L0G!N

Well i actually asked a question about this yesterday, and apparently the Mod should be able to run on any Arma Map, so Rocket could just change the map at say the 2.0.0 stage, to give every player a fresh experience where they don't automatically know where everything is. Two, i resently suggested running a forum competition to help Rocket (and ArmaII&III as well) get more assets for the game: By having fans create those assets, and entering the forum competition makes these assets publicly available. That way more assets are available for Rocket to use, while he doesn't have to have anyone involved in the actual game. He can pick what he likes. And the forum competition could just be about the best item created, without any promisses of implementation... Such a forum competition has all the benefits of a Community project, without all the negatives of people trying to force their opinion on the game and fight over art directions and gamemechanics and what not (the things that usually end a community project ;) ). And i think Rocket doesn't need one map for a release, he needs various maps, because as my thread somewhat revealed that if people know every corner of a map, the experience gets stale, there is no exploration left it's just a 'pick up that loot there, go here, then there', now go on the forum and ask for the game to be made harder... so having multiple maps would mean more gameplay...

Tnx for all that info ZedsDB Well i don't plan on getting there anytime soon, as from most peoples comments the game pretty much gets stale at the point you reach 'inhabitant' familiarity ... Why I actually wanted to know is to perhaps have Rocket change the map, for say reaching 2.0.0 ... that way people that now think they are the bows will understand better how this game 'feels' for new players, and thus how frustrating it can be seeing people ask to reduce spawns for this and that, while they know the map by heart and thus just 'go and pick up some items' ... after about 24h of play over one week, i am fairly glad i can now distinguish 5 possible loot area's commen in most villages without having to knock on every door... and while i have been able to see the NWA on my map 2x (as i found a map 2x), i have yet to make it there to be shot by a sniper ... So if this mod can run on any map, why not change it, i am fairly sure that some opinions on the game's difficulty change if players don't know their way around!

Well if you read Rocket's opinion on forums, 'their' responses are exactly what makes Rocket unsure about forums, it's that it's the only way to get a lot of feedback and input, but from what i read between the lines he'd rather just sit down and chat face to face with people that have interesting opinions about what he is doing, or interesting propositions... In regards to this 'problem' i think the only people that can truely do something about it are Mods, they have the power to remove and punish people for their behavior. And while making this topic is a decent way to show how you feel about various responses of people (hyper emotional and often of sewer levels), i doubt it will change the behavior of the people you want to effect ... (most will likely gniffle in their fist, and think things like 'whiner', or LOL or LMAO) ... So in addition to making this thread i would suggest to just report posts that cross a civilian line, I have decided I will, and if all people that prefer a civil discussion; which btw. can be heated and filled with disagreement (but without adhominen); report these kinds of post, then perhaps the Mods will have an easier time deciding to just remove those posts, and if needed infraction the poster (report doubles, report w/e) ... see, this game is different from a lot, if not all, other games, so why can't this forum be different from all the other forums as well, 'you know' not like the rest of the internet... It doesn't take much effort if we all put our best leg forward, and all that want to move in that direction, making threads like this though doesn't realy solve the issue, and is only likely to fuel more emotional responses... be civil yourself, and stay that way for as much you can, and report posts you think don't pass the darwin test, so a mod can do something about it.

I see dead people all the time in this game ?! :D Tbm serious, i get this fairly often, though not entirely audible, but surely visual and mostly at night. Tall grass or grainpops looking like zombies, trees forming what look to be houses, which then turn out to be trees. Wind that suddenly moves some grass in the corner of my eyes giving me a freight. And what i did was turn the 'music' to about 2clicks up, which means that at times the weird sounds from the music come through at a quiet moment in the game, which can raise tension for a moment :P Not sure i want more of it as i already have enough now :)

Or another way to put it would be, is the current map specifically created for this mod? I ask this because i see a lot of people 'complaining' everything is to easy to find etc. Well as I played this mod for about 24 hours over the last week, i can say, as a new player it's not that easy, and making it even harder would make it an even bigger 'pain' ... So what i wondered is, has this 'game' become so 'easy' for people because they know the map by heart? If they spawn do they just turn left or right and 'know' from the first city/town they come across where they are, and thus where to go from there to get X,Y,Z in the fastest and easiest way? If so, than the game isn't to easy, some players are just so accustom to the map that they know it by heart, they don't search and find things, they just go somewhere to pick something up, and if it's not there they will just come back in 30min or so as it will be there then... So for these people, no matter how 'hard' this game is made, this will never change, all a lower spawnrate accomplishes is that they have to wait a tad longer to get what they want, and seeing they already know where to go to survive that bit longer, it just gets more 'tedious' for them... BUT, if the current map comes from the Arma game itself, and adjustments are minimal, then confronting these people with a new map means they will have to figure everything out again, they won't know where to go, and it's fairly likely the amount of 'its to easy, make it harder' threads will be greatly reduced...

