Revive Paddles - would encourage teamwork

[Arseassin 10]

Ok so I'm a newb to dayz, had the game for 3 days, absolutely love it.

The biggest issue I see is the inability to progress into the center of the island as a group. I play with a group of RL friends and typically if one of us gets picked off, we end up taking out the bandit(s) then running all the way back to the shoreline to rendezvous with our fallen comrade.

While death would be a real part of something like this, it seems to me that without readily available vehicles it simply becomes a time consuming nuisance to continually run back. Out of the 5 attempts we've made to get to the NW airfield, I've successfully survived 2 trips, the rest we end up running back when we get near stary and a random bandit with a rifle ruins our trip.

My suggestion (go easy on me) is that revive paddles are introduced. Not the BF3 revive paddles where you run around holding the fire button and revive an army of invincible super soldiers, but a more time consuming and balanced one.

So heres my ideas on how it could be implemented without breaking the flow of the game.

-Paddles are a common spawn at hospitals where you would find blood etc. They should not be rare, as they would be balanced enough to be common.

-Paddles take up 4 inventory slots, and have one(1,uno) use. This is the beginning of the balance, they take up a LOT of room, and are only good for a single use, not easy to carry masses of them and be sufficient.

-In order to be revived, the player has to have been incapacitated for a full 3 minutes. After this 3 minute period has passed, there is a 120 second window of opportunity to revive the player using revive paddles. This gives a TWO MINUTE WINDOW after the 3 minutes have passed, for the player to be revived. This would prevent players from simply taking cover and reviving their buddy in the middle of a sticky situation to get out. It would require the friendlies of the downed player to drag his body to a safe position and keep it covered, because there is a revive WINDOW that must be met.

-After being revived, the player remains down with a hourglass screen for another 60 seconds.

-When the 60 seconds have passed, and the player gets up, he is at 2000 blood, and in need of morphine/pain killers/water/food. Meaning all of his survivals etc should be red.

I firmly believe with this level of hampering placed on not only the act of reviving a player in a tough situation, but also the revived player himself, that it would keep the paddles from being too game breaking. A player going down would mean that you would be put in the following situation:

You have to protect the player for a total of at least 5 minutes, possibly dragging his body to safety.

You have to waste a revive paddles, a blood pack, food, water, morphine, and pain killers on the revived player before he is even capable of defending himself again.

Let me know what you guys think!

[octopos 26]

Agreed with almost all of it.

Why the player must have been 3 mins "dead"? Just after he hit the floor, you can start the resuscitating. Cause 3 mins for resuscitating is pointless, the brain is already dead.

[Arseassin 10]

Agreed with almost all of it.

Why the player must have been 3 mins "dead"? Just after he hit the floor' date=' you can start the resuscitating. Cause 3 mins for resuscitating is pointless, the brain is already dead.

[/quote']

My reasoning is this - While I understand that the brain would (likely) be dead at that point, the issue is going to arise where there is a group of 3 bandits that are fired upon, one goes down, one runs for cover and fires back, while the other one immediately revives the downed player, and within 20 seconds the whole team is up and good to go again - This would ruin the 'first strike' element that the opposing force utilized by taking one of the bandits out before the others could react.

The fact is, it would be abused. If there is a lengthy timer in place that keeps a player from being revived so quickly, it forces the other team to fight their way out of a rough situation and cover their comrade, instead of just reviving him immediately then running into the wilderness.

[duddbudda 33]

learn to use the search function

in response (to the tune of westminster bells): NO NO NO NO, NO NO NO NO, NONO NONO NONO

makes team size way too important - right now a lone gunman poses a threat to my dozen man team, give us revives and we can cream anyone without fear

[Arseassin 10]

learn to use the search function

in response (to the tune of westminster bells): NO NO NO NO' date=' NO NO NO NO, NONO NONO NONO

makes team size way too important - right now a lone gunman poses a threat to my dozen man team, give us revives and we can cream anyone without fear

[/quote']

Well as kindly as I can respond to your learn to use the search function comment - I guarantee you that your team, given revive paddles under these circumstances, would still be laughably outplayed by me as a lone gunman. Just saying.

In a less snide manner however, it should be of great risk for a lone gunman to fire on a group of people. The point of the game is to survive, firing on a group of people is counter-productive to surviving in an of itself. If a lone gunman wants to fire into a group of people, he should not fear a 5 minute timer to camp a body.

[mansen 1]

You DO know that shock paddles don't help in the slightest if your heart has stopped beating - this is a disturbingly wrong misconception common in Hollywood - one that kills people every day because of misinformation.

