Humanity System - Rocket, have a minute?

[zeeb 6]

I really like this idea, I think it should be implemented.

[Delta-Dude 52]

I wouldn't like to be a bandit and wear a RED armband in a green camo ghillie suit... that will totaly give out my position. Also I wouldn't like to be survivor, who can detect bandits easily by looking at those bands on his hand.. and it's.. not rly realistic, why would bandits mark themself as bandits on purpose? =D

[kasper-bs@hotmail.com 2]

so if i am a survivor, and a bandit attacks me, i kill him... i get a red armband for self defense? sounds like a loose-loose situation for the survivors

[seannybgoode 10]

I read this' date=' the problem is, that requires substantial changes to models. These models are binarized - and would have to be edited. Also, we want to use armbands for factions later, so this would potentially get in the way of that. And I'm not sure, if you're a complete villain, that you would wear an armband?

[/quote']

Agree.

If I'm a badass murderer, why on earth would I wear an armband that tells everyone what I am?

Terrible freaking idea. Same as all the rest.

[SEF 0]

What if a bandit wants to become friendly?

[elvis71 4]

I am not convinced from this idea, as i wasnt from the Bandit skins. Imho its the try to implement a Kind of class System, which doesnt fit. Its total.nonsense to run around wearing colored armbands ^^ that is Not subtile and just goes again like all games do.

[hoik 415]

Now' date=' I'm not much of a forum rat as you'll see in the top right hand corner, this is my first post here.

[/quote']

well done.

Simple implementing what I've said above keeps all this intact' date=' but gives honest people (survivors) the opportunity to spot a killer and act accordingly.

[/quote']

Yep - but this idea has been posted many times and (IMO) has been taken to a much more matured state than the one you have proposed :-/.

@ Sui, (taken from here: http://dayzmod.com/forum/showthread.php?tid=10885&page=9 )

"RE: A new 'status' to encourage cooperation

Give players an option to show they do not kill survivors, that is all you need. Have you killed you can not show or use that option.

In another thread i wrote about using armbands you can option on or off at spawn or as long as you have not killed, once you made a kill self defense or not that option is gone and no armband for you, the good guys change rather than the bad guys and it is an option.

lonewolfs should not be penalized because they fear the people or group mentality, maybe add color to the armband to show what type you are generally speaking, green blue red, for each type of gamer.

Green for coop in general, blue for a team, red for a lone wolf, black for a killer who chose the armband at first. None for those who opt out of the armband system ?

just an example of armbands

with binos or just when meeting you can see what kind of player some one is, this way with direct comms you can call upon some one, and have better idea of what you are encountering."

And this I think is Sui's most valid point:

@ Sui

"The idea is partially from terminator salvation and partially because we want everything boxed and color coded."

[tater (DayZ) 0]

so if i am a survivor' date=' and a bandit attacks me, i kill him... i get a red armband for self defense? sounds like a loose-loose situation for the survivors

[/quote']

Not sure of a good solution but I totally agree with this.

[FAKTOPUS 4]

another idea for the humanity system, killing players with a lower humanity level than yourself should not affect your humanity. (say im at 10k humanity and i kill someone with 6k cause i just saw him shoot a kid over a can of beans, my humanity shouldn't drop for that) give us good guys an option to fight back without fear of becoming the bad guy ourselves.

[ryansongy@hotmail.com 27]

I read this' date=' the problem is, that requires substantial changes to models. These models are binarized - and would have to be edited. Also, we want to use armbands for factions later, so this would potentially get in the way of that. And I'm not sure, if you're a complete villain, that you would wear an armband?

[/quote']

Wait a minute why couldn't there be separate arm band models that just float on the arm when you get the band? From a technical standpoint that seems possible, considering that a lot of clothing in more recent games (Tera?) is ALL floating geometry on top of a mostly naked character model.

But factions sound more important than differentiating humanity either way so, your call. Though if I may I think that if someone could tell that someone else has worked for higher humanity instantly upon looking at them ('friendly' armband/skin/etc.) then the shoot on sight behavior would drop drastically. I know if someone spent a lot of time not shooting people and I could see that by the armband/whatever they're wearing I'd hesitate and consider before shooting them. And the fact that they know I'll hesitate means they'll hesitate. and thus, harmony.

tl;dr a skin for doing good things is much better than a skin for doing bad things.

[TheJackal_112 3]

Hope I am not repeating what others have said

I like the concept of armbands but I think that you should have the choice of 'equipping' your armband when and if you like - Rocket has said he doesnt like mechanics that control people's choices

So if you have a low/high humanity you can then choose to create an armband that shows off your humanity

When I think about it logically only survivors would do this since a bandit could loose his prey if they spotted the armband

[pvt_ammo@hotmail.com 164]

I prefer the current heart beat system to be honest. Arm bands seem more like badge of merit for bandits which is something that we don't want. You can imagine bandits parading around with their armbands.

I think bandits should be penalized for murder and the heart beat is a very effective way to do so. At the end of the day we are trying to discourage murder and this current system is the most effective way of doing so without hindering game play.

I would even go further and add a nervous/guilt to bandits, where the player would sweat and breath harder causing the player to be more easily detected by zombies through their odor and noise from breathing. This could be simulated by reducing their ability to not be seen or heard.

[Psyl3nt 125]

Something needs to be implemented, and funnily enough it's through no "fault" on the games side, it's the players making it this bad, and the players calling for fixes lol

I have since I started playing had NO interaction with anyone on the servers that I didn't know in real life, where they haven't started shooting at me on sight.

I do like the crows idea, it fits well with the game.

