Team Speak

[Z0LVIN 12]

Besides all the reasons that have been said as to why TS or other third party program is needed. I believe we need this other medias to communicate with each other for a far better reason.

Gestures.

Someone earlier said that there is no way 10 people are going somewhere without making a sound and how others are speaking about betraying another person without letting them hear. Imagine this in real life, who would talk about betraying another person in front of them and what ten group of people would proceed to be making noise when entering a dangerous place (like NWAF or Elektro). We would be using signs to communicate, the ten group of people would be using their hands and gestures to interact with each other WITHOUT making sound and as for the guys thinking of betrayal they would be using their eyes, moving their mouth in a pattern to make the other understand, I mean, if they are travelling together they MUST know each other and decipher what the other person is saying without having to say a word,that is why they are travelling together, because they know each other.

There is no way the game would be able to portray gestures or hand movements fast enough for people to communicate. Seriously, if you were pinned down with a friend, you wouldn't be shouting him to flank him so your attacker can hear you. You would either use your hands or whisper him.

Which I believe that to be a good idea to implement, add a whisper function in-game~! :D

Sorry for the mistakes, English is not my native language~

Edited February 10, 2014 by Z0LVIN

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I never meant to imply that anyone that uses TS is a cheater, I myself use it all the time.

 

I was trying to explain that the way the game mechanics are currently using walkie talkies as the only form of communication is broken

and to be able to locate someone is not possible without outside communication like TS and that TS is an important tool in DayZ when playing with friends.

 

At the same time explaining how important it is to the people looking at it from a role playing/realism perspective that know how

amazing this game would be if everyone could somehow all be using the in game chat system and mechanics to communicate, because it would add a lot of different factors of survival into the game. Which is true and why I was explaining how you cant find anyone without TS

so until something comes along that allows players to spawn together like my scenario suggestion (just an idea) so that players can communicate with each other realistically from the start,TS is necessary to use when playing with friends. 

 

I'm of the opinion that the game shouldn't ever support finding (or spawning with) each other. Because it's an apocalypse and I don't feel like it would fit the setting. I feel like players who have to play DayZ with friends are missing out on an interesting experience of self reliance and self preservation. Having to navigate the harsh world of DayZ all on your own, forging bonds with strangers you meet along the way, or running for your life from figures on the horizon. I feel like the story DayZ was meant to tell, comes from a solo perspective. Meeting people should be an achievement, not an arrangement.

 

I may play DayZ for the social aspects, but I never bring my social life into DayZ.

[Judopunch 523]

I'm of the opinion that the game shouldn't ever support finding (or spawning with) each other. Because it's an apocalypse and I don't feel like it would fit the setting. I feel like players who have to play DayZ with friends are missing out on an interesting experience of self reliance and self preservation. Having to navigate the harsh world of DayZ all on your own, forging bonds with strangers you meet along the way, or running for your life from figures on the horizon. I feel like the story DayZ was meant to tell, comes from a solo perspective. Meeting people should be an achievement, not an arrangement.

 

I may play DayZ for the social aspects, but I never bring my social life into DayZ.

You bring a good point. However, you imply it would be impossible to find yourself in a survival situation with your friends, or that that situation somehow has less value. I however find that it that alters the dynamics and creates different experiences of shared reliance and group preservation.

[Caboose187 (DayZ) 3036]

Think of TS as invisible hand held radios.  "Pilot to bombardier, pilot to bombardier.  Bogey sighted" 

[BL1P 252]

ACRE.

 

Lets explain that acronym.

 

ACRE is a mod used in Arma2 and Arma3.

It makes TS work the same as in game communication restrictions.

If you are both using the mod and are both ingame and in the same channel your TS will work the same as DayZ radios and direct chat work.

 

You can still move channel in ts and talk to people not ingame with you or the person not ingame can talk to you normally in TS.

The only people it effects are people ingame and using the mod together.

 

If the devs talked with the creators of TS they could have the system built into DayZ and TS so that if you are on the same server in DayZ as someone in the channel with you, you can only communicate using the ingame radios or direct chat inside TS.

This is already being used by 1000s of Arma series gamers and is a huge improvement on the omnipresent system TS currently uses.

 

With some effort this could be done in DayZ as the working model already exists in the form of an Arma2 mod.

What the devs have done is use half of the ACRE model ignoring the TS half.

 

Dont get me wrong I use TS.

I also know there is a better way to use TS with DayZ and its called ACRE.

Edited February 10, 2014 by BL1P

[sidwulf 69]

Cant stop the voip.

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

You bring a good point. However, you imply it would be impossible to find yourself in a survival situation with your friends, or that that situation somehow has less value. I however find that it that alters the dynamics and creates different experiences of shared reliance and group preservation.