Shock Paddles only serve to stabilize a heart that isn't beating at a regular pace - if you want to kickstart a heart you have to do it the old fashion way by applying pressure with your hands in strokes and breathing air into the person.

[Arseassin 10]

You DO know that shock paddles don't help in the slightest if your heart has stopped beating - this is a disturbingly wrong misconception common in Hollywood - one that kills people every day because of misinformation.

Shock Paddles only serve to stabilize a heart that isn't beating at a regular pace - if you want to kickstart a heart you have to do it the old fashion way by applying pressure with your hands in strokes and breathing air into the person.

And DO you know that in real life you cannot run for hours without getting tired? There are no zombies? DO you know that there is not some green glowing hud displaying your hunger/thirst/blood statuses in the corner of your vision in real life?

Its a game. Its not real life. The game, is geared towards realism, however it is not fully realistic. Do not scoff at other 'semi' realistic features when you are playing a game that is far from reality please.

[Officious (DayZ) 4]

Cause 3 mins for resuscitating is pointless' date=' the brain is already dead.

[/quote']

This is incorrect, but irreversible brain damage will begin. I'd love to see a bunch of random retarded players randomly walking in the wrong direction and making derping noises in game because they're brain damaged like the zombies lol.

If something like this was implemented there would need to be the risk of the player coming back as a zombie and mauling the reviver.

[duddbudda 33]

I'm sorry arseassin, no matter how good your wank tastes in your own mouth, when you spit it in my eye I still think your idea is shit

I guarantee you that your team' date=' given revive paddles under these circumstances, would still be laughably outplayed by me as a lone gunman. Just saying.[/quote']

[mansen 1]

And DO you know that in real life you cannot run for hours without getting tired? There are no zombies? DO you know that there is not some green glowing hud displaying your hunger/thirst/blood statuses in the corner of your vision in real life?

Its a game. Its not real life. The game' date=' is geared towards realism, however it is not fully realistic. Do not scoff at other 'semi' realistic features when you are playing a game that is far from reality please.

[/quote']

Two wrongs don't make a right last I checked. And the last time I checked my body was perfectly capable of informing me when I'm hungry, thirsty or hurting. Also running for extended periods of time makes you sound like an obese person trying to catch up to an ice cream truck uphill.

This is a game - geared towards realism. I have every right to scoff at others suggestions - the threads are supposed to be open for commentary, both positive and bad - as long as it is contructive in some way. :dodgy:

[ImaffoI 22]

disregard sir sandy here. It is a good idea, seems well worked out and would save a lot of time and possible frustration. I think they should be really really rare though, so only pure luck or a good team could get hold of a set. I like officious idea, but it should only be when he died by a zombie. I think it takes to much scripting though.

[Arseassin 10]

And DO you know that in real life you cannot run for hours without getting tired? There are no zombies? DO you know that there is not some green glowing hud displaying your hunger/thirst/blood statuses in the corner of your vision in real life?

Its a game. Its not real life. The game' date=' is geared towards realism, however it is not fully realistic. Do not scoff at other 'semi' realistic features when you are playing a game that is far from reality please.

[/quote']

Two wrongs don't make a right last I checked. And the last time I checked my body was perfectly capable of informing me when I'm hungry, thirsty or hurting. Also running for extended periods of time makes you sound like an obese person trying to catch up to an ice cream truck uphill.

This is a game - geared towards realism. I have every right to scoff at others suggestions - the threads are supposed to be open for commentary, both positive and bad - as long as it is contructive in some way. :dodgy:

Sorry I guess I was not born with the built in hud on the right side of my vision. Mis-communication I assume. Either way, pretending to be a part of some elitist ultra-realistic super-hardcore shooter niche is not a way to build a game that invites players. The game is realistic enough to edge out the competition, but unrealistic enough to be enjoyable to play. While constructive ideas are a good idea, attacking an idea saying its not realistic enough for your ultra-super-badass-hardcore-xxxxxx shooter, when the shooter is in fact lacking realistic features that arcadey shooters like BF3 manage to have, shows nothing but an elitist attitude that will never contribute anything decent.

I'm here trying to make suggestions to improve the game, do not insult my intelligence with your half-witted comments that are self-damning then try to pose as a martyr for your 'realistic' cause. Keep it constructive kids.

[mansen 1]

You're clearly both inept at reading and of basic understanding - I did in fact provide an alternative to the paddles if you'd bother to actually read instead of glancing and going into full "pants on head retarted retort" mode.

