jonahcutter

Yeah, neither DayZ nor WarZ invented their naming concept. "World War Z" was a book published several years ago that was about a zombie apocalypse. I think it coined using the letter "Z" as shorthand for zombie apocalypse.

No. I have never been close to dying from hunger, thirst, exposure or disease. Once you've played a few hours, you'll find yourself walking away from food and drink because you can't carry it all.

:huh: Who's excited? Just making a point mate. Glad we agree.

Permadeath? You have heard of tents haven't you? "Permadeath" is kind of a joke when you know you can run back to a tent where you've stored several assault rifles, dozens of mags, dozens of cans of food, medical supplies, multiple backpacks and even more tents to transfer all your backup kits into.

Well, when people die now, they can run back to their tent and pick up another kit from the multiple kits they have stored there. Completely bypassing having to build up from nothing. There is little fear of death when you know you don't have to start back at zero. Tents are an incredibly carebear mechanic, completely contradicting how realistic and hardcore this mod prides itself on being.

Yeah, the mod seems to be very focused on "gearing up", mmo/WoW-like, as it's primary gameplay. Camp spawns for l33t gear to camp spawns for more l33t gear... Gather parts for a car or helicopter (lol)... Once you learn the basic mechanics of the zeds, and where basic survival needs spawn, the "zombie-survival" portion of the mod basically becomes a nuisance. I have absolutely no fear of zombies in this mod. I haven't died to a zed in a long long time. And I've NEVER died to hunger, thirst, disease or exposure.

lol no it doesn't There is no legit consequence to any of this, so the behaviour being exhibited has nothing to do with reality. Hell, being able to save gear through death largely mitigates even the in-game pain of death. Tents turn death into an annoying inconvenience, not a mortal fear. And once you learn zombie mechanics and where things spawn, the "survival" aspect becomes not much more than a nuisance.

You sound hardcore dude. So you must be against being able to save items through death, thus trivializing it? Because there is nothing more carebear, than having mulitple sets of gear waiting to restock with, if you die. There is NOTHING MORE CAREBEAR in this mod than tents. Tents trivialize dying... So a hardcore player like yourself must be opposed to them.

Why is it "well played"? Someone jumped in a heli when no one was around.

Shhh... please don't point out how carebear things like tents are. Most want to pretend this mod is hardcore. Why should death have any legit ramifications? Why should players fear death?

There's immersion and survival mechanics? I've never died to exposure, thirst, hunger or disease. And I've haven't died to a zed in a long long time. Hmmm... Ghillie suits, sniper rifles and helicopters must be the zombie-survival immersion you speak of?

Once you realize how easy it is to deal with zeds, how easy it is to gather basic survival needs, and how easy it is to accumulate weapons and ammo, the mod rapidly falls apart. Its main focus of gameplay becomes "gearing up" (sort of like WoW), and the fear of death is almost non-existent because of being able to have multiple (if not dozens) of backup sets of gear stored in tents. The mod starts out strong and intense and original. It just doesn't sustain it for very long, and rapidly devolves into a sorta-persistent-world, watered-down ArmA with zombie/survival window-dressing.

Tents are incredibly carebear, vastly mitigating the pain of death.

So: DayZ is about farming loot. Others are outraged not that DayZ is about farming loot, but that someone min/maxed it.

It's what makes DayZ original and hardcore!

If I had a nickle...

Why do I think what is? I'm not being sarcastic, I'm just not sure to what you're referring.

Yeah, the mod puts too much of an emphasis on getting l33t gear (and things like tents that trivialize death), and not enough of a continuing emphasis on surviving moment-to-moment/day-to-day. It starts out really strong, but doesn't sustain it.

Exactly. Whether intended or not, zombie-survival is currently the hook to draw in new players. Once you learn the "mechanics" of the mod, it becomes a watered-down version of base ArmA. The mod starts out strong, but doesn't sustain it. It gets sidetracked with "gearing up" (kind of WoW-like) and providing things like tents, that trivialize death.

lol never I've been sniped from afar. I've been shot in the back by people pretending to be be friendly when I was clearly undergeared compared to them, and they had nothing to gain from it. I had a tent stocked with 3 almost three sets of full gear, including Alice packs, and assault rifles w/multiple mags. A couple compasses. A gps. And two extra tents to transfer to if I died. I was eventually sniped by someone I never saw, while running around with just an axe and not even a backpack, looking like a complete noob. I went to bed and the next day couldn't find the server. I never managed to find it again, it was never up when I was logged on. I considered getting po'd, until I realized it took me less than 12 hours of gameplay to gather all that gear. I had a helicopter dropped on my head once when I was camping inside the store in Cherno. Pissed off admin? Who knows... I just laughed while having the increasing realization that the mod had pretty much stopped providing me with any sort of post-apocalyptic scenario.