It would be nice if the OP could clarify his idea more in the OP, because i think i like what he means, and its something that i wanted to suggest as well. Now i may be wrong, but i would personally like to start out with ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! ( And if possible with a 5sec timer being knocked out... (unfortunatly you can't see yourself in 3rd person while you are knocked out, that be a nice way to start this game ) GIVEN, that some minor things are added to the beach. I would love to see: 1. Drift wood laying around (if not possible than a spawn for this off of boats), 10 shots then it breaks. 2. Empty Plastic bottles (with a chance to find one with a cap on it), with cap is a small drink, aka. half a canteen, if you can find water. 3. A rare spawn in the form of a 'fishnet' that can be turned into a tarp in the forest. Then seeing you start out with nothing, some basic things should be easier to find, and this will require MORE spawnpoints for MORE items. Basic rubble: - plank - steel pipe - rags (for basic bandage with 70% infection chance) * infection to clear with antibiotics or hunting knife (turning it to bleeding - which can then be bandaged up again 'clean' or with another rag giving another shot. * boild a rag in a water filled tin can over a fire to get a bandage. - Bricks, throw to make a sound, or bash a zombie. Dust bins: - find used lighters (giving a random amount of flames, 1 to 5) - find rags - Civilian backpack (4 slots) houses, we deffo need more enterable structures: - bandages - painkillers - flares - Larger backpacks (8 slots) small chance on 10 slot Barns: - Shovels - Hatchets - Hunting rifles & crossbows (normal bow?) - Basic toolset, can only build certain structures with it, and limited repair *FOREST* - Have certain trees 'give' a branch to swing with, or to use as a 'waking stick' if one has a broken limb. - Let fire wood be made into a splint with a hatched or the hunting knife. Given you have some rags to turn it into one. Well etc and so on, See, while this game focusses a lot on Fear & Frustration, it feels like it's forgetting the 'thrill' of finding something, aka REWARD. Survival is a lot about constantly improving your 'kit' (aka. everything you carry around), while dealing with a limited space, and using everything you can that you find, and having multiple ways to deal with things. Currently the 'everything' you can find is lacking 'a lot', and there are only a few ways to deal with situations (breaking bones f/e is still a mistery to me, and picking up that i supposed to get morphine for it, the only place i know for that is a city, which i would rather avoid! ) ... I also miss the thrill of comming across something realy usefull and that 'upgrades' my 'kit' in a sense that i feel i improved myself a little bit. Basically the things in the game that give me that 'finally cool loot' feeling are the Hatched; then having 2 bandages and 4 makarov mags, having 2 cans of food and 2 drinks, a filled canteen, and finding a gun of any sorts has basically left me going 'hmm meh, it feels good to have it, but it also gives great a risk' and i prefer having a handgun and hatched) while i did get that feeling when i managed to get into a town and finally found a bigger pack & figure out how to pick it up, unfortunatly i didn't get to enjoy it long and i hope the player that likely took it from me didn't get to enjoy it long either :P ) So esp. those first couple if items, mostly the driftwood, would realy give people that first sense of relief. OK I FOUND SOMETHING!! 10 swings (make it 3 to kill a zed) if i run into a zed i can atleast defend myself somewhat. Then from there on having people find things that improve themselves actually makes the 'reward' count. And the more the environment feels like it's usable, the more a feeling of living off the land gets applied to it. 'Crafting' can be a part of that as long as it's embedded in 'believability' (for not wanting to use 'realism'), it doesn't have to turn into L4D as L4D does that already, but being a bit of a survival 'geek' i personally try to put myself into emaginairy situations with limited resources and try to come up with the stuff i need to survive without zombies obviously. The amount of things you can do with a basic branch are almost limitless, in DayZ i have yet to be able to pick one up! Lastly, more spawns & more items means more exploring, finding more basic things or just trash (which can hopefully be turned into something, or be used for something, slightly usefull at some point), with less chance on finding something realy cool, which then ofcourse increases the joy of finding that realy cool thing. And this does what a lot of people are asking for as well, which is less easy access to very usefull/deadly stuff. It may make survival for the newbs a bit easier, but most 'complain' it's already to easy to survive (i haven't noticed, but then i don't spoil the game for myself by checking full blown loot maps etc), so making it a tad easier for people to get through those first 15min is no big deal (if you feel you are good enough already, just leave that trash laying around on the beach and head straight into town). And if the things you find in shore towns are the basic things you need (civilian backpacks, rags, bandages, painkillers, food, drinks, and trash, with the added chance of finding a better weapon. Then you will feel you got your basics covered, which obviously feels like the game just started, which is, well what i did by giving you nothing to start out with and giving you a bit more things to find... )