 

I'm not trying to imply it would be impossible to find yourself in the zombie apocalypse with friends, I'm just saying that I feel DayZ is currently aimed towards a solo experience. When you go to lengths to circumvent that solo'ness, the experience loses value in my eyes.

 

It even affects my experience because I've talked to over 9000 people in my DayZ career who told me they were trying to link up with a friend on teamspeak/skype. They'll talk to you, with long pauses, staring off into space. Usually ask where such and such a place is, and if they're close. If not, "can you kill me?" usually follows.

 

I'm not saying teamspeak doesn't have its place, but in my eyes it cheapens the experience of DayZ, for all people involved.

[BL1P 252]

Cant stop the voip.

Thats so true there are just too many voip progs that can be used to circumvent the ingame it would be pointless to try.

 

But DayZ could be a forerunner once again and use something no other game does which would be to have TS and DayZ work together to improve the in game communications when using TS.

It wouldn't stop people using other voip systems to get around game restrictions but its a step forward in the right direction.

[Varom 8]

I lost so many brain cells reading this topic.

[DMentMan 707]

i think global chat should go through walkie-talkies

[Judopunch 523]

I'm not trying to imply it would be impossible to find yourself in the zombie apocalypse with friends, I'm just saying that I feel DayZ is currently aimed towards a solo experience. When you go to lengths to circumvent that solo'ness, the experience loses value in my eyes.

 

It even affects my experience because I've talked to over 9000 people in my DayZ career who told me they were trying to link up with a friend on teamspeak/skype. They'll talk to you, with long pauses, staring off into space. Usually ask where such and such a place is, and if they're close. If not, "can you kill me?" usually follows.

 

I'm not saying teamspeak doesn't have its place, but in my eyes it cheapens the experience of DayZ, for all people involved.

I believe you feel most rewarded with the solo experience.

 

But I have a challenge for you.

How would you change the system to be more rewarding to friends, but still a rich experience for solo players, accepting the fact that you can not prevent players from communicating with tools outside the game.

 

An example of a unique situation that I have been in was where my girlfriend accidentally got shot in the back of the head by one of our friends during a fight at the airfield. The impact it had on everyone in our group was PROFOUND. She doent have as much time to play the game as the rest of us, so where for me I can take an hour or so and run where I need to be, her total play time per day is less than that. If she had been a random tag-a-long my friend wouldnt have felt bad, she wouldnt have been so surprised, and we all wouldnt have felt the sense of loss we did.

 

 

I imagine sometime in the future, spawning fresh on the coast with my good buddy. Running from zombies and a bandit. Forced to hide. We slowly start dieing. We find a banana. Only one of us will live long enough to make it to the next town before we starve. Who eats it? What happens to the other guy?

Edited February 10, 2014 by Judopunch

[Hrki 94]

facepalm*

 

and talkie walkie has range od 1k m only... + someone can listen to you if he is on your channel...

 

 

ts3 OP - put your friend with sniper somwhere and he covers your back while you are looting :D

[TEST_SUBJECT_83 465]

i think global chat should go through walkie-talkies

delete

Edited February 10, 2014 by TEST_SUBJECT_83

[DMentMan 707]

fuck you too then

that editing was fast, but not fast enough .

[TEST_SUBJECT_83 465]

that editing was fast, but not fast enough .

lol! wrong quote.

[DMentMan 707]

Well you can eat shit and die.

you, are very friendly to everyone here...

[yogi92 50]

Here's my simple answer to all the "OMFG TS is metagaming and it's unrealistic" posts. DayZ is a Mutha Fuckin Video Game! It's not real life, it's a game that I want to play and enjoy with my buddies.. Don't try to make 100% realism happen.. it will never happen. Plus, you would be surprised with how often we're 50m apart and still can't find each other or name any particular landmark to meet.

[Hrki 94]

if you dont like it - dont play it and dont be one angry rageing kid overhere

 

this is game ONLY A GAME and it cant be 100% realistic and it will never be and it cant be because it is O N L Y  A  G A M E

[skyline-gtr 130]

Having not read the entire thread yet, all I can do is express my view on this subject. I will read it all later and form a repsonse if I have time...

 

 

I have two things to say on the use of 3rd party communication in DayZ.

1. You will never force everyone to stop using external communications. You would be putting yourself at a disadvantage if you did not use it.

2. I am a huge fan of the MGS series and I can imagine using this type of software similar to using a MGS Codec, this device is undetectable and your communications while using it are undetectable also.

