Ammunition Change.

[Riemer 23]

Yes. Ammunition change, we have all seen the same taunting description, with M1014 shells, 870 shells, and winchester shells all being 12 gauge, yet we can't interchange them. I suggest that all those different shotgun shells either use different calibers or that all of the current shotgun ammunition be removed and replaced with a single, universal round that can be used in all shotguns. Simple idea, simple (I would think.) solution. Thoughts?

[Leechman 8]

Eh, someone brought this up before, and I'm not sure where I stand on this.

If it was to be done, then ammo would have to become a lot rarer to balance it out.

I do think having specific ammo for each weapon helps give the weapon (especially military weapons) rarity and value.

[beeman 1]

Also, the 1866 didn't fire shotgun shells. Just sayin'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_1866#Winchester_Model_1866

It fired essentially pistol rounds >_>

But I agree. If you've got two shotguns that both use twelve gauge rounds, make the ammo be universal. Maybe pick them up in stacks of five but you have to reload shells manually or something. I'm pretty sure that's how arma works normally. I guess I wouldn't know, I never use shotguns when I play normal arma >_>

Either way, the difference between an m1014 and an 870 should be largely personal preference. More controlled-fire and a tighter choke vs less accuracy but semi-automatic firing.

Edit 'cause leechman posted nanoseconds before me:

I think all ammo should be more rare than it currently is. Especially /good/ ammo like shotgun rounds. Slugs in particular. Buckshot can be common 'cause...well, hunters everywhere. Maybe reduce its damage per pellet a bit or something to balance it out.

[Leechman 8]

I think all ammo should be more rare than it currently is. Especially /good/ ammo like shotgun rounds. Slugs in particular. Buckshot can be common 'cause...well' date=' hunters everywhere. Maybe reduce its damage per pellet a bit or something to balance it out.

[/quote']

Oh definitely i think many things in this game need to become rarer. But if we were to share ammo across multiple weapons like was suggested, it would have to be taken even further. You're taking a better, rarer weapon and giving it the un-rare, common ammo of some other gun. The gun loses value and the risk associated with each shot fired drops because ammo is easily available.

Rare weapons need rare ammo to balance.

[beeman 1]

Maybe make the 870 and m1014 only obtainable through immensely rare drops in the scary military outposts.

Add a crappy shotgun for all to enjoy, maybe somethin' like the hunting shotgun in Stalker Clear Sky. Double-barrel shotgun. Still a shotgun but that reload time man. It hurts.

[Riemer 23]

New weapons probably won't be added in some time, so I am going to add some more to my suggestion.

As was stated, and I knew beforehand, the Winchester is not in fact a shotgun, and I think it should be delegated to some sort of pistol or rifle round of whatever caliber, or even removed in place of another slavic weapon that is relatively common, like the Mosin Nagant, as was suggested before, but that's another suggestion.

I agree that buckshot ammunition, as stated by Beeman, should be pretty common and easily locatable, like it is at the moment, and I also like the idea of making the M1014 and Remington 870 shotguns rarer, to balance it out, but add in a different sound, something loud and distinctive, to keep that risk that if a bandit hears that gunshot, they will know where you are and will more often than not want that shotgun.

I like the idea of the double barreled shotgun, to give limited use to the now-standard shotgun ammunition, and the availablility of the ammo and the increased rarity of better shotguns should keep balance.

[dut 21]

Why do people want to make shotguns rare? 12 gauge is the most common ammunition in farm areas (aside from .22lr) and remington 870's are cheap as hell and manufactured all over the world (under different brand names)

In a perfect world 12gauge would be made into a generic ammunition (with 8 shells taking up one space because 8 shells weigh about 350 grams) and single shot, double barreled and sawed-off shot guns would be added to the game.

[Riemer 23]

Why do people want to make shotguns rare? 12 gauge is the most common ammunition in farm areas (aside from .22lr) and remington 870's are cheap as hell and manufactured all over the world (under different brand names)

In a perfect world 12gauge would be made into a generic ammunition (with 8 shells taking up one space because 8 shells weigh about 350 grams) and single shot' date=' double barreled and sawed-off shot guns would be added to the game.

[/quote']

I said I wanted to make the 870 and the M1014 rarer, but keep the availability of the ammunition, because same reason, and possibly add in a crappy civillian hunting shotgun for the sake of realism and balance.

Not everybody in a poor post-soviet bloc country can afford a military variant Remington 870 with a tac light.

[beeman 1]

Word.

BUT, maybe the 870 could be slightly less frequent than, say, the sawn-off or double-barrel hunting shotgun...but still much more frequent than the M1014. On top of that, what about adding the AA12 as an extremely rare chance somewhere plagued by mean-spirited living corpses and junk?

