Lets remove even more control from the server admins!

[Cerven 80]

This has absolutely nothing to do with an Arma update and everything to do with 1.7.2.5.

1.7.2.5 changed how the servers log information. That created the situation we're in. That's it.

[matt216@email.com 22]

This has absolutely nothing to do with an Arma update and everything to do with 1.7.2.5.

1.7.2.5 changed how the servers log information. That created the situation we're in. That's it.

Update now in bercon i cant even see people talking so no one can talk to me as admin anymore nor can i read what people say when they are hacking my server

[matt216@email.com 22]

Update now in bercon i cant even see people talking so no one can talk to me as admin anymore nor can i read what people say when they are hacking my server

actually i can see chat in bercon still but its buggy

[Wo3dy 111]

said it before ill say it again.

APB scenario will happen with DayZ

[beans 93]

Agreed Wo3dy,

said it before ill say it again.

APB scenario will happen with DayZ

Agreed. No incentive to me to host a server any longer, and i have no desire to play in this hacking cess pool of a game. It will die before it makes it to stand alone if the trend continues.

[Tom316 10]

The rate things are going by the time they release the standalone DayZ product, its reputation is going to be that of a hackers paradise and noone is going to want to buy it. We have already shutdown both of our servers and stopped playing. There is no use attempting to play when every night someone just hops on an ruins all the work you put into it in a matter of seconds.

You remove one hacker and a dozen more hop on. It's a almost never ending stream of people cheating. The Arma engine is such a joke when it comes to security it makes other engines look secure. Really who makes a engine that allows the client to run any script and even go as far as to allow a client to run a script on another client. Really!

[matt216@email.com 22]

The rate things are going by the time they release the standalone DayZ product, its reputation is going to be that of a hackers paradise and noone is going to want to buy it. We have already shutdown both of our servers and stopped playing. There is no use attempting to play when every night someone just hops on an ruins all the work you put into it in a matter of seconds.

You remove one hacker and a dozen more hop on. It's a almost never ending stream of people cheating. The Arma engine is such a joke when it comes to security it makes other engines look secure. Really who makes a engine that allows the client to run any script and even go as far as to allow a client to run a script on another client. Really!

all this and still not a single dev post on it

[Yshido 34]

I wonder when the next step will come: hands off from the server, just pay! :lol:

Thats what we are allready doing.....

[Rocko (DayZ) 0]

I just started playing last week and I've been having fun. I ended up gifting my buddy the ARMA2 pack on Steam so we could both play DayZ and survive together. Over the weekend I ended up getting killed and teleported by some hacker. Luckily my buddy was on vent and I was able to tell him NOT to connect.

I considered renting my own server since my friend and I have been having trouble finding one to play on, and loading times see erratic on many servers, plus being able to police hackers sounded like gold to me. I came on to the forum to read the posts in the Server section and I must say I was very saddened to see how admins are treated and the enviornment the devs have created, via their rules, to allow hackers to run free.

This message is really for the devs of the game to let them know that I would love to rent a server and host the game but not if I'm going to pay $50 a month to have my hands tied and watch hackers destroy the gaming experience on my server. *shrug*

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

It's a alpa, I ASSUME that, at the moment the dayZ team leverage the help of enthousiast fans (server admins) in order to do live testing of the mod.

Once the project will be out of it's early testing phase, i personally do not think you will be able to host servers at all. This is good for testing, right now, but once the game (and not the mod anymore) is rolling servers will probably be kept under locks and keys, out of reach of any player.

[ken@thekab.com 37]

Its getting to the point where maybe rocket should get with BI to just set up servers on their own let them deal with all the crap instead of all of us that are paying for him to test his mod. Last time i checked we pay so you guys can play and test.

They'd have to absorb the $200k+ a month that the community is providing. Guess they'd rather engage in development and policies that ensure a hacker paradise. Anyone else notice that players in the last 24 hours is going down? Can't imagine why. Meanwhile every time my server hits 40+ players I know it won't be long before someone shows up to ruin it. Before I could track down who it was pretty easily most of the time and ban them, although even that was against policy! Now I can't even do that.

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

You have to understand that at this point of development, cheating, or game balance are not major concerns (if they follow standard development cycles alpha=muck things around and push features we want in). Wether cheating is rampant or not, wether the mod is even enjoyable to play is irrelevant as for all we know testing might just be done internally on a LAN server.

