The Buddy System [Friend spawning mechanism]

[zackb101 0]

I think that DayZ should have a buddy system in place. Firstly, before I start, I know that DayZ is supposed to be fairly persistent and that if a buddy system were created it would have to be balanced and carefully thought through. The reason I have the idea for a buddy system is because it can be extremely difficult and time consuming to find your friends when you join in the server, almost to an unreasonable extent. Some people don't have the time to spend running across the map to simply find each other and start playing.

The buddy system should allow a group of friends (possibly linked via Steam friends), to spawn on each other, or at the very least spawn in the same city/village. This should be the only feature of the buddy system, there's no reason to add more features and adding any more could cause unfair disadvantages.

The buddy system would need to have rigorous limitations to prevent and deter any abuse. Some examples may be;

-A time limit, only allow buddy spawning per X amount of seconds.

-Weapon limitations, every time you spawn on a buddy you could either have your weapons removed, temporarily disabled, or another limitation.

-Health limitations, for a limited amount of time your health could be lowered to prevent teleporting in a gun fight.

-Proximity and fighting limitations, disabling spawning on a buddy while they are within close proximity of another player (or bandits), or while they are in a direct gunfight.

-Any other limitations that would suit the buddy system.

I think that if implemented correctly, the buddy system could be a very valuable addition to DayZ.

[James (DayZ) 1]

I really like the sound of this idea. With the proper limitations, a buddy system could definitely be a great addition to DayZ. I know one of the main reasons I downloaded the mod was to try and survive a zombie apocalypse with my friends; spending a bare minimum of half an hour just to attempt to find/reach them can be ridiculously annoying.

Of course, without proper limitations this system could be abused, though I do like some of the limitations you've suggested already. I especially like the idea of a time limit, such as only being able to spawn on a friend within around 5 minutes of each of you joining the game.

[bobbyweenus 17]

While what you're saying makes plenty of sense from the player standpoint, I think it goes against the theory of the game. Maybe with GPS and radios you could locate each other or "marked" friends via a friendslist of sorts, but having players spawn on each other would really increase PKing 10fold.

This way, a single person could sneak behind enemy lines, then have his friends spawn on him and jump unsuspecting players. or they could scout in various directions and reconnect to the server and spawn on their friends.

It's a bit too exploitable, and really goes against the harsh 'realities' of DayZ.

[harryzhe 28]

Navigation is simply a part of the game. Yes it takes ages to find your friends, but this is one of the challenges. The better you are at navigation/observation and estimating distances and things like that, the faster you'll find your buddies. It's a facet of the survival skillset and diminishing its importance in the game diminishes the authenticity of how survival is portrayed.

Navigation is as important as combat. Your idea is kind of like suggesting that we make a mechanic where you can click on a zombie and your character will go into AI mode and fight the zombie til it's dead, automatically.

[zackb101 0]

While what you're saying makes plenty of sense from the player standpoint' date=' I think it goes against the theory of the game. Maybe with GPS and radios you could locate each other or "marked" friends via a friendslist of sorts, but having players spawn on each other would really increase PKing 10fold.

This way, a single person could sneak behind enemy lines, then have his friends spawn on him and jump unsuspecting players. or they could scout in various directions and reconnect to the server and spawn on their friends.

It's a bit too exploitable, and really goes against the harsh 'realities' of DayZ.

[/quote']

This is why I want any possible exploits to be thought of and shut down BEFORE it's implemented. As well, simple time limitations and player limitations that I listed earlier could prevent the problem you posed.

I know there are many, many exploits that could be affiliated with this system. But for every exploit found, there can be a limitation to prevent it.

The way I see it, if players do manage to find exploits that cannot be fixed by any means, then no harm no foul, the buddy system is removed. If it works, great, we keep the system. It's worth a shot in my opinion, it's better to have tried and failed than to wonder if it would have worked in the first place.

[James (DayZ) 1]

This way' date=' a single person could sneak behind enemy lines, then have his friends spawn on him and jump unsuspecting players. or they could scout in various directions and reconnect to the server and spawn on their friends.