I'm sorry if I insulted your intelligence - I wasn't aware there was any around to offend. (This is me going pants on head retarted retort if you were wondering)

[herring (DayZ) 0]

You DO know that shock paddles don't help in the slightest if your heart has stopped beating - this is a disturbingly wrong misconception common in Hollywood - one that kills people every day because of misinformation.

Shock Paddles only serve to stabilize a heart that isn't beating at a regular pace - if you want to kickstart a heart you have to do it the old fashion way by applying pressure with your hands in strokes and breathing air into the person.

Speaking of misinformation, doing CPR will never 'start' a heart. The only purpose is to maintain a minimal amount of blood circulation and hopefully prevent permanent brain damage. Its actually an extremely inefficient process as you squeeze the heart only indirectly by compressing the entire torso, and estimated to create a blood pressure of only 40 mmHg (healthy is 80/120).

If done right it will prevent brain cells from start dying, but your only real hope is a automated defibrillator or the hospital.

e. as for OP a defibrillator will not magically heal organs that are shot to pieces

[Arseassin 10]

You're clearly both inept at reading and of basic understanding - I did in fact provide an alternative to the paddles if you'd bother to actually read instead of glancing and going into full "pants on head retarted retort" mode.

I'm sorry if I insulted your intelligence - I wasn't aware there was any around to offend. (This is me going pants on head retarted retort if you were wondering)

Ok Mansen, you win, you are the resident 13 year old alpha. Please dont hurt my feelings anymore.

Go to another thread and troll fat kid, you are taking this too off topic.

[mansen 1]

As I recall you were the one to turn this into a personal attack - So if anything I'd advise you to go attempt insulting people somewhere else while we discuss this suggestion like proper adults.

[Arseassin 10]

As I recall you were the one to turn this into a personal attack - So if anything I'd advise you to go attempt insulting people somewhere else while we discuss this suggestion like proper adults.

Psssst. Go away, no one wants to argue with you here boy.

[ImaffoI 22]

Ha-ha you all got in a fight on the internet, now go home and be ashamed, little kids. Better luck being civilized to eachother next time.

[offgrid 0]

Well, I'm here and registered just now because this is one of the best ideas I've seen for the game so far coming from a non-developer. This game already is one of the most fun video games I have played in a long time, but referring to the original poster, I have to agree. This game needs SOME kind of resuscitation. THAT SAID....

I am a medic, and there are ways to do this without the usual "GIVE ME THE SHOCK PADDLES" as stated before usually in games like Battlefield 3. I feel like this game should use a painful, drawn out process as the original poster stated as well. In the field, there are better ways than a two click process to resuscitate someone in hemorrhagic shock. I believe you should need a drawn out process, taking 7-10 steps to completely resuscitate someone.

I believe once down, there can be a 5 minute window from the second he hits the floor to when there is a blood pack AND high flow oxygen hooked up to him(explained later). Once you are at the blood pack (part one) the timer stops unless he bleeds out to zero again, then it starts again, but this time, you have two minutes instead of five to get more blood into his system.

ALSO , it should DEPEND on how the player died. If they were mauled/eaten alive by zombies, it should require (not going into details of drug names) antibiotics via IV Therapy extra on top of everything. If they were shot multiple times, it should require extra bandgaes, like 5 to stop the player from bleeding once you start giving him saline/blood.

So, sample steps should be like the following:

GUNSHOTS/FALLS/TRAUMA:

1) Combitube/Intubation (for airway control) (2 slot item)

2) High flow oxygen via intubation with bag valve mask. (spawn together, take up two slots)

3) Blood pack (#1). He will continue to bleed out until you bandage (after this step)

4) 5 Bandages. (One bandage is not enough to stop multi point trauma wounds.

5) If the bleeding is stopped below 8000 HP from the first blood pack, you will need to administer another blood pack(#2) before continuing.

6) 2 Occlusive bandages (People generally get shot in the chest, it stops your lungs from collapsing for an open chest wound)

7)Antibiotic IV therapy (similar to use of a blood pack)

8) 1 Morphine

9) Patient is stabilized.

I think that a player should now get the incapacitated timer, set for 30 minutes. I know, long time, but this would be a sacrifice anyone would make, especially if you're part of a team. they can still drag you into the woods, or into a building and overwatch you. This would give your body time to stabilize ( no where close to real life , obviously) This would make your team vulnerable and make them react to keep you alive. I know a few times I died from something stupid and it woudl have been nice to have a buddy pick me up and say "seeya in 30" rather than "Have fun walking back and probably getting shot." When the player is up, he will have to take pain killers every 30 minutes for the first hour to stop getting the jitters. (or at least once).