Any sort of apocalyptic scenario would have people killing other people. It's inherent to the genre. The fiendish danger of other cunning humans is core to the dynamic. But this is also a video game, where balancing of mechanics must occur, to provide quality, original gameplay. Dayz provides that, until you learn that zombies are largely window dressing. And collecting survival supplies is so easy you will quickly be walking away from food and drink constantly, simply because you cannot carry any more and your tent(s) are overflowing. And that there is zero reason to interact with other players with anything other than a bullet. You don't need to trade with other players. Just kill them and take their shit. Imagine if you were starving and suspected another player had food, but that if you just shot them you might destroy what they're carrying. And you only have a pistol with 4 rounds and are likely to aggro zeds if you open up first. Maybe you try to trade instead. Maybe you try to trick the other player into going to a safer area first, then murder them. Maybe you say screw it an open up, taking your chances. That's the types of choices new players currently face, until they learn how easy it is to find supplies and how zeds are a nuisance at best. If this mod were creating those types of desperate choices for all players (survivor and bandit) constantly, it would be as special as it pretends to be. It has huge potential, but currently DayZ is no where near as daring or innovative as it thinks it is. The quality of the actual pvp is the base ArmA engine at work and has nothing to do with the mod itself. Putting an emphasis on "gearing up" (like WoW-style MMOs) and having so many pvp engagments turn on whether you have military-grade weapons or not, completely de-emphasize what is special about the mod in the first place. The raw, should-I-or-shouldn't-I questions players need to ask themselves about approaching other players rapidly become pointless because of the ease of collecting supplies and murdering multiple other players from a distance. Long-range weapons make that question pointless. Just shoot before the other player notices you. High-rof, high-capacity weapons makes it far too easy for someone to instigate pvp and just mow other players down. And make the zeds themselves a complete joke. The fetish for long-range, military weapons short-circuits what makes the mod special in the first place. And it points out the limits of real innovation behind the mod. It starts out strong and original, but rapidly becomes like everything else. This mod could be great. And the presence of zombie-survival as a hook inarguably shows the desire for such a type of game this mod is in the early stages. But the mod does not, at this time, sustain that gameplay. It rapidly turns into a watered-down, persistent-world version of ArmA, with a window dressing of zombies.

I stopped feeling those emotions when I realized how easy it is to store multiple sets of gear, to make death basically inconsequential. And how the zeds are window dressing and a nuisance at best. Those emotions are evoked when everyone is in a desperate situation where they must debate the potential benefits vs the potential danger of approaching other players. And everyone must debate the merits of peacefully interacting with other players vs outright attacking them. This is not happening at all right now. The merits of outright attacking other players are far far greater than approaching them. This leads to getting killed from long ranges by players you never see. The only emotion this evokes is the same emotion you get in any other pvp fps when getting sniped by campers. Hell, the pvp mechanics are just the base game mechanics. Intensely realistic firefights are base ArmA at work. It's nothing to do with the mod itself.

Random spawn points on entering a new server. No tents. It'll solve a lot of problems.

The thrill of pvp you describe is the basic ArmA game mechanics at work. It has nothing to do with the mod. And tents remove most of the pain of death, so dying in this mod isn't really all that big of a deal anymore.

If the mod is so hardcore, what the hell are tents doing in it? "Rocket isn't going to make things easier"? Rocket made tents, and tents made things incredibly easier. Tents are a highly carebear mechanic, drastically mitigating the pain of death. People don't fear death now, because their teams/clans have stockpiles of high-end gear waiting to resupply them. And the very idea of "high end gear"itself is pure main-stream, WoW-style, MMO. Gear up to get more powerful so you enjoy gross advantages over your opponent. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, this mod is no where near as daring as it wants to be. It has promise, yes, but not from people engaging in long-range pvp with scopes and high-rof weapons. Quality as that pvp is, that is just the basic ArmA engine at work. It has nothing to do with the mod.