It's a bit too exploitable, and really goes against the harsh 'realities' of DayZ.

[/quote']

I agree with you weenus in the sense that this idea could be extremely exploitable; that is, without strict and sensible limitations.

I believe one good way to handle it would be a time limitation for both players. What I mean by this is a system in which one can only SPAWN on a friend in the first few minutes of joining a server, and one can only be SPAWNED ON within the first few minutes of joining a server. Maybe only allowing new characters, and not loaded ones use this feature would be a good idea to, though that's open to debate.

As I said earlier, I really do feel a system like this could be beneficial for everyone involved, but only if implemented properly.

[bobbyweenus 17]

The severe limitations you would need to enact to avoid exploiting the system would make the system pointless. Even being able to have ONE person teleport onto your location is horribly exploitable. Spawning to specific areas would be getting camped. Never underestimate the low depths a griefer will go to ruin your day.

EDIT: Here's about as far as you could compromise this idea while still maintaining the harsh "anti-game" atmosphere and mechanics of DayZ, would be something like a 'buddy system' in the classic sense, not the Internet sense. Allowing you to 'tag' a friend or two on your initial character spawn, so that the two of you spawn nearby or together in your newbie spawn area.

[James (DayZ) 1]

Navigation is simply a part of the game. Yes it takes ages to find your friends' date=' but this is one of the challenges. The better you are at navigation/observation and estimating distances and things like that, the faster you'll find your buddies.

[/quote']

While I understand what you're saying here, I can't say I agree with it. First of all, that is a personal view, not one relational to the game for each and every person. Some people enjoy the challenge of navigation for hours on end, others do not. Personally, I am fond of the challenge of navigation and observation. What I do not enjoy is how tedious it can be in this situation in particular.

Let's say you spend an hour finding your friend. While its all fine and dandy while you're alive, the moment one or both of you dies, the process starts all over again. You also have to look at the fact that there are many people who play this mod just to enjoy it with their friends. It can really be a downer to know you very well may be investing 25% of your time just trying to find them.

Navigation is as important as combat. Your idea is kind of like suggesting that we make a mechanic where you can click on a zombie and your character will go into AI mode and fight the zombie til it's dead' date=' automatically.

[/quote']

I have absolutely no idea how this relates to the suggestion... I don't think having your player "going into an AI mode" has anything to do with a spawning system.

[zackb101 0]

The severe limitations you would need to enact to avoid exploiting the system would make the system pointless. Even being able to have ONE person teleport onto your location is horribly exploitable. Spawning to specific areas would be getting camped. Never underestimate the low depths a griefer will go to ruin your day.

You could camp anywhere you like and have people trying to spawn on you sure, but, limitations WILL make it less worthwhile for the griefer to try and do so.

For your spawn camping problem, you can limit the amount of people spawning on a certain person, and each person who spawned on the original person will also retain that limitations to prevent exploting. You can also, as I mentioned before, have it time based, nobody will wait around for 15 minutes or more to spawn on the person, and if they did, congratulations you've wasted 15 minutes of your life.

[harryzhe 28]

While I understand what you're saying here' date=' I can't say I agree with it. First of all, that is a personal view, not one relational to the game for each and every person. Some people enjoy the challenge of navigation for hours on end, others do not. Personally, I am fond of the challenge of navigation and observation. What I do not enjoy is how tedious it can be in this situation in particular. [/quote']

Well, idk. It's a pretty well established thing in arma2 itself as well. it'd need to be "modded out."

The dev has alluded to his desire to avoid video game tropes, and I would consider buddy-spawning to be one of those. Aside from that, it's pretty exploitable.

I don't think it really matters if "some players" would like to auto-warp to their friends and forgo that navigation element of the game. I don't believe it's subjective for me to say it's a significant facet of the gameplay and challenge. There are arma mods with buddy spawning in already, and I propose that if the developers wanted to include it they would have by now (if it's considered a bad thing by the developers, why would they waste any time in "fixing" it?)