THAT said. This system would generally take up a LOT of space (15), I know. But as stated before, having MULTIPLE ITEMS and a TEDIOUS process will make this need to have the designated 'Doc' on your team that is there to help when someone goes down. The meticulous process would also engage player more than (give epi-pen) when they're onconcious and boom, they're awake, Or just a small window to shock once and they're ready to go.

I feel like that would be a little more sacrificial for supplies, and keep the balance of the game in tact. Even if you are with a single friend, just carry the stuff in your pack.. if one of you goes down, you can both pull supplies out as needed to patch eachother up, same with bigger teams. it just encourages watching your buddy's back more, and if he gets that one server hopper (happened to my friend last night) that logs into a stary sobor tent as he walks by it and gets blasted in the back, you both don't have to spend a long time regrouping. Yes, he'll be on the floor next to you, but you'll have the chance to save all of his things and get his limp body to safety.

If a system like this went into affect, it'd be nice to be able to not only drag bodies, but get them into vehicles (only unconscious/stabilized) and taken out. That way you can (if your team has the resources) get them to a greater safe place to recuperate.

I know I went into a lot of detail of my off-chart version of the original poster, but let me know what you think about this kind of system for resuscitation. I didn't throw in the 'downed by zombie' steps but it would be different in my opinion. Thoughts? Thanks for reading.

-Purgatory

[mansen 1]

Certainly a good read - I think it needs some simplification for sure, but it's going the right direction. Reviving people shouldn't be as easy as "USE REVIVE ON TARGET".

[beartech28 0]

People need to read this idea its something I think that could be in the game!

Chrono

Well' date=' I'm here and registered just now because this is one of the best ideas I've seen for the game so far coming from a non-developer. This game already is one of the most fun video games I have played in a long time, but referring to the original poster, I have to agree. This game needs SOME kind of resuscitation. THAT SAID....

I am a medic, and there are ways to do this without the usual "GIVE ME THE SHOCK PADDLES" as stated before usually in games like Battlefield 3. I feel like this game should use a painful, drawn out process as the original poster stated as well. In the field, there are better ways than a two click process to resuscitate someone in hemorrhagic shock. I believe you should need a drawn out process, taking 7-10 steps to completely resuscitate someone.

I believe once down, there can be a 5 minute window from the second he hits the floor to when there is a blood pack AND high flow oxygen hooked up to him(explained later). Once you are at the blood pack (part one) the timer stops unless he bleeds out to zero again, then it starts again, but this time, you have two minutes instead of five to get more blood into his system.

ALSO , it should DEPEND on how the player died. If they were mauled/eaten alive by zombies, it should require (not going into details of drug names) antibiotics via IV Therapy extra on top of everything. If they were shot multiple times, it should require extra bandgaes, like 5 to stop the player from bleeding once you start giving him saline/blood.

So, sample steps should be like the following:

GUNSHOTS/FALLS/TRAUMA:

1) Combitube/Intubation (for airway control) (2 slot item)

2) High flow oxygen via intubation with bag valve mask. (spawn together, take up two slots)

3) Blood pack (#1). He will continue to bleed out until you bandage (after this step)

4) 5 Bandages. (One bandage is not enough to stop multi point trauma wounds.

5) If the bleeding is stopped below 8000 HP from the first blood pack, you will need to administer another blood pack(#2) before continuing.

6) 2 Occlusive bandages (People generally get shot in the chest, it stops your lungs from collapsing for an open chest wound)

7)Antibiotic IV therapy (similar to use of a blood pack)

8) 1 Morphine

9) Patient is stabilized.

I think that a player should now get the incapacitated timer, set for 30 minutes. I know, long time, but this would be a sacrifice anyone would make, especially if you're part of a team. they can still drag you into the woods, or into a building and overwatch you. This would give your body time to stabilize ( no where close to real life , obviously) This would make your team vulnerable and make them react to keep you alive. I know a few times I died from something stupid and it woudl have been nice to have a buddy pick me up and say "seeya in 30" rather than "Have fun walking back and probably getting shot." When the player is up, he will have to take pain killers every 30 minutes for the first hour to stop getting the jitters. (or at least once).

THAT said. This system would generally take up a LOT of space (15), I know. But as stated before, having MULTIPLE ITEMS and a TEDIOUS process will make this need to have the designated 'Doc' on your team that is there to help when someone goes down. The meticulous process would also engage player more than (give epi-pen) when they're onconcious and boom, they're awake, Or just a small window to shock once and they're ready to go.

