Multi-function Stance Key

[SFRGaming 718]

Maybe you get this special button, but i thinks more of gamble when situation develops out of control.

That holding down button will likely delay your prone by second at least, enough to get you killed

and if you release it too early you might end up standing out of cover.

 

 

There is nothing wrong with current stance buttons, if anything the arma 3 stance bind would be better then this suggestion.

Ctrl + W = one stance up & Ctrl + S = one stance down, but it still needs the regular buttons to quickly prone. If there is 

"stance up/down"  key in the options then you can already do it.

 

 

 

 

 

They are military stances, the whole body positioning, walking, running and aiming are part of military conditioning.

It may seem like regular stances, but there is knowledge that goes in those positionings to improve performance.

Unless you have actually being in military service i would advice you to shush. I for one have never seen

any regular civilians doing these stances anywhere, not even in paintball or airsoft.

 

 

 

Im guessing you don't even know how to position yourselves while proning on the ground, so you can breath well.

A regular person can position his/her body however the fuck they want to so they can get eyes on the target without making themselves obvious. Can you Prone? Obviously. Can you crouch? Don't understand why not. Can you at least stand??? If you can't then good luck in life. WIth all that, do you think you could variate between the 3 main stances? It's not like IRL i'm standing, and when I try to do something at the halfway between standing and crouching, some red text appears magically in front of me saying I can't access this movement cause I haven't had any military training.  This is exactly how you make it out to be.

 

And for the record, I haven't had any TRUE military training as of right now. But I can tell you that in the Paintball team that I run, I (as well as every other recruit on the team) use multiple stances such as the ones in ARMA 3.

Edited February 24, 2014 by Shadow134

[JuX 72]

A regular person can position his/her body however the fuck they want to so they can get eyes on the target without making themselves obvious. Can you Prone? Obviously. Can you crouch? Don't understand why not. Can you at least stand??? If you can't then good luck in life. WIth all that, do you think you could variate between the 3 main stances? It's not like IRL i'm standing, and when I try to do something at the halfway between standing and crouching, some red text appears magically in front of me saying I can't access this movement cause I haven't had any military training.  This is exactly how you make it out to be.

 

And for the record, I haven't had any TRUE military training as of right now. But I can tell you that in the Paintball team that I run, I (as well as every other recruit on the team) use multiple stances such as the ones in ARMA 3.

 

*facepalm*

 

You obviously do not know the workings behind the stances.

[KarmaCoin 72]

Maybe you get this special button, but i thinks more of gamble when situation develops out of control.

That holding down button will likely delay your prone by second at least, enough to get you killed

and if you release it too early you might end up standing out of cover.

 

I mentioned in the OP that they should not remove the current buttons when adding a multi-function key. So people who prefer the advantage of slightly faster prone over less key bindings will still be able to have a single button prone.

 

Also the multi-function key I described in the OP is pretty common now in FPS games and doesn't have the release issue you are talking about. Releasing does not cause standing, you must release and press the key again to crouch, and then again to stand.

 

Also, It is typically implemented with a 100-200 ms hold so it really doesn't add a substantial amount of time to going prone anyways. I probably lose at least 100 ms by having it bound to a harder to reach key than c in the current setup. Z is a tough reach for me sometimes.

[SFRGaming 718]

*facepalm*

 

You obviously do not know the workings behind the stances.

How so? It's a stance. It's something anyone can do just by adapting to something such as a barrier. Not all barriers IRL are going to be, for example, 2.5 feet tall. Someone telling me that I can't do a certain stance because I have no training is bullshit. It's all a process of learning. And the workings behind the stances is as simple as making it modular so you can use various barriers to take cover from and still utilize as a firing position.

[jfn3000 10]

I mentioned in the OP that they should not remove the current buttons when adding a multi-function key. So people who prefer the advantage of slightly faster prone over less key bindings will still be able to have a single button prone.

 

Also the multi-function key I described in the OP is pretty common now in FPS games and doesn't have the release issue you are talking about. Releasing does not cause standing, you must release and press the key again to crouch, and then again to stand.