And before you counter with what the players might want and answering the demands of the community - I don't believe the developers are obliged to do that. Design by committee isn't what got the game to where it is today, and where it is today is, objectively and measurably, hugely successful.

I have absolutely no idea how this relates to the suggestion... I don't think having your player "going into an AI mode" has anything to do with a spawning system.

I was illustrating the absurdity of removing something which is an integral part of the gameplay, or dumbing it down, or making it automatic.

[wolfsburg62 66]

+1 on this idea. Im going to give it a 5 star review

[James (DayZ) 1]

I don't think it really matters if "some players" would like to auto-warp to their friends and forgo that navigation element of the game. I don't believe it's subjective for me to say it's a significant facet of the gameplay and challenge.

Once again' date=' I believe I understand what you're thinking in this and while I still have to agree in general when it comes to Arma and DayZ, I disagree in particular with what I am actually talking about. Its not a matter of trying to eliminate the challenge of navigation in this game. Its not meant to be looked at as a way of softening the brutality or "dumbing" down the gameplay either. What it is, is an attempt to remove the annoyance of locating friends. This by no means eliminates the aspect of navigation in-game, as you suggest. It simply removes the difficulty of locating friends to truly begin your journey.

While I agree navigation is an extremely important element of this mod (and game in general), and to lose it would be to ruin a large portion of the gameplay, I disagree with thinking that navigation should be an important part of locating your friends to simply begin an adventure. What is it about spending a good portion of your time locating friends in any way enjoyable?

From what I've read you believe since it is a challenge it should be there. Following your thought process, does this mean anything and everything that makes the game more challenging is something that should be added in? Simplicity in certain aspects of a game do not make the game itself simple nor boring. What it's meant for is to make the game more acceptable to more people, which moves me on to my next point...

And before you counter with what the players might want and answering the demands of the community - I don't believe the developers are obliged to do that. Design by committee isn't what got the game to where it is today, and where it is today is, objectively and measurably, hugely successful.

Design by committee isn't what got the game where it is today, but there's no way for you to say this isn't the way the game is going to progress. Why then do we have a suggestion board in the first place, if the developers don't care to hear what their community has to say.

Yet another post of yours I'm sorry to say I truly don't understand. I would agree that developers aren't obliged to do anything we say... but shouldn't that be obvious? This isn't a demands board, this is a suggestions board. As the name suggests we are here to ask, not demand from the developers. Any of these suggestions could be turned down by the developers without a second glance, but the point is they actually want to know what the community is looking for, to make a game that caters to them.

I was illustrating the absurdity of removing something which is an integral part of the gameplay' date=' or dumbing it down, or making it automatic.

[/quote']

I see what you were trying to say, don't get me wrong here. I just disliked the comparison, and truly didn't believe either related to each other. Having an AI that does the fighting for you is not the same as a buddy system in which you can spawn on a friend within the first few minutes of you both joining the server.

Anyways, I'm heading off to bed for the night. Be glad to continue this debate with you tomorrow.

[harryzhe 28]

Its not meant to be looked at as a way of softening the brutality or "dumbing" down the gameplay either.

It simply removes the difficulty of locating friends to truly begin your journey.

Wat?

It's not to be LOOKED at as softening the brutality or dumbing it down' date=' but it is in fact removing a difficulty. Alright then.

Why can't locating your friends be part of the journey? Besides, once you do it once, you can log out in the same spot and "buddy spawn" as a reward for having found eachother and stuck together.

I disagree with thinking that navigation should be an important part of locating your friends to simply begin an adventure.

You keep artificially separating "adventure" and "finding your friends" - Can you explain the distinguishing point?

From what I've read you believe since it is a challenge it should be there. Following your thought process' date=' does this mean anything and everything that makes the game more challenging is something that should be added in?[/quote']

Oh ok, we're playing strawman now. I'll humour you - It shouldn't be removed because it's not abstract, and it feels authentic to be separated from friends and having to find them being part of the challenge. It is after all, massively rewarding.

