Adding risk to "Bandit" play style and other suggestions.

[xb4da55x@gmail.com 1]

Many people complaining about Bandits, KOS, and basically not fair game play. (I'm not talking about server hoppers & ghosting, cause that's other story). I play this game as "friendly". It's far more challenging and I hadn't bought this game to run around the map, holding hands and singing "lullaby". This is survival game. You should expect bullet any time, any where. I want to feel the risk all the time. This is IMO one of the most important aspect of this game. If some people want to make this one big co-op against zombies, sorry but it want happened. If you want to experience survival you need people on the other side.

I spawn somewhere around Solnichniy in "hardcore mode" on full server. I walked to Balota via Elektro and Cherno. In Elektro I had a chance to kill Bandit on the hill. I just had splitting axe. I was rolling in his direction, and when I was right behind him, server restart save his ass. In Cherno there was a gun fight that I had to avoid. In Bolota I was lucky and gear up my self with M4 and some other important items. And I can't imagine to experience all those feelings that I had on the way to Bolota, without Bandits or on empty server. What would be the point to play this game. So please stop complaining. Adopt or die trying!

I'm sure you will have more fun.

As much as I need other players to act like I can only imagine they would in the real apocalypse situation, there are few ideas/suggestions that IMO could improve game play on both sides.

Main idea is to force player to make decisions right at the beginning of his character life. And this will also force you to decide what will be your role in life of this character.

- Inventory.

Change ability to put bigger items in small pockets. You will still have total amount of slots in your clothes, but now you will have to reserve some slots for specific items, cause pistol with silencer won't fit in jeans pockets.
Make different speed for reaching the items from different part of your clothing. When you need to reload, it would be much faster if you reach for the clip from vest then from backpack.
Condition and type of the cloth should have impact on how save it is to put something there.
If you wear only damaged hoodie and backpack, and you decide to put your ammo to hoodie pocket for faster reload, you add risk of loosing that ammo when you move around. Basicly items size and cloths type and condition should determine how you arrange your inventory. This will also force you to take what you really need and leave other stuff that maybe other players will look for.

- Loot.

Like I said before, main idea is to force player to make decisions right from the start.
And the loot category could be the biggest factor on who you wanna be. Friendly or Bandit.
Friendly players risk much more then Bandits. They never know who they gonna face. But Bandits they just shoot, and they don't have this problem. I think that they should share some risk as well.
If you wanna play Bandit, fine by me, but it shouldn't be just about laying on the hill and snipe randoms. You should plan this, work for this and risk for this to.
Type of loot should have risk factor. Most of the stuff we can find now have general usefulness.
Food, water, bandage etc. this all is need it for both side. But if there was some items that could only benefit Bandits, it will ad some risk when you carry that specific item. If the group of Friendly players stop you, search and found that on you, they may kill you. Some of the most effective and deadly loot that could be use by Bandit could be only carry on your back, so you couldn't hide
you intentions. Scope glint should be ad, so they can't hide so easy. Maybe some birds could take off around them to reveal their position if they shoot from the forest.
Spawn for " Bandit items" should be only place away from "hot spots", so you need to carry it.
Basically your character type should search for specific loot. This could also open more category than Friendly and Bandit. All depends on loot category that developers will introduce. But this should work together with Inventory design. When you decide who you wanna play, you should focus on specific items, cause when you mix, you can't complete and you will run out of space.
Also loot category and inventory must be more strict. Player should be force to look for the food and water more often. Slots for those items should be reduced.
Amount of ammo should be reduced. It should be the most valuable item in the game. It could have huge impact on strategy and tactics when approach any situation. Every bullet will count.

- Servers.

When you play on full server this give you completely different game experience. You need to consider every move cause it could be your last. Full server give you that specific atmosphere. I cant say for every one , but I think it is  something what a lot of people looking for when they play video games. Therefore I think that information on amount of players should be removed.
It should only show empty slots like: Full, 1,2,3,4 and 5+. 5+ will tell you only that there is 5 empty slots or more. If you want to team up with others it will still show you right server. If you play in group bigger then 5 then you will have to just try. Also players list should be removed to, you should only  be able to see server name, to make sure you and your friends join the same one.
This will always force you to play like on full servers. This also may help reduce server hopping and ghosting. You will never know, around who you spawn.
Also would be nice if there will be random spawn radius. I don't know, 50 m?. So when you exit game, you will look for save place.