 

Also, It is typically implemented with a 100-200 ms hold so it really doesn't add a substantial amount of time to going prone anyways. I probably lose at least 100 ms by having it bound to a harder to reach key than c in the current setup. Z is a tough reach for me sometimes.

 I agree that 'z' is a toughie.  100-200 ms isn't too bad sounds, so I could see it be implemented well.  But you have to remember server lag/desync, and the desire to really do two things in the 200 ms, may make it not as smooth a move as it sounds.  I'm fine dying to my own stupidity, but when game mechanics get me hung up and killed I get all pissy.  If I can automatically step up a foot tall step to climb a staircase, then why the fuck do I get stuck trying to walk over 6 inch tall rocks?

[jfn3000 10]

How so? It's a stance. It's something anyone can do just by adapting to something such as a barrier. Not all barriers IRL are going to be, for example, 2.5 feet tall. Someone telling me that I can't do a certain stance because I have no training is bullshit. It's all a process of learning. And the workings behind the stances is as simple as making it modular so you can use various barriers to take cover from and still utilize as a firing position.

 

Aiming intelligently over varied height obstacles is pretty natural and doesn't require much special training.  But if you get into the nitty gritty of it, there is a lot of extra sauce the military puts into it.  They put a lot of work into finding out the subtle ways to position your body so that your weapon is supported by your skeletal structure in all those stances instead of muscles.  Bones don't get tired and shake.  Turning your body into a random height steady tripod does take a fair bit of training.  Staying rock solid after half an hour at the ready sure as hell takes training, but getting off a couple good shoots from a half-crouch is certainly doable with a little practice.  I'm calling it a tie.

[xRann 126]

How so? It's a stance. It's something anyone can do just by adapting to something such as a barrier. Not all barriers IRL are going to be, for example, 2.5 feet tall. Someone telling me that I can't do a certain stance because I have no training is bullshit. It's all a process of learning. And the workings behind the stances is as simple as making it modular so you can use various barriers to take cover from and still utilize as a firing position.

 

Aiming intelligently over varied height obstacles is pretty natural and doesn't require much special training.  But if you get into the nitty gritty of it, there is a lot of extra sauce the military puts into it.  They put a lot of work into finding out the subtle ways to position your body so that your weapon is supported by your skeletal structure in all those stances instead of muscles.  Bones don't get tired and shake.  Turning your body into a random height steady tripod does take a fair bit of training.  Staying rock solid after half an hour at the ready sure as hell takes training, but getting off a couple good shoots from a half-crouch is certainly doable with a little practice.  I'm calling it a tie.

Civilian would have their elbows untucked...would half-face and show their side, unlike plate toward the threat...would rest their elbow ontop of their knee...all the things you unlearn to do in bct during brm/arm, they would do 9/10 times or more.

 

Doing things that appear to "look like" actual fighting stances and doing the stances correctly with intent and purpose are about eight kinds of different. This isn't about simply looking above or around obstacles but physically placing your body in a form and functional state to maximize your front (offensively and defensively) toward the enemy.

[KarmaCoin 72]

100-200 ms isn't too bad sounds, so I could see it be implemented well.

 

It already is implemented well, tons of FPS games already use the exact key that I'm describing.

 

But you have to remember server lag/desync, and the desire to really do two things in the 200 ms, may make it not as smooth a move as it sounds.

 

lag and desync effect the current key setup as well and thus do not change the difference in time between the two configurations. And again, this isn't some new idea, pretty much every FPS I've played in the last 10 years that allowed you to go prone used this type of button. Perhaps I'm doing a poor job of explaining it? I'm sure you have played a game with this type of button.

[Mos1ey 6301]

First off, we do need the multi-function stance change key. Press (key) crouch, Hold (key) go prone or prone

 

I also do like the idea of more stances. I'm not sure how they implemented it in ArmA3, but It seems pretty legit

 

The multi-function key is such a dumbed down way of doing things. It's designed for the limited number of inputs on a console controller.

 

You're much better off just having to press a designated prone key, rather than hold one for a second or so before it registers and then you go prone.