What is it about spending a good portion of your time locating friends in any way enjoyable?

And now it's my turn to strawman you. What's enjoyable about dying to bandits? Friendly fire should be off on all servers. What's enjoyable about losing all your loot when you die? We should preserve loot.

What it's meant for is to make the game more acceptable to more people' date=' which moves me on to my next point...[/quote']

It's currently acceptable to more PC gamers than max payne 3, skyrim, and cod MW3, according to steam...

Yet another post of yours I'm sorry to say I truly don't understand. I would agree that developers aren't obliged to do anything we say... but shouldn't that be obvious? This isn't a demands board' date=' this is a suggestions board. As the name suggests we are here to ask, not demand from the developers. Any of these suggestions could be turned down by the developers without a second glance, but the point is they actually want to know what the community is looking for, to make a game that caters to them. [/quote']

Well that's a true statement if you isolate it. I'm specifically addressing the attitude that it would be positive to change something to make the game more enjoyable to a wider range of players. Even ignoring the fact that it's already immensely enjoyable to hordes and hordes of players, i just dont see the demand to make it any more mainstream or include any more FPS tropes. The lack of these kinds of features is what makes it stand out amongst other games. And besides, it's not like the game needs to sell. It has plenty of regular players. More players would actually be a burden and demand for new servers would just continue to rise into oblivion. I'm not saying in absolute terms that new players should fuck off, just that there's no real demand for them, and thus no real motivation to make the game have broader appeal to the general FPS audience.

[James (DayZ) 1]

It’s not meant to be looked at as a way of softening the brutality or "dumbing" down the gameplay either... It simply removes the difficulty of locating friends to truly begin your journey.

It's not to be LOOKED at as softening the brutality or dumbing it down' date=' but it is in fact removing a difficulty. Alright then. Why can't locating your friends be part of the journey? Besides, once you do it once, you can log out in the same spot and "buddy spawn" as a reward for having found each other and stuck together.

[/quote']

I by no means believe that locating your friends should not be part of your journey. If that’s what you happen to enjoy, just as I’m sure many others do, then go on right ahead. This isn’t a discussion of what is better than the other. What we are talking about here is changing one aspect of the game to allow those that don’t consider the added challenge of locating your friend to be fun or complimentary to what the game is to them personally.

Please take a look at it this way. When you’re playing a game that has an average life expectancy of anywhere from 3 hours to as little as half an hour, you must expect that some people will be annoyed by the fact that they’re probably going to have to be trying to find their friend all over again every hour or so. Can’t you see that to at least a few (if not many) people this becomes much more tedious than enjoyable. There are times when I play Day-Z by myself. When it comes to times like this, I really couldn’t care less about where I spawn. Now, when I am playing with a friend, I generally want to be with said friend. To have to at least spend half an hour attempting to find him, knowing that if I die I’ll have to find him all over again, feels like a waste of time and can be quite the downer.

I notice that you say an alternative to the system that has been suggested is to find each other, followed by spawning together at a later date… Isn’t it obvious enough that this is what people already do? What is being suggested here is a system to simplify finding a friend, not to simplify adventuring with him/her. It’s great to consider finding each other after a long search a reward (though possibly better described as a relief), and I generally do find it as such; But, it shouldn’t have to be something I need to experience over and over again. This both drains from the reward factor due to the repetitiveness of the action and begins to create an annoyed environment for those playing.

I disagree with thinking that navigation should be an important part of locating your friends to simply begin an adventure.

You keep artificially separating "adventure" and "finding your friends" - Can you explain the distinguishing point?

Of course I can distinguish the difference between adventuring and finding my friends. Once again' date=' what I see from you is a generalisation of the specific point I’ve been trying to make. I am not necessarily saying that finding my friends can’t be an adventure. I’ve tried to say multiple times that I don’t think this is always the case. I am simply saying the sheer repetitiveness can reach the point of being completely ridiculous, turning into both an annoying and boring action. What is so much fun about having to locate your friend every hour or so (not just once, but over and over again) just because death equals a random spawn? I’m sure to veterans of ARMA who have memorized the map it may not be a problem to have to find your friends, but to both newer and average players, it can turn into something more than bothersome.