Sorry for my grammar, I'm sure I don't have to tell you that english is not my primary language.
But I hope you understand enough.

 

[jock360x360 (DayZ) 26]

Forcing players to do things destroys the point of a Sandbox....

 

Also, you are suggesting play styles... Wtf man, you made this post to tell people how you want them to play...?

 

Fuck this Shit

[kein (DayZ) 4]

mouarf.
In a survival you can't choose your destiny (bandit/hero,pacifist) at the beginning.
Maybe you will run out of food and kill with sadness...

[xb4da55x@gmail.com 1]

Forcing players to do things destroys the point of a Sandbox....

 

Also, you are suggesting play styles... Wtf man, you made this post to tell people how you want them to play...?

 

Fuck this Shit

 

This game is allready design to force you to do things. You need to eat, drink, just to name few.

And I don't want to tell any one how I want them to play.

That was totaly not my intention.

[xb4da55x@gmail.com 1]

mouarf.

In a survival you can't choose your destiny (bandit/hero,pacifist) at the beginning.

Maybe you will run out of food and kill with sadness...

This is a game. I'm sure your sadness will be ok.

[Korsbaek 1778]

So where's the risk you're talking about?

 

I only saw a suggestion about making people play on full servers.

[KerrSG1 113]

mouarf.

In a survival you can't choose your destiny (bandit/hero,pacifist) at the beginning.

Maybe you will run out of food and kill with sadness...

 

I have never not been able to find supplies.  This is just an excuse to start harassing other players.

[Sutinen 635]

It already has a risk. You definitely get to a firefight when you shoot and everyone else hears it.

[TedZ 424]

I don't want to be forced how to play, or have a story-line.

[ZedsDeadBaby 2287]

The myth that banditry is a "no risk" style of play was consistently debunked by the DayZ team during the mod. People were making this claim constantly - that because bandits shoot before they ask questions, they play on "easy mode" and don't take risks.

 

The DayZ team cited statistics showing exactly the opposite. Bandits had much lower average life expectancies and much higher death rates than more neutral or friendly players.

 

The reason seems pretty obvious; if you're constantly jumping into firefights you're going to take a bullet yourself sooner or later. It's a much more dangerous lifestyle than good friendly players who are quiet, observant and careful about who they approach and often get a chance to let agressive players pass by while they remain in cover unnoticed.

 

Now, of course, players who think being "good" means you just get to waltz up to every random stranger you meet in the game waving your hands around and "wiggling" your way to happiness might not feel this way, but that's because they're being idiots and idiots get shot roughly as often as bandits. 

Edited January 31, 2014 by ZedsDeadBaby

[minime1000 78]

KOS and banditry will never be fixed because of the very fact this is a game. No matter what you do, it will still remain a game with no real consequences.

 

Birds flying away when you make noise or get near is a really good idea and would add a lot to the immersion.

Scope glint too but only if it is done somewhat realistically (the sun's, scope's and the viewer's positions have to be right)

 

I myself am a bandit but I only shoot when far away. I rarely get near other players so the only thing that would hinder me are the birds and the scope glint. Rest won't stop me from KOSing.

Edited January 31, 2014 by myshl0ng

[Hethwill_Khan 233]

DayZ is all about the ride, not the destination.

 

Plus, beware staring into the bandit issue too much...as they say... the longer you star into the dark... 

 

 

More, you have some interesting mechanics suggestions but in the context you put them in they lose the wanted "suggestion spotlight". One example is the "delay" when taking something out of your backpack or simply your shirt chest pocket.

 

DayZ is all about the ride, not the destination. Stop wanting to label players.

[burkino_026@yahoo.com 14]

I like the idea of server limited information. Gives that element of mystery and anxiety, and will definetely increase the risk in server hopping, and ghosting, along with the timer, making them basically not worth it.

 

Afterall, you dont need to know who else is on the server. All you need to know, to play, is if there are enough free slots for you and your mates to join it.

