tommes

DayZ is a FPS and has PvP in it by design. It is based on a game based around military action that is supposed to be played mostly in first person view. Whatever you think DayZ is, it's not. It's a sandbox. It's Rocket's sandbox. Not what you want it to be. You can't talk the FPS and the PvP out of DayZ. It's there by design and it's a core concept. Third person view is the side effect. Not the cause. Your argument is invalid and with that incredibly stupid...as most pro TPV arguments are in the long run because as much first person only arguments ar solely for fair and plausible PvP combat so are pro third person arguments solely of personal comfort.

That's the gravity I was talking about. That's what you get when you leave them choice. Is that the way it should be in a so called hardcore survival game? Survival usually means you don't have much choice and you have to deal with the fucking situation you are thrown in not you choose the situation which you can survive best.

Many want. Barely any does...because barely any does. Basically the only thing I really can agree on with the 3rd person lovers is that the 1st person only advocates should be more consequent in the choice of their servers...but right now that is really difficult to actually do with virtually no 1st person only servers around.

Tell me that DayZ is not a PvP FPS! Please do.

It's not about hard or easy. There's only one real point: 3rd person makes PvP combat weird. It breaks common sense and creates combat behaviour that's not just unnatural but really screwed. That distracts massively from the gaming experience of those who like plausible PvP combat and who realize the flaws of having a virtual floating all seeing eye for everybody. If you either not realize or care about common sense and plausible combat then 3rd person is awesome for you. So what is it? You want to play something at least remotely realistic or rather Super Mario Bros. style?

With enough RAM you can. This might not be actually relevant right now with most users having rigs with 4 - 8 GB RAM, but this will change radically in the next 2 years or so. Most enthusiasts already have 16 GB RAM or will have that or even more in their next upgrade cycle. With the engine in it's present state that won't help them. So imo when they finally start overhauling the old lady, making use of present and future hardware should be a top priority. Sure, the next hardware upgrade cycle will definitely include a SSD, but RAM will always be faster even than the fastest SSD.

That network bubble thing is all about server side optimization. That won't have that much effect on rendering performance on the client. SA release was all about server side performance and stability. I guess we won't see much client side performance tweaking anytime soon.

He won't remove it. He already stated that. He promised however to fix 3rd person view.

You don't have to force the FPV-Advocates. You just need to provide a decent environment. The problem is the "I need 3rd person view" folks which suck in entire groups. We need to give us, the FPV lovers, some more gravity. I thought exactly this was the point of this thread. We need to organize and bunch up against that black hole of indifference.

Yeah, Rocket really missed an opportunity here with leaving 3rd person as it was for SA.

It is simple to have a solution if you don't actually need to have one. Nevertheless we should be able to agree on that there's dire need of optimization...and not hardware side.

Your way of arguing is weird. You attack two points I've never made. 1. I never talked about other engines doing it better. 2. I never said it's easy. So what do you want? Just utter some fanboy defense? Let me clear my points up for you again: 1. There are performance issues with the current version. 2. They need to be addressed 3. People are spoiled by stunning visuals of blockbuster titles. Try to argue against those! Please!

The rendering engine isn't a fresh hatched egg. It's a more or less continueous development since Operation Flashpoint. The performance was considered bad when Arma2 was published in 2009. 4 years later it's still as crappy as back then while hardware performance has increased dramatically...like it always does. As I said in my last post, they need to get their shit together and make that engine use hardware resources more efficiently. No coding knowledge necessary for that conclusion.

The VR-engine is truly socialist. It runs shitty on every machine. You don't need to be a programming expert to see that Arma and DayZ doesn't run well. Even Rocket stated in one of the interviews given shortly before SA release that the engine has problems utilizing multiple cores. That is literally a core issue and needs to be attended to at some point. People these days aren't used to put up with that kind of crappy performance because of beeing spoiled by the big blockbuster titles and their optical prowess. A problem here might be that BI (to my knowledge) is owned by the guys that built the engine. So if they don't see the flaws of their baby probably nothing will happen there. We can just hope their love doesn't make them blind.

Not correct. The MAJORITY of players does not want FP only. The majority of this majority would still play DayZ if 3rd person would be removed.

It was always there, yes. Probably it was always built into Arma as a means of making it easier for players not skilled enough to deal with first person only. It's a crutch. An aide. Like support wheels on a bicycle. You should get rid of those as soon as you can or you never will learn how to ride a bike as it should be. In the real world anybody in full posession of his human capabilites using support wheels to ride a bike would be laughed at. To sad using 3rd person view in DayZ has become a common thing. There might be many ways in doing a certain thing, but if there are others involved you have to find one that works without fucking up the ways of those others. Like in traffic for example. You need to stick to the rules or bad things happen. You can't just do what you want or what is more comfortable to you. Or in competitive sports as I used earlier as an example. If there'd be certain rules removed, like offsides in soccer/football, the game would be changed quite dramatically to something nobody would like to watch anymore. So enforcing rules and by that keeping people from playing as they want to is not that bad as you guys like to make it for the purpose of having it your way.