Assuming you mean 'me' with 'the guy crying about cursing' ... so being on the internet makes it ok then? ... i been on the internet since 96, and i remember a whole different internet from back then, i got into online FPS gaming in 98, and i remember a whole different community feel. Sure there were asshats even then, but in general they were frowned upon, disregarded as unworthy, which only made them rage more and generally 'quit' ... having 'our' own server made things even simpler, anybody that didn't atleast behave slightly civil was just kicked off, if it persisted -> banned. Problem solved... Somewhere along the road though, this behavior became somehow accepted and even 'expected', like wth? and this meant that in a large amount of cases it's impossible to even have a discussion. UNLESS, there are mods around that actually care whether their site is a sespool of hate or a half civilized place to discuss things. And i've seen numerous times here on this forum it was said, if you want something 'changed' make it happen yourself, well I would love to ... tobad i'm don't have mod powers...

Seeing i haven't played this game for long, i can't judge the ingame environment, i have only once been shot by a player, which was because i had a broken bone and hardly any blood so I was crawling towards him in hopes he would help me (which he sort of did, 'out of my misery') I guess he feared me sneaking up on him... What i can judge on is the utter sewer level behavior of people on these forums, It may have to do with Rocket's behavior or even the Mods, but in general i found that the behavior of mods sets the standard on a forum, together with their level of moderation. i would say that over half the responses to well formulated posts are garbage that should be deleted on sight, troll posts should just be removed and trolls given a 24h ban. Keep that up and soon all the (excuse me for using this word) 'fucktards' will leave, and all those with half a brain will actually start to discuss things, disagreeing is part of discussion, without it there tends to be no discussion at all. Where discussion differs from half the garbage in here is that 'ad hominin' are largely frowned upon and arguements are used to disagree, not swearing or other sewer level interaction. And tbqh, i could do without all those swearing non civilized idiots, and in part i feel 'ashamed' to be a part of the same species, though perhaps in some genepools there has been a devolution instead of an evolutionary progression. I am mostly shocked about some of the 'staple' responses to general feedback. As for all the comments on this review stating 'this is alpha, wait till it's finished' ... well Alpha is the phaze where one decides on all the major features of a game, and implements them, so feedback is actually quite valuable ... And in an alpha, a forum should be mostly about feedback, the comments i read in various threads, and a lot of others as well, seem to be totally unaware of what alpha means, while the statement is used to devalue the posts that are most important during an alpha... :huh: As last: There can be one clear rule on the forum for the mods and us to uphold: 'If i wouldn't want my mom to read this, i should not post it' (or for mods: i should just delete this). As far as Rocket goes, I have not read enough posts to judge your behavior, i value the creation of this mod though, and i greatly value your interaction with the community. But if you come with a lot of swearing and sarcasm, do realize that a lot of people mirror this behavior in order to get on your 'good side' as for some reason 'knowing or being on friends terms' with a Dev comes with some sort of honor and status. Now i surely don't want to discourage you from posting, and esp. not set you into the mode i read about in your post on page 28 (i think). Don't be perfect, communicate, and 'swear' if things are screwed up, we all do! But do not appreciate douches, snears, flames, etc. in fact i would personally instruct my mods to delete those kinds of posts and ban people for 24h, then perhaps a 3 strikes of 24h and 'you are out' (aka ban them for 6 months or so). As soon as people see you are serious about 'some' level of civilized interaction on the forums, they will adopt and start to behave more civilized (and those that don't will be gone) ... The discussions will likely turn more towards constructive critisism instead of 'insert rant/flame/troll/swear here' and that will be more beneficial to the mod ... This may not change anything about the ingame situation though, and i have seen various very civilized posts from bandits, I think they are a great part of the game. But the people with less social skills than zombies on these forums though...