 

Although, this might create another issue: unkowningly playing on an empty server when you actually want to be around people.

[crimsonbzd 247]

Many people complaining about Bandits, KOS, and basically not fair game play. (I'm not talking about server hoppers & ghosting, cause that's other story). I play this game as "friendly". It's far more challenging and I hadn't bought this game to run around the map, holding hands and singing "lullaby". This is survival game. You should expect bullet any time, any where. I want to feel the risk all the time. This is IMO one of the most important aspect of this game. If some people want to make this one big co-op against zombies, sorry but it want happened. If you want to experience survival you need people on the other side.

I spawn somewhere around Solnichniy in "hardcore mode" on full server. I walked to Balota via Elektro and Cherno. In Elektro I had a chance to kill Bandit on the hill. I just had splitting axe. I was rolling in his direction, and when I was right behind him, server restart save his ass. In Cherno there was a gun fight that I had to avoid. In Bolota I was lucky and gear up my self with M4 and some other important items. And I can't imagine to experience all those feelings that I had on the way to Bolota, without Bandits or on empty server. What would be the point to play this game. So please stop complaining. Adopt or die trying!

I'm sure you will have more fun.

As much as I need other players to act like I can only imagine they would in the real apocalypse situation, there are few ideas/suggestions that IMO could improve game play on both sides.

Main idea is to force player to make decisions right at the beginning of his character life. And this will also force you to decide what will be your role in life of this character.

- Inventory.

Change ability to put bigger items in small pockets. You will still have total amount of slots in your clothes, but now you will have to reserve some slots for specific items, cause pistol with silencer won't fit in jeans pockets.

Make different speed for reaching the items from different part of your clothing. When you need to reload, it would be much faster if you reach for the clip from vest then from backpack.

Condition and type of the cloth should have impact on how save it is to put something there.

If you wear only damaged hoodie and backpack, and you decide to put your ammo to hoodie pocket for faster reload, you add risk of loosing that ammo when you move around. Basicly items size and cloths type and condition should determine how you arrange your inventory. This will also force you to take what you really need and leave other stuff that maybe other players will look for.

- Loot.

Like I said before, main idea is to force player to make decisions right from the start.

And the loot category could be the biggest factor on who you wanna be. Friendly or Bandit.

Friendly players risk much more then Bandits. They never know who they gonna face. But Bandits they just shoot, and they don't have this problem. I think that they should share some risk as well.

If you wanna play Bandit, fine by me, but it shouldn't be just about laying on the hill and snipe randoms. You should plan this, work for this and risk for this to.

Type of loot should have risk factor. Most of the stuff we can find now have general usefulness.

Food, water, bandage etc. this all is need it for both side. But if there was some items that could only benefit Bandits, it will ad some risk when you carry that specific item. If the group of Friendly players stop you, search and found that on you, they may kill you. Some of the most effective and deadly loot that could be use by Bandit could be only carry on your back, so you couldn't hide

you intentions. Scope glint should be ad, so they can't hide so easy. Maybe some birds could take off around them to reveal their position if they shoot from the forest.

Spawn for " Bandit items" should be only place away from "hot spots", so you need to carry it.

Basically your character type should search for specific loot. This could also open more category than Friendly and Bandit. All depends on loot category that developers will introduce. But this should work together with Inventory design. When you decide who you wanna play, you should focus on specific items, cause when you mix, you can't complete and you will run out of space.

Also loot category and inventory must be more strict. Player should be force to look for the food and water more often. Slots for those items should be reduced.

Amount of ammo should be reduced. It should be the most valuable item in the game. It could have huge impact on strategy and tactics when approach any situation. Every bullet will count.

- Servers.

When you play on full server this give you completely different game experience. You need to consider every move cause it could be your last. Full server give you that specific atmosphere. I cant say for every one , but I think it is  something what a lot of people looking for when they play video games. Therefore I think that information on amount of players should be removed.

It should only show empty slots like: Full, 1,2,3,4 and 5+. 5+ will tell you only that there is 5 empty slots or more. If you want to team up with others it will still show you right server. If you play in group bigger then 5 then you will have to just try. Also players list should be removed to, you should only  be able to see server name, to make sure you and your friends join the same one.