From what I've read you believe since it is a challenge it should be there. Following your thought process, does this mean anything and everything that makes the game more challenging is something that should be added in?

Oh ok' date=' we're playing strawman now. I'll humour you - It shouldn't be removed because it's not abstract, and it feels authentic to be separated from friends and having to find them being part of the challenge. It is after all, massively rewarding.

[/quote']

What is it about spending a good portion of your time locating friends in any way enjoyable?

And now it's my turn to strawman you. What's enjoyable about dying to bandits? Friendly fire should be off on all servers. What's enjoyable about losing all your loot when you die? We should preserve loot.

Strawman? Not to be rude' date=' but all I’ve seen you do throughout this reply is nitpick certain things I’ve said to make it sound as if the whole point I’m attempting to drive across is wrong. When I reply to you I attempt to reply to your entire message, rather than pick out disagreeable sentences throughout.

I think I may repeat myself again; I agree with you, in a specific way. I do find it both authentic and rewarding to have to find your friend, and do see it as quite the challenge. But the fact of the matter is that it can be irritating to have to do it over and over again, specifically within the same gaming session. I don’t like to think that when I go to play a game explicitly with a friend that I will be spending at least 10% of that time trying to find him/her. Do you not find that annoying in the least, or do you not play Day-Z with others to often? (Note: This isn’t meant to insult; I mean it as a legitimate question)

What it's meant for is to make the game more acceptable to more people, which moves me on to my next point...

It's currently acceptable to more PC gamers than max payne 3' date=' skyrim, and cod MW3, according to steam...

[/quote']

That has nothing to do with what we are talking about. This is a suggestion to make the game better, obviously. I’m not attempting to say its horribly flawed as it is right now and this idea would be the be all end all in suggestions to make the game better. I don’t understand what that statistic has to do with what we are talking about, other than you trying to point out that the game is popular right now due to Day-Z. Believe me, I know.

Yet another post of yours I'm sorry to say I truly don't understand. I would agree that developers aren't obliged to do anything we say... but shouldn't that be obvious? This isn't a demands board' date=' this is a suggestions board. As the name suggests we are here to ask, not demand from the developers. Any of these suggestions could be turned down by the developers without a second glance, but the point is they actually want to know what the community is looking for, to make a game that caters to them.

[/quote']

Well that's a true statement if you isolate it. I'm specifically addressing the attitude that it would be positive to change something to make the game more enjoyable to a wider range of players. Even ignoring the fact that it's already immensely enjoyable to hordes and hordes of players' date=' i just don’t see the demand to make it any more mainstream or include any more FPS tropes. The lack of these kinds of features is what makes it stand out amongst other games.

[/quote']

I believe I understand what you are saying here, and I have to say I completely disagree. Correct me if I’m wrong: What you are saying is that because spawning on friends is a feature of an FPS (I assume you are referring to Battlefield) it is an element that should not be included in an open-world survival game, for fear of attracting FPS players or turning the game into an FPS. So you believe a slightly changed spawning system specifically noted in one game is going to turn Day-Z into a mindless shooter?

Also, it’s not like a friend based spawning system is only a feature of FPS’s. You also see variants of this in MMO’s, tactical shooters and certain multiplayer roleplaying games. Of course, from what I see the debate here shouldn’t be what kind of players this will attract, as I think I’ve made it clear a single feature can’t turn a game into something completely different when implemented properly. What I’ve been trying to talk with you about this entire time is whether this feature is right for this game in particular. You are of the opinion it is not, but I have yet to see more than a few legitimate reasons as to why. Not to mention that all of your reasons are based on this feature not being implemented properly.