[KarmaCoin 72]

The multi-function key is such a dumbed down way of doing things. It's designed for the limited number of inputs on a console controller.

 

It's true that this idea originated from consoles having less input, but I don't think it is a dumb idea. It simplifies the key mappings from 3 keys to 1 at the cost of one fifth of a second when going prone. With a single key for the three stances, the z and x keys are available for other uses like range up/down

 

You're much better off just having to press a designated prone key, rather than hold one for a second or so before it registers and then you go prone.

 

That's your opinion. I understand that pressing one key is faster than holding one for 200ms. I think the difference is negligible though and the issue I more often run into is hitting the wrong key.

 

With three keys I often end up crouching when I want to go prone or hitting stand when I'm already standing but want to go to crouch. 1 Key is super simple and by far my preference. Especially since it opens up z and x to be bound to something else useful like range up and range down.

 

Additionally there is no reason to remove the current keys when adding a new multi-funciton binding. That way people who prefer 3 separate keys can have 3 separate keys and people like me who prefer 1 key can have one key.

Edited March 3, 2014 by KarmaCoin

[Mos1ey 6301]

It's true that this idea originated from consoles having less input, but I don't think it is a dumb idea. It simplifies the key mappings from 3 keys to 1 at the cost of one fifth of a second when going prone. With a single key for the three stances, the z and x keys are available for other uses like range up/down

 

 

That's your opinion. I understand that pressing one key is faster than holding one for 200ms. I think the difference is negligible though and the issue I more often run into is hitting the wrong key.

 

With three keys I often end up crouching when I want to go prone or hitting stand when I'm already standing but want to go to crouch. 1 Key is super simple and by far my preference. Especially since it opens up z and x to be bound to something else useful like range up and range down.

 

Additionally there is no reason to remove the current keys when adding a new multi-funciton binding. That way people who prefer 3 separate keys can have 3 separate keys and people like me who prefer 1 key can have one key.

 

I wasn't calling your idea dumb, I meant it was dumbed down as in simplified too far. IMO it's one of those things that might be helpful right now, but if you took the time to get used to using Z, X and C you would actually be better off in the long run. :)

[KarmaCoin 72]

if you took the time to get used to using Z, X and C you would actually be better off in the long run. :)

 

It's less a matter of "getting used to" and more a matter of z is tough to hit for some because you have to bend the ring finger down. I've been playing PC games for nearly 30 years, I'm used to using z, x and c but because of genetics some people's ring fingers do not move independently of their other fingers. The other easy access keys are all bound to useful things so simplifying the stance bindings with a multi-function key allows us to easily use all three stances and opens up two keys for other functions in what is becoming a crowded keyboard setup.

 

You could even use a double tap instead of a hold for the multi-function key. People don't seem to mind the double tap w to sprint. I think it'd be bad design to have a separate key to sprint forward and a separate key to move forward even though if you "got used to it" you could in theory start sprinting a fraction of a second sooner.

 

I get that some people wouldn't use this key but I think a lot of us would. And lets be honest, it would take about 15 minutes to add.

Edited March 3, 2014 by KarmaCoin

[Lady Kyrah 1110]

Wow, that is a lot of stances. I'm not sure I need that many. I would like a single key to be able to switch between the 3 current ones though.

Exactly, we don't. it's nice for a military shooter like A3. But for DayZ? Would be a "nice to have" but hardly more than that.

[Railsplitter84 45]

I like the stance thing and would enjoy to vary my stance like holding 'C' and roll mousewheel up/down to adjust your stance

THIS... THIS... This is perfection!!!!!   Then when you release "C" you revert automatically to standing, or double tap to stay in pose/double tap to revert

Edited March 3, 2014 by Railsplitter84

[doublebrain 255]

Just so you know I made a topic for the multiple stances. Can be discussed here now.

[KarmaCoin 72]

Just so you know I made a topic for the multiple stances. Can be discussed here now.

 

Thank you

[fundan@gmx.de 82]

+1 for ARMA3 stances!