Extended First Aid

[chickenfeed 17]

So, firstly, the current first aid system is fine. It's functional, it makes sense, it's not too complicated. So my suggestion for extending the first aid keeps that in mind: Extra features, more 'realistic', but keeping it straight forward.

Bandages

My suggestion isn't changing the mechanics of bandages, or the bandaging process. Instead, it adds a new junk item: Cloth. Similiar to empty cans, it would be considered trash and would spawn almost everywhere, perhaps it could also be created by tearing outfits (When there are more, obviously).

Consider it like this: Bandages have a 100% to stop bleeding per wound (You will need 3 bandages if you are wounded in both arms and a leg.), whereas the cloth would only have a 60/70% chance to stop the bleeding. Obviously worse than bandages, but to counteract this bandages would become less likely to spawn in homes and would be more of a hospital/military spawn.

Why would you need a cloth when we already have bandages? Immersion. The word is thrown around alot in recent times, and to be honest has begun to loose it's meaning. I know not everybody would agree with this, but crawling into a trashed house, trying to stop your bleeding with a dirty rag would just help the player get into his character.

Also, using a cloth could have a tiny chance of causing infection (Explained below).

Painkillers and Morphine

I also suggest a change to the mechanics of painkillers and, more specifically, morphine. Pain becomes more of a solid feature, not just an annoyance. Keeping it simple: Painkillers take time before they begin to take effect, and they will only last for a while. Pain will last as long as a limb is damaged, and painkillers will stop the screen shaking and moaning for a while, perhaps 30 minutes? This includes time spent offline, giving players a reason to keep stocked up on painkillers until their wounds have time to heal.

Alongside this, painkillers would now take time before they can take effect, 2 or 3 minutes, perhaps. So you can't just throw 30 painkillers down your throat and instantly feel fine.

Morphine would now also be used for stopping pain, instead of mysteriously fixing broken bones. Rarer than painkillers, morphine would take effect within a few seconds and would last for twice as long as painkillers.

Alcohol

Why is there empty whisky bottles, but no whisky? Alcohol would become a more common form of painkiller, with the obvious side effects. It would take longer before the pain is reduced (More booze, less pain), and the player's screen would become blurred, aiming becomes sluggish and after too many bottles, your character will start to move slower (Limping, see below).

Limping

Unfortunately this particular feature would require a new animation (It's completely possible), but in the meantime, perhaps it can just be simulated by preventing the player from sprinting and slowing his running speed.

When the player is experiancing extreme pain, or when one leg is wounded (Both legs will still cause crawling), or when he is pissed out of his skull, he will begin to limp, moving much more slowly but not causing the frustration of forcing him to drag himself 2km across the map and then preventing him from entering a house because the step is slightly too high (Or, even worse, breaking his neck as he tries to crawl into the building).

Linked with the painkiller adjustments, limping could be cancelled out with the use of painkillers/morphine.

Splints

Add a new item, found in hospitals or created from wood (Which has very little use, at the moment). A splint could reduce the movement issues that a damaged leg can cause. Perhaps by allowing the player to limp instead of crawl, or to speed up his limping speed. I admit, I have not put so much thought into this, but the idea is that it ties in with limping and painkillers to create an alternative to crawling with broken limbs.

Infection

Already a feature, it just needs expanding. Over time, if wounds have not been healed, there is a significant chance of infection which increases over time. Using dirty rags would also have a tiny chance of causing infection.

There is no change to the current function of infection, just giving more causes. I have never ever suffered from an infection in DayZ, and my temperature has never dropped below 42C, and I know this is the case with a large number of players. This is just giving more of a benefit to having anti-biotics as an item.

That's all I have to suggest. The main focus of all of these features is simply immersion. Although some features could be considered as more realistic, they are not HARDCORE SURVIVAL REALISM, requiring players to have formal training in first aid to be able to play DayZ, because - in my opinion - that is not where DayZ should be going. Realism is good, DayZ is as realistic as it needs to be, but there is a line between 'fun' realism, and 'chore' realism. DayZ needs to stay on the fun side.

[chickenfeed 17]

In less than one hour, this thread was buried under countless 'suggestions' trying to punish PKing, Banditry and griefing...

