Sniping

[w1lg5r 70]

Before you all say that this is stupid and that sniping has no place in dayz please hear me out.  Sniping was a large factor in the mod (maybe too large) and it made people exercise caution, but now if the only weapons available in the future are the horribly inaccurate rifles, people will be free to run through fields without a care, that's not what dayz is about. That said, sniping was OP and anyone could grab an m24 and rack up kill after kill.  The solution to this is to make sniping a skill that is hard to pull off.  IRL you cant change you scope every hundred metres by the click of a button, its hard otherwise every soldier would carry one.

 

Sniping should have a complicated zero system, wouldn't be hard just do what ace mod did.

range tables should be lootable items - very rare to find one for your rifle so practicing is the main way of gaining skill.

wind - you can find this info in a rangetable for your gun. wind should be able to be measured roughly by yourself and the environment but accurately by wind measures that should be very rare

distance - there are no waypoints so unless you have a very rare rangefinder, you are gonna have to judge it yourself.

dust - snipers kick up dust, an easy way to reveal yourself, you should be able to find/craft mats to rest your gun over.

ghillie suits - craftable as a shoddy makeshift one that degrades or extremely rare military spawn

balaclavas - helps snipers reduce skin shown

 

The problem with sniping in the mod was it was easy, however if you have ever played ACE mod, you know its not easy and takes practice and calculations even if you have the best equipment, with these additions only the skilled/dedicated would be able to do this and if you miss the first shot, your chance is gone. For non snipers like myself it would restore the sense of caution necessary as when player counts increase, a skilled sniper could be lurking in any treeline as someone is sure to pass by, this and added zombies may force players to fight for loot, increasing the chance of server hoppers getting shot.

[Space Milk 195]

The only rifle inaccurate in SA is the M4, and the .223 round is not made for long range engagements.  

The Mosin is the sniper, and VERY accurate.

However, I do like your ideas, just trying to point out that the guns used for sniping are fine, and that the M4 is not a sniper.

[axtranti 23]

I agree, making it a rare drop would make the game more interesting. In fact, with almost everyone that I've played with use a Mosin! It really takes out the fun and makes it really damn generic. Besides, the dust,wind and all those factors that can affect bullet trajectory seem like a really good idea.

 

One more thing, I've noticed almost every player just camp elektro or cherno at the top of a mountain with a mosin waiting for someone to pass by. That's the pu$$iest way of playing a game, might as well just fill the game with long range fire arms, why would someone bother with smgs and shotguns? 

[warrenpeace 38]

So essentially just factor in some ACE_Mod mechanics? I agree with that.

[MystoganXIX 78]

I support all of your ideas except for wind. It is way too hard to get an idea of what the wind factor is in a virtual world without an item giving you this information. I don't like the idea of sniping being dependent on guesswork or a rare item that gives you info on wind factor. We already need to find an undamaged bipod (not so rare) and an undamaged long ranged scope (somewhat common in military areas, but usually end up getting shot when trying to get it).

 

Instead of wind, they just need to reduce bullet dispersions and make it harder to actually aim. (Characters are not military trained, should have difficulty when aiming weapons)

[stielhandgranate 480]

One problem with sniper weapons in the mod was weapons like the AS 50 would agro the zombies, to the nearest player rather than the shooter. One way to "debuff" the use of sniper rifles would be to code them that so that any agro'd zombies would run to the shooter and expose them.

[Rushthezeppelin 8]

Actually there are scopes out there that are specifically tuned to the balistic coefficient of the round you are using and have yardage you can turn to.  Granted the majority should just use regular 1/4 MOA adjustments like most scopes out there with very rare drops being the scopes ballistic drop compensator turrets (and only specific to one caliber so you have to match it to the right weapon).