Dude, you made a lot of arguments of which many sound sensible at first but mostly are bullshit. It's to much of that to be dealt with properly in this forum because the quoting mechanic is shit but maybe I will adress that later on. For now let take this one adressed to me: 1st person only server did not succeed. You're right about that. People just want to have their drugs. They don't care if it's bad for them and the people around them. I would gladly play on 1st person servers...but not alone. There's no point in playing a MMO alone other than having all the loot for oneself. I want to interact with other players. I want to have PvP combat as well. I want to play fair. I don't want to be at a disadvantage. I want to play with friends. It is virtually impossible to find a 1st person only server with at least a decent population wich I consider more than 10 players. If all the 1st persone only advocates would be hardcore enought to ditch their friends and get together on the few remaining servers everything would be fine. They're just not that much of assholes and rather put their egos behind the urges of their friends, which are demanding to play on 3rd person enabled and maybe even crosshairs enabled and whatnot or they won't accompany you on that server. Then they try to convince the other side with discussion and arguments...how uncivilised. Who would do such an outraging thing? Discussing matters with arguments and stuff? Over and over again...with people not willing or capable to even try to understand the argument? The problem is, there's no hope in having hope in the player base. The player base consists of "stupid children" not able to see what's better for them and all around them. So they just keep doing what their parents not explicitly forbid. Time for some parenting. Rocket could just disable 3rd person completely and you little shits coulnd't do anything about it except for whining all day long. He just is no responsible parent at the moment though he already confirmed that there is this problem with 3rp person view enabled and that it should be dealt with. He just didn't do anything yet. Now let's go to the realism thingy. It's a fucking video game! The realism has it's limits. No way around that unless a major leap in technology happens an we all can log into the matrix. BUT....everything is more realistic than having a floating camera 3 m behind and 2 m up your head. That is just the most unrealistic solution to a realism problem. It makes certain things even more unrealistic and that's PvP combat. A central thing to every game with a first person view and guns involved. A major aspect of this kind of game is not just made even more unrealistic but implausible...where plausability is a major credo for Rocket. He doesn't use the word "realistic" regarding to DayZ but "plausible" instead. I just wish he'd finally show the balls to impose his vision of DayZ regardless of whining players as he always proclaimed. If I'd be the lead designer of a game, I would make you play as I intended and it would be right, because I created this world you are in. You cold whine all day long an I would laugh at you and suggest you should finde some game more suitable for you. Lucky for you guys I'm not in power. So I'm forced to trying to convince you guys with arguments, appealing to your intellect and decency, which basically means fighting against windmills. I'm not good at appealing...as you might have noticed...

I only rage against stupid opinions...cuz they're stupid. Having 3rd person enabled does this one huge fuckup to PvP combat which means, it does it to all other players. If DayZ would be a single player game, nobody would care. If it were a strict co-op game, nobody would care. If there'd be enough 1st person only server, nobody would care. But 3rd person became normal. A lot of players don't want to play without it because it gives them comfort. They either don't realize the negative effects on gameplay or they don't care because they like to use it. You only need one of those guys in a group to draw the whole on a 3rd person enabled server unless the group is willing to ditch that guy. Essence is, you have this major fuck up to gameplay vs. what? The personal comfort of yourself. Some players are willing to give up personal comfort to gain a better, more decent gaming experience for them and everybody else. Some just won't give up their support wheels like it's their little teddy bear and cling on it for life. Now who's behaving like a child? Who's stubborn? Who ignores the other opinion?

3rd person makes things more realistic? Who's reality are you talking about?

yeah...well...da fuck learn to read! Your so called argument has been answered to like a million times.

Dude, read! There are virtually no 1st person only servers left to play on. That's because the gravity of choice sucked them dry. If it would be that easy nobody would complain.

I use both to if available. Has it's perks and is comfortable in many situations. I'd gladly give that comfort up for a better combat experience.

Because sometimes force is necessary to make it better for everybody. That's why in any other sport or game certain rules are enforced. Especially if it is competitive. For example the offside rule in soccer/football or whatever other ballgame. The game would be quite different without it and not better. That's why it's there and nobody with any sense is disputing it. First person only or not is a server setting in the mod. Didn't help shit. Players gravitate to 3rd person enabled servers for several reasons, none of them having a better or more fair PvP experience. Most don't even realize the difference in combat between 3rd person enabled and not. They just want the comfort of having 3rd person and crosshairs and whatnot crooks made for beginners of a single player game there have been made available for this so called hardcore survival simulator.

I don't care about morons not agreeing with me. They pissed me of first with their inability to realize that combat with 3rd person enabled is screwed, how and why, and therefore make the same stupid arguments over and over again. You don't solve the problems of a game mechanic by creating an extra game. With that you only divide the player base. I wouldn't mind though, but the in my opinion fucked up version has a lot more gravity and therefore sucks the original dry. This gravity exists not because the game is better that way but solely because players don't want to lose the comfort they're used to have. In short: players are lazy fucktards, not able to realize how this screws up things for them and everybody around them. Then they come here and proclaim choice is the answer to everything...and make me wish some parents had chosen birth control... Did I piss of enough people again? Good.

This thread once again show that people are just to stupid to be given choice. I just hope Rocket will keep his promise of "fixing" 3rd person view so it can't be exploited in combat. I put that "fixing" in quotes because it actually means to fuck it up beyond any use.