This will always force you to play like on full servers. This also may help reduce server hopping and ghosting. You will never know, around who you spawn.

Also would be nice if there will be random spawn radius. I don't know, 50 m?. So when you exit game, you will look for save place.

Sorry for my grammar, I'm sure I don't have to tell you that english is not my primary language.

But I hope you understand enough.

 

 

You (and many others) seem to be forgetting that with a balanced in game loot economy and increased zombies and damage resulting to items from player damage in the future, there's going to be plenty of danger for any sort of bandit.

Consider this: You're a newspawn with a backpack and a few items, but no weapon to speak of yet. You run into two players, one of which draws a gun on you and orders you to freeze.

Right now, you're boned. Once all these things are implemented, first of all, they might need to rob you for a specific item you may have. Perhaps backpacks are really really bare at the time and they just want yours.

 

Now, with the zombie count increased, there's PLENTY of zombies outside.

Do you think they'll risk shooting you, drawing in zombies if you just bolt?

If they do, they might ruin your backpack in the process.

 

It's going to be a whole element to the game, more than just PvP, with the information we already have.

[Pandema 352]

There is already a risk.

 

Being shot to death.

[kein (DayZ) 4]

I have never not been able to find supplies.  This is just an excuse to start harassing other players.

 

I was just suggesting it could occurs in real life/survaving when speaking about simulation ;)

[xb4da55x@gmail.com 1]

Look's like I need to be more careful with the word " force". It seems to freak out some ppl.
I understand "Open world" type of games. But to think that you are totally free to do what you want and when you want is somehow naive. Let's take minimum activity you need to obtain to stay alive. You need to eat, drink and hide somewhere in a relatively safe place. Right now probably I would stay around 1 km north from NEAF. You have few buildings their, well pump and it's not so popular area like other parts of the map. So you should have no problem beating the boredom record there. But still even when you gonna take just minimum, you are still "force" to go back and forth for food and drinks. Now add need for weapon, clothing, interaction, curiosity… etc. and it create a lot of activity you "must" made to get what you want/need.  Yes, off course its up to you when and how you gonna do it, but basically this is it, what is up to you. Then again, it was not my intention to force any one how to play this game. I just wanted to suggest more consequences from decisions we may take. So when I said "Main idea is to force player to make decisions right at the beginning of his character life." I did not have in mind, that you have to/must make this decision but rather be aware that what you loot and when, may or may not have some consequences. It's already in the game. You want M4, you need to visit "hot places" and there could be some consequences. But I wanted to expand this to loot and Inventory system. You will still be free to decide when and how you gonna do it. Sorry that it was not so clear.

 

 

So where's the risk you're talking about?

 

 

Scope glint, birds flying away that reveal the shooter position. If we have loot that may help a player who like to KOS, but want to be so useful for more friendly players, then carry that object around can be risky. Those are just a very simple quick idea, any other are more than welcome.

 

It already has a risk. You definitely get to a firefight when you shoot and everyone else hears it.

 

Yes, of course, but there is a plenty of ppl that like to shoot unarmed players, from a hidden position. And I don't think they risk enough.

 

 

 

The myth that banditry is a "no risk" style of play was consistently debunked by the DayZ team during the mod. People were making this claim constantly - that because bandits shoot before they ask questions, they play on "easy mode" and don't take risks.

 

The DayZ team cited statistics showing exactly the opposite. Bandits had much lower average life expectancies and much higher death rates than more neutral or friendly players.

 

The reason seems pretty obvious; if you're constantly jumping into firefights you're going to take a bullet yourself sooner or later. It's a much more dangerous lifestyle than good friendly players who are quiet, observant and careful about who they approach and often get a chance to let agressive players pass by while they remain in cover unnoticed.

 

 

I agree, but only if you take Bandits who constantly looking for some action. But if you take for example this guy:

 

I myself am a bandit but I only shoot when far away. I rarely get near other players so the only thing that would hinder me are the birds and the scope glint. Rest won't stop me from KOSing.

and a Friendly player who is not so quick with the trigger , then I assume that Bandit will live longer.