 

As to the accuracy of Mosins, unless you are talking about a Finnish Mosin (or a good luck of the draw on a Russian/Bulgarian), they are usually crap shooting groups of 4"-6" at 100yds.  M4s on average shoot 2"-4" at 100yds although you can with a match barrel (or once again luck of the draw) and match ammo shoot as low as 1/2" at 100yds.  Hell my stock milspec AR shoots average 1"-1 1/4" groups with just regular old M193 55gr FMJ.  I've been able to shoot mine pretty accurately out to 500yds although if you aren't getting a vital or head shot at that distance FMJ will do little more than poke a quarter inch hole in somebody.  I think it would be an interesting mechanic to have random variability in the accuracy of your rifle.

 

As for wind, that would be incredibly tricky to impliment and honestly wind makes little difference with larger calibers (.30/7.62 and up) until 500-600+yds.  If they were to impliment a wind compensating system they would have to make it readable not only with a (very rare) wind meter but also with higher power scopes using whats called wind mirrage (which is incredibly hard to read IRL) or implement accurate wind mechanics with things like tall grass and trees (would be a NIGHTMARE from a programming standpoint).

[warrenpeace 38]

It is way too hard to get an idea of what the wind factor is in a virtual world without an item giving you this information.

 

Wrong. ACE_mod for Arma II had an excellent wind mechanic. Press shift + K (default) and you get an arrow that gives the wind's direction. It also gives you a certain color depending on the current severity. You could dial in scopes far better, but that's bound to be implemented if this sort of thing gets made. As suggested, a range table for each firearm could be implemented and picked up (again, also something that ACE_mod had.

[lukeyguy 17]

If they ever do snipping i hope they only add 1/2/3 in the WHOLE server and NO more. So it's super rare.

[Gdaddy22 299]

good idea

[-Gews- 7443]

I support all of your ideas except for wind. It is way too hard to get an idea of what the wind factor is in a virtual world without an item giving you this information.

 

Rocket seems to dislike any form of HUD, that might be a problem.

 

IMO the ACE system with the coloured arrows was perfectly fine, I don't know what the problem is with something like that. It's only on your screen when you want it to be.

 

As for wind, that would be incredibly tricky to impliment and honestly wind makes little difference with larger calibers (.30/7.62 and up) until 500-600+yds.

 

As long as they put realistic values then wind affects the different bullets roughly the same in-game as in real life.

 

Not really hard to implement. A complete real-time meterological system, yes, that's impossible. Simplified wind drift, no.

 

http://forums.dayzgame.com/index.php?/topic/130854-wind-and-ballistics-system/

 

^once upon a time, it was even being considered for the mod...

[Space Milk 195]

Clouds always move to the east. Means constant wind, just have variable wind speeds but make it go the same directions.

[SFRGaming 718]

The only rifle inaccurate in SA is the M4, and the .223 round is not made for long range engagements.  

The Mosin is the sniper, and VERY accurate.

However, I do like your ideas, just trying to point out that the guns used for sniping are fine, and that the M4 is not a sniper.

Even though it's not made for sniping situations, it still can reach 500m easily. The game just has the wrong variables at the moment.

[AP_Norris 1017]

Clouds always move to the east. Means constant wind, just have variable wind speeds but make it go the same directions.

The wind may be moving a very different direction that far up.

My Dad told me they control hot air balloons by knowing the wind direction at different altitudes.

[maddcheese (DayZ) 0]

Before you all say that this is stupid and that sniping has no place in dayz please hear me out.  Sniping was a large factor in the mod (maybe too large) and it made people exercise caution, but now if the only weapons available in the future are the horribly inaccurate rifles, people will be free to run through fields without a care, that's not what dayz is about. That said, sniping was OP and anyone could grab an m24 and rack up kill after kill.  The solution to this is to make sniping a skill that is hard to pull off.  IRL you cant change you scope every hundred metres by the click of a button, its hard otherwise every soldier would carry one.

