, but why are you so concerned with shooting something beyond 200 meters with a military weapon, if not to improve your chances of taking down another player? If you're worried about hitting a yet-to-be-added game animal, go find a Mosin.

More to the point, I don't believe it's just the "military sim shooter" that he, and many others are after, but the easy ability to put a piece of metal in the remote area, within reason, we intend it to be and not relying on the insane and very arcadie cone of fire. It is detrimental to any serious gunplay even when dealing with non-pvp. I cannot take ANY of the firearms seriously as they stand now, they are all a complete joke.

 

I shouldn't have to rely only on a mosin for killing zombies at a distance when the other platforms SHOULD function similarly between 0~400m.

 

Arguing that players are "untrained" does not mean shit. Stop this argument please, it is a false assumption. Until an individual picks up a weapon and fires it there's no way to know how well they are with them. I don't care where they come from or how prevalent firearms are geographically to them. Using a firearm is nowhere near as difficult as any of the melee weapons or the bow and arrows that are being worked on. There is a reason firearms have become the standard for armed conflicts. They take minimal, if any, training to be able to use.

[Valadain 270]

The learning curve is non-existent when all you have to do is point and click.  There's no anticipation of the kick, no dragging finger pull, no wind, no concussion, no gun jams, no sight flaws or adjustment (other than range zeroing).. Maybe you've missed my point as well.  It may need to be tweaked, but why are you so concerned with shooting something beyond 200 meters with a military weapon, if not to improve your chances of taking down another player? If you're worried about hitting a yet-to-be-added game animal, go find a Mosin.

 

EDITED TO ADD: On a separate note, perhaps this is a good argument for persistent skill development of characters. Shooting accuracy is certainly a learned skill that requires practice and consistent technique.  If you get killed you lose the skill and start over from scratch.

 

First, you add environmental factors, don't just lump them into something that absolutely cannot be overcome.

 

Second, please no on the skills. If shooting accuracy is a skill that you lose on death, I will never play with anyone that I don't know and will kill anyone I don't. If my enjoyment of the game is contingent on keeping the same character forever, I'll do what it takes (and will be pretty upset at random bug death).