I only suggest that because AA12 is in Operation Arrowhead...and I love it >_>

[Riemer 23]

Yeah that coupled with the common ammunition would make it the single most valuable gun in the game, but like I said in the OP, Rocket is probably not adding in more content anytime soon, but tweaking the ammunition, making it standardized, then messing with the spawning a bit to make all the shotguns except for the winchester rarer would be the best compromise I can come up with at 4 in the morning.

[Zombie Squirrel 5]

I think AA12 - especially with a drum of 30 HE shells - would be too unbalancing...Even in OA it's more like a rapid fire grenade launcher, if you are good with estimating your aim you can take out helicopters with it easily...

[Riemer 23]

Yeah, no AA12. Even a few well placed rifle shots to the tail rotor can send a heli spinning straight to hell though.

But yeah, no. This is not BF3. No USAS 12 + Frags.

[Stallownage 3]

I think magazines should be a refillable item of their own, like water bottles. they can be found empty or full, and refilled with the ammunition type they need. Basically a complete re working of the ammo system; if you find a box of 5.56 x 45 for example, then any magazine that holds that ammunition can be filled with it. And any weapon that can take that magazine can use it. Basically a realistic portrayal of weapons, magazines and ammunition. Simply make the weapons and magazines rare to find (the ammo as well, but to a lesser extent).

[Riemer 23]

I like this idea, with the actual rounds seperate from the magazines, but this will probably be hard to code in and thus we probably won't see it for a while.

Also, makes guns in general more difficult. inb4 drowning in bullets but no magazines in sight.

[beeman 1]

I'd only played BF3 for a couple hours. Every time I did, it made me turn around and play me some ACE mod >_>

I don't know how the mod handles it, but in typical ArmA, you can't down a helicopter with small-arms fire. Unless you kill the pilot...which is extremely hard to do. Well, for most people.

You technically can, but I've flown straight over hostile towns in Warefare, Domination and WarfareBE with dozens of soldiers firing at me. Only thing's been able to take me down was light armor or godly AI firing rockets at me >_>

But yeah, forgot AA12 uses explosive rounds in ArmA. Sad day.

[b00ce 5]

As I keep saying, make the 1866 use the 8 round 1014 magazines, scrap the 15 rounders and call it good.

This will cause an issue with class names and what not, but there is a simple fix for it. Make the 1866 magazines inherit from the 1014 mags, and allow the 1866 and 870 to accept them as well as the regular 1014 magazines. After that, replace the 1866 with the 1014 in the spawns.

(The 1014 still won't be able to accept the 1866 magazines and there would be no real way to tell which is which, but its better than nothing.)

This way you spawn in with 8 round magazines that work, eventually there won't be any 1866 magazines in circulation and you can remove them completely.

[Land Squid 22]

Thing is, the 1866 isn't a damned shot gun!

Remove the 1866 pellet ammo. Rename the 1866 slug ammo to ".44-40" and tone down it's damage to just a bit over .45ACP. Decrease accuracy of the 1866 weapon substantially and give it significant bullet drop back 200 meters.

Those are what is needed to bring that weapon back into aligntment with reality.

[bobda 11]

I really wish they'd just remove the winchester or tweak it somehow to make it hold less rounds. I mean, when you find it, it usually has 2 pouches of shells with it, holding 30 shells. Finding more is fairly easy. Compared to the enfield and cz you can hold 3 times the amount of ammo with the same space, which makes little sense when you compare the size of 5 rifle rounds to 15 12 gauge shells.

Switching it to a carbine would make sense. A lever action carbine would fire faster than the bolt actions, be much quieter, and hold more rounds. Adding a 20 gauge in it's place would also work. Then make the 12 gauge interchangeable between the 870 and the 1014, like the stanag and ak mags are interchangeable. Make the 12 gauge more powerful than the 20 would make the current higher end shotguns more valuable. Because right now the 870 and 1014 are pretty much useless.

Of course there's bigger fish to fry right now. But sometime in the future when more items are being added in I hope they address this issue.

[Zee (DayZ) 0]

I agree with making 12 gauge ammo universal, completely.

If it's not going to be universal, then, as others have suggested, make the firearms different calibers. There is a such a thing as a 10 gauge and 20 gauge shotguns.

I, totally, understand the need for a balance of rarity among the shotguns, however, I cannot curb my frustration when the pure fact is that 12 gauge ammo is 12 gauge ammo.

The same goes for .45ACP. Change the revolver to chamber .44 magnum, or some other, common, revolver caliber. If it were .45ACP, I'd be able to put it into my M1911.