I don't mind the arm-band idea either, but if we are going for total realism (then why can't I use a stick to fight) - then yes bandits would not be advertising it.

[7-75 callaghan 43]

Agreed, something needs to be implemented to differentiate them. The crow idea is cool, as it would discourage people from being bandits unless they feel they absolutely must be. Perhaps being in the vicinity of a bandit should trigger a different music track for survivors? That way if there is one in your group a whole new 'detective' and paranoia/suspicion dynamic is introduced.

[logan23 118]

Here something to think about

From "Psychology of killing"

http://www.military-sf.com/Killing.htm

"Obsessional and Complusive States are like Conversion Hysteria except the soldier is more aware of what is going on. The soldier understands that fear is causing everything but he cannot do anything about it. This can be manifested by uncontrollable tremors, palpitations, stammers, tics and so on. After a while the trooper may find some kind of hysteria that allows him to escape psychic responsibility for the physical symptoms."

"Character Disorders are when a soldier becomes fixated on certain actions or things. Paranoia may include irascibility, depression and anxiety about his personal safety. Schizoids become hypersensitive and prefer to be alone. Epileptoid's become more prone to violent and sometimes unpredictable rages. Some become obsessed with religion and some become psychotic. In essence a person's very character has changed."

These are some things to think about when looking a a mechanic for people that do mass killing.

This is about making the game realistic/brutal

Players like this sniper should not be immune to their reckless killing spree.

Something like this is for players who kill mass player (ex a sniper who has 80 kills- this sniper is not a Bandit)

[Robert Shannon 27]

I think it would help.

[logan23 118]

I'm picturing it working like the Temp system.

You lose humanity = heart beat = can I trust?

(humanity should be rested after each death- easier to manage variables)

(they will need a mechanic that raises humanity but raising should take longer the lowering= keep players in teams from exploiting any feature like this)

Once your humanity is at a low level-very low- then the next mechanic kicks in.

This like the Temp(get sick) but with the humanity you start to hear things= playing on paranoid- Player will hear audio like Zeds breathing, gun fire, reloading of guns. These would not be constant but would pop up , maybe after the next kill ing or when you are low on water/food it will pop up and then go away.

I don't think tremors should be in it since I rather it be subtle like the cough when your sick.

Like when you get sick- you can get antibiotics to cure it so..

If this hearing things for the low humanity over a long time - would also need a method to calm the hearing of false events. This could be a new item that will remove the condition for a time.

This just makes all decisions in the game have consequences like standing in the rain at night - can get you sick.

[Firenzey 0]

i dont care what it is but there needs to be some sort of downside to just slaying everyone you meet at this point everyone on just about every server i play on shoots immediately without question or hesitation even as you scream friendly unarmed freshly spawned at the top of your lungs to them and its just getting ridiculous I want to group and survive but how can I when most "survivors" cant seem to string together two words before shooting.

Hello Friendly

there not so fin hard is it?

[Psyl3nt 125]

What about the teams......

How about opfor - ppl who have not killed anyone and another type lol is the amount of people on the server who have commited murder.

But have no actual visual indicator that they are or are not,

This would show the "tone" of the server and indicate the level of caution needed.

[Reaps 22]

I don't think the skins and distinction between the two are the issue we need to tackle, all these suggestions are nice n all (some VERY good ones) but until you tackle the core mechanics of the game, they are all seriously flawed.

Think about it. You walk out of a barn, a Survivor in whatever shape or form decides to take a shot at you, but misses. You shoot back, and kill him. Now YOU are the bandit. You are the ribbon wearing, crow followed poor schmuck that was doing nothing but minding your own business and defending yourself. You're now shunned from the inner circles of survivor happyness, unable to show yourself in the local store. You are destined to dwell in a bush, or rooftop.

The way the humanity is calculated needs work, a lot of work and i'm not sure this mod can take into account all the variables to realistically do this. Maybe in the future it would be possible, but it's a hell of a lot to ask of a mod.

The current system - the heartbeat. is a nice touch, but also flawed. For the very reason i mentioned above every system you implement would be flawed. Shy of having factions where you pick bandit or survivor at the start of each spawn and having friendly fire off. Which eats into peoples realism they love. There's no way possible to accurately indicate who's who in this mod.

[Srgntcuddles 0]

Sounds like a good idea.

[RandomAxe 4]

How about no armband for bandits and normal players. So they all stay exactly the same. But anyone who's given help to other players in the form of medical aid like bandaging, transfusions, or by trading players items such as food or weapons, or just anything else that is deemed a friendly act and can be implemented. These people can be spotted by having this green armband (or other form of clothing) so they can be spotted as a known friendly person. Then just keep the more subtle points of spotting a bandit with things like a heart beat or crows overhead. Solves the easily spotting a bandit problem, you don't know if to trust these people still, exactly how it is now, but anyone friendly, boom, you know they've helped players. This could also work for a bit of trickery as a bandit perhaps, for example, two people who are bandits help each other to get the green armband (or other), then use this to fool a real friendly. But once you kill another player in cold blood, that's it, you lose the armband. (Open to tweaking..)

Faction system does sound brilliant, which is why I say other forms of clothing, or anything, in case anyone has any other ideas. Just trying to mix the more popular ideas into one that works.

[Saurey 41]

This is a very nice idea, i had a similar idea but you can see if the player is a bandit or not and also there are counter-bandits who try to kill the bandits for rewards an dkeep peace for those who prefer PVE play style and also bandits get rewarded for killing the counter- bandits but nothing for killing the normal survivors, that makes the game balanced and more peaceful for new players. it also gives the new players 3 choices read on in HERE if you wish

Edited July 26, 2012 by Saurey