No starter weapon removes survival instinct, and respect for zeds

[CaptainAnt 0]

Remix. Stop trolling, you aren't contributing to the thread other than L0L UR S0 DUM8! L2P N00B

"Stealth" now is crawling for literal hours on end through a looting area *praying* that a bandit doesn't see you and kill you for your bandage, undoing hours of crawling, or that a zed doesn't spot/hear you from the moon and chase you down, prompting said zed train. His opinion isn't wrong, it's different from yours is all.

If you really enjoy crawling for literal hours on end to find a few mags and no wep then I'm glad you're enjoying yourself ingame.

[enigma (DayZ) 0]

Remix. Stop trolling' date=' you aren't contributing to the thread other than L0L UR S0 DUM8! L2P N00B

"Stealth" now is crawling for literal hours on end through a looting area *praying* that a bandit doesn't see you and kill you for your bandage, undoing hours of crawling, or that a zed doesn't spot/hear you from the moon and chase you down, prompting said zed train. His opinion isn't wrong, it's different from yours is all.

If you really enjoy crawling for literal hours on end to find a few mags and no wep then I'm glad you're enjoying yourself ingame.

[/quote']

This has absolutely nothing to do with spawning without a starter weapon.

[igelqott 2]

This problem is not about starter gear or not.

Its that you can run from zombies without risk.

I did the same before, you spawned with the makarov anyway.

You shouldnt be able to kite zombies all day long, thats the problem.

[CaptainAnt 0]

Remix. Stop trolling' date=' you aren't contributing to the thread other than L0L UR S0 DUM8! L2P N00B

"Stealth" now is crawling for literal hours on end through a looting area *praying* that a bandit doesn't see you and kill you for your bandage, undoing hours of crawling, or that a zed doesn't spot/hear you from the moon and chase you down, prompting said zed train. His opinion isn't wrong, it's different from yours is all.

If you really enjoy crawling for literal hours on end to find a few mags and no wep then I'm glad you're enjoying yourself ingame.

[/quote']

This has absolutely nothing to do with spawning without a starter weapon.

No starter wep = either a stealth crawl for hours to hope you find a matching wep and ammo, or creating a zed train while on your quest to find a firearm, and then just DC'ing once you have your wep as to avoid all the zeds. I get that stealth should be a part of gameplay, but several hours of playtime can be nullified by being spotted once and you have no defense against zeds other than kiting them around for ages or DC'ing. That isn't fun and that isn't realistic to just up and disappear from a zed train, rather than defend yourself for one last valiant stand.

TLDR - no starting wep = game mechanics abuse to get a weapon easier, breaks game immersion

[enigma (DayZ) 0]

Remix. Stop trolling' date=' you aren't contributing to the thread other than L0L UR S0 DUM8! L2P N00B

"Stealth" now is crawling for literal hours on end through a looting area *praying* that a bandit doesn't see you and kill you for your bandage, undoing hours of crawling, or that a zed doesn't spot/hear you from the moon and chase you down, prompting said zed train. His opinion isn't wrong, it's different from yours is all.

If you really enjoy crawling for literal hours on end to find a few mags and no wep then I'm glad you're enjoying yourself ingame.

[/quote']

This has absolutely nothing to do with spawning without a starter weapon.

No starter wep = either a stealth crawl for hours to hope you find a matching wep and ammo, or creating a zed train while on your quest to find a firearm, and then just DC'ing once you have your wep as to avoid all the zeds. I get that stealth should be a part of gameplay, but several hours of playtime can be nullified by being spotted once and you have no defense against zeds other than kiting them around for ages or DC'ing. That isn't fun and that isn't realistic to just up and disappear from a zed train, rather than defend yourself for one last valiant stand.

TLDR - no starting wep = game mechanics abuse to get a weapon easier, breaks game immersion

Don't you see that your main issue is the new zombie behavior and revised sight and sound issues and not the lack of a weapon on spawn? Are you telling me that if you would spawn with a makarov and 6 mags that you wouldn't be either crawling for hours trying to find a better weapon or running like a marathon sprinter with 100's of zombies in tow?

[CaptainAnt 0]

Don't you see that your main issue is the new zombie behavior and revised sight and sound issues not the lack of a weapon on spawn? Are you telling me that if you would spawn with a makarov and 6 mags that you wouldn't be either crawling for hours trying to find a better weapon or running like a marathon sprinter with 100's of zombies in tow?

No, because if I came upon a barn or deerstand with goods in it that's in the woods I can actually do something about getting the goods from that location rather than run like an idiot around them to kite them off the loot, or hope they don't see me throwing a tin can (which they always do) in an attempt to distract them. Have a means of defense in the game is a HUGE deal. I don't care if it's a firearm or not, I'll take anything on spawn that I can defend myself with and/or kill a zed or two with if they aren't in a larger group.

[enigma (DayZ) 0]

Don't you see that your main issue is the new zombie behavior and revised sight and sound issues not the lack of a weapon on spawn? Are you telling me that if you would spawn with a makarov and 6 mags that you wouldn't be either crawling for hours trying to find a better weapon or running like a marathon sprinter with 100's of zombies in tow?