[Plaguetongue 47]

i dont really know what is worst in DayZ

- admin abuse?

- hackers?

- dupes?

- all other alt+f4 abuse?

- graphic bugs?

if they had a good report system for admin abuse and fixed the graphic bugs then all admins could have alot more power to fix the rest of the problems, but really the admin abuse problems need to stop first to be able to fix the rest.

im not saying u abuse admin powers but alot of server admins does and there is the core of the problem.

More power = more cheaters banned ofc, but also more admin abuse.

[ken@thekab.com 37]

You have to understand that at this point of development, cheating, or game balance are not major concerns (if they follow standard development cycles alpha=muck things around and push features we want in). Wether cheating is rampant or not, wether the mod is even enjoyable to play is irrelevant as for all we know testing might just be done internally on a LAN server.

What does that have to do with anything? We're talking about policy and the fact that they went out of their way to remove information from the log file.

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

What does that have to do with anything? We're talking about policy and the fact that they went out of their way to remove information from the log file.

They had players prod around the hive server (and corrupting it) before, you really believe they are going to just leave hive debug messages in the log files?

[arma2eraseditself 22]

So we made program that allows us to scan the RPT file that us server owners have control of and all it did was scan for log in and log out times. This has helped our server out more than you know as it shows us if people are duping. When we see someone log in and out numerous times in a short period of time its pretty good evidence that they are up to no good. Then of course we can compile evidence and proceed with the ban process if needed. But after our recent patch this is not possible any more. The RPT file will no longer register people loging in we still get the logout though but i cant confirm the log out log as it might still be old data in the RPT file. So my complaint is that at the current moment admins are the onlything stopping cheaters as we all know how good BE has been at it. So the new lack of log registered to the servers just restricts the admins even more. So on this note with our anti-cheat method being completely removed i am starting to believe that the Dayz team and BI have no intrest in stoping the ramped cheating atm. As more and more admins become wiser on all of this i expect the server counts to start dropping because if you guys cant control the cheating now what makes you think it will be any different in your standalone.

Why dont you consider this a gift that you cant be banning people illegally? Your lucky you havent ended up blacklisted. Rocket said himself the ONLY reason @ ALL to ban ANYONE is racism basically.

unless you can PROVE a player is hacking (which is pretty damn hard), then you CANNOT Ban. DUPING is not a banable offense....

[MarKeR (DayZ) 57]

You know what trig!!

You try try running a server and the you will find out how fucking stupid Rocket's rules are!!

So don't come on here and try the old rule book pish, it doesn't work!!

[Cerven 80]

Why dont you consider this a gift that you cant be banning people illegally? Your lucky you havent ended up blacklisted. Rocket said himself the ONLY reason @ ALL to ban ANYONE is racism basically.

unless you can PROVE a player is hacking (which is pretty damn hard), then you CANNOT Ban. DUPING is not a banable offense....

Actually it was pretty easy to prove someone was hacking before, the true 'hackers' really aren't that many in number, the majority of the people running scripts are just reading info off a website and running a program: they have no real knowledge beyond that. The log picks these people up, and we were banning them accordingly. We didn't ban anyone that we didn't know for 100% certain was hacking, and the logs had already been submitted.

Again guys, you're welcome to have opinions, but quit spouting statistics, numbers, or facts unless you have real evidence to back it up. 90% of hackers aren't running bypasses, and it's not 'pretty damn hard' to prove someone's hacking most of the time. A lot of you guys are posting this stuff without ever having run a server on this game, and really don't know what we're up against here. It's alright for you guys to have opinions that run counter to ours - that's your right - but please don't post stuff that is just patently not true here unless you've got facts to substantiate it.

Edited August 14, 2012 by Cerven

[l0p 4]

Again guys, you're welcome to have opinions, but quit spouting statistics, numbers, or facts unless you have real evidence to back it up. 90% of hackers aren't running bypasses, and it's not 'pretty damn hard' to prove someone's hacking most of the time

Nonsense. You obviously have not been paying attention to logs pre .5 because otherwise you would have noticed a particular event happening recently with no clue on who is doing it other than people who do it tagging it on innocent bystanders. Obviously you haven't been paying attention to your server to see the teleports. Or the bus spawners. Or the 2000m shots. Or or or. Nothing caught by battleye and now even less to be found in the logs.