And besides' date=' it's not like the game needs to sell. It has plenty of regular players. More players would actually be a burden and demand for new servers would just continue to rise into oblivion. I'm not saying in absolute terms that new players should fuck off, just that there's no real demand for them, and thus no real motivation to make the game have broader appeal to the general FPS audience.

[/quote']

What’s the problem with having more and more players get into a game? So you’re saying we should hide this mod away from new players so we can enjoy it for ourselves? I think it is by no means a bad thing for a mod to have a growing community alongside it. This is how mods turn into fully supported expansions. I don’t think any mod or game has ever attempted to LOWER the amount of people in its community; to make people lose interest.

Again, I’m not trying to sit here and argue with you. I’m simply trying to make a point and show my support for this idea, while at the same time bringing new ideas to the table. I Hope that you won’t take this personally and realize that I’m just expressing my opinion.

[mike10019314@yahoo.ca 3]

what if it spawned you within 1 or 2 km of your friend? and only if he is not in combat or close to hostile players"bandit's"

[hrlambing@gmail.com 4]

I agree with Harry on most points, especially how finding your friends is part of the journey. That's why this game is so fun: every player's life is valuable, and it took them time to get where they are. It wouldn't be as satisfying to kill a bandit you know just spawned next to his friend, or a survivor if that's your thing. A spawning system would devalue player lives and, in my opinion, make the game less fun.

[Alex (DayZ) 8]

Please understand, you may not find it a fun experience trying to find your friends but thats part of the experience and part of the desperation. If your having a hard time living past 20minutes then your surviving wrong, stay away from cities, ghost roads instead of following them, head immediately into the North - the true wilderness of Chernarus. A mechanic that allows you to simply teleport to a friend would destroy the very nature of this mod.

[KaiHong 1]

It's the journey of finding your lost friends that makes the experience of DayZ more enjoyable.

It's like the reward of trekking across countless zombie infested cities.

It's part of the experience of DayZ. I kinda like the idea, though xD Mainly because it makes things easy.

Still, I do not support this idea.

edit: Read a lot of similar responses xD

But yes, it will be annoying, but that is the 'harsh reality'

Kotaku even had an article on the difficulty of old games and how recent games were spoon feeding players the answers.

Games on the NES like LoZ which had you start without any idea, made the exploration and everything you came across really rewarding.

[zackb101 0]

what if it spawned you within 1 or 2 km of your friend? and only if he is not in combat or close to hostile players"bandit's"

That seems like a nice compromise. I like the idea.

[harryzhe 28]

I by no means believe that locating your friends should not be part of your journey. If that’s what you happen to enjoy' date=' just as I’m sure many others do, then go on right ahead. This isn’t a discussion of what is better than the other. What we are talking about here is changing one aspect of the game to allow those that don’t consider the added challenge of locating your friend to be fun or complimentary to what the game is to them personally.

Please take a look at it this way. When you’re playing a game that has an average life expectancy of anywhere from 3 hours to as little as half an hour, you must expect that some people will be annoyed by the fact that they’re probably going to have to be trying to find their friend all over again every hour or so. Can’t you see that to at least a few (if not many) people this becomes much more tedious than enjoyable. There are times when I play Day-Z by myself. When it comes to times like this, I really couldn’t care less about where I spawn. Now, when I am playing with a friend, I generally want to be [b']with said friend. To have to at least spend half an hour attempting to find him, knowing that if I die I’ll have to find him all over again, feels like a waste of time and can be quite the downer.

Since i've located my main partner in the game, I've not died once. It sounds like you just need to be more careful if you've actually died WITH A FRIEND this many times. If people just stopped playing it like it was an action game things would be pretty much ok. There's no reason you should be being forced to repeat this process anywhere near as many times as you suggest if you're actually careful and observant.

Strawman? Not to be rude' date=' but all I’ve seen you do throughout this reply is nitpick certain things I’ve said to make it sound as if the whole point I’m attempting to drive across is wrong. When I reply to you I attempt to reply to your entire message, rather than pick out disagreeable sentences throughout. [/quote']

I'm trying to avoid a wall-of-text, and i generally don't respond to something if there's no need to say anything about it. Unless i strongly agree or disagree, why should i extend the length of our posts out to infinity for it? The point of debates is that they're public. It's unlikely you or I will change our opinion but those reading can see our viewpoints articulated and challenged, assisting them in forming their own viewpoint.