No' date=' because if I came upon a barn or deerstand with goods in it that's in the woods I can actually do something about getting the goods from that location rather than run like an idiot around them to kite them off the loot, or hope they don't see me throwing a tin can (which they always do) in an attempt to distract them. Have a means of defense in the game is a HUGE deal. I don't care if it's a firearm or not, I'll take anything on spawn that I can defend myself with and/or kill a zed or two with if they aren't in a larger group.

[/quote']

Say the zombie behavior was reverted to pre 1.7.1 behavior. Would you still have problems looting a deerstand when spawning without a weapon?

[CaptainAnt 0]

In 1.7.0, I don't think I'd have near the problems that I do now looting deer stands/barns, mainly because the zeds didn't have superhuman vision and hearing that would allow them to spot you standing up from prone in dense forest while cocking your arm back to throw a tin can. That said, if I had a means of defense I could take a higher risk/higher reward approach in killing the zeds outright and looting the stand without worry of visitors.

Yes, there are problems with zed AI (in my opinion) but the lack of a means of any sort of defense on spawn makes anything more than sprinting around the map in search of a means of defense a waste of time.

[johnflenaly 0]

Ran a car into a tree the other day, so I got to try out starting over in the latest patch. Most fun I've had in awhile.

[breetai3 0]

This problem is not about starter gear or not.

Its that you can run from zombies without risk.

I did the same before' date=' you spawned with the makarov anyway.

You shouldnt be able to kite zombies all day long, thats the problem.

[/quote']

I suppose that is really it. If I knew I wouldn't be able to kite them, I wouldn't have done it.

I think the difference is when I had the Makarov, there wasn't an immediacy to do anything like that before.

[Virfortis 111]

Nobody gives a shit about survival one way or another, the gear you spawn with doesn't matter. Actual survival implies being scared about dying, but when we can respawn, who cares?

It's best to just accept that DayZ is a fantasy and move on. The game and it's PvP/lack of survival obsession becomes much more tolerable at that point.

[Imbalanxd 59]

Ye, completely illogical thread this. You don't care about a flashlight but you did care about a Makarov? Flashlights were and still are more rare than Makarovs, so that makes absolutely no sense. You are clearly just bad and can't do anything without your starting weapon. This is, of course, a bit of a conclusion to jump to, but what else could it be since your original post is clearly just a rationalisation.

[baz (DayZ) 19]

I like not having a weapon and food/water. But I agree that the zombie sensing ability makes it just a touch too time consuming to get a decent start. I can spend an hour crawling through small town only to find a bunch of crap I don't and nothing that I do need to survive.

While I always take the stealth route, it's not very immersive and tense knowing that if I am spotted (which is quite likely with the latest version), I only have to stand up and run up a hill, then back down. The Z's commit suicide by running off the edge, like native American's doing a buffalo run.

[CaptainAnt 0]

Ye' date=' completely illogical thread this. You don't care about a flashlight but you did care about a Makarov? Flashlights were and still are more rare than Makarovs, so that makes absolutely no sense. You are clearly just bad and can't do anything without your starting weapon. This is, of course, a bit of a conclusion to jump to, but what else could it be since your original post is clearly just a rationalisation.

[/quote']

please. enlighten me.

[Imbalanxd 59]

please. enlighten me.

What ancient knowledge do you seek, child?

[r3db4ss 6]

I can only tell you from my experience' date=' that by spawning with no weapon last night it threw my respect for living out of the window. With nothing, I could care less if I died.

[/quote']

So if you start with a pistol EVERY TIME you die, its different and your life is worth more ?? makes no sense............

At least there is no more spawning--> runnning into elektro/chreno, playing triggerhappy bandit with your makarov till you are out of ammo or die again....

I enjoy every fresh start , i would even make a timer so ppl cant "force where to spawn" with suicides.

[breetai3 0]

Ye' date=' completely illogical thread this. You don't care about a flashlight but you did care about a Makarov? Flashlights were and still are more rare than Makarovs, so that makes absolutely no sense. You are clearly just bad and can't do anything without your starting weapon. This is, of course, a bit of a conclusion to jump to, but what else could it be since your original post is clearly just a rationalisation.

[/quote']

Say who's in the what's it? I don't have to play in the night time if I don't want to...why would I care about a flashlight?

[TheGoldElite 0]

What you spawn with is irrelevant for respect. Spawn with nothing? who cares you start again with noting. start with M16 and NVG and GPS? who cares you start again with same gear. New spawns will always be reckless, short of restricting respawn times to like 10-30 minutes, which I doubt is the answer

Edit, suicides however, should have one free suicide, then a 15 minute suicide spawn cooldown, to deter spawn choosing. This wouldnt affect any deaths except successive suicides, so if implementable I see no reason why not!

[Imbalanxd 59]

Say who's in the what's it? I don't have to play in the night time if I don't want to...why would I care about a flashlight?

Pretty much exactly my point. You don't care about the "value" of your character, all you want is something that performs a task that you want. In this case, it is being spoon fed a weapon that can kill hordes of zombies.