Edited July 19, 2012 by Chickenfeed

[Madfast 22]

I agree, I think they could be some more variation in the medical system, especially with more homemade or civilian solutions. An ethos I believe should be applied to the entire game.

[GeordieMarv 293]

I agree too. Let's hope that the medical system evolves a bit more...it is early DayZ though ;)

[Egi 5]

Totally cool suggestions. Adding a few more:

The first aid process should take more time. The couple of seconds it takes now is better than nothing but the bandaging should take several minutes. In addition bandaging yourself without any help, while you are bleeding, in pain and in darkness is a very hard task. This should encourage teaming up. The bandaged wounds should open up later if you are on your usual 5km run though Black Forest. Alcohol could be used to clean wounds and prevent infection.

[aversionfx 63]

Some of these are okay, and would definitely deepen the mechanics for survival. However, I don't think it would be worth expanding on these things, simply because most encounters with hostile players are fatal. I think your concept of cloth not being as effective as a bandage is poor - bandages are made from cloth, and they are both applied in the exact same manner.

I would like to see splints, and alcohol used in numerous forms (such as a disinfectant, painkiller, and as fuel for creating molotovs).

[FuzzyPooka 20]

Perhaps bullet wounds have a chance to embed themselves in flesh. (This isn't NATO shoot to aim, this is buckshot and M24 rounds.) say 30%? Usually pass through the body, causing blood damage and bleeding, but when embedded causes pain and groans if said limb is used. Needs tweezers to be pulled out.

[Madfast 22]

Some of these are okay, and would definitely deepen the mechanics for survival. However, I don't think it would be worth expanding on these things, simply because most encounters with hostile players are fatal. I think your concept of cloth not being as effective as a bandage is poor - bandages are made from cloth, and they are both applied in the exact same manner.

I imagine that is why doctors just rip off bits of cloth too apply to wounds? A real bandage is specially woven and treated to prevent it 1.Sticking to the wound 2.Causing infection and most importantly to maximize its ability to absorb blood through both the material it is made of, how it is made and because the bandage itself applies pressure to the wound to reduce bleeding.

[Jenga22 22]

i love all the ideas that have been suggested here i hope they get implemented <3 +1

[legendaryfish12@yahoo.com 0]

Maybe you can also include a nutrition system with more varietys of food, eating nothing but meat and beans must be harsh on the system

plus vitamins, the flintstones ones

(yes i know that there is more than meat and beans in the game its just that those are the only ones people care about)

Edited July 20, 2012 by KillerSalami

[Hendrix27 54]

I like these ideas very very much and I myself would like to see this happen in the game.

[chickenfeed 17]

Some of these are okay, and would definitely deepen the mechanics for survival. However, I don't think it would be worth expanding on these things, simply because most encounters with hostile players are fatal. I think your concept of cloth not being as effective as a bandage is poor - bandages are made from cloth, and they are both applied in the exact same manner.

I would like to see splints, and alcohol used in numerous forms (such as a disinfectant, painkiller, and as fuel for creating molotovs).

I disagree, wrapping a rag around a bullet wound is not going to be anywhere near as effective as a proper bandage. Consider the use of a cloth as more about the method of applying it to a wound. If a player uses a cloth, it could take effect more quickly to simulate a rushed job to quickly stop the blood before you get proper medical care. Using a bandage would take longer, but is applied more carefully and, as Madfast said, is designed to stop blood and not clean dirty windows.

Perhaps bullet wounds have a chance to embed themselves in flesh. (This isn't NATO shoot to aim, this is buckshot and M24 rounds.) say 30%? Usually pass through the body, causing blood damage and bleeding, but when embedded causes pain and groans if said limb is used. Needs tweezers to be pulled out.