I also generally edit out paragraphs where you repeat yourself or dont provide any new information. If there's something specific I've missed, feel free to point it out. It's what I would do.

I think I may repeat myself again; I agree with you' date=' in a specific way. I do find it both authentic and rewarding to have to find your friend, and do see it as quite the challenge. But the fact of the matter is that it can be irritating to have to do it over and over again, specifically within the same gaming session. I don’t like to think that when I go to play a game explicitly with a friend that I will be spending at least 10% of that time trying to find him/her. Do you not find that annoying in the least, or do you not play Day-Z with others to often? (Note: This isn’t meant to insult; I mean it as a legitimate question)[/quote']

I exclusively play the game with friends. It helps ensure survival. In your case it appears to have the opposite effect. You're just repeating and repeating that you apparently die all the time in the game. I just can't understand why, if you even take the slightest amount of care.

That has nothing to do with what we are talking about. This is a suggestion to make the game better' date=' obviously. [/quote']

For who? Apparently for the people dying every half an hour. What about rewarding the players who are careful and excellent at surviving?

Should the game be made most rewarding for the people who are the most careless? Should we add auto aim too?

I’m not attempting to say its horribly flawed as it is right now and this idea would be the be all end all in suggestions to make the game better. I don’t understand what that statistic has to do with what we are talking about' date=' other than you trying to point out that the game is popular right now due to Day-Z. Believe me, I know.[/quote']

I'm pretty astonished by this. You were the one who brought up the "need" for the game to appeal to as wide an audience as possible. I responded by questioning just how wide of an audience it needs to appeal to? It's already as popular as it is. Most servers are constantly full. It doesn't rely on sales to support itself... It's in fact "donating" it's sales to bohemia, or "diverting" them i guess... So my question is "why does it need to appeal to a wider audience than the audience to which it is already appealing."

I believe I understand what you are saying here' date=' and I have to say I completely disagree. Correct me if I’m wrong: What you are saying is that because spawning on friends is a feature of an FPS (I assume you are referring to Battlefield) it is an element that should not be included in an open-world survival game, for fear of attracting FPS players or turning the game into an FPS. So you believe a slightly changed spawning system specifically noted in one game is going to turn Day-Z into a mindless shooter? [/quote']

No, im suggesting it's only even being asked for because it's a luxury taken for granted in your average shooter. People have had something like 2 months worth of dayz playtime at the absolute most, maybe give them time to figure the game out before we start demanding it adopts tropes from things we're more used to.

Also' date=' it’s not like a friend based spawning system is only a feature of FPS’s. You also see variants of this in MMO’s, tactical shooters and certain multiplayer roleplaying games. Of course, from what I see the debate here shouldn’t be what kind of players this will attract, as I think I’ve made it clear a single feature can’t turn a game into something completely different when implemented properly. What I’ve been trying to talk with you about this entire time is whether this feature is right for this game in particular. You are of the opinion it is not, but I have yet to see more than a few legitimate reasons as to why. Not to mention that all of your reasons are based on this feature [b']not being implemented properly.

There is no implementing it properly. The game currently rewards people for being careful and knowing how to navigate by landmarks. It's a huge part of the gameplay and to just grant it to everyone by default without having to learn any new skills would be screwing over all the people who have gotten good at it and enjoy doing it.

I actually *like* that there's a skill curve, and i *like* that most the skills are real life, cognitive ones, and not some abstract rote-learned thing.

If some player both finds it difficult and tedious to locate someone within a few KM of themselves on a map, and finds it difficult to stay alive once they do find that person, they must be very new to the game or very careless. The atmosphere would be partially destroyed if every player was automatically granted the luxury of teammates to protect them. I knew guys who'd been up north with plenty of supplies already when i just started playing. Imagine if i could just teleport to them? Imagine if i could just start the game with decent guns and food supplies, without having to do anything at all? There'd be no reward for the people who know how to use the environment to their advantage.