interesting read, i wonder how i will feel in about a weeks time... :)

While i think the suggested implementation is a tad harsh and 'unrealistic' for something that is intended to sarcasticly be uber realistic... i do think this could be something to add at some point, see the whole 'relieving' issue is such a taboe in regards to survival, that 'besides drinking your own pee' it is never shown nor explained in survival shows. And it took me quite some googling to find a site that spoke of several ways to actually relieve yourself (with ease and a tad of comfort) while being outdoors. Also asking some of my army buddies added some more ways to deal with these kinds of things.. and don't take this lightly, if you soil your own water source you are pretty much screwed for that location as a basecamp. So think before you go! So yeah, if implemented in a reasonable way, then idd be all for this... perhaps sickness could induce diarea aswell, which is a real killer when surviving due to the added risk of dehydration...

I don't agree with pretty much everything in this suggestion :) ... not that i think it sucks, but i just disagree based on a couple of arguements and a different view of opinion :) 1. In order to explain why i disagree i will compare this with another 'survival game' called Minecraft (which you likely know). So minecraft has a very short day/night cycle, and the choice for this is made with great care, it is the 'thing' that creates urgency in the game, as this is the time when monsters come to kill you. So w/e you want to do (top side) you 'want' to do during the day, the cycle is short to have that sense of urgency and to limit the amount of things you will be able to do. Having a long cycle in minecraft would totally bork the game, as you would have plenty of time to prepair and 'watch paint dry' befor a long night of basically just mining the crap out of it. Having the short cycle means you can only do this and that b4 you need to retreat to a save place, and/or you only have a short period of time to 'farm' baddies, before they despawn and you have a short time to do other things (aka. f/e make more swords/arrows). And the availability of stuff is plenty full, so having just a short time, gives just enough time to get what you need, giving a sense of 'ok i made it' (be it through the day prepairing for night, or through the night just staying alive) In DayZ though, the baddies are always around, and the sense of urgency doesn't come from day or night, it comes from your vital signs and the 'urge' to find something to defend yourself with (no matter if it is day or night). Now what night does, is it does create some sort of urgency, as it is much harder to find your way around during the night, and if you 'can' you will want to find the stuff you need during the day, to just 'log off' or make it for the woods during the night, so you just don't have to 'bother' with running around a town with 15m of visibility. What the current long time does remove though, is a sense of urgency if you play during the day, and add a sigh of 'relief' during the evening as it starts to get bright again (these feelings tend to follow rather shortly in minecraft), if DayZ they can be totally avoided. But, seeing day and night are not driving the urgency, and seeing that the 'availability' of items is scarcety and not abbundance (like in minecraft), one needs a longer time to 'somewhat feel save' and a longer time to 'be prepaired for' and feel 'stressed about'. So, 1h and 30min are just to short. Though i will agree that the cycle needs to be shortened to add a slight tense of urgency to the day, and short enough to give a sense of 'its going to end, ill make it through' for the night time. A minimum would likely be 3h for both, which will be long enough to matter, and short enough to 'force' most, if not every, player through them. 2. Respawns are currently (what i picked up on these forums sofar) 10min or so, I personally think this is way to short. Doubling or even trippling this to 30min would make every find more valuable. BUT, i will have to add that i think there should be way more spawnpoints for items, preferably 75-80% of houses should be enterable, and have a chance to spawn something (but also a chance to not spawn something). This will mean that in general there will be a bit more items available (though more scattered), while there it takes longer for items respawn. This will deal with the following, in about 70% of all the respawns i was forced to take, i was 'behind' somebody else. This meant that all stuff was taken, because there is such a limited amount laying around (more spawnpoints would mean a longer time to gather stuff, which would give any other player a chance to also find something. At the same time, a longer spawn time, will also make people move on sooner, if it's 'just' 10min, why even move from a town, just take what you can get, move to the treeline, go for a drink & toilet break, then loot again. If on the other hand the time is 30min, it may well be faster to just move on to the next town, giving players that come after a bigger chance to also get some stuff. 3. Here is a topic on which i would like to write my own suggestion someday soon (i wanna play realy, and been typing for about 4h now :( , but i'll give the essence anyways). The map will have to be reviewed and likely redesigned with the following in mind: Risk, Reward, Chance. These are 3 'scales' that should be used to generally devide the map up in sectors, or even apply it to certain town sizes (as sectors). Again this comes 'together' with having more places for spawns, and thus more enterable buildings (if even just 'versions' of the same building with different spawn types, loot tables and chances assigned). Then using things like: - High risk, High Reward, Low Chance - High risk, medium Reward, medium chance - High risk, low reward, High chance - And all other variants of combinations between these. Would be the catagories of different sectors used to devide up the map. And within a certain sector, the various buildings could adhere to the variations. This way a high risk city may have more certainty of finding something every spawn, but it may not always be high reward. While a medium risk place, may have a lower chance on finding something, but it may still be High reward. etc... If you combine this with longer spawn times and shorter cycles, i hope you will agree that it's more likely that people will move and explore. While this would also increase the chances of finding something worth while as you do so. And if possible it would even be cool if the loot chances could take into account 'IF" something is looted in the last X spawn times, and based upon that, increase chances on higher reward spawns. If nobody has been 'somewhere' it's more likely that there is something there, while if a place is looted often, it's more likely that the stuff that is there is less valuable (as people take the stuff that is more valuable first, disregarding if it has ever been there, seeing this still is a game ;) ) So yeah, all the area's you posted on could indeed be improved, but i disagree in the way you want to improve them ;) ... and now i just wanna go and play a bit :-/