Perhaps removing bullets should be possible alone, but takes along time and causes alot of blood loss, whereas if you get another player to do it for you, it's faster, less painful and much cleaner. Also, include the ability to remove a bullet with a hunting knife, which is obviously a very bad, but possible, method of removal. Also, as aversionfx and Egi said, it would be good to add more functions to alcohol. Maybe allowing it to be used on wounds to reduce the chance of infection when bandaging/removing a bullet.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Chickenfeed

[ZomboWTF 527]

In less than one hour, this thread was buried under countless 'suggestions' trying to punish PKing, Banditry and griefing...

yep, suggestion forum, and nobody ever reads stickies anyway

i like your ideas, add more serious injuries that take time to heal plus your painkiller splint and cloth stuff woud make perfect sense

(first fix the *kill yourself by proning* stuff) then add the mechanic of broken legs requiring a splint or something plus time to heal, and only be able to run with morphine

[Frozen (DayZ) 144]

I disagree, wrapping a rag around a bullet wound is not going to be anywhere near as effective as a proper bandage. Consider the use of a cloth as more about the method of applying it to a wound. If a player uses a cloth, it could take effect more quickly to simulate a rushed job to quickly stop the blood before you get proper medical care. Using a bandage would take longer, but is applied more carefully and, as Madfast said, is designed to stop blood and not clean dirty windows.

dont see any difference between usuall cloth rag and a bandage in terms of stopping bleeding. except bandage is antiseptic.

but if rag was soaked in alcohol it will do the same trick

Perhaps removing bullets should be possible alone, but takes along time and causes alot of blood loss, whereas if you get another player to do it for you, it's faster, less painful and much cleaner. Also, include the ability to remove a bullet with a hunting knife, which is obviously a very bad, but possible, method of removal. Also, as aversionfx and Egi said, it would be good to add more functions to alcohol. Maybe allowing it to be used on wounds to reduce the chance of infection when bandaging/removing a bullet.

why there always should be penalty for treating bullet wounds on your own? i`d say the chance that something will go wrong while treating bullet wound by yourself should be implemented, because its actually random when you can treat wound solo or not.

a like the idea of hunting knife usage, and i would be also great to cauterize wounds with it, combined with campfire, which will stop bleeding but will cause a pain status.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Frozen

[Ske7ch23 1]

I think introducing leg splints etc is a great idea. But why does everything have to be in a backpack the whole time. if you have a broken leg, chop some wood and make the splint on the floor in front of you. If I was making a leg splint in real life I wouldn't be putting it in my backpack ever. It is something you would crawl off and find in the woods and then strap together out of rags from your clothing / the cloth you mentioned.

I would also like to fix the falling damage in the game though, I have never broken a bone in my life, I have fallen down staircases with a heavy suitcase, been in car accidents and played sports, but never broken a bone. In this game if a zombie sniffs at you or you trip on a step in a barn both your legs fall off! jumping from a height of 4 feet is pretty safe even with a heavy backpack on. anything higher and you could start introducing a player risk of broken bones. I think this game over compensates realism in some aspects

[hombrecz 832]

Some very good ideas here!!

I think that medical stuff could be a bit expanded like in ACE mod for Arma 2.

Also splendid idea that bullet could get stuck in you and only other player could put it out with tweezers (coop encouraging anyone?).

Also, why not to add small chance to "ressurect" player that died in last lets say 20 seconds?

You would need to apply adrenaline shot, you would need to massage his heart for like 20 seconds, also bandage him and if he gets back,then blood transfusion, pain killers and maybe even morphine. If player comes back, he would have blurred vision for some time, also unable to run very fast etc.

Ofcourse the chance of ressing player would be quite low and you would need to make your attempt very quickly after he dies.

This would not "steal" kill point from his murderer as not to angry these PKers.

[starwarsfan@gmx.de 450]

The first aid process should take more time. The couple of seconds it takes now is better than nothing but the bandaging should take several minutes.

Because you want to bleed out while bandaging yourself... right.

[Riis 22]

Because you want to bleed out while bandaging yourself... right.

Well, I'd suggest tourniquets being added to the game, to stop bleeding from the extremeties untill you can bandage em. While a tourniquet is applied you would be in serious pain as this often (at least from my experiences as a combat medical technician) hurts more than the wound itself.

So step one when you've been hit, apply a tourniquet if possible, this would take anywhere from 15-30 seconds and should be done while in cover.