What’s the problem with having more and more players get into a game? So you’re saying we should hide this mod away from new players so we can enjoy it for ourselves?

This is idiotic hyperbole. The mod couldnt be hidden if it tried. My point is there's no reason to bend over backwards to attract new people. The community IS growing at a massive rate' date=' I believe the word used was "exploding" - Theres absolutely no reason to fundamentally nerf parts of the game to attract more. The servers can barely keep up as it is.

I think it is by no means a bad thing for a mod to have a growing community alongside it. This is how mods turn into fully supported expansions. I don’t think any mod or game has ever attempted to LOWER the amount of people in its community; to make people lose interest.

...Except it's ALREADY going to be an official part of arma2, and it ALREADY has an enormous and growing community supporting it. Your point would make perfect sense if hardly anyone was playing... But it's not, so your point is ridiculous.

Again' date=' I’m not trying to sit here and argue with you. I’m simply trying to make a point and show my support for this idea, while at the same time bringing new ideas to the table. I Hope that you won’t take this personally and realize that I’m just expressing my opinion.[/quote']

I will never, ever take this kind of debate as something personal. Neither of us know anything about eachother beyond our first names, It's un-nerving that this even has to be said on this forum. But hey, i guess it is still the internet, and most people on the internet dont seem to be able to take rational debates well. Appreciate the gesture either way.

[robertstuartmarshall 1]

The only way I think this should be handled is with a rare loot of a set of walkie talkies and also batteries so that they can run out after much usage.

Say you find 3 walkie talkies, you give 2 out to friends and then set them to have a max range that is not the whole map. A new chat channel would need creating for this and maybe some signal indicator on the devices themselves to say how many of the receivers are in range.

The only part of this I have no idea how to implement is what happens if one of you dies and tehn the receiver gets looted or just despawns. Seems a bit fiddly, but I would like walkie talkies.

[rossmum 7]

I would absolutely hate to see the guy I just spent the better part of fifteen minutes stalking respawn on his hitherto clueless friend and then come after me. This would make ambushing and besting larger parties, or even simple hit-and-run raids, absolutely impossible. It would also see everyone with a friend already in the game suddenly appearing with tricked out weapons in massive numbers in places they ought not to be.

If you die, you start over. No picking and choosing which bits are reset and which aren't. Being able to respawn on, or fast-travel to friends would absolutely ruin the mod's gameplay. Even once is too many times, this should never, ever be a thing.

[harryzhe 28]

hm, just had an idea.

If BOTH characters were <20 minutes old maybe itd be ok. This would simulate, i guess, people just being in the same spot post-"apocalypse." I just dont like the idea of every place on the map having chernogorsk status.

However, itd disable these people (who are apparently new enough to die every half hour or so) from just teleporting up north, taking good gear or cars, and dying in the middle of a giant horde with it.

You'd probably have to have a dialogue saying "xyz wants to start with you. Allow?" or people could just farm makarov ammo with it in the early game.

But to be honest, the complaint being made here is "every time i find my friends i die and have to start all over again"

It doesn't sound like having a friend is really helping you.

[Jugg 33]

The only spawn system I'd be ok with is a 2-5 minute window when you initially spawn as a fresh survivor. Your friends may spawn on you, but only as a fresh survivor themselves. Essentially you are starting your adventure all over again.. just together.

If you want to keep all of your gear, then you must use it to find them the good old fashioned way.

[Dullard 6]

The way you solve this problem is by only allowing spawning on a friend to occur in the newbie zones.

"Player2 wants you to spawn at his location. Do you accept?"

Click "Accept" or "Yes" and you spawn at a typical in-game starting point.

Do NOT allow players to spawn anywhere else but where we normally spawn. It's like starting the journey all over again but without the 30 minute run to try to meet back up.