The keywords in these kinds of discussions regarding game worlds is 'believability' and 'gameplay' ... 1. In an apocalipse world it is believable that antibiotics are scarce. 2. Pain is a gameplay mechanic, and based upon the wound pain doesn't always go away on it's own. One could suggest having it reduce over a long period of time though... 3. Gameplay mechanic mostly, and it is partly believable that you would more than likely run around such an obstacle then through it (with the risk of cutting yourself) 4. gameplay mechanic, and believable based upon the size of the wound. some wounds just don't stop bleeding without presured bandages. The gameplay mechanic is the bandage item, you could ofcourse suggest adding 'rags' as an item that could be used as bandages, with an added chance on infection. 5. This again depends on the type of infection, viral, bacterial, fungal, etc. some of these will actually kill you before you get better. So in a sense it's believable that only antibiotics can cure them (for sure). So in my views it's generally best to strive for high believability within the gameplay mechanics. Calling it 'realism' is a mistake that is easily made because 'believable' tends to be close to 'how it is for real' (aka realism), as you noted though, realism can be hard to achief in gameplay, esp. if you are dealing with Zombie infections (realism much ;) :D ). Hence using the 'believable' grade within the context of the game, tends to be an easier way to validate or judge suggestions. And ofcourse whether is possible within the game mechanics... Last bit, i am not entirely sure where this is a suggestion? as the thread setup is more like a general discussion about the trade off between realism and challenge... hence i responded as such.