When its "scene safe" as we call it, you can apply a bandage, wait a few minutes and then remove the tourniquet and the bleeding should be stopped. Now this means that while you wait for "scene safe" you would be in very serious pain, only removeable with morphine, not painkillers.

[Frozen (DayZ) 144]

Because you want to bleed out while bandaging yourself... right.

well bandaging takes approximately 40sec - 2min, depending on wound location. but when you applied bandage and made 1-2 wraps around, you are already dont lose blood, or at least not so intense. so it would be close to reality, if bleeding was suspended at the start of the process, and completely stopped at the end of it.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Frozen

[Madfast 22]

dont see any difference between usuall cloth rag and a bandage in terms of stopping bleeding. except bandage is antiseptic.

but if rag was soaked in alcohol it will do the same trick

Proper medical bandages are must better at stopping bleeding than a cloth rag. Not only are the woven in a way to maximize the about of blood they can absorb, they are designed to apply constant pressure to a wound. You are talking to someone possibly on the other side of world instantly. You think we would be able to achieve that feat of technology as a race, but our bandages would be no better than alcohol soaked rags? Especially considering our pretense for murdering one another.

[chickenfeed 17]

dont see any difference between usuall cloth rag and a bandage in terms of stopping bleeding. except bandage is antiseptic.

Yep, as Madfast said (Twice). Thanks for your feedback though!

[Frozen (DayZ) 144]

Proper medical bandages are must better at stopping bleeding than a cloth rag. Not only are the woven in a way to maximize the about of blood they can absorb, they are designed to apply constant pressure to a wound. You are talking to someone possibly on the other side of world instantly. You think we would be able to achieve that feat of technology as a race, but our bandages would be no better than alcohol soaked rags? Especially considering our pretense for murdering one another.

blood absorption of a bandage depends on cloth thickness and quantity of layers. if we are talking about gauze bandage which is the most common(and thus most likely to be found in DayZ), it will require multiple layers of it to stop bleeding or dense cloth rag/piece of cotton wool(nasty shit but does the trick).and usual cloth made of more dense material then gauze is, and thus you need less of it. but chances that its contaminated are lot higher

Edited July 20, 2012 by Frozen

[Madfast 22]

blood absorption of a bandage depends on cloth thickness and quantity of layers. if we are talking about gauze bandage which is the most common(and thus most likely to find in DayZ), it will require multiple layers of it to stop bleeding or dense cloth rag/piece of cotton wool(nasty shit but does the trick).and usual cloth made of more dense material then gauze is, and thus you need less of it. but chances that its contaminated are lot higher

I guess that is why hospitals use alcohol soaked rags they find on the floor...

Oh no that is right they spend a lot of money to buy bandages specially designed to staunch blood flow. Also if absorption depends on thickness I guess that is why a cloth absorbs more water than a sponge. Oh wait no it doesn't. It is the intrinsic properties of a material, its affinity for water, its ability to expand that determine how much it can absorb. But if you ever get shot, feel free to try and stop the bleeding with a dirty dish cloth, I will be using the specially designed bandages to deal with it.

[Riis 22]

I guess that is why hospitals use alcohol soaked rags they find on the floor...

Oh no that is right they spend a lot of money to buy bandages specially designed to staunch blood flow. Also if absorption depends on thickness I guess that is why a cloth absorbs more water than a sponge. Oh wait no it doesn't. It is the intrinsic properties of a material, its affinity for water, its ability to expand that determine how much it can absorb. But if you ever get shot, feel free to try and stop the bleeding with a dirty dish cloth, I will be using the specially designed bandages to deal with it.

The ONLY thing that stops a bleeding is pressure, absorbing blood has NOTHING to do with how well a bandage stops a bleeding, it has something to do with how well it protects against infections.

You can stop a bleeding with just about anything, I've tried packing a wound from an artery on a pig with a foil blanket, and it worked fine, the bleeding stopped. You can use just about anything to stop a bleeding, as long as you can put enough pressure on the bleeding vessels. BUT! Using dirty materials = greater risk of infection, gangrene, bloodpoisoning, death...

[Jehangir 52]

In less than one hour, this thread was buried under countless 'suggestions' trying to punish PKing, Banditry and griefing...

But you shamelessly dug it back up!