90% of the cheaters ARE RUNNING BYPASSES because any script injector will come with a bypasser. But hey, enjoy not looking at the server so you can claim all is fine.

[l0p 4]

My question to Battleye is this: Why is this only NOW receiving the attention from your organization that it deserves? Why did it take DayZ to get to this point? Didn't you realize you had MAJOR issues with your anti-cheat engine prior to this?

It is not battleye which needs attention, its dayz and the fact that not only now we don't have crappy logs. We have almost no logs at all. So if a cheater runs something they'll have bypassed battleye, and what line of defense do we have left to catch and prevent future indicents? Denial and going lalalalanothappeningnothappening?

[ken@thekab.com 37]

They had players prod around the hive server (and corrupting it) before, you really believe they are going to just leave hive debug messages in the log files?

Again, what does that have to do with anything?

Do you believe that "corrupting" the Hive had anything to do with removing debug messages? Bull. If you think those messages allowed any kind of corruption of the Hive and more importantly if you believe that such corruption could be stopped by removing them you have not a clue what you're talking about.

There was one very effective tool for rooting out cheaters. They removed it. I guarantee you that was not a technological decision, it was a policy decision. Furthermore there can be no debate that the simple act of deciding to make a rule stating that server admins cannot ban is anything but a policy decision.

This is a very simple argument about policy that you keep conflating with other irrelevant topics.

[l0p 4]

There was one very effective tool for rooting out cheaters. They removed it. I guarantee you that was not a technological decision, it was a policy decision. Furthermore there can be no debate that the simple act of deciding to make a rule stating that server admins cannot ban is anything but a policy decision.

Exactly. I find quite ironic that everyone complains about cheaters and thunderdomes and rather than expand the log file capabilites dayz patch cuts them down to nothingless. As I was looking at the new sorry excuse of a log file that we have I wonder how long do I want to keep a server up when it's free for cheaters to abuse everyone and all I can do about it is read 'WRITE: PASS'. Lol.

Oh, cheats for the new build are of course up and running.

Edited August 15, 2012 by l0p

[ShiftyDevil 0]

So, we're just now firing up our first DayZ server, we had two major reasons to do so (control of server restarts) and, having better control over hackers.

I am pretty unhappy with what I'm reading in this thread. I can't imagine a good reason to limit the knowledge an admin has over what's happening on their server. As someone who has admin'd many different game servers in the past I've always felt admins had the responsability of providing a fun, safe place for players.

To intimate that limiting something so simple, and, basic as the server logs an admin has for their own server will somehow curb admin abuse is pure ignorance.

Edited August 15, 2012 by ShiftyDevil

[ken@thekab.com 37]

I should also point out that everything the log file revealed can still be gleaned by a server admin who knows what the hell they're doing. The difference is now the time and effort required to do so is simply too much for me to spend to weed out cheaters. If I wanted to be malicious I could do so, neutering the log file does not stop that. But if I had wanted to be malicious in the first place it was always far easier and cheaper to use a "hack" than it was to pay for a server and use the log file. Furthermore as a matter of policy there is still a rule against banning cheaters, so there's that too.

[Lady Kyrah 1109]

Again, what does that have to do with anything?

Do you believe that "corrupting" the Hive had anything to do with removing debug messages? Bull. If you think those messages allowed any kind of corruption of the Hive and more importantly if you believe that such corruption could be stopped by removing them you have not a clue what you're talking about.

There was one very effective tool for rooting out cheaters. They removed it. I guarantee you that was not a technological decision, it was a policy decision. Furthermore there can be no debate that the simple act of deciding to make a rule stating that server admins cannot ban is anything but a policy decision.

This is a very simple argument about policy that you keep conflating with other irrelevant topics.

Those lines in the log where created EVERY TIME the server would read or write from/to the hive and you don't see why it's something they might not want you to get?

We don't need server admins to stand on guard against cheating, only to keep servers in working order. When it comes to cheating we only need better anti cheat capabilities.

Oh it looks like my prayers where heard -> http://dayzmod.com/forum/index.php?/topic/71904-new-major-battleye-anti-cheat-features/