[r3db4ss 6]

But I agree that the zombie sensing ability makes it just a touch too time consuming to get a decent start. I can spend an hour crawling through small town only to find a bunch of crap I don't and nothing that I do need to survive.

Thats one thing i dont get, just today i visited Krasnostav, just for fun, i was not 1 time crawling, just got aggro once because i was running into the market without watching my left......( and no i was not just killing every zed in my way :P )

Last fresh start took me about 30 min to loot everthing i need in elektro on a full server without much crawling to avoid zombies ( if just to avoid other players).

maybe you should start new und really test, how near can i go, how far away do i need to be too run, etc....:D

[CaptainAnt 0]

please. enlighten me.

What ancient knowledge do you seek' date=' child?

[/quote']

you say we as survivors should be more concerned about a flashlight than a means of defense because the flashlight is more rare? A weapon, any weapon is magnitudes more important than a spotlight for zeds and snipers to come kill you, and now the easiest/best way to get one is through making a zed train and/or force DC'ing once you've found loot but have too many zeds on you to take it. Having trouble starting out because you don't have a means of defense doesn't make you a "baddie", it makes you on the same level that any other (real) human being would be on if they were put in the same situation.

If realism is the point of this game, then being 100% helpless to deter attacks isn't really all that real, is it? You should at least have your dukes up, ready to fight it out, or be able to grab a rock and cave some heads in, not just run with your tail between your legs until you find a building or cliff and can exploit the AI rules.

[magus_taliesin@hotmail.com 0]

^not for me!

I keep seeing people having a hard time "I crawl through town and die blah blah" Don't go into towns! For frak's sake the map is HUGE. There are plenty of places to look for loot without going into towns. Tree stands, barns, edges of towns. Look for camps, other people, etc. If you have no weapon, and you keep dying in towns, and keep going into towns...and keep dying, it's not the game that's faulty!

[Bungles 1]

I've been playing for over a month and a half' date=' and the new beta finally prompted me to create a forum account to discuss the starter weapon change.

As a disclaimer, I do not find survival difficult. I finally died after two weeks yesterday simply because I spawned right behind a guy in a random house...what luck for him, enjoy your free MP5SD. I think the game actually needs to be a bit more difficult, but spawning with no weapon is not the answer to that.

I can only tell you from my experience, that by spawning with no weapon last night it threw my respect for living out of the window. With nothing, I could care less if I died. I also had no respect for the lethality of zeds...nothing to protect? who cares? Never in the hours and hours of playing had that thought ever crossed my mind previously.

I spawned near Kamenka, so I just ran to the airfield and without care for bandits or zeds, aggroed the entire base and ran them around in circles while searching for weapons. Inside the hangars, up the radio tower, I imagined the Benny Hill music playing in the background as 20 zombies chased after me. Oooo...an AK in the radio tower....grabbed it, ran down the ladder and off into the woods for 5 minutes until they were all gone.

That made it a video game, not realistic survival. It was silly, and it was ridiculous. The zombie apocalypse already HAPPENED. If you are a still a survivor in the zombie wasteland, it's because you are able to defend yourself. At least start us with a melee weapon. Who wouldn't have a blunt instrument in the zombie apocalypse?

I think starting with no weapons creates the exact opposite conditions that were intended with the game. It created an experience I never want to have again...where survival meant jack. I love this game because it's just about the only one that is supposed to care about living.

[/quote']

That is exactly what I do when I respawn. I sprint in on mad dash mode to get stuff without fear of dying. Before I had things that were of value and I tried to be careful to protect what little I did have and try to find more/better things to help in survival. Now I just go all out without caring how many ppl notice or how many zombo's I attract because If I die I can just do it all over again in 2 min. The fact that zombo's aggro so much easier has killed my ability to stealth as well. I can slow crouch walk and get noticed 85% of the time and I even get noticed while crawling, so why bother when u can just sprint in and lose the zombies by LOS. Great post it's exactly my experiance.

[breetai3 0]

If realism is the point of this game' date=' then being 100% helpless to deter attacks isn't really all that real, is it? You should at least have your dukes up, ready to fight it out, or be able to grab a rock and cave some heads in, not just run with your tail between your legs until you find a building or cliff and can exploit the AI rules.

[/quote']

Exactly this. Give me a rock. A piece of wood. Don't incite me to abuse game mechanics because of the designer's attempt to make the game more realistic.

[CaptainAnt 0]

^not for me!

I keep seeing people having a hard time "I crawl through town and die blah blah" Don't go into towns! For frak's sake the map is HUGE. There are plenty of places to look for loot without going into towns. Tree stands' date=' barns, edges of towns. Look for camps, other people, etc. If you have no weapon, and you keep dying in towns, and keep going into towns...and keep dying, it's not the game that's faulty!

[/quote']

That would be great to do if the game didn't spawn zeds specifically on loot spots as you come up to them. I can rarely even get some empty cans to distract the zeds because even THOSE spawns are covered by more zeds. No means of defense = no progression without exploiting game mechanics flaws.