 

Sniping should have a complicated zero system, wouldn't be hard just do what ace mod did.

range tables should be lootable items - very rare to find one for your rifle so practicing is the main way of gaining skill.

wind - you can find this info in a rangetable for your gun. wind should be able to be measured roughly by yourself and the environment but accurately by wind measures that should be very rare

distance - there are no waypoints so unless you have a very rare rangefinder, you are gonna have to judge it yourself.

dust - snipers kick up dust, an easy way to reveal yourself, you should be able to find/craft mats to rest your gun over.

ghillie suits - craftable as a shoddy makeshift one that degrades or extremely rare military spawn

balaclavas - helps snipers reduce skin shown

 

The problem with sniping in the mod was it was easy, however if you have ever played ACE mod, you know its not easy and takes practice and calculations even if you have the best equipment, with these additions only the skilled/dedicated would be able to do this and if you miss the first shot, your chance is gone. For non snipers like myself it would restore the sense of caution necessary as when player counts increase, a skilled sniper could be lurking in any treeline as someone is sure to pass by, this and added zombies may force players to fight for loot, increasing the chance of server hoppers getting shot.

 

 

Dammit you beat me to this discussion... but beans for you

[The Aquatic Land Walrus 565]

I believe that wind really has no place in here. But, your other suggestions are nice.

Sniping shouldn't be a rogue tactic. You should have other people down in the fray pulling the heat off of you. If you want an accurate description of sniping, read the book "American Sniper" by Chris Kyle.

[floj 393]

One problem with sniper weapons in the mod was weapons like the AS 50 would agro the zombies, to the nearest player rather than the shooter. One way to "debuff" the use of sniper rifles would be to code them that so that any agro'd zombies would run to the shooter and expose them.

Yes please - with the currently suggested 10k zombies we get an average of 200 for each of the 50 odd towns (higher for the big places)... and they'll respawn :)

 

Clouds always move to the east. Means constant wind, just have variable wind speeds but make it go the same directions.

http://www.naturalnavigator.com/find-your-way-using/weather

 

Also not mentioned in there, you have morning/evening changes in wind direction up and down valleys as the air heats up/cools. Basically, visible cloud direction =/= wind direction at ground level

[AP_Norris 1017]

I doubt sniper noobs will be happy when they basically have yo carry a weather station around with them.

Or they can just chance the first shot, either way :)

[-Gews- 7443]

I believe that wind really has no place in here.

Why not? Wind is the biggest factor in long range shooting yet the game leaves it out entirely. Odd.

[DarknessFalls (DayZ) 1]

This! We definitely need wind drift to be added in the game, especially since hunting is gonna be a thing, i would like to see arrows and bullets being affected by wind drift when operating close to their maximum effective range. If they are gonna focus on hunting, wind drift would be a great new factor to add complexity to the game, especially when you don't want to or can't use traps/snares to catch your food. Increasing the sniping skill cap would make it harder for people who pick up scoped rifles just to get easy kills, since they actually have to practice and gain experience with the rifle when firing in long distances.

 

After they implement the physics system putting in some sort of wind drift should be more doable for the devs and the community should really push for it because it will add another level of complexity in Dayz.

[gibonez 3633]

What sniping needs is this.

[a_ruttle 199]

I agree with this post entirely, ACE sniping was awesome, it wasn't too difficult inside of 400 or 500 meters to get 100% hits with practice but it certainly would help in that not every average joe can ping you at 800 meters when you stop.

 

My record on ACE II was 2565meters with a TAC50, was so chuffed with it, really the added difficulty and realism makes sniping so much more pleasing.

[w1lg5r 70]

What sniping needs is this.

yeah pretty much

[voxframe 31]

Agreed! There needs to be a little more variety to sniping. Different weapons and different scopes. Range finders and charts as well please. Wind please. Realism is the key here. Sniping is an art form that can't simply be done by everyone, but right now it's too limited to have that talent kick. There should even be scope adjustments etc that can be performed.

 

Better camo, dust kicks, etc.