I feel like that would be a little more sacrificial for supplies, and keep the balance of the game in tact. Even if you are with a single friend, just carry the stuff in your pack.. if one of you goes down, you can both pull supplies out as needed to patch eachother up, same with bigger teams. it just encourages watching your buddy's back more, and if he gets that one server hopper (happened to my friend last night) that logs into a stary sobor tent as he walks by it and gets blasted in the back, you both don't have to spend a long time regrouping. Yes, he'll be on the floor next to you, but you'll have the chance to save all of his things and get his limp body to safety.

If a system like this went into affect, it'd be nice to be able to not only drag bodies, but get them into vehicles (only unconscious/stabilized) and taken out. That way you can (if your team has the resources) get them to a greater safe place to recuperate.

I know I went into a lot of detail of my off-chart version of the original poster, but let me know what you think about this kind of system for resuscitation. I didn't throw in the 'downed by zombie' steps but it would be different in my opinion. Thoughts? Thanks for reading.

-Purgatory

[/quote']

[Techercizer 82]

Purgatory's suggestion might be worth trying out a little down the road, but such a complicated mechanic-heavy process with so many tools and procedures necessary is probably best saved for the later end of the alpha when the devs don't have so much on their plate and everyone isn't deathmatching everyone else every 3 min or glitching their lungs halfway through rocks.

[Strongarm Steve 1]

These 'revive' paddles are used to normalize a heartbeat. They don't magically bring people back to life. That's video game fantasy land.

No. Learn to be more careful or get a vehicle.

[offgrid 0]

Yes I know strongarm. The paddles in games are revival tools usually. In real life yes, they can treat only three cardiac dysrhythmias, which usually have nothing to do with trauma. Defibrillation is a common treatment for life-threatening cardiac dysrhythmias, ventricular fibrillation, and pulseless ventricular tachycardia. This is why I believe a more realistic trauma resuscitation is needed.

@Techercizer - 1.7.1 is supposed to have more fluid moving zombies.

[LoneWolf123 0]

Ok so I'm a newb to dayz' date=' had the game for 3 days, absolutely love it.

The biggest issue I see is the inability to progress into the center of the island as a group. I play with a group of RL friends and typically if one of us gets picked off, we end up taking out the bandit(s) then running all the way back to the shoreline to rendezvous with our fallen comrade.

While death would be a real part of something like this, it seems to me that without readily available vehicles it simply becomes a time consuming nuisance to continually run back. Out of the 5 attempts we've made to get to the NW airfield, I've successfully survived 2 trips, the rest we end up running back when we get near stary and a random bandit with a rifle ruins our trip.

My suggestion (go easy on me) is that revive paddles are introduced. Not the BF3 revive paddles where you run around holding the fire button and revive an army of invincible super soldiers, but a more time consuming and balanced one.

So heres my ideas on how it could be implemented without breaking the flow of the game.

-Paddles are a common spawn at hospitals where you would find blood etc. They should not be rare, as they would be balanced enough to be common.

-Paddles take up 4 inventory slots, and have one(1,uno) use. This is the beginning of the balance, they take up a LOT of room, and are only good for a single use, not easy to carry masses of them and be sufficient.

-In order to be revived, the player has to have been incapacitated for a full 3 minutes. After this 3 minute period has passed, there is a 120 second window of opportunity to revive the player using revive paddles. This gives a TWO MINUTE WINDOW after the 3 minutes have passed, for the player to be revived. This would prevent players from simply taking cover and reviving their buddy in the middle of a sticky situation to get out. It would require the friendlies of the downed player to drag his body to a safe position and keep it covered, because there is a revive WINDOW that must be met.

-After being revived, the player remains down with a hourglass screen for another 60 seconds.

-When the 60 seconds have passed, and the player gets up, he is at 2000 blood, and in need of morphine/pain killers/water/food. Meaning all of his survivals etc should be red.

I firmly believe with this level of hampering placed on not only the act of reviving a player in a tough situation, but also the revived player himself, that it would keep the paddles from being too game breaking. A player going down would mean that you would be put in the following situation:

You have to protect the player for a total of at least 5 minutes, possibly dragging his body to safety.

You have to waste a revive paddles, a blood pack, food, water, morphine, and pain killers on the revived player before he is even capable of defending himself again.

Let me know what you guys think!

[/quote']

bloody good idea, i pray to god that someone in bohemia reads this suggestion, the only imrovement i would make is ditch that 60 second hourglass waitting time after being revived. seems a bit unecessary, baring in mind that it wolud take 5 minutes fir the rivival to take place but a genius suggestion:idea: