L0G!N (DayZ)

The OP doesn't seem to want helpful and collaborative, he just seems to want easypeasy ... if he wanted helpfull and collaborative he would have wrote a thread where he is thankfull for this removal as now he and his mate(s) have another objective as one of them dies, to find eachother again on time. And how this feature puts him is all sorts of places actually challenging his ability to survive... but NO, what does he want, he wants to spawn close to his mates so (t)he(y) can give him back his stuff and they can continue their 'hike' or shooting noobs in cherno ...

Just add weight and have it reduce speed, then i'm sure people will fear zombies, also add splints and give zeds their bone breaking abilities back ! Add more items to loot tables so other items spawn less! ... and some of these steps don't require to much effort either !

YET ! ... as you seemed to forget about that...I entirely agree with the OP as far as gamedevelopment goes, though i do realize that the last 2/3 weeks have been largely about hackers, server hoppers, and respawn abusers ... while i personally couldn't care less about all these problems in an alpha stage, it was clear that everybody that doesn't view this mod as an alpha thought these were the most important problems. But basically, besides the respawn abusers that were messing up life-expectancy and other data, there was/is no real problem as far as alpha testing/development goes with these other two things. Are the things that needed fixing, sure! but in a Alpha screw around phaze they are not, it's the entitled whiney consumer that wan't it's cake before it's baked that caused a shift in focus for the dev team. It's realy a shame in regards to the speed the mod could have moved forward, but with 800.000+ players that all sort of payed for DayZ by buying Arma2, well i can somewhat see how the Dev.team had not choice but to deal with these 'perceived problems' first. Now where i do agree with the OP is that the survival needs to be worked on, but i do not agree this has to be the 'thriving part', because as the OP clearly analyzed, the survival part is currently easy and somewhat lacking. And there are easy ways to continue the 'experiment', that is by taking the next step in the cycle. Aka, the first thing that was likely created in this mod are the Zed's and their behavior, the next was likely the spawns and some items, after which the User interface followed quickly. When this was done the body functions likely followed, which in turn brought Rocket back to the Zeds and items, to deal with the introduced inconveniences... And i agree that the zeds can be tweaked till 'the zombie apocalypse' comes, so don't keep doing that, nobody notices any real progress with it and they are not going anywhere soon! They need work but for the alpha they shown their value to the game! So now the next step needs to be made and that's the Items and spawns (re-evaluate your weapons, remove some/add some others), also run through the assets and figure out whether there are more that would be suited as spawns (YES!! Containers, Piles of Rubble, Boats, dead bodies), i would also advocate making more items, even if they are completely bogus now. And find out that these will put more presure on the loot tables, actually making other items spawn less (that is what some people wan't and what could make innitial/medium survival harder), i would also test spawning us with just a bandage, putting backpacks & flashlights more prominently on the loot tables. While the beartrap worked as a proof of concept, 'we' all know the looting can be improved a lot, people are asking for lower chances, but as chances always have a 100% reducing one means increasing another. UNLESS you add more options to drop !! And we all know there need to be more items to drop, so why not just add a ton of stuff that may not entirely have a function yet... atleast the dev team can find out how far they can drive the loottables and object classes, fairly important info i would think. And also effecting the game as already explained ... and just to show that these times dont have to be high tech: - rags, partial (torn) maps, notes (greets from the dev team), post card, needle&tread, batteries, carbattery, fishing line, rocks, magots, wurms, cookies, candybars, bullits, empty mags, cooling packs, breakable walls, storrage crates, etc ... And all these items could essentially be used in all sorts of features lateron, but atleast it will mess up the loot tables, and the models and textures are neither hard nor demanding (easy shapes, and simple textures). Questions to be asked: So more items means less directly usefull spawns, how did that pan out? did it effect average living time, did it f/e increase server hopping? have 'you' found a better sollution for it in the meantime, what does data say? ... how are the forum reactions, are people still gearing up in 20min, can they find what they absolutely need in a fairly decent time, how about what they want? ... how is the engine holding up, can these items be made 'active' in some use, how easy is it to implement? Easy step2: Reduce the inventory space, and the toolbelt space, it's not realy important yet what the interface will look like, but just remove some slots. And with it I would suggest adding in 'broken' backpacks of all the types with less slots, and perhaps adding the water canteen to the toolbelt (if possible). Not only do the extra bagpacks put more items on the loottables, further reducing spawns of all items, it will also experiment a bit with specialization and teamwork. If you can't carry all the tools. In step one people already spawn without a backpack, and with broken backpacks added, chances on very big packs will reduce. So i would suggest, to cut the toolbelt in half first, and then at each consecutive patch remove a slot. In regards to the inventory, perhaps remove a slot every patch. Somewhere people have got to 'break' in their choices, WHAT DO THEY DO!? ... do they whine here on the forum (obviously) but what do the fanboys say, do they agree or see the value in teamwork? do they shoot eachother less now that less space means you may well want a teammate, or do they just stack tools in their backpacks? How far can Rocket reduce our slots till the forum explodes !! ... (my guess is around 4 toolbelt slots and 6 main inventory spaces, with 4 secundary inventory spaces) ... so now what? Do you give people even less space when they start out, how do you give them more space as they progress? Can you do this, by either introducing toolbelt-bags, being a bit more lenient on backpack spawns, can you integrate space in clothing perhaps? CAN you do clothing, and link it to space? What clothing do people start out with, how does that relate to the minimum space that has 'just' been determained... How is the engine holding up with all these different items? and the larger loot tables? After these fairly easy steps, it's clear that the body functions need a serious update, we need to die of hyperthermia and hypothermia, well just check the 'Full medical'-compilation thread in my signature-link, there is a TON of stuff that can be improved or added, some may also need new items (like splints). But likely the most important, add WEIGHT! or do something about us being able to sprint for miles! We do need a travel mode, that is beyond doubt, but sprinting from zombies should only be possible for a short while, especially if you are packed! ... then again, if you just start you may want some extra speed UNTILL you get packed, and WEIGHT is the perfect speed balancer. And once you add weight, ohw hey, this may well effect the zed's again (it may not), because if we can't run endlessly to shake them off, they instantly become a bigger thread, and especially where you want them to be a bigger thread, that is after you are packed! because if they are a bigger thread you are hurt more, you use more ammo, you need more medical supplies, etc. AND you accomplish this WITHOUT messing with the zeds! The dev's might actually have to tone them down a bit, depending on how harsh they make weight influence speed. This will make them somewhat slower, which will likely make them glitch less because the animation is innitially made for a slower pace. It also means you won't have to make new animations YET, because making those now for faster zeds, that may be 'to fast' if you slow the players down, a waste of time... So we are now back at where we are now, evaluate the zeds, based upon speed ... Questions to be asked: how did this pan out? did it effect average lifespan, are people complaining enough about it being hard and unfair? how do i need to tweak the zeds to deal with the running, or should i tweak the weight penalty? Do i need to tweak the medical conditions, or are people asking/suggesting more ways to deal with them? How is the engine holding up with all these added scripts? what can i use for the standalone? In between all this i think clothing should have a good look, it could be a way to integrate some sort of cash-shop, where different designs are sold which have fairly basic equivilents in the game. Never sell the best ingame stuff in the shop, you will ruin the game, but with weight added having 'medium' space available for some cash only means you get into hoarding troubles sooner. And players don't have to buy these clothing items because they can find them in the game as well, If you set up your clothing system well and think of benefits and drawbacks well, it may mean a FTP game with loads of options for fans to contribute to the game financially while not giving them any significant advantage. Heck perhaps you still need to find the equivilent clothing item in the game before you can wear your 'bought' alternative, wouldn't that be fair ! And 2 of these should not even take to long, if the dev team pulls together and helps eachother out! ... I am also still a fairly convinced that letting the community contribute assets to the game in some sort of forum competition could speed up fase1 to lightning speed! ... And while all this is NOT the kind of improvement of survival that the OP meant, as he seems to hint clearly at 'when are we getting our base building!' all of these things are to me atleast, clearly the aimed at start and mid-game experience, aka stretching the survival part into mid-game, stretching out 'gearing up' over time, and step 1 & 2 could likely be in patch 1.7.3.0 (2-3 weeks) ... After all of this, as i noted, we are back at the zeds, so again the cycle starts, items&spawns (more items available? how about effectuating them), new inventory to include clothing? All these items need to spawn, how does it effect spawnrates... etc and so on, well i guess we can see the cycle going now and we get ever closer to endgame while all the base 'features' get ever more expanded putting more strain on loottables, by now we likely also have more assets used as spawns, just to accomodate all that stuff spawning, how is the game holding up? and how is the community doing?

The frustration you experience over not spawning where you did is the same as being washed ashore as your boat capsized in a storm. You tried to get out of that horrid cherno but alas ... now atleast you 'survived' the capsize, but where are your friends, where are you... shit happened and now you have to deal with it... that is called survival, and that is the game... if you don't find that fun, then thats perfect as the 'shit' part of the game is not supposed to be fun, thats why its such a great experience... I haven't had this much frustration and tension since the [save game] was introduced, while it was great to actually finish some games, it also destroyed the whole tension build-up you would experience the further you got ... that is now entirely back ! and it's great ! So please play the game like it's meant to be played, when your car breaks down in the middle of nowhere there is no way for a friend to just 'spawn in' close to you, or even die and spawn at a better location. Either you know what to do, or you die, simple as that!

Well there does seem to be something iffy going on atm. as i entered a city i am sure there were infected, but no building had any loot in it, as i made my round i finally found a building with some stuff. On my way out i passed an already checked building and now it did have loot, making me do the whole round again and now indeed every building had stuff. And that loot couldn't have all been old, i been hanging out near that town for the whole week, and we hit it about every day atleast once. There is always stuff there, but now with 1.7.2.4 there wasn't :/

hello suggestion forum, I would like to have some feedback from people in regards to this inventory design/mock-up, before i turn it into a true suggestion. What i am mostly interested in is if you guys/girls can easily identify what each section/slots is/are for ... any other feedback is welcome too: ps1. i think the troublesome way that the backpack is accessed in the game ads to the authenticity of using a backpack, it also ads to the game as you don't just go and grab some stuff at any moment you feel like it ... so suggesting i add the backpack as always accessable and basically just extra 'slots' ... don't sweat and spare yourself the time to type it down, i will not change it ;) ps2. Reading the first couple of suggestions linked in my signature may help identify certain area's of this inventory design, if you can't figure it out and still want to know ;)

Nopes, those would be slots for clothing, and each clothing item would come with a couple of pockets (or a lot) and this would determain the inventory size. Tnx for this feedback though, it would have been more clear if i had actually put some clothes on 'him/her', which in the normal game would have been the case...In regards to the possibility of implementation, well some things might not be possible, but i did try to stick as close to the original as possible. Hence the various buttons at the bottom to put your stuff in/to various places. The toolbelt & bags prettymuch work like the backpack, the loot side would work like the loot listing but with icons instead. Hardest would likely be the clothing ?

Last time for me to request some feedback, seeing i been staring at it for a long time already and made it, i know exactly what does what and what it is for, without anyone giving me some feedback it's impossible for me to see if i missed something and whether its intuitive, so if you can help me out then please do so :)

Rallige, speed is always relative, so the speed of the zed's is connected to the speed of the players, reduce the speed of the players and zeds speeds can be reduced aswell ... fairly simple in my views atleast ... and this is unrelated to a sort of vision for zeds because a player will related the speed of the zed to his own speed, as that is what determains whether a zed is fast or slow ... ;)

@wigumen, please read my post, it was not adressed to your specific problem, which btw is a problem of a bug or hackers and the respawn is a work around to that, not a sollution...

we know there have been atleast 3 threads on it already... and its not patch 1.7.2.4 it's actually the Arma patch that was released earlier this week!

Some additional ideas for this nice feature: 1. There is actually a shovel in the game (currently no use except if you also have an engineering bag, what ever that is :P ) ... so using a shovel to get some wurms is realy easy. Just stick the shovel in the ground (grass usually helps) and start shaking the shovel, the wurms will actually crawl out of the ground and you can just pick them up. A more horrible way to get bait is to grab some maggots from a dead body :rolleyes: 2. Your can or bottle trap will only catch small fish and you would need a lot of them to provide a meal. There are atleast 2 traps that i know of that would work more easily. One is combining some wood + hooked line + bait: slam the wood in the bank and check on it at a later time, this is basically like fishing without hanging around to wait for a fish to bite (if you have the resources setting multiple will increase your chances with just some effort putting them up) ... second would be what is generally considdered as a lobster trap, making these in game would be hard though, as there is no way to collect small branches (willow is best as its bendy, i am not to sure about reed but it could be used for the weaving) and let them soak in water for a while, so they get realy bendy and you need a bit of rope or a rag. You take a bundle of 10/12 and tie them together at one end, then you start to weave in other twigs to make a basketlike structure for about 3/4 of the way of the base branches. Then at the other end you take small twigs and weave them in at an angle so they 'close off' the top, you can strenthen this by also partically weaving in between these twigs to close off the top a bit more, but always leave a 'closed off' hole big enough for the fish you want to catch and the twigs still need to be able to bend out of the way 'inwards' ... now place this trap in the banks by jamming a big stick through the end, and put some stones to weigh it down... then put bait inside and make sure to mush them up so they disperse a scent ... The fish will now be able to swim in with some effort in the direction of the twigs, but they can not get out. Lobster traps can also be added as a 'drop' from the various boats that lay around the maps. Nets, these are actually quite useless in most cases, unless you can entirely block off a stream with them. But if a stream is small enough you can also fish another way. Just block off the stream (make a dam), and make another dam with an opening in it.... Then walk up or down stream, but atleast away in the direction you made the open 'dam', and start walking towards it while using a stick to slam on the water, splashing heavily with your feet helps as well... So you chase all the fish into the lil pond you created, and when you get to it you close off the hole... now its a matter of just lobbing the fish on dry land or using a spear ... Nets maybe 'authentic' enough to be used in DayZ though, and they could also spawn in boats or 'washed' ashore. I personally think that nets could also be the basis for creating one's own guilli suit, just to give a choice whether to use them to fish, or to wear ;) 3. Fish tackle could also 'spawn' from boats or from hunting cabins, though the best way to find them 'in the wild' is to look in between rubble washed ashore, while it's somewhat unlikely to find hooks attached IRL, finding fishing line on the beach if a fairly commen thing, usually it's a big mess, but as you only need about 1,5m bits to make the traps or a fishing rod ... 4. Tin cans can fairly easily be turned into hooks, you don't always need a hook shape either, a inch or 2-3 cm straight piece of metal will also do, it can also be some bone or a stick, but i personally think metal is more easily shaped, sinks and can be made smaller while still keeping strength. but seeing the top and bottom of a can is already 'rolled' it wouldn't take to much to turn it into a viable hook. 'Old' soda can lids also work great given you have some pliers to work them with...

I wondered if a rope with 'hook' may be a work around in regards to this, see currently the 'hatched' already needs you to be in the woods near a tree (i think atleast the tree needs to be close, i should test this :P anyways: ), so if the game can detect if you are near a tree, then you could toss a rope which has a 'ladder' script attached to it, and it would allow you to climb the rope into the tree :)

Well it is! Survival is just a short word for saying: "Shit happened and now you have to deal with it" ... so if this is a survival game, which it is called, and the content largely consists of 'shit happening', and dealing with that shit is the other part of the content ... so, yeah :thumbsup:

I somewhat agree, there seems to be no real planning involved in the updates, atleast over the last two weeks ... I personally would suggest the Dev team to declare a Patch-Release-Day, and Monday would be a good day. It gives the dev team a whole weekend to prepair for it, then release it, if something turns out to be somewhat 'borked' they have a whole week to fix it. BUT, the patch will likely be as stable as intended over the following weekend, meaning that the large majority of gamers (you know all the average 35+ gamers that have other stuff to deal with during the week) can have a stable experience over the weekend ... and if a patch isn't good enough, then skip a monday and just wait till the next to come along ...

I don't get the 'whining' of mature people in here, so what would you actually do if a friend would spawn right near you, you would just give him his stuff back and keep killing players in cherno? ... i play with 2 friends and we have a couple of hours as well, it hardly ever happens that we all die the same time ... so IF somebody dies we just go and get him, person spawns and finds the nearest village to determain position, the survivors already know where they are (most of the time). So we move in eachothers direction, rescue and extract missions are fun, you actually get to places you wouldn't normally go to, and these missions can be a lot of fun... recently one of us died, and as he was trying to grab some stuff to get to us he got injured badly! 3000HP passing out etc. it was great fun to hear his relieve as a found some food and drinks in a barn to not die again... me and my other friend ran over 80miles crosscountry to go and find him, on our way hoping to find bikes or a car to speed up our rescue attempt, to no avail... when we finally found him he was overjoyed, we healed him up, and shared supplies 'we' picked up along the way. Then we made our way back to our 'home region' and on our way back we found a repaired truck in the middle of nowhere! Which obviously made us ride home instead of walk all the way... To me, that whole mission was exactly PLAYING THE GAME! ... Another thing we did was set a home region for ourselves, so if people die when playing alone, or die near the end of our session, they know where 'abouts' we are, they can make their way back there on their own time or depending on time we go get him. It works just fine if atleast everybody sticks to the plan ... so realy, if you want to play the game, then play the damned game how it is and work with it instead of 'whining' like a lil kid that just can't have it's cake and eat it ... you should be mature enough by now to deal with these things, if not, then (and i hate this phraze in most cases) perhaps this game is not for you and your friends. Battle field has a 'spawn on leader' team function, and rounds are fairly short, if you only have limited time perhaps that is a better game to play with likewise friends...

I think a lot of the more regular suggestion forum dwellers would love to see some of the 'here is my list of suggestion that i post here without using search' (with 99% of them already discussed), and see those threads dissolve into a wishlist thread. There used to be one b4 the forum switch and I personally would love to see it return !

Bumping this because it would make this forum easier to read when all the lists can be gathered in one thread ...

I agree on the moderation part, even though i try to report doubles with a link to an already excisting thread, it seems like it's a lost cause if that is all i can do about it. Some indeed get merged, but if i were a mod most of those wouldn't even BE merged ... This forum also needs the [sticky]-wishlist thread back, it was great for all those 'these i my ideas and i just drop them here and don't realy care to discuss them'-threads, I even put this up as a suggestion, but it likely sank in the large pile of tincans that seems to occupy this part of the forum ... I think the reason why this forum might not be read by dev's (although i did see a Dev'team member here yesterday), is because of the large amount of doubles and empty tin cans. Now there are a couple of realy good compilation threads, one of which i made myself, and the OP's actually show an effort to update the OP. These kinds of threads just need a sticky, and half the nonsense will disappear or can just be merged with those stickies... And i think every now and then a good idea pops up and discussion on it is generally good as well, trolls get much more attention in the general forum, so they hardly ever come down here... I will say that the amount of provanity and cursing isn't hardly as present as in the general forum, sure we get our bit of rants but after a couple of [reports] and people being warned the amount of BS got reduced to fairly reasonable limits. The biggest problem is actually people not using search or when doing so not finding the thread (or simply not caring). Lastly, if you could be an advocate of your own concerns i could actually take you serious: aka. why the heck to you rant & curse about this, showing absolutely no sense that you even understand or care about your own concerns. So b4 you start calling other people names, perhaps you should check the mirror first...

Realy :huh: ... nobody has any critisism, questions or otherwise, is it that good ^_^

Tnx but i'm not realy looking for esthetic feedback yet, more interested in whether you would know which part does what and how... :)

Well i personally think restoring an electric plant and keeping it running should indeed take the effort of a lot of people, as it will power the whole area so it shouldn't be to easy. While say a factory may have a couple of machines running off a mobile generator... The gazoline should realy slowly fill back up, meaning that if you empty one with a truck to power the electricplant, you won't be able to do that again for say a week, sure you may be able to fill up one or two cans with fuel to power a car after a few hours, but say that a large guild or a whole server runs the oilrig for a while filling up the refinery, to then power that to refine the oil, to then use that to fuel a city for a long time, they could create basically a save zone on the server. They may start to check service stations and filling these up if needed to keep supply lines safe. etc... If just a small group could achieve all those things and keep it running with ease it's just bore people, just compare it with eve (not sure if you ever played), but there aswell as single player can do small things, but a group can accomplish large things, just by deviding up tasks amoungst eachother. fighters band together with fighters to take on bigger prey, miners band with fighters to stay safe, producers band with miners and fighters, traders band with fighters or with producers, groups already together start undertaking bigger projects, etc and so on... for this to happen though you need those challenges that need ever bigger groups of people to accomplish ...

While some of it may be Rocket's view on zeds, there is another issue directly related to it: our ability to run for miles at full speed. This 'ability' makes it so that melee units (which are the only NPC opponents) have to be able to run fast. And i realy hope that Rocket will either copy/paste ACE code in relation to speed/weight, or just codes something he feels is appropriate for DayZ. The moment we can only Sprint for 50y at full speed, and can 'jog' for 15km at a medium speed. Will mean that zombies can all of a sudden move slower and still pose a thread, because we may be able to sprint away from them, but if our jog is slower than a zombie run, they will catch up with us, with their current persistance they WIL catch up with you...And there is another reason why i hope he will do this, that is the glitches with zeds now. As i understood the animation was made for a slower speed, now the speed is not in sink with the ingame speed which makes it have to many animation frames: made animation is 25 frames/sec for a speed that only has 'time' for 20 frames/sec, meaning there are 5 frames 'left' a sec. Which obviously makes them 'buggy' ... then there is also the distance traveled with the animation, at a higher speed the zeds will travel more distance with an animation that lacks enough 'animation' for that distance... again making them buggy... So once Rocket implements something like stamina which will then allow him to slow down the zeds without loosing the thread level they impose, and i think the gaming experience will increase due to a more fluid experience...

DayZ could deffo use some of the features ...

Nice thing about DayZ though, is that IF you find somebody elses stash of stuff it instantly becomes your pile of stuff especially if it comes on wheels :) ... all you have to do is move it to a different location ;) ... and you have a place to indeed, gather more stuff :rolleyes: ...