 

 

edit: because next post by jumling

Edited February 10, 2014 by Skyline-GTR

[e00c 84]

Look at Dark Souls/Demon Souls (bloody hard game!). They've blocked chatting in game. Solution, I whip out my phone, bluetooth headset in, skype with a friend (Y) 

 

It's here to stay regardless of  what people think. To me, it's an utterly pointless discussion. Sorry OP. The only thing threads like this achieve is flame, and debate which goes nowhere. 

[bad_mojo (DayZ) 1204]

I believe you feel most rewarded with the solo experience.

 

But I have a challenge for you.

How would you change the system to be more rewarding to friends, but still a rich experience for solo players, accepting the fact that you can not prevent players from communicating with tools outside the game.

 

An example of a unique situation that I have been in was where my girlfriend accidentally got shot in the back of the head by one of our friends during a fight at the airfield. The impact it had on everyone in our group was PROFOUND. She doent have as much time to play the game as the rest of us, so where for me I can take an hour or so and run where I need to be, her total play time per day is less than that. If she had been a random tag-a-long my friend wouldnt have felt bad, she wouldnt have been so surprised, and we all wouldnt have felt the sense of loss we did.

 

 

I imagine sometime in the future, spawning fresh on the coast with my good buddy. Running from zombies and a bandit. Forced to hide. We slowly start dieing. We find a banana. Only one of us will live long enough to make it to the next town before we starve. Who eats it? What happens to the other guy?

 

I think just general improvements to the in-game voip system would benefit everyone. Being able to whisper for example would go a long way towards bridging the gap between super-safe teamspeak and yelling out loudly in direct chat. Maybe to encourage more usage of the walkies, they could be put into residential loot, or maybe even as starting gear.

 

The reason you don't value a "random tag-a-long" is because you put so much stock in playing with your group. I'm sorry but I don't think your girlfriends time being wasted can inflict the same sense of loss that I've felt when I've genuinely lost someone in the game. Meeting people and spending time getting to know them, only to have that link abruptly severed, sometimes right in front of my eyes. Knowing I'll never see or speak to this person again, those experiences are far beyond any of the times I've had people in my teamspeak group be killed.

 

Your last example of the starving to death with a friend is a good example of how existing relationships with people can take priority over the game. You know that if you let your friend starve to death because you ate all the beans, it will not be the end of it between you two. He will still be linked to you through teamspeak. There's really no option to betray this person and leave them for dead, you're essentially stuck with them forever. This totally negates the whole social dynamic Rocket was going for in DayZ. His inspiration for DayZ came from a military training course in which he had to steal from and betray his fellow brothers in arms, in order to save himself. When pushed to our limits, it's amazing how quickly we can betray those closest to us.

 

 

Also, I wrote this thread months ago in the mod. I think it applies to this discussion.

[Element47 2480]

whether its courage or lunacy, beans to OP for trying to lead a civilised discussion on this controversial topic.

 

 

and i fully agree, that not using a 3rd partys voip solution makes the experience richer, and more intensive. thats the reason why i prefer to play DayZ solo.

improving the ingame voip will surely improve the experience for everyone, but it should be up to tha player to embrace it or not, to decide how far he wants to immerse himself.

 

bad_mojo makes an excellent point of how playing with your friends removes a significant portion of the game, namely being a lost survivor trying to gather his bearings. this is why, imho, voip is on the same level of metagaming as clans and groups. but as i tried to point out in another thread, such meta not only removes experience from the game, it can also add to it. the bookclub, the trusted medics, the trading groups, all this would to this point be not possible without out-of-game meta, and yet it added so much to the game.

 

the game cannot depict a lot of the communication and organisation possible in the real world. the out-of-game solutions make up for some of that, but it will obviously never be perfect.

[Mdogg2005 447]

Oh look this thread again.

[Samuri_Bake_Pie 96]

If you know someone well enough to be in TS with someone, you guys probably know each other. Hand signals and whispering would be things that you two could communicate to each other. There are no hand signals or whispering yet so TS is how you hand signal and whisper. It's perfectly plausible in real life that you and you friends can silently communicate.

[McGlock 3]

Rocket himself uses TeamSpeak when he plays which is tantamount to some sort of endorsement. As people have said this is a video game, and lots of people get the most enjoyment from then when playing with friends. Removing external communication software like TS makes makes playing with friends extremely difficult, to the point of being nearly impossible- not to mention boring when you're running across the map with no one to talk to. And even when you are using TS in game confusion can still be an issue, as friendly fire incidents or being killed by someone you thought was your friend are still very common. 

TeamSpeak isn't going anywhere, and if it did people would still find a way to communicate as theirs simply too many options. Perhaps the only thing to be done is for those that want to maximise in game 'realism' is for those people to group together, and play on a server under agreement not to communicate with players outside of the in game methods of communicating.