While art & screenshot & meme's and Vids are all great forum competitions, for a game in alpha it doesn't contribute much to the game. It's fun for the forum, true, but there is no lasting honor for a winner... so I propose the following competition: An Item, Weapon, Skin, Asset competition. While this may take some preperation from the mod(s) running the competition (pointing out requirements for ingame item files and possibly point towards software that can aid in constructing them), the results could be that this game get's instantly enriched with a TON of stuff, and there may be a TON of winners that get their item implemented in the game. HOW COOL IS THAT ! The competition could still run as a forum competition, the better the 'thing' created, or funny or w/e, could win the forum competition. While all good & viable assets have a chance to get implemented in the game. This way it becomes both a forum competition as well as a bit of a community project, with out the whole hassle that tends to come from a community project. Aka, the competition is to make some asset for the game, which could be anything, and make it so that it can be implemented (thus the need for some guidance from the mods), the winners just 'win' the forum competition, and all assets are for Rocket to use as he sees fit (or not). And don't be mistaken, there are likely a lot of players who'd be into entering a competition like that, and if the competition is set up right you can have all sorts of entry levels, f/e: - flat textures (.png?) for: Notes, Scribbles, checklists, Pictures of wife&kids, posters on buildings, art in buildings, instructions, map fragments etc. and so on. all these items could be added into the game to enrich the story of the world. What was it like b4 the infection, how did people live, did people survive for a while, etc and so on (for mods: do these textures need to be of a certain resolution, size, do they need an icon (reqs for those), or a .txt file to be viewed?) - Simple items (.???) for: Canned Pineapple (or w/e canned), cookies, candybars, candy, beer, winebottles (empty/full), fruit. But also think of: nibbled on feet, chunk of arm. Perhaps dried ham. Basically anything 'smallish' that needs: A simple 3D model, a texture, an icon, Bit of txt. If they are useable a discription of their use, and they may need an after use item. If used in 'crafting' it may be an assembly of items used together (with or without the 'code' to make them operable). Perhaps a simple spawnpoint for a particular item, like a pile of rubble... Lighters, zippo's, kitchen knives, forks, spoons. (for mods: do these need to be of a certain resolution, size, reqs for those icons, and the .txt file) - More elaborate Items, Weapons, assets: Basically anything bigger than kneeheight, these can be items, weapons & ammo, or simply assets (boxes, streetlights, etc be creative!). They would all have a model & texture, and may need other stuff as well. Perhaps Truck parts to assemble a truck. Or they could be animal models (bears, wolfs, brown chickens, squirrels, rabbits, etc and so on). Or even closed off buildings. Weapons like: lead pipes, branch, driftwood, guns, tasers, you name it... (for mods: again some guidance on requirements would be needed ;) ) - Full blown Assets: These are basically enterable structures, buildings, containers, perhaps openable sheds, dumpsters. Some may still be simple, but the requirement for this catagory is basically that a player needs to be able to enter or open it (chests, locker, cabinet, closet). Obviously needs a model and texture + activation triggers (and thus a different state model?). This is basically the 'expert' catagory, or for those driven enough to figure stuff out. (for mods: more guidance needed to point people in the right direction and clear requirements) How to run this competition Obviously the time requirement for each of these catagories is different, so i would make this a phazed competition: 1. Make 1 thread announcing the whole competition, with links to the 4 threads for each catagorie. Make sure you include that all rights to the thing created are transferred to Rocket. 2. Make 4 threads for each catagory, give clear discriptions of the requirements for the particular catagory and a clear deadline: - catagory A: within a month - catagory B: within 2 months - catagory C: within 3 months - catagory D: within 4 months. 3. Then run the catagory A competition every month for 4 months, announcing a winner every month. Run catagory B two times. Catagory C & D will run once. Obviously people making a catagory C or D asset, may well find a certain A or B item usefull to implement in their asset, think artwork on walls, posters, etc? 4. Have multiple winners on the forum for 4 months, have a tons of stuff to be added to the game. We all win and have a good time! Big plus, besides the forum glory, loads more people will be honored with their item implemented in the game. The game is greatly enriched with items & assets in just 4 months, exceeding what Rocket would ever be able to accomplish in those 4 months, and Rocket can just keep fixing bugs during those 4 months, at the end he will have a ton of stuff to implement and it will feel like christmas to him, and to us all as the game gets a HUGE boost in things to find, places to go. You name it!

While i like your post there is one thing that somewhat bugs me about it, and that is: If you make things more scarce (like food, drinks) it will become MORE important to kill another player over it !! And IRL has shown that IF food becomes realy scarce, 'we' are not besides eating eachother to survive ! What i do like is extending the ability to share things, like a can of food actually working in portions with an increased chance of the portions spoiling if opened. This means that sharing food becomes a more efficient way of playing. And i think in this 'efficiency' lies the key for players to cooperate, same with drinks, if one can hold more than you need, and you can't hang onto an opened can, sharing it means you can both hold one can and have 2 moments where you can clear thirst, instead of having to hold two cans yourself. An extension of the medical emergencies is a good way to go about this as well, but again i would go for efficiency first instead of simply reducing availability. Say that you can use a bloodpack yourself for 400HP but having it administered heals for 1000HP. Another thing that just popped my mind is adding WEIGHT to items, besides space, See i was quite amazed that i could take a full steel tanktrap with me and it just taking 1 spot, without it effecting me at all. If you would actually need somebody to hold your stuff while you together build something that benefits both, thats a reason to cooperate... Again, those kind of sollutions will work better than just making it a living hell, because a living hell will just mean more incentive to kill another player, as that can of beans will save you or him, and if that is the choice ;) :(