 

 

Now, of course, players who think being "good" means you just get to waltz up to every random stranger you meet in the game waving your hands around and "wiggling" your way to happiness might not feel this way, but that's because they're being idiots and idiots get shot roughly as often as bandits. 

 

 

Someone said " you can't fix stupid", and I'm not even trying…

 

 

KOS and banditry will never be fixed because of the very fact this is a game. No matter what you do, it will still remain a game with no real consequences.

 

 

I don't want to fix it. Cause IMO it's important for this game. All I want it, is to be more challenging.

 

 

DayZ is all about the ride, not the destination.

 

Plus, beware staring into the bandit issue too much...as they say... the longer you star into the dark... 

 

 

More, you have some interesting mechanics suggestions but in the context you put them in they lose the wanted "suggestion spotlight". One example is the "delay" when taking something out of your backpack or simply your shirt chest pocket.

 

DayZ is all about the ride, not the destination. Stop wanting to label players.

 

As much as I don't want to label anyone. I don't think you can avoid this in this game.
How people play this game they divide themselves into more or less friendly type.
For some it may be ride, but for some it may be destination.
Take for example clan, where people will be assigned to specific task/role.

 

I like the idea of server limited information. Gives that element of mystery and anxiety, and will definetely increase the risk in server hopping, and ghosting, along with the timer, making them basically not worth it.

 

Afterall, you dont need to know who else is on the server. All you need to know, to play, is if there are enough free slots for you and your mates to join it.

 

Although, this might create another issue: unkowningly playing on an empty server when you actually want to be around people.

 

If you want to make sure you will play around other players you just go to servers with a number of empty slots: 1,2,3,4
I know I said up to 5+, but it has been just an example, it could be 10+ as well.

 

 

I only saw a suggestion about making people play on full servers.

 

It's not that I want others to play on full servers, it's that I like to play on the full servers, cause just this fact, IMO add extra atmosphere . And I said that I can't say it for everyone. But why would someone want to play on empty server? Because server hop & ghost, easy loot, new to the game. I don't see many more reasons.
Ghosting is obviously cheating. Server hopping for me is the same. Gear up quickly and easily when others have to put some effort into it. It's totally unfair. As well you can give people option to respond with the gear they chose.When you eliminate time effort for server hoppers, I don't see much different. It's just a cheap way to gear up. No! thank you. And as for new players, they can have separate servers where the character is not saved, and it's just for learning reason. But I think that not knowing who is on the server may help little to fight hopping and ghosting.

 

You (and many others) seem to be forgetting that with a balanced in game loot economy and increased zombies and damage resulting to items from player damage in the future, there's going to be plenty of danger for any sort of bandit.

Consider this: You're a newspawn with a backpack and a few items, but no weapon to speak of yet. You run into two players, one of which draws a gun on you and orders you to freeze.

Right now, you're boned. Once all these things are implemented, first of all, they might need to rob you for a specific item you may have. Perhaps backpacks are really really bare at the time and they just want yours.
 

Now, with the zombie count increased, there's PLENTY of zombies outside.

Do you think they'll risk shooting you, drawing in zombies if you just bolt?

If they do, they might ruin your backpack in the process.

 

It's going to be a whole element to the game, more than just PvP, with the information we already have.

 

I am aware of the current stage of development. And I'm sure that the final product will be different.
But I think that what is planed to be introduced to the game, and what will actually stay in full release , we may only be sure after it's is going to be tested and worked as it supposed to. Dev may come to some limitation that they may not be aware now. And some great concept, that was fine on paper, maybe will have to be rejected. I don't know.
You said "zombie", great, but how many?, where they will be located? Cities? more around nature? All around the map? Maybe it won't be possible to keep that many on the server? I don't really know.

But I know this is a Suggestions section of the forum, and I thought, I could drop some of my ideas. After all, it's here for a reason, right?

 

 

 

I think, that if you have to think about what you loot, where you put it, how often you have to look for it.
It's not such a bad idea. Of course in my opinion. I don't see a reason why you should be able to put any item anywhere you want as long as you have enough empty slots. We have hunger, thirst and other mechanics that try to imitate real world, so why not this? I think it could be more interesting.